Grisos Square Off -- 1100 versus new 1200 8V

[MisterSmooth]

For the last few months as I’ve been wandering in and out of Moto International (Seattle’s Aprilia and Guzzi dealer) the Moto Guzzi Griso has been catching my eye.  Dave has three or four 1100cc Grisos hanging around the showroom floor like nightclub bouncers.  Shiny and black, like my soul.

When the Griso came out (in 2005?), I thought that it looked cool but lacked a mission.  It was a more macho but less usable Breva.  It didn’t have hard luggage or a windscreen.  Was it a power cruiser without the power?  A 550 pound city bike?  A mellow country lanes bike, but without a real back seat?

But with time I’ve begun to appreciate the Griso’s looks more and more.  And then Dave got in a 2009 Griso 8V.  This is the new, improved Griso with a 1200cc engine that we first saw here in the States in the Stelvio.  This is the Griso that won BIKE magazine’s four-bike comparo this month.

Let’s say that again, because you don’t get to say it that often.  A Moto Guzzi won a comparison test in Britain’s largest bike magazine.  Given the quality of British bike mags like BIKE, you could effectively argue that this meant that an 8V Griso came out on top in a test in the best bike magazine in the world.

So I kept wandering through Moto International’s showroom while they fixed my Mille’s clutch, and lingering as they mounted freshy fresh OZ wheels on my Tuono, and I’d swing a leg over that new Griso and wonder what this was about.  And say to myself, “I should ride the old Griso and the new Griso back to back.”

It became one of those things in life that sounds like fun but was just too easy to put off.  For some reason yesterday I had one of those “Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday…hey!  There is no ‘someday!’” epiphanies and decided to go see Dave the very next sunny morning.

This was that morning.  After hitting the gym and obtaining the all-important hall pass from my wife I rode the Tuono over to MI and was first handed the keys to the new 8V Griso.

It looked like a black Griso but here on STN, it doesn’t exist without pictures so here it is.




Note the sunny weather--it doesn’t rain every day in Seattle.  Actually, from July 4 to the end of October the weather is great.  Of course March and April are gray as the inside of a Pittsburgh smokestack and wet as a dog at the beach.






I’m not a big fan of aftermarket tail tidies because they always look cheap and, well, aftermarket.  But something’s gotta be done about this rear fender/license plate monstrosity.  Good God that plastic is a waste of our petroleum resources.


The 1200 Griso is a modern bike (This is a compliment).  Everything just works.

Perfect bar end/seat/peg placement (granted, I am a relatively small guy at 5’-9” and 155).  Clear instruments.  Wonderful engine without lumps and dips in the powerband.  Clicky-click shifter with a light action.  Excellent brakes.  It’s…well…it’s the bike the Japanese would build if they wanted to copy Moto Guzzi the way they want to copy Harley.

To the purist, this is probably a negative.  But for me, a guy raised on Japanese motorcycles and without the reserves of patience for “character” required by a Ducati owner, it’s a big positive.

And it’s fun to ride.  The riding position is classic standard, really, rather than cruiser.  The seat height is relatively low and although it’s not light (maybe 550 pounds), the weight is carried low.  The bike feels solid and all of a piece up to six or seven tenths pace (more on that later).  The engine makes wonderful growls and burbles like a small-block V-8.  It’s very tractable and sounds great without sounding strangled like the old bike (more on that later, too).  Here’s a hairy-chested power cruiser rare enough that you’ll never see yourself coming down the street; it looks macho but it’s a big pussycat.

The cat has some claws, though.  Twist the grip hard and it launches satisfyingly down the road.  The redline is relatively short (8,000 RPM) but there’s not the  feeling of running out of revs.  BIKE dyno’d one of these at roughly 100 rear wheel horsepower and 75 lb-ft of torque and that seems about right.  Not as much top end as my Tuono but plenty much for a naked standard, and with that much torque there is a sensation of immediate power when you crack open the throttle.

The Griso’s owner sees this tidy LCD instrument cluster every day.  Very similar in layout to an RSV or Tuono, but with clearer lettering and somehow butch-er.  Available are not just speed, RPM, odometer and dual trip info, but also a clock, real-time charging voltage, ambient temperature, rider and passenger heart rates, and a stock ticker.



This pic of the data center brings me to the requisite apology for my impossibly lame-ass photography.  I gotta get Orson or Daniel Kalal to take the pics for my posts.

Course, did Orson get out there and test Grisos for you?  Nope, he left it to the unqualified.




Besides the red “8V” decals and the black handlebar, a couple of ways to distinguish the 8V from the 1100cc Griso are the radial brakes and these trick chevroned discs.


