Engine Heat Uly vs Bolt

[2DFlyer]

Depending on who you talk to you get different stories about how much heat you get off the XB12 engines.  I've never heard anyone with an R complain about roasting but I seem to see a lot of references to how uncomfortable the X or S can be around town.

Anyone know why or if there is a difference?  R pilots never slow down?

I'm a woose that can't stand the heat.  The Bolt has been on the short list since '02.  I've come close a couple of times and got distracted by something else.

[Kootenanny]

R pilots never slow down?

You might have something there!  

I will say that I have never really noticed the heat off my 'Bolt, until recently--I was working out of town, and actually had to commute through city traffic for a couple of weeks.  Because of the long ride home, and not knowing what the weather would be, I had my JR Ballistic gear with me, rather than the leathers I prefer (but which suck in the rain).  Of course, having my weatherproof gear with me meant it was warm and sunny the whole time, and I gotta say that sitting in traffic in the sun really sucks!  And in those conditions, yes I could feel the heat under my left thigh.  Nothing unendurable or anything, but it was definitely there.  

Under way, though, there is absolutely no problem with heat from the 'Bolt.  And perhaps, since I very seldom have to sit in traffic--almost all my riding is on rural highways and backroads--I had simply never noticed the heat before.

One nice thing about Buell is that the dealers usually offer demo rides (one reason I own a Buell, since I refuse to buy a bike I've never ridden).  Take a test ride yourself and see if you like the bike or not.  Buells are great, real-world bikes--if you're looking for a bench-racer, best look elsewhere, but of all the bikes I've ridden, nothing compares with the Buell for sheer riding enjoyment.

[Rogue]

If you look at a 'Bolt and a Uly side by side, you will see there there is this opening on the Uly's chassis near the rear cylinder.  This opening allows rear cylinder heat to escape up towards the rider's right thigh (the rear cylinder is closer to the right than the left).  It is inherent in the raised chassis design of the Uly.  The 'Bolt doesn't have such an opening.  And even though the rear cylinder sits closer to the rider's right thigh (lower rear subframe), the forward portion of the seat and the enclosed frame rails keep the heat from flowing up towards the rider.  Even when the rear cooling fan goes on, it directs heat towards the rear and below the seat.  So again, very little heat hits the rider.  That's not to say there is no heat.  On a hot day when you are sitting in traffic, the right rear frame rail gets hot (but not enough to burn).  You will feel that if you are wearing jeans or thinner pant material.  I can't even imagine how that would feel with shorts!  But with riding pants, even thin ones, heat on the Firebolt is not an issue.  Honestly, you can't expect it to be otherwise.  The rear cylinder sits no more than 4" away from your thigh!  

The good thing is, as soon as you start moving, whatever heat there is completely goes away.  And since that is where most people ride their bikes anyways, I would chalk it up to a slight inconvenience!  If you like riding at parade speeds often, do NOT get a Buell.  If you are sensitive to heat, do NOT get a Buell.  Oh and vibes at idle too.  And dancing turn signals.  All of these will manifest itself in slow going, stop and go traffic.  And if you are a sensitive person, it will eat at you and you will hate the bike and then you will come in here whining and complaining and ask why, why, why?        My only suggestion is for you to take that Buell and find yourself a wide open road and ride the piss out of it.  That is when it is most happy!  

[Brad1445]

I have had owned two Bolts and one Uly.  If the fan cycle is any indicator of heat the Uly fan never shuts up/off compared to the Bolt's.  I'm guessing that meant more heat.

I vaguely recall some reference that the longer Uly frame covered more of the rear jug.  Not sure if it true but I know for a fact the fan noise on the Uly was obnoxiously loud and long running very odd and  disruptive in serene rural settings.

[Kootenanny]

Interesting comments, Brad.  The fan on my 'Bolt doesn't bother me, in fact it's a bit of a conversation starter sometimes when I shut my bike off in the presence of other riders.  I have noticed that the fan runs less with synthetic oil in the engine...must have better heat transfer capability, or something.

Like Rogue says, the heat is only noticeable when sitting still.  Honestly, I hear guys talking about how much Buells shake at idle, how much the turnsignals dance around, etc.--but I don't see it, yeah my signals vibrate a bit at idle, but not so much you'd notice, and mostly because they're on rubber mounts.  The thing that I noticed most when stuck in traffic is the clutch...I've never really noticed how stiff it is, because I only used it to shift gears, and seldom had to hold it in while stopped.  Well, crawling along in city traffic, I gotta say, I finally realized just how stiff the clutch on my Buell is.  Thankfully, I'm back home in the sticks again, I'll leave the city commuting to those tougher than I am.

[Rogue]

Koot, Buell fixed the stiff clutch in 2006.  Now it's as light as most Japanese clutches.

[Baz]

Calling a Buell rider a pilot is sort of like calling a dash 8 pilot a astronaut no?  

[2DFlyer]

I demo'd a Uly awhile back and rented a 12R for a day without noticing anything on either but I didn't spend any time standing still and I've never lived with them.  I'm treating myself to a day on an S in the next couple of weeks and I'll pay more attention.

One thing I wondered about was the pegs.  The bolt has the knees tucked up higher and feet further back.  Maybe this makes a difference.

[2DFlyer]

Calling a Buell rider a pilot is sort of like calling a dash 8 pilot a astronaut no?  

I think of Buell pilots in the same sense as the 1930's barnstormers.  I think they're connected to their rides in the same way and both have to be just a little loose between the ears.    Not sure what that would make a Dash 8 pilot - a bus driver?

