DRZ400?

[DNA]

As I sit in the office enjoying my 9.5 hours of daylight, dreaming of a new bike is something to keep me sane.

I have the ST/GT thing covered with the Sprint.  It has almost 30K miles in 2.5 years so it gets used - but no a whole lot.  I have been using it mostly for rallies and LD stuff.  With a new baby due any day, 2 things are going to be in short supply: Money and time.  Spending 6-10 hours on the bike every weekend is out - as is buying a new FJR.  So I keep asking myself, "Self, how can we have some fun - commute 45 miles on traffic congested 2 lane back roads, get in the dirt, and basically compress 10 hours of giggles in the twisties into morning commute and the occasional 3 hour Gilligan?"

I rode a KTM 450 something this year at Hatfield's and McCoys, and had 3 fantastic days.  Dirk bikes rock!  But the need to trailer several hours is a deal killer.  The SuperMotard thing looks like a blast, but I no practical experience.  Everyone else seems to like the KLR, but it seems too big and heavy to by good on dirt, and too small to tour in comfort.

What specifically am I looking for?
1) Must be fun!
2) I want to loft the front end at will, and generally be a hooligan.
3) Must have enough travel and be light enough to be decent on dirt roads, and possible easy single track.
4) Must be capable of sustained 75 MPH.  It will see highways ~1 hour max not for 10 hours (The ST will work on that).  100 MPH+ not necessary.
5) I need to carry a laptop/ briefcase, so some type bag or case is desired.
6) It should have good (or upgradeable) lights as I ride home int he dark often  
7) Easy maintenance - I am not a master wrench - this is well known.

Other bikes I have considered include the F650 Dakar, and the KTM640.  Any idea about the DR650?

Specific questions about the DRZ:Any idea of ballpark pricing on a lightly used bike? Are accessories widley available?  Are there any lightly used DRZ's or do they all get destroyed?  Is the 2 tire set thing good or more of a gimmick?  How bad would an hour on the highway be?


I look forward to comments about this bike and any others I might have missed.  I need to get educated about the whole DS thing.

[garry]

I don't think the DRZ400 is for you. I had one last year and put about $1000 in mods to it. Had it nicely set up, then sold it in a fit of stupidity. Here's why I think you need to look elsewhere:

- Not much power. With stock gearing, you can loft it in first, and second if you try, but it's not a wheelie king stock.

- If you drop the gearing for dirt use, wheelies are easy, but you'll be screaming on the highway

- An indicated 75 is about as much as it's comfy with. I put in long days (250-300 miles) on it and that's about all it's comfy with IMO. I did see 90+ indicated once when wringing its neck.

- It's a dirt bike, so it's kinda snakey/wiggly at speed, in cross winds and on the highway (turbulence from other vehicles)

- It's only a 5 speed. An overdrive 6th gear for highway use would be great.

- Tires are the limiting factor for off-road use. If you use 50/50 tires, they suck off-road if it's muddy or loose. DOT knobbies are great for the dirt, but aren't any fun on the street.

- Pro Moto Billet makes a nice rack. I'm sure you can bodge some sort of top-case on there if needed.

I'm thinking you're more of a 650 dual-sport customer. KLR is most street oriented, Honda the most dirt (of the Jap bikes) with the DR650 in the middle. Personally, I'm lusting after the KTM 525 EXC right now.

www.ThumperTalk.com has an awesome DRZ400 forum.

[Johnny Monsoon]

If you're wanting a light bike, aditch the idea of the BMW immediately; it is heavier and less dirt worthy than the KLR.

The DR650 may be an option for you; maybe the best option, however there are others:

The TE-610 will be lighter than the KLR (and just a tad lighter, I believe) than the DR650, but far better equipped for dirt, and sports a sixth gear for highway.

My pick would be the KLX250S.  While it isn't built to be a highway tourer, I have spent 2 hours straight in the (comfortable) saddle with the throttle well opened; and 75 (indicated) was no problem at all for my 170lb 5'11" self.  You endure any single on the highway to get to the dirt; that's just the facts of life.  It does just fine though; but tops out at  95mph (indicated) on flat roads with no headwind.  Legal speeds are easily attainable, and the offroad prowess of this bike is unreal.  For the money, I don't believe there's a finer bike that'll allow you to actually catch serious air, traverse mega nasty trails, and still allow you to run up and down the highway.  You can also punch out the engine with factory bits to 330cc.

