Beginning Bike for My Mom

[jadziadax8]

A little background here:
My mom used to ride when she was in college - a little 100cc Suzuki in the mid-'70s to get back and forth to college.  The bike got stolen one night and she never got a new one.

Fast forward to 1995.  She goes and takes the MSF and gets her endorsement.  She's not able to buy a bike due to financial circumstances, but keeps her endorsement.

Fast forward to today.  Mom is now financially stable and wants to buy a motorcycle.  She's looking at cruisers like the Vulcan 900 or Yamaha V Star 1100.  I tried talking her into something like an MP3 (since she's got Minnear's Disease) or a Bonneville (since they are lighter) but she's having none of it.

Does anyone know anyone who's had these bikes as a first bike?  I'm sure they're more noob-friendly than a sport-bike.  How do they hold up?  Is the weight an issue?

[Squareman357]

With sport bikes it's power that's an issue, with cruisers it's weight.  She might want to look at the V-Star 650 first, or I think there is still a Vulcan 500 (with the Ninja 500 engine), or the Honda VLX 650.  She'll definitely want something smaller and lighter to start on until she gets back in the flow again.

[Yankee Dog]

....................there is still a Vulcan 500 (with the Ninja 500 engine),..............

of all the small cruisers out there (not counting the 250s) the Vulcan 500 has the best power.

However its really all a matter of degree.  just let her get what trips her trigger.  

Yankee Dog

[jadziadax8]

of all the small cruisers out there (not counting the 250s) the Vulcan 500 has the best power.

However its really all a matter of degree.  just let her get what trips her trigger.  

Yankee Dog

It's not a matter of letting her do anything, since she is my mom.   Mostly I was asking because I don't know any thing about cruisers, and have never ridden one.  I want to be able to give her good advice about a purchase, since she is already asking me about bikes she's finding on Craig's List.

[Yankee Dog]

you are quite right.

Cuisers vary as much as sport bikes so it hard to give specific advice.  Weight is not as much of a problem since the weight is down low but it is not to be entirely discounted either.  Why not run down to a local dealer or two and sit on a few.  At least it will give her an idea about seat height and weight.  

Yankee Dog

[denisep]

I bought a brand new 2007 Shadow Spirit the day after I finished MSF class..  (what an idiot)..

I'm 5 foot tall, 125 pounds...   it took me MONTHS to master that stupid bike...  turn that front wheel, grab the brake and down it goes.

but, all in all, it was a decent bike-- just depends on your willingness to perservere.

Lots of folks start out on cruisers, just not the easiest thing to re-learn on.

[Triple88a]

Denise, you have to balance both brakes and press them softly not just slam on the front and lock it up

[denisep]

Denise, you have to balance both brakes and press them softly not just slam on the front and lock it up

DUHHHHH!!  

My point is...  a cruiser is tough to pull back up if it starts to go down, during that learning curve time -- 550 pounds of beast

..  once you learn not to grab at things, then it's all a cake walk.

[UHOH]

linky on best bikes for the newer female rider http://www.sport-touring.net/forums/index.php/topic,28730.0.html

but,
 1) she has to decide who she wants to ride with; there is a huge benefit in having a comparable bike to your fellow riders.  
2) when you go to visit her, take her to a dealer that has a ninja 250 in stock that she can sit on.   follow up with a suzuki 500 and SV650 std/naked.  people who have these love them.   all of these bikes are more comfy and fun to ride than the cruisers (OK-  hit me), but don't know how you'll get her to see that.

 if this is really a medium big deal, then try to get her to go to A) a HD/cruiser function and then B) a sport touring / std bike night function so she sees the different types of riders in her area.  

--then you have to let her do her own thing; she's your mom and she's right.

[STeve3b3]

fwiw,
My BIL bought a Vulcan 900 after not having ridden in quite a few years.  He's maybe 5'6" and 170lbs, and it fits him well.  So far, (~1month) he likes it.
You might also have your mom look at the Hyosung GV650.  My wife's been lusting after that one, being a cruiser girl herself.

Steve

[jadziadax8]

l1) she has to decide who she wants to ride with; there is a huge benefit in having a comparable bike to your fellow riders.

I think this is a big part of her wanting the V Star 1100.  One of her friends at the school she teaches at has one.  Another one of the women at her school rides a Harley.

I've talked to her about how tough a heavy bike would be to learn on.  She says that if I have trouble picking up my Ninja, then she would have trouble with anything above a 250, so she might as well get the big heavy bike she wants.  *sigh*  I think I'm going to lose this battle.

At least she's willing to look at a bunch of different bikes.  She went out on Sunday to look at a Tiger 955.    Needless to say, it didn't thrill her.

[Triple88a]

cant you rent a bike (vstar1100) for a day to see if she likes it?  She might change her mind as soon as she takes off.

