1993 ZX1100 Overhaul or Trash-haul?

[APCZX11]

I am looking for some advise, or at the very least, opinions on the following questions.

Part 1:
I have a 1993 Kawasaki ZX1100 D-1 with about 30,000 miles. I have had several mechanical issues with the bike in the 14 moths that I have owned it. Now I can't keep the coolant from overheating and "boiling/expanding" out of the reservoir tank. Up till now, the temperature gauge has not gone passed the half way mark. Any ideas?

Part 2:
I really like the bike when it runs well, but she does not always run well. I have had the thought of putting the bike into a shop and tell them to go over the bike from stem to stern. What do you think that this would cost?

At what point, dollar wise, would you stop putting money into a 16 year old bike?

Let you opinions fly, and thanks.

Alex  

[M.Brane]

 I'm probably not the best person to ask since I ride a 21-year-old bike (I do all my own wrenching), but you might start with a new radiator cap if there are no coolant leaks.

[DredheadV2.0]

What kind of problems are you having when it's not running right?

Does it happen completely randomly, or have you noticed any kind of a pattern?

[APCZX11]

The coolant flows out of the overflow tube on the coolant reservoir under the seat and one other place in the same area, but I have not been able to pin point it.

Earlier this year I noticed coolant leaking from the engine area. The shop diagnosed it as a "cool" leak due to the O-rings being old. As the block cooled, the block contracted and the coolant leaked out around the ports where the coolant manifold enters and exists the block. This appeared to work for nearly 1,1000 miles, now the coolant leaks out of the over-flow.

At first I thought that the systems was over-filled, but last night I had to add over a quart directly to the radiator and the reservoir was empty.

As for my history of the bike, I paid $3,550 for the bike and have put in another $800.00. Part of my problem is that I am not mechanically savvy enough to do some of the work, so the labor is a high portion of the cost?

[dj313]

Sounds like a head gasket to me.  Find your local kawasaki group and have a repair party.  Buy beer and ask someone to bring some tools to help you replace your head gasket.  It should take the better part of the day, but you'll meet some new people and learn a bunch about your bike.

BTW, I chased a bunch of stuff on my bike over 6 months.  Did leak checks, replaced caps, hoses, o-rings etc.  The mechanics in the know told me head gasket, but I'm thick...  

[M.Brane]

As for my history of the bike, I paid $3,550 for the bike and have put in another $800.00. Part of my problem is that I am not mechanically savvy enough to do some of the work, so the labor is a high portion of the cost?

 Yeah unless you can diagnose, and repair the bike yourself you're gonna end up upside-down on it real quick.

 If the cooling system has leaks it can't pressurize properly which causes the coolant to boil at too low a temp. Most bikes run pretty hot so this is more critical than the average cage.

 If the leaks are coming from plumbing it can be a relatevely easy fix once you find 'em. If they're coming from the engine itself that means major work. Believe me I know. I just finished installing the 3rd head gasket on my ZX600. I don't know about the ZX11, but on my 600 there are no oil passages in the cylinder block. When the gasket goes bad it just starts leaking out the sides.

[birdrunner]

Did you overfill your coolant?   I did that once,  boy did I feel stupid when the mechanic pointed out the "fill" line on reservoir, and explain that it was there for a reason  (hot coolant expands).

me bad.

But naturally you wouldn't be THAT silly?   I like to think of myself as a league of my own when it comes to mechanical thingys.

[Andrew]

Here is a long shot, have you bled out the air bubbles out of the water pump. There is a small bolt in the water pump, if removed/loosened up the trapped air will bleed out. If this is not done when filling up an empty system the water pump can not push the coolant around due to a large air pocket at the impeller.
Second thought, do you have a cooling system pressure pump. If so pressurize the cooling sys and check for leaks (both cold and warm engine) If you do not have the pump, get one very helpful tool.
Third thought, replace the rad cap (I think it is the same cap as a mid 90s Honda)

[MK96xj]

Sounds like a head gasket to me.  

I am with DJ. If it is pushing out before coming up to temp and you have a history of coolant leakage at the engine already my guess is you ened a full engine overhaul. If for nothing else just the gaskets.

[APCZX11]

Thanks to all of you. You have given me a few new options to investigate.

If the head gasket has failed, is it cost effective/worth it to re-build, or should I start shopping now?

AC

[DredheadV2.0]

I am with DJ. If it is pushing out before coming up to temp and you have a history of coolant leakage at the engine already my guess is you ened a full engine overhaul. If for nothing else just the gaskets.

