REV'IT! Questions answered

[atadaskew]

I could order an Aerostich with a generous supply of custom alterations and still come in cheaper than that.

Interesting.. less money, wet crotch, less money, wet crotch.....

[NVR2L8]

I met Dennis at the Long Beach show...he seems to be a good guy and really know his stuff when it comes to Rev'It! gear.  I checked out the Infinity suit and walked away very impressed with the overall features and quality, but due to the price I just can't convince myself to pull the trigger.  Even at the reduced show price I still found it tough to justify that much money for a piece of riding gear, but I still intend on visiting his store and trying it on in person.  If it fits really really really well then I might be able to convince myself, but in my opinion I think Rev'It! would sell a ton of these if the price was lower.

[Motodisiac]

Nice to meet you at the show as well.

INFINITY costs $1099 because its materials and armor are pricey. On top of that it's extremely complicated piece to manufacture, only few facilities in the WOLRD are able to handle such task (and none of them are motorcycle related) It takes over 10 days to make each suit. You cannot really compare it to Stitch, they are from different eras.

[Motodisiac]

As far as winter gloves go, FAHRENHEITs are great deal right now, only $125

[ctbandit]

Nice to meet you at the show as well.

INFINITY costs $1099 because its materials and armor are pricey. On top of that it's extremely complicated piece to manufacture, only few facilities in the WOLRD are able to handle such task (and none of them are motorcycle related) It takes over 10 days to make each suit. You cannot really compare it to Stitch, they are from different eras.

I really can't wait to see one in person. Not that I'll be able to buy one in the next 5 years, but it's nice to be able to materialize my dreams. I love Rev'It! stuff... they seem like the gear company who give a damn who they look and want great protection. Everything I've tried on from them has fit so great, and the fact that man of their items come in sizes like 44 42 rather than l or M says a lot

[Motodisiac]

Sounds like an excuse to go for a little ride, it's nice and sunny here in So Cal  

D.

I really can't wait to see one in person. Not that I'll be able to buy one in the next 5 years, but it's nice to be able to materialize my dreams. I love Rev'It! stuff... they seem like the gear company who give a damn who they look and want great protection. Everything I've tried on from them has fit so great, and the fact that man of their items come in sizes like 44 42 rather than l or M says a lot

[ctbandit]

Sounds like an excuse to go for a little ride, it's nice and sunny here in So Cal  

D.

Yea but it's cold as hell along the way. Plus I'd run out of money for gas before I got trough the plains states. I plan on traveling out there though, maybe not in 09, maybe not in 2010, but soon. I'll def stop in.

[rsrat]

Hi Motodisiac  

Now that you actually have the Infinity suit, could you answer a few questions for me please?

1. Has there been actual testing of the crashworthiness of the suit yet? (i.e. by designers in lab or otherwise)
2. If so, is there any data as to how it holds up compared to Roadcrafter, Admiral, etc.?
3. I am willing to grant that from a tech perspective this suit is leading edge in it's materials and possibly its craftsmanship(designed in Holland, but built in ?China and elsewhere?), however, as protective moto apparel, I need to know, if at all possible, that for this price the suit is superior primarily in its crashworthiness, long term durability and not just in it's waterproofness. For example, the literature from Rev'It indicates that its abrasion resistance is very high in regard to resisting wear from such things as backpack straps and similar long term, normal use( rubbing against things). But that literature doesn't seem to actually support or even suggest that any crash testing or similar work has established that it will surpass any of its competitors in real world pavement surfing situations. E.g. will it perform well in a typical 30 mph off, and, will it also survive more than one? For that matter, with whom do I deal should I need any repairs or other support? Again, Roadcrafter at least is a known performer in that regard, they are here in the US, and rather accomodating to deal with.
4. While all the rest of the Infinity's specs. and representations are commendable, and while I give great credit to Rev'It for taking on the challenge of meeting or exceeding the Roadcrafters' 30 year track record and reputation, I think that for most motorcyclists, the proof really has to be in the pudding, especially to get them to pony up the extra money, not to mention invest in a suit that hasn't yet established an actual track record. For that reason many of us are puzzled that Rev'It is introducing the suit at such a high price rather than starting lower to compete and thereby win customer trust and later buying volume once the "early adopters" have been able to provide actual reviews and constructive input. Indeed, with the current financial situation, I'm even a bit more surprised. And, if they decide to drop the price later, there will be many disappointed buyers if they jumped in early based on hype more than fact. (btw, what is/was the special "show price?")
5. I would note that the revised and supposedly improved Spidi Admiral is now selling well below the Infinity and it's own original asking price and much closer to the Roadcrafter's and I think it now includes a CE backprotector, improved zippers and, an integrated rear storage pouch, along with other similar "pocketation." The Roadcrafters offer a broader range of all around features in its base models than does the Infinity and also, for a similar price or less, total customization and fitting, should the buyer want or need that. For example, even the ability to add velcro for knee sliders when new or after purchase keeps their suits pretty attractive and competitive, given the current asking price for the Infinity.
6. As a matter of fact, the only advantage the Infinity seems to offer currently is a claim of total waterproofness (not so far proven, as I understand it) against the Roadcrafter's apparent propensity to admit some water under extreme conditions that most riders never see nor would want to ride in. And that is apparently reduced significantly by choosing the two piece Roadcrafter which still offers the convenience of quick don/duff. There is also the matter of lining material which the Infinity lacks compared to the others. The lining eases entry and exit and improves comfort significantly. Perhaps you can cite other Rev'It products with similar materials and construction which have established the kind of proven reliability that I refer to. Admittedly, I'm not at all familiar with other Rev'It products.