[Bueller]

You can try the Uly without the front fender for a while.  This is what is supposed to be a big factor the difference in the increased heating in Ulys and STTs.  If that makes a difference you can fit a low guard.  Trouble is that a small part of the travelling forks remains exposed to stones when you do this.  

I've noticed that the '09 Ss has a gap above the guard that exposes the sliders.  Be interesting to see if this causes problems.

[Kootenanny]

Koot, Buell fixed the stiff clutch in 2006.  Now it's as light as most Japanese clutches.

Yeah, but my bike's older than that, and the clutch is stiff.  Like I say, it doesn't bother me, except when I'm sitting in traffic (which is very, very seldom...).

If I had to commute, I'd be looking to buy a Ducati 620 Multistrada.  Discontinued now, but when I rode one at a demo, I immediately thought it'd be great for commuting--the seating position is upright, the bike is light and comfortable, and the clutch is so light you think something's wrong with it!

But for my use--rural backroads and mountain highways 99% of the time--the Firebolt is perfect.

[Bueller]

Hi Kootenanny

I stock the MullerPower clutch, and for a lower priceTrojan has the soft clutch which is possibly as good.  It is just a change to the lever activated by the cable.  40% reduction in clutch pull without an equivant reduction in throw.  Makes Einstein look like a genius.  You can fit one without removing the primary case

[Kootenanny]

Thanks, Bueller, I'm familiar with the Muller Powerclutch, and also with a few other aftermarket units (including a hydraulic system).  But like I said, the stiff clutch on my 'Bolt doesn't bother me--it wasn't until I had to spend some time commuting in city traffic that I had any issues.  Thankfully, I very seldom have to sit in traffic...from my home, I have to ride 10 km or so to get to the closest traffic light, and another 25 km or so to find the next one.

That said, I might still consider a Muller, as long as the throwout is still sufficient (add a longer lever arm to the clutch lever, but keep the cable movement the same, gives you less throwout...do you change the ball bearings and ramps with the Muller, too?)

[Bueller]

Thanks, Bueller, I'm familiar with the Muller Powerclutch, and also with a few other aftermarket units (including a hydraulic system).  But like I said, the stiff clutch on my 'Bolt doesn't bother me--it wasn't until I had to spend some time commuting in city traffic that I had any issues.  Thankfully, I very seldom have to sit in traffic...from my home, I have to ride 10 km or so to get to the closest traffic light, and another 25 km or so to find the next one.

That said, I might still consider a Muller, as long as the throwout is still sufficient (add a longer lever arm to the clutch lever, but keep the cable movement the same, gives you less throwout...do you change the ball bearings and ramps with the Muller, too?)

Not that I recall. I'll be going back to the storage pretty soon so I can check.  The new cluth cables are also much lighter.  There are a lot of people breaking the hollow adjuster bolt when tightening them into the primary so you have to be light in the touch.

I'll post a pick of the muller.  I am sure it is only the lever.

[Bueller]

Hi Kootenanny

This is a link to it on ASB

http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-prodshow/16077.html

It has a pic which shows the components.  They do change the balls.  I couldn't see all components without opening the pack.

[Thunderbox]

You can try the Uly without the front fender for a while.  This is what is supposed to be a big factor the difference in the increased heating in Ulys and STTs.  If that makes a difference you can fit a low guard.  Trouble is that a small part of the travelling forks remains exposed to stones when you do this.  

I've noticed that the '09 Ss has a gap above the guard that exposes the sliders.  Be interesting to see if this causes problems.

I have my fender changed out with one from the XT.  So far I haven''t noticed any difference in heat.  I can't say I had any complaint about heat in the first place either.  I always wear gear and therefor it hasn't been a problem.

As far as exposing the forks to rocks I wouldn't worry about it.  Sitting on the stand there is abour 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch exposed above the gaurd on the fender.  When you sit on the bike it disappears.  It does look a heck of a lot better than the cheap looking plastic and the beak.

[Bueller]

I have my fender changed out with one from the XT.  So far I haven''t noticed any difference in heat.  I can't say I had any complaint about heat in the first place either.  I always wear gear and therefor it hasn't been a problem.

As far as exposing the forks to rocks I wouldn't worry about it.  Sitting on the stand there is abour 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch exposed above the gaurd on the fender.  When you sit on the bike it disappears.  It does look a heck of a lot better than the cheap looking plastic and the beak.

Good point about the forks dropping when there is a load.  Thanks

[2DFlyer]

Had an '06 X out for the day the other day.  Heat no big deal in mixed riding.  A little toasty at the right knee but just opening up the legs a bit took care of the worst of it.  It came and went so I can only think it was noticeable when the fan was running.  Seems odd that the fan would have to run when motoring along at 60+

[Rogue]

Been commuting daily on my Firebolt.

One day it was 95 degrees out and I got stuck sitting at several long interval intersections.  

I had work slacks on.  The fan was running.  My bike was standing still.  FOOK!  I was miserably hot and I had my right leg down and the heat from the engine hit my inner thigh.  Ouch!  It was HOT!  I switched to putting my left foot down and was relieved.  

These XB's would NOT be my first choice if you plan on doing a lot of stop and go city riding in temps above 85 degrees!  Granted, any bike sitting and running in 95 degree heat would not be happy, the XB's are even LESS happy!

Fortunately, as soon as you start moving, all is foregiven!