When will Miguel Retire?

[rajflyboy]

How much longer do you think Miguel Duhamel will race in the AMA Superbike Series?

[Jeff]

If he keeps posting decent results, and he is, he'll keep on racing. Unless he has another huge get off that forces him to retire.

JMO.

Jeff

[Jeff N]

Yvon is still racing snowmobiles, so Miguel's career has no boundries.

[phoenix]

He's ONLY 38! Same age as me. He's got plenty of racing left in him.
 
And yeah, as long as he's running top 5 most races, who's to say he should stop?

[tbeemer]

I like the guy as a racer, and personally from the handful of times I've interacted with him; but I wish Honda would move on and sign some younger talent.  Sure, he's still fast, but maybe there's a young gun out there who'd be a bit faster on the same level of machinery and get the red machine at the pointy end of the championship.  

Tom

[Playinthestreet]

Who would those young guns be?

[scott-sts]

I respect Miguel and obviously, he's a great racer but IMO, his time passed a long time ago.  I think Honda is holding back their own program by keeping him on their bike.  I do think he would be great in several of the support classes (Superstock and supersport come to mind).  Even when he was on top of his game, he was not what one would consider a consistant rider, which certainly hurt his ability to win championships.
Yes, he's good for a podium now and then and may even eek out a win but a Superbike championship?   Unless Honda doesn't want to win the championship? (Headscratch)

[scott-sts]

Who would those young guns be?

Lots of 'em; Josh Herrin just signed with Yamaha.  Even if you stay away from the young guys, Hacking, T. Hayden and Eric Bostrom could have been signed to ride in '07 for Honda if they wanted them.  
The 2 youngest riders Honda has got the best results last year: Zemke won the Superbike race in UT and Josh Hayes won the formula extreme championship.

[Playinthestreet]

You've changed the parameters.  The statement was "young guns".  You gave me Herron and I'll give you Eslick.  That's 2.  Who are the "lots of 'em?".  Steve Rapp and Chris Ulrich and Larry Pegram don't count either.

[Snowbird]

Miguel will retire long before you have your dream date with Vivid1.

[phoenix]

Miguel will retire long before you have your dream date with Vivid1.

 
 

Yes, he's good for a podium now and then and may even eek out a win but a Superbike championship? Unless Honda doesn't want to win the championship? (Headscratch)

He was 2004 and 2005 Formula Xtreme champion. I realize that's a championship that Honda seems to have bought, but he must be doing something right to win the championship at least twice. Maybe he's just got those 600's dialed in.  Regardless, I think it would be to Honda's advantage (or anyone else) to keep him around to pass on skills and knowledge to future riders.

[scott-sts]

You've changed the parameters. The statement was "young guns". You gave me Herron and I'll give you Eslick. That's 2. Who are the "lots of 'em?". Steve Rapp and Chris Ulrich and Larry Pegram don't count either.

I'm not an encylopedia of young racers (sounds rather pornographic) thus I can't sit here and name names. Maybe Jeff Wood deserves a shot?  Point is, like ALL sports, the future comes from youth.  All teams are looking for the next superstar.  I believe the point is Miguel's seat on the Superbike team would be better filled by a hungry, young rider.  
Steve Rapp was a factory Ducati rider and Larry Pegram is average, IMO.  Chris Ulrich is average, on a good day.  Frankly, he's not even an above average writer and that's his day job.

[scott-sts]

 
 
 
He was 2004 and 2005 Formula Xtreme champion. I realize that's a championship that Honda seems to have bought, but he must be doing something right to win the championship at least twice. Maybe he's just got those 600's dialed in. Regardless, I think it would be to Honda's advantage (or anyone else) to keep him around to pass on skills and knowledge to future riders.

I knew someone would bring up Miguel's Formula Extreme championship.  Think about it: He beat the only bike capable of even hanging in his draft and it was ridden by his teamate.  Furthermore, he won it by what? One point or something?  
I agree he could be an awesome influence on a younger rider.  I'd love to see him back in Supersport.  Honda could really sell alot of CBR600RR's if Miguel did race in Supersport.

[Gaolee]

How old is Gary McCoy?  I am pretty sure he is older than Miguel, and he is still going in all kinds of things.  BSB has several riders in their 40s, too, if I remember right, although I can't name them.