[chimera]

..  once you learn not to grab at things, then it's all a cake walk.

   


On Topic: I've ridden a Vulcan and a small Sportster.  Of the two, I'd pick the Vulcan just because it costs so little for a perfectly good small cruiser

[OrangeSVS]

How about a sportster?  (serious)
It's reasonably priced, got some serious "cred" amongst a certain population of riders, and looks cool.

[jadziadax8]

How about a sportster?  (serious)
It's reasonably priced, got some serious "cred" amongst a certain population of riders, and looks cool.

Can you disown your parents in reverse for doing something like that?

[jadziadax8]

Well, it appears that my mom is being more stubborn about this subject than I could imagine her being.  I wrote her a long and imploring email about why I thought a smaller bike would be better to start out on.  I wanted to be honest about what I thought of starting on a large bike.  I tried to couch everything in a positive manner, wanting to point out possible areas where things could go wrong on a large bike, without making it sound like I didn't think she could EVER handle one.

The next couple of paragraphs may be full of things you don't want to hear, but please read it with an open mind.  The things I'm saying are the same pieces of advice I'd give to any friend who wanted to start riding.

I'm really, really, excited about the idea of hopping on the bikes and riding up and down the River Road with you, Nate, and Dave.  I think it would be the coolest thing ever to go riding with my mom.  In fact, we have some friends from our riding group that ride as a family.  Matt is our age and Mark and Diane are your age.  Mark rides a Triumph Trophy and Diane rides a Piaggio MP3 (that really weird 3 wheel bike that leans like a regular motorcycle) after ditching a Vulcan (she hated the weight; says it would fall over at the drop of a hat and crushed her leg once).  I envy how they go on bike trips together.

All this being said, I don't think it is a good idea for anyone to start out riding on an 1100 cc motorcycle.  It's going to be very difficult to learn how to make low speed and fast braking maneuvers on a bike that big, let alone learning how to lean into a curve.  You may say, "but we're in Illinois, there's no curves!"  What happens if you go past your skill level on a cloverleaf?  It would be easy to low-side if you don't have the skills.  You yourself said you had trouble understanding countersteering.  You need to know how to do it, and the bigger the bike is, the harder that is.  What happens if you're riding to work and someone cuts you off?  An 1100 will not be able to make a quick lane change to get you out of trouble.  I know you're worried about stability and power on the freeway, but stability has a lot more to do with steering geometry than weight or engine size.  I never had any trouble on the freeway with the Burgman 400, and I have a friend who regularly rides from North Carolina to Illinois on a Ninja 250.

Why not get something small and cheap, ride it for 5000 miles, and sell it for about as much as you bought it for?  People do this all the time, trust me.  You'll be a better rider in the end, and will be able to have fun on the bigger bike you obviously lust after.  I'm not trying to talk you out of getting a bigger bike, eventually.  I'm just trying to convince you that you will have a better time motorcycling if you take it slow and learn the skills you need on something small before tackling the big bikes.  BTW, have you thought about taking the MSF again to brush up one your skills?

I must have blown it, because this is the response I got from her today.

Dear Maggie,  I have read with an open mind and I understand your concerns.  However, I happen to disagree with you. I see no reason to "work my way up" to an 1100.  I want you to know that I love you and am touched by your concern.  Honestly, I am probably taking as big a risk riding the trike on the highway.  I am realistic about riding a motorcycle.  Basically I am invisible and the world will be out to get me.  I am not blithely disregarding your advice.  I just am not convinced.  I'll be riding on Lisa's V-star in the near future and that will give me an idea as to what I want.  I assure you that I won't buy a bike that makes me feel uncomfortable or "on the edge".  In the meantime try not to be anxious.  Trust that I understand my limits and capabilities.  Love, Mom

[chimera]

Yeah, you got "the hand".

A Vstar 1100 is not all that hard to handle at speed.  It's the parking lot, left turns, garages, etc. that will challenge your mom.  You tried your best and all you can do is wish her well  

[Ghost Dog]

Can I assume Minnears disease causes some sort of balance impairment?

Geez, I'd stick to a trike. But if you can't convince her, then I'd suppose a bike with the lowest seat and lowest center of gravity possible (with sliders and engine protection bars) would be the best choice.

[jadziadax8]

Can I assume Minnears disease causes some sort of balance impairment?

Geez, I'd stick to a trike. But if you can't convince her, then I'd suppose a bike with the lowest seat and lowest center of gravity possible (with sliders and engine protection bars) would be the best choice.

Minnear's Disease does affect balance and hearing.  Basically it makes you dizzy and then throw up.

She won't even consider a trike, or anything like it.  I showed her a Piaggio MP3 since it leans like a motorcycle and she said she might as well get a convertible.

[Triple88a]

IT'S HER FIRST BIKE, NOT HER LAST

[jadziadax8]

IT'S HER FIRST BIKE, NOT HER LAST

Are you making a suggestion to me or to her?

