need some help deciding

[45 SHOOTER]

Hello all,

Nice forum
sorry for the long winded post.
Ive been lurking on all kinds of MC forums for about 2mths
Ive been riding since 6  and have been out of it for about 10yrs
I have a friend that just left for IRAQ and he left me with his Speed Triple and now I have the bug again for two reasons.
1 I love riding and forgot how much.
2 I commute 75 miles a day min. in a Dodge 1500 w/Hemi and the gas is KILLING ME. So with the Triple managing 42-47mpg Im LOVING IT!
but its just not my idea of comfort at 60-80MPH on the highway

I had a Goldwing in high school and loved it but im older now (39) and want something fun that I can also put the wife on occasionally and take a 3-4hr trip on.  I put her on the Triple and she loved it but she couldn't hardly walk after 3hrs on it.  Course part of that may have been it was her first MC ride and she was TENSE to begin with.

So I'm thinking I want a sport touring bike. probably leaning slightly to the Sport side.  
I want performance in line with the Triple or better (its so nice to be able to pass slow cars again, urban sprawl has killed my times because there is no longer any place to pass slow people in a truck)
I want hardbags and a fairing (goldwing spoiled me)

I'm 6' 190-200lbs the wife is 4"11" 100-110lbs  

I have narrowed it to buying used and I need some comparing and contrasting help

#1 FJR 1300
no particular order from here on.
ZZR 1200
CBR 1100XX
BMW 1200GT (this is a dream I cant afford this thing even used)
Triumph Sprint ST

I have looked a little at the
VFR 800
ST1100 and 1200
Concours
I dont think they have the performance that I want. (could be wrong)  
 
If I have left anything out dont be shy about letting me know.

For those of you with experience with some of these I would like your opinions on these bikes and anything else that you think fits in there.
I'm looking for relative comfort
MPG figures for sane riding (most of the time I'm sane)  
maintenance costs (I'm an aircraft mechanic so ill do it myself)
reliability
anything else I may need to know about a specific model before I buy one .

thanks for the help

Larry

[mica]

My .02.

First I would go sit on a few bikes you may or may not like some things about a bike you are considering.

Can't go wrong with an FJR.

I rode an Honda ST1100 once, thought it was a bit top heavy. The Honda ST1300 is nice, power to pass, adjustable wind screen. I currently ride an VFR, great bike but you might be looking for a bigger windscreen.

Performance. I guess you need to be the judge of that. The VFR can pass with authority at highway speeds as I think any bike on your list probably can.

[Zerosum]

Yeah, the FJR is pretty much the mothership of sporty sport-touring bikes.  IMO, at least.  I can't think of a thing wrong with it, except that it costs more than all of my bikes put together.    But hey, if you have the scratch, go for it.

If you like the Triple, go ahead and get the ST.  I really like sitting on the ST, it feels very comfortable yet sporty.  The rider posture is very similar to the VFR.

I own an older VFR750.  It has plenty of power for me, but it does run out steam as you enter the triple-digit range.  The motor is tuned for a very broad powerband, which is great on back roads, but it may not be the bike for you if you want gobs of top-end power.   I imagine riding 2-up would noticably tax the bike.   In fact, you'd probably find it underpowered compared to that Speed Triple.  It is a very smooth engine, though.

I'm pretty much the exact same size/weight as you, and it's pretty comfortable.  It does help to be in shape, though.  It's a bike that rewards proper posture, ie keeping your spine straight and keeping the weight off your hands.

Re: mpg... the sad reality is that you really don't save money.  Any money you save on gas will go to tires and more frequent maintenance.  That equation may sway in either direction by a few bucks, but it's essentially true.  Especially with higher horsepower bikes.

Also keep in mind that a Triumph will probably cost a good bit more to maintain than one of its Japanese counterparts.

[GilaMonster]

.....Re: mpg... the sad reality is that you really don't save money.  Any money you save on gas will go to tires and more frequent maintenance.  That equation may sway in either direction by a few bucks, but it's essentially true.  Especially with higher horsepower bikes.....

It used to be that way.  When fuel was $2.00/gal, my BMW was roughly $.05/mile and a set of tires were $.08/mile ($400 mounted, Metzeler Z-4) 5,000 mile life).  My diesel truck was $.10/mile for fuel, and a set of tires (6, a dually) was $.015/mile ($600 mounted, 40,000 mile life).  That netted $.13/mile for the bike and $.115/mile for the truck.

Today, at $4.00/gallon, the bike is now $.14/mile for tires & fuel ($400 mounted, Metzeler Z-6, 9,000 mile life), and the truck is $.21/mile. 

This doesn't take into account maintenance, which I am guessing is pretty much a wash, or difference between gas & diesel prices at various times. 