I don't mean to sound like a shill for Aerostich or Spidi and I am certainly not connected with either- I'm just a reasonably experienced rider with a "show me" attitude. I really do commend Rev'It on its willingness to challenge the others in this market, but still don't think the company has provided us yet with much more than promises and hype, backed up with some materials and fabrication innovations and "test data" on waterproofness, mostly of the fabric, along with the scuba dry suit zippers. I will grant that the armor is current state of the art, though that can be upgraded in the other suits too. As a rain suit it is perhaps up to its promise, but how about in its other areas of performance? Is the Infinity really just aimed at full time commuters, or to the broader all around rider market? It would be helpful if you could clarify that.

I've owned and used a Roadcrafter and have only tried on both the Admiral and Infinity. I noted the Admiral's zipper issues when first trying it on and see that Spidi did indeed have to address that while also ultimately lowering its price. I think the Infinity uses an identical type zipper, though possibly somewhat better than the Admiral. So, while I do not maintain that the Roadcrafters are by any means perfect, they are at least as good as their current marketing representations say they are. And, as far as that is concerned, Aerostich staff guided me as to the right sizing over the phone and then provided it shortly after, with a resulting perfect fit. So far, I've found I'm in between sizes with the off the rack Infinity suits and not sure I'll be able to get a proper fit unless and until the in-between sizes are made available, whenever that is. And, as you know, proper fit is perhaps the most important of all elements in moto gear, especially of the one piece variety.

Please do address my comments critically, correct any misimpressions or misstatements, and persuade me why buyers should choose the Infinity at this time. I really do want to be persuaded because I am currently in the market to replace my Roadcrafter and would be happy to try another product once I'm convinced that price, value and facts support the investment.

Thanks for taking your time to do so and to read my submission. I am happy to see Rev'It succeed and very open to buying its product once I know the "proof is in the pudding." ( I recently said the same thing to Erik Buell re the new 1125 and am waiting patiently to become fully persuaded)

I look forward to hearing from you.

Respectfully submitted,
RSRAT,
Colorado

[ctbandit]

[rsrat]

Here's a few more thoughts, observations and questions:

Having examined and tried on the Infinity and having used the roadcrafter two piece for some time, I wonder if the waterproof zipper should have the covering fabric all the way along its length or at least over the belt buckle area, to protect the paint on the bike. Or, has Rev'It actually determined that this particular zipper won't scratch or mar paint when rubbed against it? It would also add some wind, water and abrasion protection to the zipper mechanism itself.

I once asked Andy Goldfine this question-- have you considered adding a rear storage pouch to the roadcrafters? It could be offered as a builit-in, or installed later as a custom alteration. I have the same question re Infinity-- any reason why it wasn't included? The Admiral and several other suits and jackets, including BMW and Rukka include that feature these days. Any chance such a pouch could be added to the Infinity later or upon request? It is especially handy when removing layers to be added later in the day as a dry place to keep that soft stuff and not need any other stowage space on the bike. That back area is usually large enough to accomodate such a pouch without interfering with vents or otherwise compromising the designs.

And, along the same lines-- it would be very helpful to have at least one more pocket, inside the chest, where you could keep a wallet, cell phone, etc. most suits and jackets include that, but not the Infinity. While it does appear you could put some small items within the zip vent spaces, I'm not sure if that's intended by Rev'It, or wise. Could you comment on that?