Having owned (and adored) a KLR650, I would have no reservations about getting a KLX250S as a replacement.  I'd want to upgrade the tank to a larger unit, and soft luggage can be strapped on anything.

If you're looking primarily at multi-surface grin factor, the KLX250S is nearly impossible to beat.  It contains some really great offroad bits and comes in a very affordable package.

[DNA]

Thanks guys - keep in coming.  More bikes to look into.  The KLX looks interesting.  I see a dirt bike coming soon.
Pardon my ignorance - but would a 250 have the grunt to loft my 225lb?  I really doubt I will be on the highway much.  

[hig4s]

Think  KTM 525 EXC street legal!!!  

[bluepoof]

If you're wanting a light bike, aditch the idea of the BMW immediately; it is heavier and less dirt worthy than the KLR.

I do believe the latter is a matter of opinion.  

Honestly, even though the F650GS is 20 lbs heavier than the KLR, the gas tank is under the seat, which greatly lowers the center of gravity.  I've never ridden a KLR (stupid tall bikes) but I've found the F650GS to be very capable on the dirt.  Just my opinion.

I'm not seeing why a DRZ400 would be a bad choice for DNA.    I'd agree with the assessment of a 650cc if he were doing more highway, but he said that he's not.  It seems like a DRZ400 would actually work very well.  

[Johnny Monsoon]

I do believe the latter is a matter of opinion.  

Honestly, even though the F650GS is 20 lbs heavier than the KLR, the gas tank is under the seat, which greatly lowers the center of gravity.  I've never ridden a KLR (stupid tall bikes) but I've found the F650GS to be very capable on the dirt.  Just my opinion.

I'm not seeing why a DRZ400 would be a bad choice for DNA.    I'd agree with the assessment of a 650cc if he were doing more highway, but he said that he's not.  It seems like a DRZ400 would actually work very well.  

I don't know what it is on the BMW that is heavy and high, but the COG is actually higher on the GS than the KLR.  The KLR is easier to handle offroad by a good bit.

The DRz400 is a decent bike, but it won't do highway any better than the KLX, and doesn't have nearly the offroadability, so for a few less bucks, you get a better dirt bike with a more comfortable seat and way better suspension.  The KLX is also a 6 speed (forgot to mention that earlier).

And, DNA, the KLX will indeed haul your butt around.  My bud is 6'4" and about (if not slightly more) than your weight.  He gets around just fine on it.

[cosmoose]

Think  KTM 525 EXC street legal!!!  

Do, actually.  That's the route my dad took.  Downsides include high initial cost, low oil capacity (frequent changes) and no fan on the radiator, which means it'll overheat if you're slow.  Also, he decided to install a keyed ignition, since it only came with a button.  

But, it's really light (roughly 40 pounds better than the DRZ400S), has great suspension, a heck of a motor and lots of dirt cred.  

A lot depends on what state you're in.  Dad just barely got the KTM made legal here in WI.  In Michigan, anything with a mirror, headlight and a horn could get a plate.  

All that said, I've toughed through interstate runs on 250s (and one 200), learned to ride on the KLR650, and currently have a DRZ400.  It's all about compromise.  Figure out not only what kind of riding you're going to do, but what kind of riding you want your bike to be good at.  I spend more time on the road than in the dirt, but when it gets muddy, I want a machine that'll handle well, and one I can pick up again and again.  The DRZis almost too big for hard-core dirt riding, but does easier trails comfortably and has enough motor that I'm not flaying it on my commute.  If I did a touch less dirt, I'd have a 650, but if there were trails just a little closer, I'd be on a 250.  

It took me 4 bikes to figure that out.  Hope you find the one that fits you sooner.  

Dave

[garry]

A lot depends on what state you're in.  Dad just barely got the KTM made legal here in WI.  In Michigan, anything with a mirror, headlight and a horn could get a plate.  

I think all the 2007 EXC models (at least the 450 and 525) are DOT legal in all 50 states. Note the addition of turn signals and mirrors on the KTM site.

[Johnny Monsoon]

I think all the 2007 EXC models (at least the 450 and 525) are DOT legal in all 50 states. Note the addition of turn signals and mirrors on the KTM site.

I believe you are most correct.

[bluesurf]

From the requirements listing then it seems like you want dirt bike fun (loft at will, big suspension, etc.) but won't be using it much on the trails, at least initially.  You also want the ability to cover some highway mileage, likely with minimal maintenance as those hours/miles add up.