Now, back to the bike choice considerations.  There's nothing wrong with an FJR, but take a serious look at '02-04 BMW K1200RS or GT, ST 1300, or Connie-10.  They all have more than plenty of power (100+), fairing protection for highway speeds, and legendary durability.  I have owned or ridden each of them, and I would rate them for what you describe in the following order mostly for comfort at speed:

1.  '02-04 BMW K1200RS or GT--best overall
2.  Pre-'06 FJR--best sport side
3.  ST 1300--best two up
4.  Concours 1000--best price/value

IMHO, the VFR, and Sprint are great rides but a bit light for highway speed winds, and the Blackbird and ZZR are plenty fast, but not comfortable for 75 mile commute.  Oh, and shaft drive is the only way to go if you are putting on lots of miles. 

Weight is a hassle around town, but a plus at speed for stability.  That's why I have the Multistrada for day rides, and the K1200S for trips.

[fxrbill]

GilaMonster summed it up pretty well.I came off a HD to the ST1300.The SO says that she is much more comfortable on the ST.ST-Owners.com has all the info and more that you will ever need on this bike.Poor performance as it will only do 140mph and the1/4 in 11.2 with 7.7 gals. of gas in it.Takes me all day to pass the squids in the mountains. :lol:So far not one of them has returned the favor.

[1000lbs]

I currently own a Speed Triple and an ST1300...  Both are great bikes, the Speedy is the first bike I've owned that I can't imagine selling...  I went through a very similar list when considering a second bike for the wife and I to ride, and the ST1300 got the nod...  Passanger comfort was a big part of my decision and if you plan on taking your SO on many rides the ST1300 does very well in that regaurd... That plus the V4, shaft drive, and the adj. windshield were some of the main points that tipped the scale...  MPG on the ST is around 38-42 when out of town... On my 7 mile city commute it only gets low 30's...  It does lean more on the touring side of sport touring, but if you are used to hustling a bigger bike around it is still a lot of fun and at my current level of skill I'm not sure I could go much faster on any of the other hard bagged big displacement ST's out there... That being said, I can't arguee against an FJR as a sportier choice, I just wanted to get my hands on a V4 for a while...

[UHOH]

...have been out of it for about 10yrs ...So I'm thinking I want a sport touring bike. ...  
I'm 6' 190-200lbs the wife is 4"11" 100-110lbs  ...

you've good inseam height, some experience, lightweight wife.  
Man you've got you options open  

If I was going to do 2-up a lot, I'd look for 1000cc or better
remember, on any bike, you can always buy a taller windscreen and handlebar adapters

I'm happy with FJR1300, but there's the Concours, ST1100.   I'd get it to fit you;
your wife is petite so she should be kinda easy to fit on anywhere...

[45 SHOOTER]

By chance I stopped in a MC shop today about 50 miles outside of town while on delivery.. they only carry used bikes and had one hell of a selection.

I spotted hardbags on a bike and headed to it with tunnel vision...
Red VFR800 with honda bags... really pretty.  So I sat on it. talked to the sales guy who talked it up and mentioned the FJR...... BANG EYES GO WIDE.... WHERE
he points two rows in front of me where I had just walked right by it...

Blue O6 with the Top bag and 1700 miles ...
he twisted my arm and made me test drive it.  almost broke my arm really...

OH MY GOD  now I understand why everyone loves that bike so much and it has an almost cult following... WOW
To me reading about that bike doesnt do it justice at all.  It has the power of the Speed Triple in a much more refined package. great wind protection even at 90+.. It felt very much piggish while at parking lot speed compared to the Triple but at 25+ mph it flicks like a pure sport bike. maybe its the wide bars on FJR making it feel more nimble... It does everything I want from the 10 min I was on it I putted around at 30-40 hit the Slab and ran to almost triple digits went threw a couple sweepers (not fast)  at 40 MPH I saw an indicated 65mpg at 70mph it was 45MPG  im in love....

Got off the FJR and he offered the VFR.... it wouldnt start so he grabbed one without the bags and I took it.. at low speed parking lot it kicks the FJRs rear.... bigtime. After its moving.... well honestly the only thing I liked was the engine sound at about 8K... thats KEWL. Nice bike does everything ok but the wind protection is not there. The motor wasnt impressive powerwise (I know thats because I have gotten used to the low end grunt of the Triple.) It puts more weight on the wrists for me too.  Nothing wrong with it just not what im looking for... So the VFR is a no.

I guess I have to be fair and test the ST1300 and the Sprint and maybe I can luckout and find a ZZR1200 and Blackbird to compare too... Got a friend bringing his Sprint up from FL this summer and hes promised to let me take her for a little while.

I have to say right now that the FJR.....WOW what a bike.

Thanks for all your replies. Ive still got some looking to do.

[brianm767]

First let me say, I sold my Blackbird and Hayabusa when I bought my ST1300, no it doesn't have near the power they did, but it's the best all arounder bike I've ever owned.