 

From this pic you might think that Hallie is unexcited about Moto Guzzis.  She is fourteen, however, so she wears this expression most of the time that she spends with her parents.


I got the feedback from my family.  “Retro,” said my wife.

“It’s too serious,” said my ten-year-old.  The three of them agreed on that.  Fair enough, I suppose, but the point of this bike is strength and butch style and it has that in spades.  So it’s a man’s bike.




That’s more like it.  A future Guzzista, perhaps?


Negatives for the updated Griso were few from my perspective.  The suspension was just a little soft for my taste; fast bumpy corners had the bike moving around a little too much and I could feel its weight working against it.  That said, for bimbling around town it was perfect and many Griso owners may not be interested in riding that aggressively anyway.

And it’s expensive.  There aren’t many of these bikes available and MI is asking a little more than $14,000.  It’s an excellent bike with remarkable build quality and I think it’s worth it if that’s what you want.




Then it was my turn on Griso Version 1.0.  If the 1100 Griso could talk it would sound like Vito Corleone.  And it would say something like “My throat hurts!  I got laryngitis something awful.  Call the Doctor.  No, no, not Rossi, my doctor’s name is John Wittner.”  There’s never been a motorcycle that wants an aftermarket end can more than the 1100 Griso.  The Guzzi bark has been muzzled, and it’s a shame because this bike could sound wonderful.

The riding position isn’t quite as refined.  The bars are just a little further from the seat and are wider, which isn’t good but just about the easiest thing you could fix on an motorcycle.  The bars on the 1200 are black, too, which looks really nice.  Before you leave your dealer with your new 1100 I’d have that bar changed to the new style.

The brakes and rotors are not as sexy as the 1200’s, but damn do they work well.  They are the same Brembos that the Mille R had in 2002 and they corral the Griso’s ponies with ease and control.

So in conclusion the new bike is the way to go, right?  Well, maybe not because the 2009 Griso is so expensive.  The 1200 is over fourteen large, and Dave has brand new 1100’s for less than nine (which has gotta be one of the new bike bargains of the millennium).  Do you want to/can you afford to spend $14,000 for a motorcycle when there’s one parked right next to it that is visually indistinguishable and almost as capable for $9,000?



The 1100 looks like this (the muffler is the giveaway).  I realize that I’m an old, old man, old enough to remember the slide rule, but here’s fresh evidence that some technologies bring out the worst in human tendencies toward obsessive-compulsive disorder.  This guy stood there while I parked up and took pictures, oblivious to everything but his texting.  Jeez, dude, just call her.  It’s so easy.  The same device that allows you to communicate poorly with a text message can be used for effective voice-to-voice contact!




Here’s the 1100’s front end.  Not as sexy as the radial brakes and corrugated rotors on the bigger bike, but absolutely just as effective.

 




SCORECARD
Riding position:  The new Griso’s shorter bar and different seat make it the winner.  As pleasant as a VFR.

Engine:  The old Griso is fine ridden in isolation, but the new Griso rocks.  What a wonderful engine.

Brakes:  The old Griso doesn’t have the higher-end spec that the new Griso does…but it’s just as good.  Remember, the old Griso’s brakes are the same that were awesome top-of-the-line binders for cutting edge sportbikes in 2002.  A tie.

Handling:  Both good; the new Griso wins with its nicer ergonomics.

Charisma:  Pick ‘em.  Only a dyed in the wood Guzzi fanatic could tell them apart.

Sound:  From stock, the new bike all the way.

Cost:  The old Griso is $5,000 less than the new one.  The new one is a better bike, but the difference in value is not $5,000.  You’d be miles ahead buying an 1100 Griso, an aftermarket muffler like the one below from Agostini in Italy, and upgrading to the new bike’s bar and seat.  Presto, a bike with 95% of the capabilities of the 1200 for $3,500 less.

[traveler]

Thanks for the report on the Grisos, a bike I've lusted for since they were first introduced.

That's a big discount MI is offering on the 4V, very tempting. But I might regret not getting the additional power which comes with the 8V.

According to Guzzi forum chat, the Griso requires some individualized suspension set-up for maximum benefit, and responds well to the full adjustability available on both ends. I doubt either was set up properly for you. And that's not a knock on MI, who I understand is one of the primo dealers in the country for Guzzis.

I think I would still want some sort of front fairing/windshield for touring, and bags, of course.

Further comparisons to the VFR would be appreciated, at least by me.

You didn't seem too impressed with the power differential between the two. Is that true?

[Orson]

I hate you.

Excellent write up  

The looks of the Griso have been slow to win me over, but It's slowly breaking down my barriers.

[MisterSmooth]

...Excellent write up  ...