If it's the head gasket, how does that explain the intermittent running well?

[M.Brane]

 A head gasket is not a bad job if you have the tools, time, and can follow the shop manual. It's a lot of time labor-wise so to have a shop do it won't be cheap.

 After doing mine for the 3rd time I can practically do it blindfolded.

 I can't find anything wrong with it. My conclusion is it's just a poor design, and doesn't deal well with being flogged uphill at lower speeds on hot days.

If it's the head gasket, how does that explain the intermittent running well?

 I'd bet that's another problem altogether. Likely ignition or fuel related. Depends on how bad the gasket is. If it's sucking coolant into the cylinders that could make it run bad, but if that was the case it would likely be steaming out the exhaust.

[MK96xj]

If it's the head gasket, how does that explain the intermittent running well?

A head gasket can fail in different ways.

[APCZX11]

FWIW:

I have agonized over which way I should go concerning this bike.

I was this "" close to buying a new bike. As I was running things by the wife, she suggested that I try one last time to find a mechanic that could look over the bike from stem to stern. Fortunately I found a good mechanic who was able to facilitate the repairs.

I am not overly mechanically talented, but here is my understanding of the core problems with the bike.

The coolant system was losing coolant due to a pinched O-ring on the return manifold from the block. For what ever reason the O-ring did not leak when the bike was cold or hot, only warm. The shop intially did a leak down test, but found no leak. They then ran the bike and inspected it for leaks, still none. They parked the bike and after about 30 minutes the mechanic noticed a small pool of coolant. He pressured up the system, still no leak. He ran the bike again, still no leak. He then shut off the engine, and then looked at it about every 10-15 minutes, on the second inspection he found the leak.

There was a hole in one of the carburetor diaphragms, and the "jets" were replaced. I had them perform a full service check, carb sinc., valve check (only 1 out at 31,000 miles) as well as a compression test, and a tune up.

They also told me that one of the problems with the carburetors was allowing the gas to mix with and dilute my engine oil. This too appears to have been corrected. The bike used to smoke some, but I thought it was due to the nature of the D+D exhaust, it also had a very strong "exhaust" odor. The bike now fires up quickly, the throttle response is instant, and my mileage has increased nearly 10%, running at 75-90MPH. My last tank was 45.2 MPG.

Even though the bill was $790.00, the bike runs better than it ever has since I have owned it. If she keeps running well, I will ride the paint off of her.

Alex

[PhilBiker]

Awesome!  The ZX-11 motor is built like a tank, but age can be the enemy of even the most well built motor.  Glad you got it running, that's a great bike and definitely worth keeping!

[M.Brane]

 Good to see you got it sorted out.

 Looks like a lot of the problems were related to rubber parts. This can happen on older bikes that sit.

[maropa9]

Hello everybody. I have a ZX11 (in Europe ZZR 1100) 1993. I was not given any problem in  153.000kms. I have respect revisions and maintenance. With the age of our motorcycle must be brought forward to wear the pieces on everything from rubber. Change oil and filter at 5000 kms.ELF moto 10W40 semisint.
It's a great bike and can last a long time. The mine would stay in the garage for good.
Here's a picture of a tour yesterday of 300 kms


Excuse my bad english.

[Lon]

Someone gave me a 1991 VFR.  I have just over $2000 in parts in to it right now (did all the labor but tire mounting myself / with friends) - this excludes my crash which was another $630

Oh, it had 49,000 miles when I picked it up.  Has 51,500 or so now...

http://spreadsheets.google.com/a/metamorphism.com/ccc?key=p7SD6gh9vXnrP4mFhMzK9LQ&hl=en

[Tar Snake]

Third thought, replace the rad cap (I think it is the same cap as a mid 90s Honda)

The key here for Concours/ZX-11/GPZ owners is it's the same cap as a mid-1990's Honda automobile and about zillion other cars. You can buy a cap at any autoparts store for a few bucks. If you're unsure what to get look up 1991 dodge colt, it's the same cap.

[M.Brane]

The key here for Concours/ZX-11/GPZ owners is it's the same cap as a mid-1990's Honda automobile and about zillion other cars. You can buy a cap at any autoparts store for a few bucks. If you're unsure what to get look up 1991 dodge colt, it's the same cap.

 I wonder if my ZX600 shares that cap? The last one I bought cost me nearly $30.