I noticed that in your list, you said the FJR was your first choice, and that is a great one, but then you said the ST1300 and Connie might not have the power you want??  trust me, the Connie has slightly more power than the FJR, and the ST1300 has slightly less than the FJR, but their all pretty close, unless your an expert rider, they will all have enough power for you,

My son and I both have, Blackbirds, well actually I sold mine a few weeks ago, my son is 25 yrs old, he wanted some thing more comfy for longer rides than his Blackbird, he loves riding my St1300, but I suggested he might want to try the FJR since it has sportier styling and a little more power than the St1300, he said , dad when I'm following you on my Blackbird, and your on your St, there's no way in hell I can even come close to keeping up with you, (yes, i have way more experience) so unless your an expert rider, and your able to ride a St or FJR or what ever to it's max limits, their all going to have enough power for you, well IMOP they will.  my son also just bought a ST1300 because he said it was more comfortable then the FJR, now he says he has no desire to ride his Blackbird.

You cant go wrong with a FJR or a ST1300, their both great bikes, each may have a slight advantage or disadvantage in an area or two.
 FJR slightly faster, but the ST makes great TQ down low and right where you need it,
FJR uses regular, St uses premium,
FJR seat is probably better,  the stock St seat sucks!! easy fix through Spencer for about $125 bucks
St is  more comfy, and has more leg room
Drop an St and it will cost you about $15 to repair due to the crash bars, drop a FJR and it could be over $1000 in damage.
FJR has vibrations in the bars at highway cruising speeds, made my hands go numb, I couldn't buy it because of this, grip puppies helped a bit, but it was a deal breaker for me.
The St puts out more engine heat than a 06 or newer FJR, that's a deal breaker for some, I have no problem with it at all. infact when in the sierras at night, I wish for more heat.
FJR 1 yr warranty, St 3years.
FJR looks better, especially with bags off
ST's are pretty much bullet proof, they'll go over 100,000 miles with no problems, not too sure about the FJR maintenance reliability since I went with the St??

i could go on and on, but these sights will tell you all you really need to know about these two bikes,
http://www.st-owners.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=160
http://www.fjrforum.com/forum//index.php?

As far as the Blackbird goes, I've owned two and my son still owns one, fantastic bike, plenty of power, bullet proof motor, well almost, some have problems with cam chain tensioner, if it goes, get your check book out,
puts out a ton of engine heat in the summer, gas tank and frame rails get almost too hot to touch, my Hayabusa never got hot.  makes a great sport tourer with Buell foot pegs and VFR bars, I thought my hayabusa was more comfy on longer rides since it was more compact and about a 4" less reach to the bars,  but the XX ,VFR, ZZR1200, Sprint and Busa are all still a sport bikes, if your riding two up, your wrist get tired from your wife leaning on you.

You cant go wrong with a FJR or St, I'm not too familiar with the Connie other than I hear it puts out ferocious heat on your legs,  and a couple of guys i talked to who sold their FJR's to buy the Connie's, regretted it.

a couple of other options might be the FZ1's ( I prefer the first generation bikes ergos, but they are a bit buzzy) and the new Suzuki Bandit 1250

 Oh and my buddy has stripped the fairing off FJR's and his St, he said the St is much easier to access stuff to work on it.   and I'm also an A&P 22 years now, and Ii find the St is easy to work on, well actually I don't work on it much , it doesn't break, i just maintain it and install mods .

Either way, if the FJR vibes don't bother you while cruising, buy it, it's a fantastic bike, you wont regret it, but you might want to keep an open mind and try out the St1300 before you buy, such as jackieboy did here, started off to buy a FJR or Connie,   then rode the St, you never know you might love it or hate it, but try them all.
http://www.sport-touring.net/forums/index.php/topic,25522.0.html

[county]

Used I'd go with a Blackbird, new, get the Busa

Fast & comfortable and will hold the wife.

[vandy]

I agree with the fjr choice but even if you do go with one of the others you cant go wrong there are so many good ones out there now.
The overall reviews place the fjr a touch better in the twisties than the Kow but the Kow is a little better on the open highway.
Might be a little teathing problems on the Kow yet and I have heard that there is a heat on legs problem like the first gen fjrs had Mine included. but there are fixes for the fjr and should be fixes for the kow.
Holdover 07 models can be had for less than 12k and used ones hardly ever sell below 7 k so they hold there value preaty good.
Good luck in your choice

[Zerosum]

I don't know... it sounds like you've already made up your mind about the FJR.    

Don't belabor the decision, just go buy it!  

[UHOH]

I don't know... it sounds like you've already made up your mind about the FJR.    
Don't belabor the decision, just go buy it!  

good call ... keep Zerosum's advice close to heart, not just for motorcycle shopping, either  
just do  it

[maverik]

Hello everyone, I'm new to this forum, but not to riding, have had many different bikes in the 40 or so years I've been riding,,for the kind of riding you describe, that 06 FJR you found fits the bill in spades,,at 1700 miles, it's not even broke in yet, makes me wonder why ,,before you ride it out of the shop bolt some frame sliders on her, then it wont hurt so bad if you drop that big beautiful doll,,theres a web site called FJR Tech that has valuable info, such as torque. specs and little how to tips,,,enjoy your new ride,,you wont be sorry