That's what I've been trying to convey to her as well.  I'm just afraid she's going to end up like this guy.  If this is a legit deal, I'd bet anything he thought he wanted a big mean cruiser, and then realized he didn't like riding it because it was hard to handle and uncomfortable.  Hence he's selling it.

[cultureslayer]

Maybe find someone else with balance issues or similar problem to send her an email?

She can write you off as an over concerned daughter but maybe someone with a similar problem will be listened to.  

[jadziadax8]

Maybe find someone else with balance issues or similar problem to send her an email?

She can write you off as an over concerned daughter but maybe someone with a similar problem will be listened to.  

An excellent point.  I wonder if there's anyone here who is riding with Minnear's Disease.  I think I'll go ask the question over on the General Discussion board.

[Jes_VFR]

I hate to sound blase about this, but she did say she was going to ride her friends 1100.

What do you think will happen when she drops it in the parking lot?
Will that be enough to convince her to look at a smaller and lighter bike.
If so show her that there is more than small and big cruisers, show her the middle and upper middle weights (like maybe an vulcan 800, shadow 750 or a boulevard 50series) these are not the little cruisers, but they are not the 1100 beasts either.
Also show her the more upright fz6 and fz1000, the sv650 (not the full faired model)and its big brother the base sv1000, the bandit, the ninja 650r.
ask her to at least sit on those bikes so she can see how much easier they are to balance.

[jadziadax8]

I hate to sound blase about this, but she did say she was going to ride her friends 1100.

What do you think will happen when she drops it in the parking lot?
Will that be enough to convince her to look at a smaller and lighter bike.
If so show her that there is more than small and big cruisers, show her the middle and upper middle weights (like maybe an vulcan 800, shadow 750 or a boulevard 50series) these are not the little cruisers, but they are not the 1100 beasts either.
Also show her the more upright fz6 and fz1000, the sv650 (not the full faired model)and its big brother the base sv1000, the bandit, the ninja 650r.
ask her to at least sit on those bikes so she can see how much easier they are to balance.

I hope she doesn't drop it, but I also hope it shows her how hard they are to manage.  She's really impatient about this whole thing, and I bet she'll go out and buy one without finding the time for a test ride.

I asked her about why she's so gung-ho about having a big bike and she told me that a 900 - 1100 cc bike is a middleweight cruiser to her.    I told her I wouldn't say another word if she took the MSF BRC again before buying the bike.  She said that they were all full, and she wanted to take it again after she'd had some saddle time.    I told her that you can walk in to any of them and sign up for an alternate position.  We'll see what happens.

I've been showing her all sorts of different bikes.  I've sent links to 650s and 700s.  I won't bother about anything that looks remotely sporty.  She sat on my Ninja 650 and said it was too tall for her.  I think she's picturing herself as Rose's alter ego from Rose is Rose.

[Triple88a]

Tell her to try as a walk in (there is a better chance of getting in early in the mourning).  I got in on a course that started Saturday mourning.

[jadziadax8]

Tell her to try as a walk in (there is a better chance of getting in early in the mourning).  I got in on a course that started Saturday mourning.

Thanks for the suggestion.

I told her that you can walk in to any of them and sign up for an alternate position.  We'll see what happens.

 

[sscully]

Sorry to hear about your situation here, but I do have to interject that if she had a 1100 she could pick it up, if she did it correctly.

Skertz has been around for some time, and this is what I sent to my DDS when he ( mistakenly ) bought a behemoth HD ( he is 5'10" maybe about 160# ).

http://www.pinkribbonrides.com/
 
I tried this method with my '88 GL1500 ( prior to the 2002 ZG ) and it made it so much easier hefting that beast off its side ( at the time I could mussel damn near anything with enough time & determination, now I wouldn't be able to walk straight for a week if I tried that ).  

This only addresses the up righting of a downed beast, not addressing if she is "ready" for X bike.

I will say I started on a Kawk CSR305 back in 1984 and I rode that bike to death,  keeping pace with dad and the BMW group to BMW rallies.

Everyone else in the group had larger displacement bikes ( R100RS/7 with Windjammer, R100RS/7 stock plastic, R90S, etc ), but did not get stupid with passing multiple cars, etc ( i.e. they knew how to ride in a group ).

If she is with a HD crowd, what is the HP on those, 53 to 73 ?  The 1100 in the group is the highest I am guessing.  If the group rides like a group, this is not an issue.

A guy at the Starbucks just got a Shadow 750, and it looks huge next to a Shadow VLX ( 600 )
The 750 is 496# ( ~100# less then the ZG ) for the version I looked up quick.
Rake is 34*, vs a standard in the 28-29* range.

An 1100 I think is going to be ~ 600# ( on par with the ZG, but distribution is bit different ).