Where's my damn photographer?   I can't work under these conditions!  

[greench440]

Shiny and black, like my soul

Yeah right.  Next time you do one of these test rides you should give us locals a heads up to meet for coffee or something to see the bike.

You should send these little tidbits in to CycleNews or MCN as riding impressions.  Who knows, you might be able to turn it into some farkle money.

[atadaskew]

Nice write up.  I was strongly considering the Griso 8V and would have bought one if it wasn't for the pathetic dealer network on SoCal.
I also woulda sprung the extra $4K for the 8v.  100 rwhp is perfect for this bike.  75 is not, and all the pipe is gonna do is add maybe a couple, plus the sound.  If I got the 4V I woulda kicked myself silly the moment I rode away.  Sure it's cheaper, but if it's not the one...

Either way, the Griso 8V should be about $12K.  It should be more competitive price wise with a Duc Gt1000.  Then it would kick it's butt due to higher spec motor.  But then what the hell do I know? I just bought a Dyna.  So, yeah, I woulda paid $14K for the 8V if it wasn't for the lack of dealer support.

[spinalator]

Excellent comparison, so detailed, it might be labelled over the top, but Guzzi riders are indeed a different sort.  

I would take the 9000 and the old one and spend the difference on performance enhancements, or male enhancements.

[Daniel Kalal]

... it wasn't for the pathetic dealer network on SoCal....

He may not be a dealer, but you have one of the very best Guzzi shops in the U.S. through Mark Ethridge at Moto Guzzi Classics.  So, now you have no excuse.

(nice write-up, Mr. S.)

[atadaskew]

He may not be a dealer, but you have one of the very best Guzzi shops in the U.S. through Mark Ethridge at Moto Guzzi Classics.  So, now you have no excuse.

(nice write-up, Mr. S.)

I know of Mark.  But he is of no help with warranty etc issues.  For service work etc fantastic.  But that stuff I would do myself anyway.

[sagerat]

The exhaust on the Griso may be the most hideous stocker ever foisted on the two-wheeled nation.  

Enjoyed the write-up.  

[atadaskew]

The exhaust on the Griso may be the most hideous stocker ever foisted on the two-wheeled nation.  

I think they're cool on both bikes.  The one on the 8V intentionally is the shape of an 8 in cross section.

[MisterSmooth]

Thanks for the report on the Grisos, a bike I've lusted for since they were first introduced.

That's a big discount MI is offering on the 4V, very tempting. But I might regret not getting the additional power which comes with the 8V.

According to Guzzi forum chat, the Griso requires some individualized suspension set-up for maximum benefit, and responds well to the full adjustability available on both ends. I doubt either was set up properly for you. And that's not a knock on MI, who I understand is one of the primo dealers in the country for Guzzis.

I think I would still want some sort of front fairing/windshield for touring, and bags, of course...you didn't seem too impressed with the power differential between the two. Is that true?

Hey, Joe.  I didn't know you had a secret Guzzi jones!  I agree about the suspension--it was not necessarily set up for me (and I didn't mess with it).


I liked the power in the 8V motor, and the way it was delivered, very much.  The early bike is down about 25 horsepower on the 8V, and you definitely notice.


The 1100 is a sweet engine, though, if flat in comparison.  Still it's hard to tell what it would be like if that exhaust wasn't strangling it.  You could almost hear it saying "...can't breathe...can't breathe..."


As to Griso versus VFR, they're different flavors entirely.  Griso = no luggage, no screen, poor passenger accommodations, and no factory options or remedies for any of that.  So you have to take the Griso for what it is, which is a perfectly decent motorbike to hold down the floor of a one-bike garage if you like traveling naked (the bike, not you).


At the current price points, the rational choice would be to buy a new '07 and adjust it to add some of the goodness of the 8V.  But make no mistake, the 8V is a better bike.

[DFH]

Now then MisterSmooth.. it has come to my attention that you have not only ridden both Griso's, but also the 1200Sport. What sage like comments have you regarding the 1200Sport in light of your Griso-ness?

DFH
 

[Rincewind]

Great write-up, you re-ignited my lust in the Griso.  I hope this doesn't lead to me igniting my wallet.  

[traveler]

Given the sales success of the Griso, relatively speaking, it's only a matter of time before many more aftermarket farkles are available. Looks like a platform made to order for individualized custom add-ons/improvements.

Good points about the VFR vs Griso differences. As I rarely carry passengers, that's not an issue. Fairing/windshield is, however.

One thing which continues to attract me to bikes like Guzzi is the "old" technology and ease of routine maintenance, something not present in the VFR. No radiators, hoses, t-stats, water pumps to worry about. Though more frequently required, easier valve adjustments (at least on older 4V) than VFR, something I don't do myself at present.