I've seen people toss suspension, etc., upgraded KLR's through things that they probably shouldn't, and they are also very capable and comfortable of living off of for months at a time...plenty of stories out there; check out http://advrider.com.  However, the KLR isn't a hooligan machine by any stretch.

As others have pointed out, the DR-Z needs a few mods to make it a real hoolie bike and even then is slightly constrained on the highway side.  Personally, I've done thousands of mixed dirt, highway and nasty trails on one, and it's a fine bike.  The FCR carb from an E or other compatible model is the best mod to feed that engine and get overall results.  Well-kitted used models (look for '02+ to take advantage of the upgraded forks) can regularly be had for $4-4.5K.

You mentioned not really intending to put much dirt time down, but I'll wager that's going to change, and would place a bet towards a bike that can handle the highway and be ready for more than light easy trails once in a while.

I'm voting for either a KTM640 or a Honda XR650L.  Plenty of power throughout the range, luggage capability, can easily be ridden for an hour or three at a time on the highway and then handle almost everything off-road.

[DNA]

I'm voting for either a KTM640 or a Honda XR650L. Plenty of power throughout the range, luggage capability, can easily be ridden for an hour or three at a time on the highway and then handle almost everything off-road.

I think you hit it.  
KTM 640 seems to be the lust object of the season.
I had heard maintenance was high though.  Any idea if this is true - relative to the others?

[R.Markus]

I think you hit it.  
KTM 640 seems to be the lust object of the season.
I had heard maintenance was high though.  Any idea if this is true - relative to the others?

Oil changes and valve adjustments every 3000 miles.

The oil change is actually more time consuming than the valve adjustment. It has one external oil filter, one internal oil filter, two drain plugs under the engine (one with a screen and the other with a magnet), and one drain plug on the frame under the external oil filter. You have to put oil in the case and then more in the frame near the steering head, then the frame needs to be bled after the oil change.

The bike vibrates a lot so you have to constantly check hoses and wiring to make sure they aren't rubbing through...in nearly 9000 miles on mine nothing has yet, but there are a couple hoses I'm going to replace soon.

[DNA]

Oil changes and valve adjustments every 3000 miles.

The oil change is actually more time consuming than the valve adjustment. It has one external oil filter, one internal oil filter, two drain plugs under the engine (one with a screen and the other with a magnet), and one drain plug on the frame under the external oil filter. You have to put oil in the case and then more in the frame near the steering head, then the frame needs to be bled after the oil change.

The bike vibrates a lot so you have to constantly check hoses and wiring to make sure they aren't rubbing through...in nearly 9000 miles on mine nothing has yet, but there are a couple hoses I'm going to replace soon.

   That design sounds completly stupid.  On my triumph I'd be doing that every 4-6 weeks in the summer.
Is it worth it?  
Nice bike - I really like the Black ones...

[vitaminC]

   That design sounds completly stupid.  On my triumph I'd be doing that every 4-6 weeks in the summer.
Is it worth it?  
Nice bike - I really like the Black ones...

How tall are you? And seriously, that oil change is a real PITA. There's a great KTM thread pinned in the thumper section at advrider, check it out.

[R.Markus]

   That design sounds completly stupid.  On my triumph I'd be doing that every 4-6 weeks in the summer.
Is it worth it?  
Nice bike - I really like the Black ones...

Actually it is a good design, just complicated. The bike wasn't designed for easy riding and it's engineering seems a bit overkill if you aren't using it for it's intended purposes. Desert racing is what KTM does best and that is basically what the bike was designed for, all the extra filters and screens are there to keep the sand out.
 
It is more than worth it. Triumph and street bikes are a totally different animal than KTM and Husqvarna.

...oh, if it is black then it is probably a 950.

[R.Markus]

How tall are you? And seriously, that oil change is a real PITA. There's a great KTM thread pinned in the thumper section at advrider, check it out.

Yeah, height might be an issue also.

 I'm 5-08 with a 29 inch inseam...

Here's me trying to put my feet down while stopped...bear in mind that the rear is loaded down with camping gear also, so I can't usually touch that well.



This pic shows how tall the 640 is compared to the KLR:



...and that oil change isn't that bad, it takes about an hour and you can get a good look around the bike to see if anything else needs to be given some attention (like bending your handguard back into shape because it's compressing the front brake lever).