And last but not least-- it's great that Infinity includes the hip armor, and high end, light weight at that. However, the included back protector doesn't cover down to the tail bone and one additional small pouch added to that area could easily accomodate one more small armor pad in that area, without adding appreciable cost, weight or discomfort. I think that would be an excellent enhancement to the suit. If future suits were to include it, you might keep your early customers happy by then offering it as a retrofit for them.

All this being said, you've indicated already that Rev'It does intend to be able to provide repairs for customers down the road, should they be needed, along with a generally high level of customer service. If so, do you think Rev'It might consider offering all or some of the foregoing modifications to current and future owners of the suit, or perhaps provide it as a service at some later time. My understanding is that the factories currently producing these suits are specially equipped to fabricate, repair and work with the suit's fabrics and construction, so is there any reason that such modifications could not be done at a reasonable cost?

thanks for taking time to reply.

[atadaskew]

maybe you should direct your questions to RevIt directly?

[Fav]

maybe you should direct your questions to RevIt directly?

and shorten them some  

[jim williams]

maybe you should direct your questions to RevIt directly?

seems this is why dennis started the thread

[rsrat]

So, you're ducking my question? actually two questions-- you haven't replied to the first one yet either.

I think my questions and suggestions, offered respectfully, would rate a prompt reply, especially by someone entering the forum as a vendor rep. interested in providing information to it's potential customers, something often not tolerated in many such forums. But, with all due respect, I'm happy for you to pass the buck to Rev"It and ask someone there with greater knowledge to try to provide replies and since you represent them, I'd appreciate it if you'd go ahead and handle that. I really don't know who else to write to, but understood from your thread's title, "REV'IT Questions answered", that you'd identified yourself as an appropriate source so I presume that you, rather than I, would best know who to forward my questions to. Please feel free to do so as I still look forward to hearing some answers and replies.

And, I'm not really interested in being brief with my sincere thoughts, questions and suggestions; I'm trying to be thorough at a time when that can have it's only value, rather than after the fact, at which point it wouldn't help potential forum members much, who take time to follow threads such as this in anticipation of a purchase, while their forum partners, such as myself, volunteer time to compose and offer them. Many of our members, including myself, effectively become "beta testers", even at our own, unreimbursed, expense, in part out of our own interest, but also with an eye to helping one another out by offering our observations, experience and knowledge for each other's benefit.

Considering the amount of Rev'It material presented on multiple websites, glossy publications and so on, that many of us have been devoting our time to reviewing, for lack of actual data, I really don't think my inquiry and feedback is unduly verbose, but pretty much to the point and a sincere attempt to be thoughtful, thorough and most of all constructive, for our members and for the vendor, in this case. Do try to remember that we've been exposed to much marketing material noting such things as, "an $1100 one piece suit," "targeting all competitors", "delayed release for years in order to attain "perfection", "soon to increase by a couple hundred more dollars," etc. Now, we'd simply like to have our legitimate questions answered, to the extent possible by whomever can speak for the company in that regard, if not yourself.

Thanks again for taking your time to read and respond, or otherwise forward my inquiries to those who can or will.

Sincerely and again, Respectfully,

rsrat

[Joey Stalin]

^too long, didn't read

[Motodisiac]

OK, I will try my best to answer your questions.

All fabrics REV’IT!  are tested as raw materials for the following tests.

Brush Pill ASTM D3511

Breaking Strength ASTM D3597-D1682-64

Seam Slippage ASTM D3597-D434

Breaking Strength D5034 Grab Method

Martindale Abrasion Test

Of course during the development each garment is crash tested, however REV'IT! (like any other manufacturer would) keeps the test results confidential since they are a part of development.

The materials used in the Infinity are extremely abrasion resistant. Where the "other brands" use 500 denier cordura, the Swiss fabrics REV’IT! is using in the impact areas exceed the protection offered by 1050 ballistic Nylon. All seams are double stitched, and double layers of material on all impact areas. The SAS-Tec armor is the highest rated armor in Europe, and includes a CE Level 2 back protector and hip protection.

As for repair, the Infinity is reparable. REV’IT! has an outside repair center located in Seattle. REV'IT! can supply them with materials, and they can patch, repair waterproofing, velcro and snaps. Zippers can be repaired (although expensive to do.)

Any comparision to Roadcrafter is not fair, it's a great product, just like 1971 Ford F-150, however INFINITY is complitely different breed of suits, the ones from 21st century.

SPIDI is out of business in US and the remaining products are being liquidated. Good luck getting any service or warranty from them. The Spidi is missing any form of stretch panels, is not completely waterproof, is using 500 denier cordura which is not protective enough, and is simply uncomfortable and difficult to use.