[keystonejenks]

I'm glad somebody pointed out Miguel's recent championships (saved me the time of looking them up).
 
That being said I think one rider that is itching for a shot at a factory ride is John Haner. I think this guy is a very talented racers. However, my racing knowledge isn't as in-depth as many on here.

[scott-sts]

How old is Gary McCoy? I am pretty sure he is older than Miguel, and he is still going in all kinds of things. BSB has several riders in their 40s, too, if I remember right, although I can't name them.

 
Lot's of 40 year old wash-up's in minor league baseball too.

[scott-sts]

I'm glad somebody pointed out Miguel's recent championships (saved me the time of looking them up).
 
That being said I think one rider that is itching for a shot at a factory ride is John Haner. I think this guy is a very talented racers. However, my racing knowledge isn't as in-depth as many on here.

 
Agreed.  Haner was hurt for a good part of the year, hopefully he didn't miss his window.  Geoff May looks ferocious (he resigned with Ulrich's Emgo Suzuki team).  Hopefully, his support of Pirelli won't hurt his career (Politics and all).

[rajflyboy]

Miguel will retire long before you have your dream date with Vivid1.

 
Man >>  I don't have a thing for Vivid!  Gee Wiz    

[rajflyboy]

I was at Road Atlanta in 2005 for the Great Formula Extreme battle between Miguel and Jake Zemke for the title.  That is the best racing I have seen in person at an AMA event.  Those two guys put on a whale of a show.

[Scoop]

Since Miguel is a Canuck, I have always watched his career with interest.  I recall watching him ride the wheels off of Harley's attempt at Superbike.  He was unbelievable.  No one else but a crazy frenchman could have coaxed that bike to the podium.  He was in line for the win, but rode it off the track while trying everything possible to keep the bike in front.  Still managed 3rd.  
He still has it in him, but injuries and circumstance are taking a toll.  Remember this past year when he was a contender with a busted windscreen?
He may be getting on, but he is still a hell of a rider.

[DogBoy]

How old is Gary McCoy?  I am pretty sure he is older than Miguel, and he is still going in all kinds of things.  BSB has several riders in their 40s, too, if I remember right, although I can't name them.

Thats a complaint about BSB. Its hard for young riders in the UK to break in to BSB because the seats are locked up by the same riders year after year. Kind of like here. BTW, McCoy is only 33 or 34. His bones are about 75 years old though. McWilliams is over 40.

Back on topic. With Eslick, Haner, Herrin, Blake Young, Geoff May, etc... there are plenty of good riders out there. If they're too young and without enough Superbike experience, what about Neil Hodgson? He's not a young gun but outran the Hondas several times this year.

[Gaolee]

I would be willing to bet that we will see an influx of young British riders into the AMA over the next few years, for exactly the reason you mention.

[phoenix]

Isn't Jeff Ward over 40, and he's kicking ASS on supermoto. Just wanted to make that last point.

[rajflyboy]

Isn't Jeff Ward over 40, and he's kicking ASS on supermoto. Just wanted to make that last point.

 
Wardy is still awesome too!   Impressive stuff!

[jerome_oneil]

Miguel is the winningest rider in AMA history, or something.  He can retire when he wants, which hopefully is never.

[spinmaster]

How short memories can be....
 
2004 Superbike Results
1. Mat Mladin (Factory Suzuki)
2. Miguel Duhamel (Factory Honda)
3. Jake Zemke (Factory Honda)
 
Honda (HRC specificly) retuned to AMA superbike in 2004
 
2005 Superbike Results
1. Mat Mladin (Factory Suzuki)
2. Ben Spies (Factory Suzuki)
.
.
5. Miguel Duhamel (Non Factory Honda - HRC and Honda NA went seperate ways and HNA fielded their own in house bike)
.
.
11. Jake Zemke (Non-Factory Honda)
 
2006 Superbike Results
1. Ben Spies (Factory Suzuki)
2. Mat Mladin (Factory Suzuki)
3. Miguel Duhamel (Non-Factory Honda)
.
5. Jake Zemke (Non-Factory Honda)
 
The point here is that when on a competative bike, Duhamel was kicking but. Finishing 2nd on a first year factory ride is not bad at all. In 2005 it was obvious that Honda was building a bike from scratch and was working out the parts problems.  By the end of 2006 the results were begining to show. I wouldn't call Duhamel over the hill until after 2007 and we see the fruits of HNA's efforts.
 