[Mac]

I have the drz 400 s and love it. I commute with it about 45-50 min one way, sometimes on back roads and sometimes slab. The big thing is gearing. Swap out a front sprocket with a 12 or 13 tooth if you're going to ride in the dirt and put the 15 back on if you're riding slab and maybe change out the rear with a 38 tooth. I have 4 front sprockets and 6 rear ones. Total cost maybe 150 bucks. The two sets of wheels thing is a good idea if you can find them. I would ride the drz more if I could just swap rims instead of having to spoon on different tires  for street or dirt riding. All in all its a very good bike.

[hig4s]

The KTMs are sweet bikes, but they are designed like real racing machines, takes a bike of maintenance, just like having a motocross machine.

If the maintenance issue is a problem I say go for the DRZ400 nice bike.. Or if you are serious that you won't be that much on the trails check out the DRZ400SM  (supermoto) same bike but slightly lowered suspension to make it better on the street.  Although it comes with street tires and you would have to change to dual sport tires or buy a second set of rims and put dire tires on them.

[DNA]

Thanks all.
As for height - I am 6'0", but it is all leg.
I was flat footing my friends big Strom last week and I could tip toe the 1150 GSA.
That was a tall bike - I hope the KTM is not that big.
With all this info - looks like my decision will largely be based on availability and what great deal comes my way.
Thanks for all the data - the DRZ with 2 sets of rims and a bunch of sprockets could work, the KTM could too.

[R.Markus]

As for height - I am 6'0", but it is all leg.
I was flat footing my friends big Strom last week and I could tip toe the 1150 GSA.
That was a tall bike - I hope the KTM is not that big.

The seat height of the 640 (37.5 inches) is 2 inches higher than the 1150GSA and 5 inches higher than the Strom 650...but it is narrower than either of them so reaching the ground is easier.

Getting a 400cc dirt bike like the DRZ and changing sprockets would work, that's what I did with my WR.

[DNA]

The seat height of the 640 (37.5 inches) is 2 inches higher than the 1150GSA and 5 inches higher than the Strom 650...but it is narrower than either of them so reaching the ground is easier.

Getting a 400cc dirt bike like the DRZ and changing sprockets would work, that's what I did with my WR.

Do you miss your ST?  Any longing for the touring comfort any more?

5 inches higher than the 650?  I was on the 1000, and it wasn't too bad - but - wow.
The GSA was up there - that must feel like a skyscraper.  I had some difficulty flat footing the KTM450 - but that was purpose built for off road.
I think the local one I sad advertised for sales (used) may have been purple?  Time to start looking for a deal.
-DNA
 

[R.Markus]

Do you miss your ST?  Any longing for the touring comfort any more?

5 inches higher than the 650?  I was on the 1000, and it wasn't too bad - but - wow.
The GSA was up there - that must feel like a skyscraper.  I had some difficulty flat footing the KTM450 - but that was purpose built for off road.
I think the local one I sad advertised for sales (used) may have been purple?  Time to start looking for a deal.
-DNA
 

I don't miss the ST at all. I put 3000 miles on it last year and really started to hate the bike.

The Adventure is plenty comfortable to tour on. My longest day on it so far is only 700 miles...that wasn't a problem at all (I like the seat better than the one on the ST).

The blue (purple) ones are 1997-1999. I think only the 1999 model was imported. I really like that color.

There is more information on the 640 here than you can imagine, have a look around and see if it is the bike for you. It does require a bit of maintenance and looking after, but it is well worth it.

[vitaminC]

 Time to start looking for a deal.
-DNA
 

If you want a well set-up 640A, here's your bike!  

[R.Markus]

If you want a well set-up 640A, here's your bike!  

That's the one...and it raced the Alcan 5000 last year!

[DNA]

Yep - that looks like the ticket - wish I had the scratch right now.
Probably should wait for the baby first anyhow...  

[cjgauthier]

     I don't understand the need for bling factor and high priced dirt bikes. Some of the most fun I've had in the woods and powerlines was on a  semi -abused DR 250 I picked up from a tow yard for $75.  Cross streams, trail rides, thrash around a bit, then hose it down and forget it. Something light  enough to pick up or pull out of a mud hole alone. I guess it depends on how dirty your dirt riding is.  