If physical size is the name of the game here, have her look into a 750 class cruiser, the dimensions "look" similar While shedding some sprung weight.  If this is a displacement plate issue, not much you can say about it  

Hope this helps with the obvious parts of the conversation, the other about Minnear's Disease I have no input on.  I could go either way with that one with the no knowledge I have about it.

Good luck finding out why an 1100 is the answer
 

[Triple88a]

Thanks for the suggestion.

Also when she is doing her exams at the end of the course, tell her to go slower and not use the speedometer on the bikes   When i did my exam i went by the speed on the speedometer and i screwed up.  If you go slower they will make you do it again because you're going slow (no punishment points), if you go too fast and screw up.. too bad for you.

I went fast and i clipped a cone when i did the swerve which killed my score so i failed.

[phoenix]

Is there any chance that her gal-pals could talk to her about her bike choice? Or maybe I skipped over something that said they were encouraging the 1100 as her starter bike. I would *hope* that some of her peers could have the same type of discussion with her, and she would accept those comments. Its looking a bit like she doesn't want to take pointers from her daughter.

Just a quick note. I had a V-Star 1100. I've had a few cruisers. Although I think that many cruisers are fantastic looking machines, I just end up feeling negatively about them and I'm pretty sure I won't go in that direction again. The riding position to me just does not inspire confidence. I just don't feel like I am in total control of the bike like I do when I'm on a standard or a sportbike. The laid back seating position only made me feel like I was along for the ride, with not enough control. Going from a sportbike to the 1100, I also didn't like the slow steering and lack of ground clearance.

I wish you could talk into something along the lines of a Yamaha XT225. Small light, and no worries if it tips over. Yeah, its on the complete other side of the spectrum of the V-Star and I doubt you would have any chances with suggesting it. I'm tempted to think that she would just have to learn from her own choices and I hope there's no hard lessons.

A few weeks ago my dad (72 years old and has his own set of health issues) said something along the lines that he was thinking about getting a GoldWing. I think it would be his first bike. I don't think he's even taken a spin around the block on a motorcycle in 20 years. But he was fairly vague about it so I don't think its going to happen.

[jadziadax8]

I wish you could talk into something along the lines of a Yamaha XT225. Small light, and no worries if it tips over. Yeah, its on the complete other side of the spectrum of the V-Star and I doubt you would have any chances with suggesting it. I'm tempted to think that she would just have to learn from her own choices and I hope there's no hard lessons.

A lot of it is about ccs, I think.  She won't even consider a 250.  I asked.  She thinks she needs the power.  What she doesn't understand hp/weight ratios, but I'm not sure I even want to get into that conversation, because it will probably get her thinking about bigger bikes.

[Triple88a]

What she doesn't understand hp/weight ratios, but I'm not sure I even want to get into that conversation, because it will probably get her thinking about bigger bikes.

Compare it to a car then.  A bike has much much better ratio.

[STeve3b3]

This thread petered out a few years ago and I just stumbled upon it checking out post's I'd replied to.

Did your mom ever get the 1100?

How did she do?

Steve

[jadziadax8]

This thread petered out a few years ago and I just stumbled upon it checking out post's I'd replied to.

Did your mom ever get the 1100?

How did she do?

Steve

Well, she decided that with the Minnear's Disease and all that 2 wheels were not enough.  Therefore she bought a used Porsche.  She got a great deal on it and had a lot of fun last summer with it.  I still haven't gotten to drive it, though.

[bassjones]

Well, she decided that with the Minnear's Disease and all that 2 wheels were not enough.  Therefore she bought a used Porsche.  She got a great deal on it and had a lot of fun last summer with it.  I still haven't gotten to drive it, though.

   There's always the Can-Am Spyder now...

[Loki]

Well, she decided that with the Minnear's Disease and all that 2 wheels were not enough.  Therefore she bought a used Porsche.  She got a great deal on it and had a lot of fun last summer with it.  I still haven't gotten to drive it, though.

Your Mom hasn't dropped it yet has she?

One thing you forgot to mention is this whole thread...there is a history of dropping bikes in the family.  (ducking here)  Lol

Just sayin'

Hugzz

P;

[jadziadax8]

Your Mom hasn't dropped it yet has she?

One thing you forgot to mention is this whole thread...there is a history of dropping bikes in the family.  (ducking here)  Lol

Just sayin'

Hugzz

P;

Hey, it wasn't my fault.  Someone around here just has to have a gravel driveway.

 

[jsanford]

Can you disown your parents in reverse for doing something like that?

+1

Take her around to several shops and have her sit on everything, even bikes she shouldn't get at her current level of experience. Tell her there are a lot of new options out there since 1995.  Since she sat on a Tiger, it sounds like she's open to other models.

As for styles, it doesn't really matter as much amongst friends. As a woman rider she's going to stand out in mixed company anyway.