I agree though that he's going to have a tough year as Honda faces factory bikes with serious talent on them from Suzuki, Kawasaki, and Yamaha.

[curvesurfer]

I'm surprised Honda hasn't signed on of the Haydens given their relative youth and American Honda's relationship with Nicky.

[HexHead]

Lots of 'em; Josh Herrin just signed with Yamaha.  Even if you stay away from the young guys, Hacking, T. Hayden and Eric Bostrom could have been signed to ride in '07 for Honda if they wanted them.  

Why would E-Boz want to ride a Honda? That new R1 may very well be the bike to beat next season.

[Snowbird]

Man >>  I don't have a thing for Vivid!  Gee Wiz    

Ok.. if you say so...  

[Against The Wind]

[R1150RTMark]

The 2 youngest riders Honda has got the best results last year: Zemke won the Superbike race in UT and Josh Hayes won the formula extreme championship.

IIRC, Josh did it without factory backing. I had the good fortune to see the clinching final race at Mid-Ohio. It was the only real competitive race of the day (with anything really 'riding' on it) and Josh was very impressive.
 
I'm not sure I agree that age has a lot to do withi it though. Isn't Mladin close in age to Duhammel? And Yates, I believe, was older yet.

[keystonejenks]

IIRC, Josh did it without factory backing. I had the good fortune to see the clinching final race at Mid-Ohio. It was the only real competitive race of the day (with anything really 'riding' on it) and Josh was very impressive.

Hey, I was there too. It was the best race of the weekend!
 

 

 

I'm not sure I agree that age has a lot to do withi it though. Isn't Mladin close in age to Duhammel? And Yates, I believe, was older yet.

Here are the ages:
Mladin 34
Duhamel 38
Yates 33 (on Dec. 13)

[R1150RTMark]

Hey, I was there too. It was the best race of the weekend!
 
Here are the ages:
Mladin 34
Duhamel 38
Yates 33 (on Dec. 13)

 
It WAS the best race! Wow - Yates LOOKS much older. Hahahahah.
 
You were just past the esses - weren't you? By the walkover bridge?
 
I was just in front of you!! (see the same Salem camper in the background of the shots?) We may have even chatted.
 
My perspective: (and folks - this is how close Josh and Eric raced all race long!)
 

[VIVID1]

Miguel will retire long before you have your dream date with Vivid1.

[keystonejenks]

It WAS the best race! Wow - Yates LOOKS much older. Hahahahah.
 
You were just past the esses - weren't you? By the walkover bridge?
 
I was just in front of you!! (see the same Salem camper in the background of the shots?) We may have even chatted.
 

If we didn't chat we were standing rather close because that's where we sat too. I walked over by the bridge to get that one shot and walked back.  Here is a picture of Chaz Davies - same race:
 

[tbeemer]

Who would those young guns be?

If you don't know, you're not paying attention.

But I'll stimulate the synapses for you: Geoff May, Ben Attard, Josh Herrin, Danny Eslick, Blake Young, Jake Holden, and John Haner for starters.  Not to mention the one guy that Honda gave up on, Roger Lee Hayden.  Honda used to be good about grooming some young guys with the Erion team, but now it's kind of been turned into a place where older riders get a second or third shot (no disrespect intended to Hayes, but he's been around for quite a while, including being with Erion before).

I knew this would get off on a "Duhamel's still fast" tangent, but that's not the point.  Sure he's fast, but he hasn't been consistent.  He's thrown out some real stinkers as well, finishing just ahead of the privateers.  Why not develop a bike around a couple of young hungry riders, rather than one who's been around forever and has only delivered one Superbike championship; and because of his age could potentially pull the plug anytime.  Excuses are great, but he had full factory machinery for all those years and didn't deliver.  Then he had a fresh young team-mate who delivered a championship in his second year (Hayden).  Then they bring in another guy who was instantly faster on the RC51 than Miguel (Roberts).