[R.Markus]

     I don't understand the need for bling factor and high priced dirt bikes. Some of the most fun I've had in the woods and powerlines was on a  semi -abused DR 250 I picked up from a tow yard for $75.  Cross streams, trail rides, thrash around a bit, then hose it down and forget it. Something light  enough to pick up or pull out of a mud hole alone. I guess it depends on how dirty your dirt riding is.  

...because my dirtbike doubles as a tourer...otherwise I do agree with you.

[mtrider16]

...because my dirtbike doubles as a tourer...otherwise I do agree with you.

+1

If you just want to bomb around in the dirt, a 250 or 400 is all you need.  

If you ride roads to the the trails and some running around on pavement, the 400 to 650 are a better sized to keep up with traffic.  

When you start talking 1000 miles of road or more, then the 650, 950, and the Big Trailies start to work better.

(of course I still may want it look better than the Jone's bike, and if it looks like Ricky C's or Jeremy M's thats even better.)  

David

[bluesurf]

     I don't understand the need for bling factor and high priced dirt bikes. Some of the most fun I've had in the woods and powerlines was on a  semi -abused DR 250 I picked up from a tow yard for $75.  Cross streams, trail rides, thrash around a bit, then hose it down and forget it. Something light  enough to pick up or pull out of a mud hole alone. I guess it depends on how dirty your dirt riding is.  

I've ridden older dirt bikes, heck, grew up riding XR75's, RM-125's, atc's, etc.

Today's higher-priced bikes come partially at the cost of inflation/growth, but moreso as a result of increased technology.  Personally, I'm not going to pay more for a bike due to "bling," but will do so to attain the suspension/engineering/etc.  As I've previously posted, the 300exc is my personal hero bike woods bike, because it makes riding in incredible conditions so much more easy and fun overall.  The difference between a current-gen dirtbike and one from the mid-eighties is day & night.

I do grok what you're saying about having fun on most any bike when riding alone, but I don't do that out in the technical/exposed stuff.  Also, I don't mind spending 30 minutes to an hour cleaning and going over the bike after a days ride....helps keep the resale value up, not too mention knowing the bike and that it's ready for the next pounding.  

[Tropical FJR]

It really depends what you want to use the bike for.

A good second hand DRZ is terrific bang for the buck.

However, they are a dirt bike, not designed for long road trips....

[R.Markus]

A good second hand DRZ is terrific bang for the buck.

However, they are a dirt bike, not designed for long road trips....

No, but they'll do it if you want them to.

[Tropical FJR]

Yes, they will - just plan on a slower speed.

Look at it this way - more time to admire the scenery...

 

[R.Markus]

You won't end up going much slower. I did one tour on my WR426 and didn't have much of a problem keeping up...except toward the end when it was just me and a 1150GS. He had to ride a lot slower and I had to really wring the WR so that we could keep a similar pace, but I would not normally recommend traveling with people whose bikes aren't evenly matched.

[hig4s]

No, but they'll do it if you want them to.

yup they will, back in the day I use to ride from North Chicago to Grand Rapids MI, 215 miles, and back on the weekends with a Honda MT250 Elsinore 2-stroke dual-sport   .. I think the DRZ would be much better.

[Johnny Monsoon]

+1

If you just want to bomb around in the dirt, a 250 or 400 is all you need.  

If you ride roads to the the trails and some running around on pavement, the 400 to 650 are a better sized to keep up with traffic.  

When you start talking 1000 miles of road or more, then the 650, 950, and the Big Trailies start to work better.

(of course I still may want it look better than the Jone's bike, and if it looks like Ricky C's or Jeremy M's thats even better.)  

David

Ordinarily, I'd agree completely, but I cannot stress enough the streetability of the KLX250S, even in stock form.  The 6th speed and aftermarket power upgrades available, combined with very light weight make it a killer machine for touring and real offroading.  It is worth taking a look.  You won't be doing light-speed touring, but it'll be very close to the bigger bikes; more comfortable than several, actually.

[marc11]

I think people tend to over look the KLX because it is "just" a 250 and assume a 400 has to be better.  When you break down the power to weight, the weight and wheelbase of the bikes for dirt use, the suspension, tranny and comfort factor, the KLX as a dirt bike wins hands down.  That same suspension and light weight that makes for a great dirt bike, makes for an amazing street bike too.  So much so, this same bike is sold in supermoto trim in Japan.

I know I compared the DRZ and the KLX for months before my purchase, the KLX won hands down and after riding them back to back, I am pleased with my selection.