Then there's the shaft drive, requiring little maintenance.

Being old and slow, I probably wouldn't miss the top speeds achievable with the VFR, but still enjoy low and mid-range power, something the Griso excells at.

Thanks again for your insights and for futher adding to the lust. Like I really need a new bike. Mine's only got >80,000 miles.

[goodhawk]

someone wanna take a guess - what's MG quality like ( the 'ole fit & finish ) after 4 or 5 years, does it hold up ( BMW , Honda ) or start getting the sad sack look ?  I tend to hold onto one bike rather than get new every couple years . . .

I realize owner care /detailing makes a little diff., but I also think there is basic manuf. difference . . .

[atadaskew]

someone wanna take a guess - what's MG quality like ( the 'ole fit & finish ) after 4 or 5 years, does it hold up ( BMW , Honda ) or start getting the sad sack look ?

Interesting choice.  My neighbour has a CBr10002004 vintage (I think), and it has the same miles as my 2003 Ducati.  We both take care of the bikes, wash them when they need it, wipe em down the rest of the time.  Both are garaged.  My Duc still looks new, his Honda has corrosion of the fork legs, all the fasteners are corroded and the paint is looking tired.
Looking at the Guzzi, it seems to be finished to the same standard as my Duc.  Maybe Orson could chime in and let us know how his V11 is holding up?

[Jetboy]

Great write up.  The suspension has a lot of adjustability,  I think you owe it to yourself to try another ride with some adjustments.  It can be quite amazing.  As the the price difference,  A year form now the 09's will be discounted as well, maybe not as deep but still closing the gap.  You need a right side exhaust.

[Rincewind]

You need a right side exhaust.

They should all come that way to show off the SSSA.  Very nice pics, I'm in lust.  

[Black Ice]

The Buck Rogers can has got to go.  

[1KPerDay]

Available are not just speed, RPM, odometer and dual trip info, but also a clock, real-time charging voltage, ambient temperature, rider and passenger heart rates, and a stock ticker.

 

Great report. Thanks!

[sagerat]

someone wanna take a guess - what's MG quality like ( the 'ole fit & finish ) after 4 or 5 years, does it hold up ( BMW , Honda ) or start getting the sad sack look ?  

The bikes appear to hold up fairly well with proper care and feeding, based on what I've seen over at wildguzzi.com and from talking to other Guzzi folks.

[Daniel Kalal]

Griso = no luggage, no screen, poor passenger accommodations, and no factory options or remedies for any of that.

I spent two weeks in Australia on this one.  The factory screen and luggage worked just fine.

[MisterSmooth]

I spent two weeks in Australia on this one.  The factory screen and luggage worked just fine.

OK, OK, so I'm liar about the screen, there is a factory screen and apparently luggage too (Daniel, are those hard bags or some kind of soft throwovers?).

I really liked the 8V and its lack of screen and hard luggage (now I know there are factory options) didn't bother me.  As far as creature comforts go, I tour on a Tuono, which has basically no screen, and I pack everything I need in a messenger bag.  My perfect touring setup is where I ride up to any destination, park the bike, get off and walk away and no luggage has to be removed from my bike or is left on my bike.  I don't camp.  I'm not interested in riding my motorcycle to a destination where I can't buy a new toothbrush if I forgot to bring one.

[Daniel Kalal]

...are those hard bags or some kind of soft throwovers?).

They are rack mounted soft bags with a zipper opening (and quick disconnect).  They worked well, and didn't even seem to leak (although I wouldn't count on that).

[Chronic]

The Buck Rogers can has got to go.  

Here's an optin for curing that.....http://www.guzzitech.com/store/GT-Rx-GrisoExh.html

A feller makes in his garage.  VERY well made.

[MisterSmooth]

A feller makes in his garage.  VERY well made.

The "left side" option does nothing for me but the "right side" version is terrific.  

[martee99]

Great write up.

Gawd, I wish there were a Guzzi dealer in Cincinnati.

[JonS]

The "left side" option does nothing for me but the "right side" version is terrific.  

I didn't even realize it has a single sided swingarm with that ugly stock can.
Reading this topic and Orsons latest ride report, has me curiously yearning for a Guzzi.

[1KPerDay]

The "left side" option does nothing for me but the "right side" version is terrific.  

Both look way better than stock to me... but I agree that open tire looks better. I'd love to hear a sound file.

[st ryder]

But the stock canister has the stylised "8" built into it, and if the 4 valve engine is the feature, then the aftermarket pipe takes aways an original styling cue. I wonder if it the original could be "cored." I also think any canister looks better on the left side, otherwise, it lacks symmetry.