REV'IT! is great about gathering user's feedback and using it while designing new gear and updating old one. CAYENNE PRO is perfect example of that, I have used older CAYENNE and every little thing that annoyed me in it has been addressed in CAYENNE PRO. If some small issues will arise while using INFINITY, REV'IT! will definitely be quick to react, however at this point let's not solve the problems that don't exist.

What liner are you talking about? To my best knowledge Roadcrafter doesn't have any lining and from my experience no lining in the world will make donning the suit easier. It's very easy to put on once you get used to it, and since it comes in standard, long and short sizes we can accomodate riders of different sizes and shapes  

SAS TEC back protector is designed and manufactured by  German company that specializes in armor only. It exceeds highest CE rating possible - CE2. I think they know very well how to design proper protection and I think that we are not in a position to give them suggestions.

By the way if you look at this thread on ADV riders all your questions will be answered: http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=180005

Cheers,

Dennis





 

[atypical1]

So, you're ducking my question? actually two questions-- you haven't replied to the first one yet either.

Damn dude, give the mofo time to answer you before you jump on his case  

I actually have a question regarding Revit leathers and if it's possible to get them here. Any good or bad reports on them?


james

[rsrat]

Thanks Dennis, some focused dialogue is always better than lobbing eggs over someone's fence. I appreciate your making time and effort to try to reply with substantive information.

As for some other's in the thread lately, well... there's motorcyclists, and then there's bikers.

I'm not anti- Rev'It or the Infinity. But for the very points you make-- "new 21st century technology, etc." That's all good. But just like Aerostich was once in Rev'It's position, now, about 30 years or so later, they are accepted everywhere including on-track days. If Rev'It wants the Infinity to have such acceptance instantly, it just may not happen. It may take some time and continued patience of its advocates in persuading, and even showing, others that it is the new, real deal.

I'll digest your reply and respond as concisely as I can, with any follow up questions, unless you request I do otherwise. I don't want to seem to be hijacking the thread, if that's how it appears.

Those who aren't too interested in this dialogue will continue to have your other threads elsewhere as an alternate point of contact.

[Motodisiac]

James,

I may be biased but here is my opinion on REV'IT! leathers: I have had Dainese, Alpinestars and First Gear suits before, and my REPLICA is by far the most comfortable of them all (at least it was until I gained 20lbs, but that is another storyhttp://www.motodisiac.com/blog/chicken-strips/) While REV'IT! jackets and pants are smart buys because of their quality and safety, REV'IT! suits are a STEAL, I'm shocked they are not really flying off the shelves. Comparable suit from Dainese and such would cost over 2K, and with all honesty I think REV'IT! uses higher quality materials. Every knowlegable person that has seen the suits in my shop (I have several sizes in stock) commented how incredibly nice they feel, and when I announce the price people fall into shock even further, they are amazing value. I plan to participate in local track days and will bring some suits over so people can see them in person, hopefully by the summer REV'IT! will be a bit more known in So Cal sportbike community. And we got the best guy testing for us - Randy De Puniet



D.

 

Damn dude, give the mofo time to answer you before you jump on his case  

I actually have a question regarding Revit leathers and if it's possible to get them here. Any good or bad reports on them?


james

[Motodisiac]

Feel free to ask any questions that you may have. Keep in mind that since the INFINITY is such a new product, even information that I have is pretty limited.

REV'IT! already established itself as high quality manufacturer thanks to iconic items such as CAYENNE PRO, and even though INFINITY is new it is expected to be good simply because they have great reptation. It's like doubting that new BMW M3 will not be good....As far as taking Roadcrafter to the track, you may as well cancel your health insurance.  I would stick with track oriented produts.... Regards,

D.

Thanks Dennis, some focused dialogue is always better than lobbing eggs over someone's fence. I appreciate your making time and effort to try to reply with substantive information.

As for some other's in the thread lately, well... there's motorcyclists, and then there's bikers.

I'm not anti- Rev'It or the Infinity. But for the very points you make-- "new 21st century technology, etc." That's all good. But just like Aerostich was once in Rev'It's position, now, about 30 years or so later, they are accepted everywhere including on-track days. If Rev'It wants the Infinity to have such acceptance instantly, it just may not happen. It may take some time and continued patience of its advocates in persuading, and even showing, others that it is the new, real deal.

I'll digest your reply and respond as concisely as I can, with any follow up questions, unless you request I do otherwise. I don't want to seem to be hijacking the thread, if that's how it appears.

Those who aren't too interested in this dialogue will continue to have your other threads elsewhere as an alternate point of contact.