This is not to say the DRZ is a bad bike, it's not, its a great bike.  But rather the DRZ is more at home on the street and on dirt roads, where as the KLX will rip up single tracks, mud, rocks and everything else you can throw at it and still take you all the way home at above legal highway speeds in relative comfort....I know, I just did this very same thing yesterday.

[Albie]

This is not to say the DRZ is a bad bike, it's not, its a great bike.  But rather the DRZ is more at home on the street and on dirt roads, where as the KLX will rip up single tracks, mud, rocks and everything else you can throw at it and still take you all the way home at above legal highway speeds in relative comfort....I know, I just did this very same thing yesterday.

You're kidding right? More at home on dirt roads, that's utter nonsense. Until KTM became so popular the DRZ 400 was one of the most popular enduro bikes going. They can rip up single track, crawl over rocks, and climb hills like a billy goat with the best of them. Granted, the hybrid enduro bikes like the CRF X's and WR's as well as the 2 and 4 stroke KTMS are all you see now in enduro's, but then they put out a ton more HP and are 20-25 lbs lighter then the DRZ.

[vitaminC]

Ordinarily, I'd agree completely, but I cannot stress enough the streetability of the KLX250S, even in stock form.

The biggest problem with the KLX250S is that it's not sold in Cali  

[hig4s]

You're kidding right? More at home on dirt roads, that's utter nonsense. Until KTM became so popular the DRZ 400 was one of the most popular enduro bikes going. They can rip up single track, crawl over rocks, and climb hills like a billy goat with the best of them. Granted, the hybrid enduro bikes like the CRF X's and WR's as well as the 2 and 4 stroke KTMS are all you see now in enduro's, but then they put out a ton more HP and are 20-25 lbs lighter then the DRZ.

When, from the Enduros I've been to, the KTMs have been the bikes serious competetors since the late 70s early 80s and prior to that it was mostly Husqvarna doing the winning.

[Johnny Monsoon]

You're kidding right? More at home on dirt roads, that's utter nonsense. Until KTM became so popular the DRZ 400 was one of the most popular enduro bikes going. They can rip up single track, crawl over rocks, and climb hills like a billy goat with the best of them. Granted, the hybrid enduro bikes like the CRF X's and WR's as well as the 2 and 4 stroke KTMS are all you see now in enduro's, but then they put out a ton more HP and are 20-25 lbs lighter then the DRZ.

Compared to the KLX250S, the DRz400 is a wallowing swine offroad.  Frankly, on-road it has no appreciable gains over the KLX for comfort; in fact, there isn't even a saddle comparison between the two; the KLX is a far more comfortable motorcycle, than can do offroad far better, and on road travel just as well.

[johne]

IMHO if you buy a DRZ400 and were looking at the KTM640 also you will shoot yourself within a matter of weeks. Nothing against Suzuki of course (see avatar) but the KTM is just the best dual sport bike between the 2. KTM has been putting a lot of R&D into dual sport bikes for quite some time and I think they have the right ideas. Dakar pretty much proves that. Good luck with your choice.

[Albie]

Compared to the KLX250S, the DRz400 is a wallowing swine offroad.  

LOL, a KLX250s the EXACT same weight as my DRZ400E. I'll say it again since people have trouble following posts. To say the DRZ is better suited to dirt roads then single track is utter nonsense.

[Johnny Monsoon]

LOL, a KLX250s the EXACT same weight as my DRZ400E. I'll say it again since people have trouble following posts. To say the DRZ is better suited to dirt roads then single track is utter nonsense.

The DRz400S (street legal) is 291lb dry.  The KLX250S is 262lb dry.  While the DRz400E (262lb dry) does have an electric start, it does not have the gear, or really, the electrical system to support street-legalizing (not to mention trying to even do that in your state, much less the cost involved).  Take into consideration that this is primarily a trail bike and won't be happy, at all, on the highway for any amount of time.

Sorry, they're just two very different animals.  However, it does point out that the KLX, still, is better ON road, and STILL doesn't suffer, at all, offroad to the E model.

[marc11]

DRZ 400s - $5599
KLX250s - $4799

 

[R.Markus]

DRZ 400s - $5599
KLX250s - $4799

 

I assume you are refering to the price of the 250 being almost as high as the 400?

The 250 was completely revamped and upgraded last year, it is quite a bit modernized compared to the DRZ. Hell, it's also odd to see it in the showroom next to the KLR...with nearly the same price.

By the way...what was the original question again?