Nostalgia's great, and Miguel's great; but racing's a cold business, and if you're not delivering the goods, it's time to move on and bring in someone who may try just a little harder.  Someone who'll push a 5th place machine into 4th or 3rd, or take a 3rd and turn it into a 2nd or a win.  I know it's harsh, but that's just how I see it.  I'd think that sooner or later Honda would get tired of losing to Suzuki in one of the biggest motorcycle markets in the world, assuming they still hold to the "win on Sunday, sell on Monday adage".

Tom

P.S. Those Formula Extreme Championships were a joke really.  I was embarassed for him and Honda to make such a big deal out of winning a class in which they were the only factory presence.

[tbeemer]

I would be willing to bet that we will see an influx of young British riders into the AMA over the next few years, for exactly the reason you mention.

I certainly hope so, but we've got the same lockup of the factory teams here that they do in BSB.  I like that Alistair Seeley kid from Ireland who came over and was competitive right out of the box.  If I was a team looking for some hardcore young talent, I'd be looking at the BSB support classes.  There's some real grinders in there.  

Tom

[scott-sts]

If you don't know, you're not paying attention.
 
But I'll stimulate the synapses for you: Geoff May, Ben Attard, Josh Herrin, Danny Eslick, Blake Young, Jake Holden, and John Haner for starters. Not to mention the one guy that Honda gave up on, Roger Lee Hayden. Honda used to be good about grooming some young guys with the Erion team, but now it's kind of been turned into a place where older riders get a second or third shot (no disrespect intended to Hayes, but he's been around for quite a while, including being with Erion before).
 
I knew this would get off on a "Duhamel's still fast" tangent, but that's not the point. Sure he's fast, but he hasn't been consistent. He's thrown out some real stinkers as well, finishing just ahead of the privateers. Why not develop a bike around a couple of young hungry riders, rather than one who's been around forever and has only delivered one Superbike championship; and because of his age could potentially pull the plug anytime. Excuses are great, but he had full factory machinery for all those years and didn't deliver. Then he had a fresh young team-mate who delivered a championship in his second year (Hayden). Then they bring in another guy who was instantly faster on the RC51 than Miguel (Roberts).
 
Nostalgia's great, and Miguel's great; but racing's a cold business, and if you're not delivering the goods, it's time to move on and bring in someone who may try just a little harder. Someone who'll push a 5th place machine into 4th or 3rd, or take a 3rd and turn it into a 2nd or a win. I know it's harsh, but that's just how I see it. I'd think that sooner or later Honda would get tired of losing to Suzuki in one of the biggest motorcycle markets in the world, assuming they still hold to the "win on Sunday, sell on Monday adage".
 
Tom
 
P.S. Those Formula Extreme Championships were a joke really. I was embarassed for him and Honda to make such a big deal out of winning a class in which they were the only factory presence.

 
Nice!  I agree with everything you wrote.

[Jeff]

Remember since American Honda took the development in-house is when their competitiveness really dropped. As they're getting the bike dialed, they're being more competitive. In this case, maybe Duhamel is good at development where the kids aren't.

I'm not saying the young guns shouldn't get a shot, but that could possibly be a factor. Plus Duhamel is very popular.

Jeff

[Leanintree]

He still has it in him, but injuries and circumstance are taking a toll. Remember this past year when he was a contender with a busted windscreen?
He may be getting on, but he is still a hell of a rider.

I'm not saying the young guns shouldn't get a shot, but that could possibly be a factor. Plus Duhamel is very popular.
 
Jeff

These factors are why he still has a ride. Miguel is a good racer (not necessarily the fastest, but not far down), and he TRIES. ALL THE TIME.  How many of the young guys eat it into the runoff area and just stand the bike against the wall and walk away? Heck, some of them do that even when they just ride off the track. I can't remember EVER seeing Duhamel not try to keep going. Even if he's 2 laps off the leader, he keeps on going.
 
And his manner very much typifies the Honda ideal. No temper tantrums. No acting like a jerk. No mouthing off to the media. He thanks his sponsers, gives the other guy credit, and pays attention to BUSINESS. Zemke has benefitted from his relationship with Duhamel in that respect if nothing else.
 