[Scratch33]

IMHO if you buy a DRZ400 and were looking at the KTM640 also you will shoot yourself within a matter of weeks.

Do you know whether KTM discontinue the 640 entirely; or just stopped sending 'em to the USA?

[marc11]

Ummm, one should never assume anything.  The point of the cost comparison, as you pointed out, is that the KLX is a new and fully modern.  So, for $800 less you are getting an overall better bike.  Lighter, more modern, better suspension and a better power to weight ratio than the DRZ.  I also suspect lower insurance costs as well as lower tax.  Overall a cheaper bike to purchase on the road.

That was the point.  The DRZ is a fine bike, nothing wrong with it, but when compared to the KLX, and when wanting to ride off road more than on road, it is hard to justify the weight and cost differences.

[R.Markus]

Do you know whether KTM discontinue the 640 entirely; or just stopped sending 'em to the USA?

They are bringing in a limited number for 2007, probably about 100 like the previous 2 years. THey are most likely 2006 leftovers and are identical except that the tank doesn't say "Dual Sport" on it. They aren't in the catalog and I would hurry and get a deposit down at a dealership that is getting one, they'll most likely all be spoken before before they even get to the dealerships (same as the last two years).

In fact, after I bought mine last year the dealership called to say they had several guys really want one and would deal with me on a 950SE if I would trade it back in. Not worth it.

[Scratch33]

Thanks for the info.  Any idea what the going rate is for 'em?

[R.Markus]

Thanks for the info.  Any idea what the going rate is for 'em?

I think MSRP new is $8898. Demand this year will see what they actually sell for...and it's hard to bargain when your putting a deposit down on a new bike that has limited numbers.

I saw this one on cycletrader. It's in TX, but looks to be set up pretty well. Those tank guards are hard to come by (have to be ordered from Sommer in Germany).

[Johnny Monsoon]

I assume you are refering to the price of the 250 being almost as high as the 400?

The 250 was completely revamped and upgraded last year, it is quite a bit modernized compared to the DRZ. Hell, it's also odd to see it in the showroom next to the KLR...with nearly the same price.

By the way...what was the original question again?

It is odd, and one should ask why.  The answer is easy, but understanding the answer is difficult wihtout being able to experience it directly.

A) yeah, the KLX has better offroad bits.  Newer, more modern (or really, more dirtbike spec'd) parts.  The suspension is amazing; and that's tough to say about any UJM that is roadworthy.  In fact, that alone deserves some heavy consideration and late night pondering.  Rider aside, the second focus, even before engine upgrades, is always suspension.  You can jump right to the engine on this little guy; bumping it up to a 330cc bike with a nice carb and aftermarket exhaust which will give you some pretty good power for any of the bikes in this class.

B) As much as it pains me to say it, the KLX250S really doesn't give much up to the KLR on the road.  The fairing and the tank size are the two main points of contention.  The KLX has a higher frequency buzz, but it spins up to something like 11K rpm, where the KLR is running around 7.5Krpm to redline.  The KLX would need soft luggage, where the KLR can accept hard luggage and racks on its subframe.  The KLX may be able to be retrofitted with a rack (likely, I think) but it isn't a common mod at this point.

There are unusual things to consider when getting a DS bike:

One is that you'll have a reduction in speed when on the roads.  That's just a fact of life.  Even with all the engine in the world, a big single with lots of mud-guarding plastics that stick out in the breeze will not be a good upper 10s and early 100s mph cruiser.  DS bikes are most comfortable at legal highway speeds.  

Any DS bike listed will do legal highway speeds just fine; it becomes a matter of range and the amount of wind protection you want.  Bikes with larger tanks actually profide decent mid and lower body wind protection, as well as a longer range.  

Windscreens can be adapted to most any bike with a little ingenuity; and frankly, you can get away with stuff like that a whole lot more readily on a DS machine.  

They aren't great 2-up bikes.  If you are going 2-up with more than a heavy child or a light adult pillion, skip any of the bikes with less than 650cc.  

The suspension exploits of a great dirt-worthy machine are largely wasted on the road.  That isn't to say there isn't a gain with better suspension, but that the long, controlled travel designed to suck up airborne landings will be a bit of overkill.  However, with that being said, it is always better to have more/better and waste it than it is to be wanting.  My KLR650 was fine offroad for just creeping along, but for actually 'playing' the KLX is vastly more fun, and frankly, a lot easier to get where you want to go with a lot less effort (and skill, I think).