I expect when Miguel does retire, he's going to retire as a team manager. His experience and political accumen in the racing world would benefit many teams (and it wouldn't suprise me if he continues that long term relationship with Honda).
 
leanintree

[tbeemer]

These factors are why he still has a ride. Miguel is a good racer (not necessarily the fastest, but not far down), and he TRIES. ALL THE TIME.  How many of the young guys eat it into the runoff area and just stand the bike against the wall and walk away? Heck, some of them do that even when they just ride off the track. I can't remember EVER seeing Duhamel not try to keep going. Even if he's 2 laps off the leader, he keeps on going.
 
And his manner very much typifies the Honda ideal. No temper tantrums. No acting like a jerk. No mouthing off to the media. He thanks his sponsers, gives the other guy credit, and pays attention to BUSINESS. Zemke has benefitted from his relationship with Duhamel in that respect if nothing else.
 
I expect when Miguel does retire, he's going to retire as a team manager. His experience and political accumen in the racing world would benefit many teams (and it wouldn't suprise me if he continues that long term relationship with Honda).
 
leanintree

I'm thinking either you never saw the "early" Duhamel, or rose colored glasses have altered your memory.  He was an A-number-one-prick in his early years, generally a pain in the a$$ if he didn't win, with a million and one excuses for why he didn't win (other than just being beaten).  Granted, he's matured quite a bit, and most likely learned some hard lessons in order to get the way he is now.  So don't kid yourself too much, Duhamel v2.0 is pretty far removed from Duhamel v1.0.

Tom

[stk0308]

I'm thinking either you never saw the "early" Duhamel, or rose colored glasses have altered your memory. He was an A-number-one-prick in his early years, generally a pain in the a$$ if he didn't win, with a million and one excuses for why he didn't win (other than just being beaten). Granted, he's matured quite a bit, and most likely learned some hard lessons in order to get the way he is now. So don't kid yourself too much, Duhamel v2.0 is pretty far removed from Duhamel v1.0.
 
Tom

And even then, DuHamel v2.0 is really hard on anyone not a factory rider on the track(cutting people off for no real reason, flipping them off, kicking at, etc).  Witness his confrontation with Chris Ulrich at the last Mid Ohio weekend.  He chopped off Chris, then flipped him off.  Chris, not willing to take sh!t, waited for him in the hot pits.  As Miguel rode by, gave him both fingers.  Miguel actually came to Chris' pit later and got in his face over this.
 
All due respect to Miguel, but there are times when he definatly looses his cool.

[Scoop]

I'm thinking either you never saw the "early" Duhamel, or rose colored glasses have altered your memory.  He was an A-number-one-prick in his early years, generally a pain in the a$$ if he didn't win, with a million and one excuses for why he didn't win (other than just being beaten).  Granted, he's matured quite a bit, and most likely learned some hard lessons in order to get the way he is now.  So don't kid yourself too much, Duhamel v2.0 is pretty far removed from Duhamel v1.0.

Tom

This is true, but he's French!  What does one expect?  Actually, his parents are quite nice people and easy to talk to.  We had a nice chat when I was trying to get Miquel's autograph.  Couldn't get one from him, of course, but did get Mom and Yvon to sign my shirt!  

[arkansawyer]

I heard he was running Superbike times on his 600FX bike at the dunlop Daytona tire test.

[rajflyboy]

Miguel will retire long before you have your dream date with Vivid1.

Very Funny HERO

 

[bogthing]

And even then, DuHamel v2.0 is really hard on anyone not a factory rider on the track(cutting people off for no real reason, flipping them off, kicking at, etc).  Witness his confrontation with Chris Ulrich at the last Mid Ohio weekend.  He chopped off Chris, then flipped him off.  Chris, not willing to take sh!t, waited for him in the hot pits.  As Miguel rode by, gave him both fingers.  Miguel actually came to Chris' pit later and got in his face over this.
 
All due respect to Miguel, but there are times when he definatly looses his cool.

And nobody, but nobody, cut's off an Ulrich!, do you know who my father is?!!!

(sorry, I couldn't resist)  

[stk0308]

And nobody, but nobody, cut's off an Ulrich!, do you know who my father is?!!!

(sorry, I couldn't resist)  

It's kinda the attitude I read on Chris most of the time too