The brakes are better on the KLX.  The new KLR has finally addressed the brake issue, but the KLX, with its lighter weight and larger rotor, just works better.

However, the KLX is a slightly smaller bike; more like a dirtbike in proprortions instead of a larger trallie like the KLR or DR.  On a really extended highway trip, I'd likely find more comfortable spots to move around on if I had a larger bike; but I'd readily sacrafice that for the better suspension (if nothing else) of the KLX.

It all really comes down to what you want to do with it.  The KLX is a great jack of all trades bikes; much better than a lot of bikes before it, but it still suffers all the DS limitations; and frankly is not going to be as cheap to buy as a used KLR or DR.  The used KLR or DR will get you just about all the places a KLX will; just at a slower pace and with more effort.  There are some great advantages to the KLR over the others for specific applications (luggage/touring mostly).  Make sure you get a bike that doesn't lock you in financially, and one that allows you to exploit a wide range of disciplines of offroading so you can get a good feel for what you really want to do, and what really interests and engages you.

[Albie]

The DRz400S (street legal) is 291lb dry.  The KLX250S is 262lb dry.  While the DRz400E (262lb dry) does have an electric start, it does not have the gear, or really, the electrical system to support street-legalizing (not to mention trying to even do that in your state, much less the cost involved).  Take into consideration that this is primarily a trail bike and won't be happy, at all, on the highway for any amount of time.

Sorry, they're just two very different animals.  However, it does point out that the KLX, still, is better ON road, and STILL doesn't suffer, at all, offroad to the E model.

The E model has a more then adequate electrical system for street legal electrics. The cost can run around $100, unless you want to  spend a lot of extra money just to buy all the parts in a nice little kit,  plus the usual taxes involved which you pay to register ANY bike. Aside from a couple states it's simple to get street legal registration. I know all this because I've actually done the conversion along with 3 other riding buddies. So I'm speaking from actual KNOWLEDGE.

And once again, I'm not arguing which one is better on road, I've never ridden a KLX 250 so I have no basis to argue that point. BTW, how many DRZ E's have you ridden? Why you keep bringing up a one sided argument is beyond me. All I ever pointed out is it is idiotic to make claims that the DRZ is suited to dirt roads, and not single track. That's a load of crap.

[Johnny Monsoon]

The E model has a more then adequate electrical system for street legal electrics. The cost can run around $100, unless you want to  spend a lot of extra money just to buy all the parts in a nice little kit,  plus the usual taxes involved which you pay to register ANY bike. Aside from a couple states it's simple to get street legal registration. I know all this because I've actually done the conversion along with 3 other riding buddies. So I'm speaking from actual KNOWLEDGE.

And once again, I'm not arguing which one is better on road, I've never ridden a KLX 250 so I have no basis to argue that point. BTW, how many DRZ E's have you ridden? Why you keep bringing up a one sided argument is beyond me. All I ever pointed out is it is idiotic to make claims that the DRZ is suited to dirt roads, and not single track. That's a load of crap.

To properly wire the DRzE for street gear is more than just plug and play.  I'm sure there are probably a couple of kits out there that'll try to make it seem that way, and may fulfill the 'letter of the law' but they won't be adequte for true use.

As far as 'legalizing' a dirtbike:  Nope, can't be done in NE; and that follows for many other states, and is becoming more and more the norm.  That's the whole reason KTM went to issuing all their bikes with a street-legal kit available.

I have ridden an older E.  Granted, it was pretty well used, but it didn't hold a candle to the KLX offroad.  Even in the broad open expanses of flat(er) dirt areas that would let us get up to and maintain speeds of about 50mph, there was a huge difference between the two in gearing.  The extra gearing on the KLX made it feel effortless.  Then there's the instrumentation issue...  The KLX has 'em.

Again, I don't think the DRzE is a bad bike, but street is not its purpose, and it still falls a bit short of the KLX.  I just can't see that it is equitable for a newer or intereted DS rider to get into modding a bike and going through the trouble of registration (if even possible in his state) when a perfectly good (and superior in many ways) machine is available that needs no modification at all for a very reasonable price.

[DNA]

This looks nice for you Pacific Northwet guys.  A bit far from home for me though.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2001-KTM-640-LC4-dual-purpose-with-supermoto-wheel-kit_W0QQitemZ130067344953QQihZ003QQcategoryZ6711QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem