HD 883 Iron - The Nightster Mini-Me

[Rincewind]

The Nightster got a little 883 brother now, does that mean we call it a Nightie?  

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/26january09_hd_883iron.htm

$7899, 565lbs wet

[chornbe]

Waste. Of. Time.

[Rincewind]

Waste. Of. Time.

It has style, and it's $2000 less than a Nightster.  I think they'll sell a butt load of them.  

HD 883 Iron page

[Playinthestreet]

All it needs is black wrinkle finish on the exhuast.

[chornbe]

It has style, and it's $2000 less than a Nightster.  I think they'll sell a butt load of them.  

HD 883 Iron page

If so, my estimation of Harley buyers continues to dwindle.

[Rincewind]

If so, my estimation of Harley buyers continues to dwindle.

What's the BFD?  I hope they sell like hot cakes - apparently HD could use the money.

[Geoff]

It has style, and it's $2000 less than a Nightster.  I think they'll sell a butt load of them.  

I agree. This is good vertical integration.  

[GerryPetrecca]

Waste. Of. Time.

True Dat!

I can't believe they didn't  include blacked-out pipes, totally blacked-out forks (I mean why only black-out the bottoms) and what's with the chrome trim ring around the head light.  Idjits!!!  

[DogBoy]

Thats a really nice looking bike.

[olderigetfasteriam]

Waste. Of. Time.

Yeah, its no Concours.

[1KPerDay]

All it needs is black wrinkle finish on the exhuast.

My thoughts exactly.

And put longer shocks/forks on it so you can actually turn.

I'd rock one...

[Gsam]

It's still the same old sporter.

[atadaskew]

I like it.  They already made the Sportster that Chornbe wants - the XR1200.
The 883 Iron looks killer, and for people who always wanted a Harley but think they couldn't afford one and 'settled' for a Japanese copy (spare the angry letters, you know there are lots and lots of people out there like this ), they can now get the real thing for less money than many Honda cruisers.

Ask yourself this.  What looks better? (and yes it is mainly about the looks Francis)  This $8K Harley or that new Honda Fairy?  Which is going to be a lot more money.

[Playinthestreet]

It's still the same old sporter.

And there are riders who've ridden them the world over.

[JReazor]

Mid controls, reasonable handle bars. The seat's a little low but other wise it looks like a nice, functional little bike.  I'm not sure where the extra $700 went but these things rarely make financial sense.

[Geoff]

Mid controls, reasonable handle bars. The seat's a little low but other wise it looks like a nice, functional little bike.  I'm not sure where the extra $700 went but these things rarely make financial sense.

It all comes together when you realize the good resale value Harleys hold compared to other marques.

[chornbe]

Not on an 883, it doesn't.

[SVNET]

I think a bike like this is equivalent to a SV or ER-6n in the Asian world of bikes.

I think is way over priced.

$6300 MSRP would be more ideal.

[atadaskew]

I think a bike like this is equivalent to a SV or ER-6n in the Asian world of bikes.

I think is way over priced.

$6300 MSRP would be more ideal.

How is it overpriced when a 750cc Honda Shadow cruiser, with carbs (the Harley has a fantastic FI system), shaft drive (the Harley has a much better belt drive), ugly ass gas tank seem and just plain ugly styling is $7K?
The Harley also has a 2 year warranty vs the Honda's 1 year.
The Kawi Vulcan 900 cruiser is much more competitive but that is $7500.  So for $400 more you can have the Harley?
I'd agree with you if those Japanese cruisers were $5K...

[SteveG]

My wife's held its value pretty well, we paid $7,000 for it and then about 4 years later sold it for about $6k.  It was a fun bike to thrash around on, but definitely underpowered. But, it got her into riding, and she really enjoyed it while she had it.

[JReazor]

It all comes together when you realize the good resale value Harleys hold compared to other marques.

I'm actually comparing it to another HD. The 883 Low which appears yo be very similar except for the fork gaiters, handle bars and license plate bracket carries an MSRP of $ 7,279.

[atadaskew]

That license plate bracket also has led turnsignals/brake lights.  Mechanically the two are essentially identical, but the cosmetic stuff (including wheels and engine finish) definitely is different.  Whether that's worth the extra $ is up to the consumer.
I'd say yes, because looking at the two, I'd want to make the Low model look like the Iron model, and it would cost a lot more if you started out with the Low model...

[JReazor]

That license plate bracket also has led turnsignals/brake lights.  Mechanically the two are essentially identical, but the cosmetic stuff (including wheels and engine finish) definitely is different.  Whether that's worth the extra $ is up to the consumer.
I'd say yes, because looking at the two, I'd want to make the Low model look like the Iron model, and it would cost a lot more if you started out with the Low model...

Sure and that's completely subjective. I'm just saying that I don't see where The Motor Company has that much more money in the bike.

[SVNET]

How is it overpriced when a 750cc Honda Shadow cruiser, with carbs (the Harley has a fantastic FI system), shaft drive (the Harley has a much better belt drive), ugly ass gas tank seem and just plain ugly styling is $7K?
The Harley also has a 2 year warranty vs the Honda's 1 year.
The Kawi Vulcan 900 cruiser is much more competitive but that is $7500.  So for $400 more you can have the Harley?
I'd agree with you if those Japanese cruisers were $5K...

It is just a matter of perspective...

My Suzuki C50 800cc $6500 would smoke any 1200cc stock Nightster $10K any day in terms of speed and quickness.

In terms of technology, the C50 is top of the line, it has all the new age advancement.

800cc on an Asian bike is more like 1200cc on a Harley just like a 6HP Honda lawnmower is more like 12hp bridge & Stratton.

So to my guess, a 800cc Harley would be more comparable with like a 650cc Suzuki or 500cc Volcan.

The value in the Harley is in the image and the patriotism not on the bang for the buck per say as it is with Asian bikes.

[chornbe]

For my $$$, that $8k - if you want a Sportster 883, which I *did* - would be better spent doing what I did. I ended up with a better bike for less money.

Looks are very subjective, of course. That new 883 captures the whole flat black look that everyone was rattle-canning onto their machines 2 years ago, and does it with typical Harley flair and, I'm sure, impeccable quality and finish.

Now, I've never been a fan of bringing a bike home and immediately tearing into it, but that's exactly what I did with my Sportster. I had 400 miles on it when the disassembly began. I spent $6k on my base 883, put less than that extra $2k into it and got a better handling (fork rebuild and shock replacement, NOT lowered), better stopping (dual disc conversion up front), better riding (much nicer-than-stock tires), more useful (4.5 gallon tank - granted it's used and the color doesn't match, but I could have gotten a new one in the basic black and been within budget) bike, overall.

And it don't look to shabby, either. Yeah, I'd have preferred more on it to be blacked out, but the better overall riding experience more than makes up for it.



And if you've never ridden a lowered Sportster, I can't imagine anyone on this site enjoying the experience... not with all the emphasis on "SPORT-touring". ( a shout-out to County   )

[Rincewind]

And if you've never ridden a lowered Sportster, I can't imagine anyone on this site enjoying the experience... not with all the emphasis on "SPORT-touring". ( a shout-out to County   )

In the 90's I used to ride a 883 Hugger, even for touring, and I loved it.  I'd do it again but I'd want to use your bike this time.  

Hard to believe you did all your mods for less than $2k.  The 4.5 gallon tank would be a pretty critical upgrade for me - the 3.3 gallon peanut tank is not tour-friendly.

[chornbe]

I have an absolute ball on this bike, man. Next time we're in the same area - at Ephrata or where ever - you're absolutely welcome to go flog it for a while. This ain't "dad's old iron head Sportster"... that's for sure

[Rincewind]

I have an absolute ball on this bike, man. Next time we're in the same area - at Ephrata or where ever - you're absolutely welcome to go flog it for a while. This ain't "dad's old iron head Sportster"... that's for sure

I'd love to, thanks.  

[chimera]

883 Iron:  I like it alot.  The only thing I don't like is no passenger.  

[1KPerDay]

Always enjoy seeing pics of that bike.  


Put a peanut tank on it, though.  

[Geoff]

883 Iron:  I like it alot.  The only thing I don't like is no passenger.  

Considering the poor shocks Harley uses, the lack of passenger seat might be a design consideration.

[atadaskew]

It is just a matter of perspective...

My Suzuki C50 800cc $6500 would smoke any 1200cc stock Nightster $10K any day in terms of speed and quickness.

In terms of technology, the C50 is top of the line, it has all the new age advancement.

800cc on an Asian bike is more like 1200cc on a Harley just like a 6HP Honda lawnmower is more like 12hp bridge & Stratton.

So to my guess, a 800cc Harley would be more comparable with like a 650cc Suzuki or 500cc Volcan.

The value in the Harley is in the image and the patriotism not on the bang for the buck per say as it is with Asian bikes.

 Motorcyclecruiser.com tested the Sportster 1200 vs the Yam Star 1100 and the Sportster smoked the Yamaha.
http://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/roadtests/0806_crup_yamaha_v_star_and_harley_davidson_sportster_1100s/index.html
It would do the same to your C50.  But that is presenting facts...
p.s. motorcyclecruiser also lists the C50's 1/4 mile at 15.5/ 83.2mph..

The Sportster does it in 13.02/103mph.  So while the Harley is slow, your C50 is a loooooooot slower.

http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/roadtests/122_0412_cruiser_comparison/price_specs.html

[chornbe]

It is just a matter of perspective...

My Suzuki C50 800cc $6500 would smoke any 1200cc stock Nightster $10K any day in terms of speed and quickness.

In terms of technology, the C50 is top of the line, it has all the new age advancement.

800cc on an Asian bike is more like 1200cc on a Harley just like a 6HP Honda lawnmower is more like 12hp bridge & Stratton.

So to my guess, a 800cc Harley would be more comparable with like a 650cc Suzuki or 500cc Volcan.

The value in the Harley is in the image and the patriotism not on the bang for the buck per say as it is with Asian bikes.

So you've never actually ridden the Harley 1200, then?

I happen to agree that Harley does less with CCs than many others (in terms of horsepower generation), however that's mostly a limitation of the upper RPM capability of the strokers.. They're RPM-limited more than anything. Harleys, CC for CC lay down comparable - sometimes superior - torque numbers.

The 1200 Sportster is something of an outlier in the normal v-twin world... trust me, it'll smoke the other loving balls off *many* bikes, even those considered "performance" bikes - right up until it runs out of RPM... again, a design limitation, not a "we're afraid to go fast" limitation. If you look at performance oriented twins, they're usually square or oversquare and rev higher than cruiser engines. Cruiser engines are usually vastly undersquare, long-strokers and simply don't do RPM without coming apart at the seams. This is all pretty well known... most cruiser twins just lay down torque and rely on gearing to move heavier bikes, 2-up and touring stuff without lugging. Try slapping a 750cc I-4 in a 600lb bike with 2-up and 100lbs of luggage and such, then try to keep the engine below a frenetic RPM. You won't go anywhere, any time soon. The guys who design these engines know what they're doing.

In short... Harleys (and all cruisers) aren't typically meant to be fast. Some may be quick - well-geared application of torque - but almost all run out of steam around a buck - a buck ten.

And with a good rider, my little 883 has surprised more than a few guys on fun roads riding way more "capable" bikes.

Arrow-straight performance is a pointless discussion, IMO. These are motorcycles and even shitty motorcycles will out handle, out brake and out accelerate most cars and just *beg* to be ridden on twisty roads and make use of leaning. Riding one down the 1/4-mile is... "meh". Riding one on longer straights - like across Oklahoma - is even more boring (I know!!!).

[SVNET]

So you've never actually ridden the Harley 1200, then?

I happen to agree that Harley does less with CCs than many others (in terms of horsepower generation), however that's mostly a limitation of the upper RPM capability of the strokers.. They're RPM-limited more than anything. Harleys, CC for CC lay down comparable - sometimes superior - torque numbers.

The 1200 Sportster is something of an outlier in the normal v-twin world... trust me, it'll smoke the other loving balls off *many* bikes, even those considered "performance" bikes - right up until it runs out of RPM... again, a design limitation, not a "we're afraid to go fast" limitation. If you look at performance oriented twins, they're usually square or oversquare and rev higher than cruiser engines. Cruiser engines are usually vastly undersquare, long-strokers and simply don't do RPM without coming apart at the seams. This is all pretty well known... most cruiser twins just lay down torque and rely on gearing to move heavier bikes, 2-up and touring stuff without lugging. Try slapping a 750cc I-4 in a 600lb bike with 2-up and 100lbs of luggage and such, then try to keep the engine below a frenetic RPM. You won't go anywhere, any time soon. The guys who design these engines know what they're doing.

In short... Harleys (and all cruisers) aren't typically meant to be fast. Some may be quick - well-geared application of torque - but almost all run out of steam around a buck - a buck ten.

And with a good rider, my little 883 has surprised more than a few guys on fun roads riding way more "capable" bikes.

Arrow-straight performance is a pointless discussion, IMO. These are motorcycles and even shitty motorcycles will out handle, out brake and out accelerate most cars and just *beg* to be ridden on twisty roads and make use of leaning. Riding one down the 1/4-mile is... "meh". Riding one on longer straights - like across Oklahoma - is even more boring (I know!!!).

>>>>>>>>>>>>

It is just a matter of perspective...

My Suzuki C50 800cc $6500 would smoke any 1200cc stock Nightster $10K any day in terms of speed and quickness.

In terms of technology, the C50 is top of the line, it has all the new age advancement.

800cc on an Asian bike is more like 1200cc on a Harley just like a 6HP Honda lawnmower is more like 12hp bridge & Stratton.

So to my guess, a 800cc Harley would be more comparable with like a 650cc Suzuki or 500cc Volcan.

The value in the Harley is in the image and the patriotism not on the bang for the buck per say as it is with Asian bikes

Not sure if you know what a Suzuki C50 is.... It is not a high reving sport bike, so the references you made are not relevant to the point I was trying to make.

I once rode a 1996 1200cc sporster and to be honest, I was not impressed, but it was an old bike, I am sure newer Harleys are a lot nicer.  

So, no, I have not ridden a top notch Harley, but I have raced plenty of stock 1200cc Harleys on the streets and I was able to frustrate plenty of Harleys riders with my stock 800cc C50 that cost 1/2 of what they paid for theirs.

But we are going on a tangent here, the original point is that Harleys are way over priced, that is a fact and that is no secret to anyone and the 883 Iron is no exception to that rule. It is sad that Harley doesn't have an entry level bike with an MSRP of $6K or less.

I do hope for the day where I have enough money in the bank that I can buy my toys just for the pleasure of having the toy, instead of having to rationale cost vs bang for the buck.  Until that day, I do have to base my purchases carefully so that I can get the most for my money in all aspect, not only patriotism, name brand and ego.

Now with regard the 750cc Honda Shadow, I agree it offers very little for the money, but the Shadow is a living proof of how far Honda has gone trying to imitate Harleys, also providing the least bang for the buck when compared to other similar Asian cruisers.  Suzuki on the other hand doesn't hold back highligthing how over priced Harley bikes are.  For the same amount of money Suzuki provides more with the C50 then the 883 Iron or the Shadow.

Bottom line, price should not be a factor, must important should be how do the bike makes you feel.

If the bike can transform your life when you are riding it, then the MSRP should not matter, and neither how it compares to other bikes in terms of value and technology, I guess...

[MisterSmooth]

I think the Nightster is the best looking Harley, period.  Even better looking than the new XR1200.

And the 883 is one sweet ass looking bike.  However, from a consumer standpoint, why bother?  It's not like the 1200 is physically bigger or remarkably more powerful ("I couldn't handle all that power, so I just got the 883"   ).

However, in the world of Harley it probably does make sense.  There probably are people who are intimidated by the thought of all 1200 of those cc's on the "big" sportster.

And I think chornbe's right about people on this site not being happy with the limitations of a sporty.


But damn the Nightsters look hot!

[chornbe]

Not sure if you know what a Suzuki C50 is.... It is not a high reving sport bike, so the references you made are not relevant to the point I was trying to make.

No they're not... I was doing general comparisons. I know exactly what a C50 is. I believe what you said was that your 50ci engine is comparable (superior?), in street-delivered power, to what a 1200 Sportie would put out...

I took that from this statement...

My Suzuki C50 800cc $6500 would smoke any 1200cc stock Nightster $10K any day in terms of speed and quickness.

I'm not sure I can agree... I also have no vested interest. Your 50 will likely tear up my 883 in a straight line.

And my response was that while Harley tends to rev lower and develop less overall horsepower than many like-cc bikes (even other non-sport twins), the 1200 Sportie is something of an anomaly in that regard; with good torque across the full range, free-breathing heads and a 7k redline all stock, it will likely eat your 50's lunch. I've ridden quite a few 1200s, and while I've ridden several of the 90ci models by Suzi, and I haven't ridden the 50... I stand by the statement. My 90+ft.lb. Big Twin can't *touch* a 1200 Sportie on a short run, probably not in the 1/4 mile, certainly not in the 1/8th, but will top-end it once the gears start changing and the Big Twin breaths a bit and stretches its legs.

The 1200 is far, far faster and quicker than my 883. More than the missing ~300 CCs (25%) would suggest.

I had a few built 1200s and a few big twins completely eat my CBR's lunch more than once right up until about 90-100mph, or when the silly Harley riders short-shifted or hung around too long at redline, or something, then I was GONE and they were hitting rev limiters trying to catch me. They simply don't top-end. But in a short run... a good pilot and a flat torque curve can do some pretty fun stuff.

But again, I consider that kind of power... WOT, straight shots... to be completely pointless. Hell, my Burgman put out... 30...? horsepower on a good day and it was completely wrung out by 90-95mph (no gears to change). But that thing was nearly untouchable on the super-tight twisties by anything but a "real" twistie bike and a good pilot because it weighed like 19lbs and could turn a 6-7' circle in my driveway (I kid you not). Not because it was fast, but because you could enter the turn at nearly max turn-speed, and just rail thru' it. I could WOT that thing thru' pretty much any turn and it just... did it (God, that poor engine suffered when I rode it ).

But in a straight line... yeah, good night quick. It had ZERO low-end and top-end power. It was nice in the midrange only... right where the CVT kept it.

[Geoff]

My Suzuki C50 800cc $6500 would smoke any 1200cc stock Nightster $10K any day in terms of speed and quickness.

Damn straight! The C50 loses resale value with much more speed and quickness than the Sportster.  

[atadaskew]

So, no, I have not ridden a top notch Harley, but I have raced plenty of stock 1200cc Harleys on the streets and I was able to frustrate plenty of Harleys riders with my stock 800cc C50 that cost 1/2 of what they paid for theirs.

Yes, that must be true seeing that a 1200 Sportster covers the 1/4 mile 2 seconds quicker than a C50..
 

I do think that you got a good deal on your bike, all things considered, seeing you apparently paid $5K for it (half the price of a Sportster 1200.)

[st ryder]

 Motorcyclecruiser.com tested the Sportster 1200 vs the Yam Star 1100 and the Sportster smoked the Yamaha.
http://www.motorcyclecruiser.com/roadtests/0806_crup_yamaha_v_star_and_harley_davidson_sportster_1100s/index.html
It would do the same to your C50.  But that is presenting facts...
p.s. motorcyclecruiser also lists the C50's 1/4 mile at 15.5/ 83.2mph..

The Sportster does it in 13.02/103mph.  So while the Harley is slow, your C50 is a loooooooot slower.

http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/roadtests/122_0412_cruiser_comparison/price_specs.html

I remember when I had my Low Rider, some twat on a V-Star 1100 pulled up beside me at a light and started gunning it. I blew that idiot away so fast  he didn't know what hit him. For some reason I don't understand, many metric crusier owners with smaller displacement v-twins seem to think they can out perform HD big twins just because they are metric.   Buddy had his eyes opened after I let him catch up, then he wanted to know what I had done to the engine. Umm, nothing, it's just 300ccs  bigger than yours.  

A Suzuki c 50 vs a 1200cc Sporster?!   Ohhh commme onnnnn mannnn! Why waste even one breath on that one?  

[SVNET]

I remember when I had my Low Rider, some twat on a V-Star 1100 pulled up beside me at a light and started gunning it. I blew that idiot away so fast  he didn't know what hit him. For some reason I don't understand, many metric crusier owners with smaller displacement v-twins seem to think they can out perform HD big twins just because they are metric.   Buddy had his eyes opened after I let him catch up, then he wanted to know what I had done to the engine. Umm, nothing, it's just 300ccs  bigger than yours.  

A Suzuki c 50 vs a 1200cc Sporster?!   Ohhh commme onnnnn mannnn! Why waste even one breath on that one?  

Yeah this is a useless thread, trying to get a Harley lover to have good sense is basically senseless  

Sticking to the subject:

First original point, ALL Harleys are over priced including that 883 and that is a FACT.

Second point, for $6500 the C50 is the best bang for the money over any Harley.

Now with regard those reports that you read online...  What counts is what you actually get to experience and enjoy, not what X magaizne claims or state.

Like I said, blame it on the riders or on faulty bikes, but while I owned my C50 with only 800cc, I had the great pleasure to live and experience the joy of smoking plenty of 1200cc Harleys and to me that is what counts, my inferior $6500 bike was able to frustrate plenty of ego sense less Harley riders.

A little further down the road from my house there is a guy that commutes on his gray nightster.

Plenty of time in our way to and from work we found each other on the same road and it was fun watching his bike strugle and reaching the rev limiting while my little 800cc just kept on advancing ahead of him.  Maybe that guy got a defective nightster or maybe he just didn't have the magic required to make a Harley fly, but the lived experienced was that I smoked him every single time.

[chimera]

And the 883 is one sweet ass looking bike.  However, from a consumer standpoint, why bother?  It's not like the 1200 is physically bigger or remarkably more powerful ("I couldn't handle all that power, so I just got the 883"   ).

Maybe the $$$?  Fairly large price spread, enough to make me think twice about the step from 883 to 1200

[st ryder]

Yeah this is a useless thread, trying to get a Harley lover to have good sense is basically senseless  

Sticking to the subject:

First original point, ALL Harleys are over priced including that 883 and that is a FACT.

Second point, for $6500 the C50 is the best bang for the money over any Harley.

Now with regard those reports that you read online...  What counts is what you actually get to experience and enjoy, not what X magaizne claims or state.

Like I said, blame it on the riders or on faulty bikes, but while I owned my C50 with only 800cc, I had the great pleasure to live and experience the joy of smoking plenty of 1200cc Harleys and to me that is what counts, my inferior $6500 bike was able to frustrate plenty of ego sense less Harley riders.

A little further down the road from my house there is a guy that commutes on his gray nightster.

Plenty of time in our way to and from work we found each other on the same road and it was fun watching his bike strugle and reaching the rev limiting while my little 800cc just kept on advancing ahead of him.  Maybe that guy got a defective nightster or maybe he just didn't have the magic required to make a Harley fly, but the lived experienced was that I smoked him every single time.

  Yah, like we haven't heard BS like that before.  Yes, Suzukis are better than HD. How could we be so foolish. You keep on "smokin" what ever your smokin, but I can tell you, it ain't HD bikes, other than maybe in your imagination, which you confuse with "facts."  

[atadaskew]

In other news, I regulary smoke dood on their Busas while on my skateboard.  Maybe there's sumfink wrong with their Busas, or they don't know how to ride, but it happens every time.

[chornbe]

In other news, I regulary smoke dood on their Busas while on my skateboard.  Maybe there's sumfink wrong with their Busas, or they don't know how to ride, but it happens every time.

Come on... there was that one time the dood idled up that hill. He so smoked you at the top.

[SVNET]

  Yah, like we haven't heard BS like that before.  Yes, Suzukis are better than HD. How could we be so foolish. You keep on "smokin" what ever your smokin, but I can tell you, it ain't HD bikes, other than maybe in your imagination, which you confuse with "facts."  

Again, we already hijacked this thread enough which is not fair.

My point is that the Iron 883, although very cute, it is over priced just like every other bike in the Harley lineup.

Ask any Victory bike owners and they will completely agree with me...

First it was all about the great Harley performance, now you getting personal about what I smoke or don't smoke...

Obviously I hurt your sensitive Harley feelings, wrong doing on my part, won't happen again.

I will rest my case with this little story below...

The value of a vehicle is not just about speed, ego or brand name, but the combined overall experience.

More people at work are getting motorcycles and riding to work everyday.

Around the same time I got my new C50, another coworker got himself a brand new 2007 1200cc Sportster, pearl white color, beautiful bike and it sounded great...

One day he rode to work to find all his pants full of oil on the inner thigh area, the bike was leaking oil near the top head and the oil was being sprayed on to his pants with the wind.

Later his bike started burning / blowing the tail, head light bulbs and the dealer did not know what was going on, he still having that problem after taking the bike several times to the dealer.

Finally, one Friday that we both rode to work and got out at the same time, he invited me to a bike meeting with his friend at a local bar so I followed him. After a great night of live music and fun we head out the bar and his bike would not turn on so I had to use my AAA card to have it towed to his house.

In the two years that I owned my C50, I was able to ride it like I stole it and it never complaint, I never had to see a mechanic, it never dripped one single drop of oil, I never had to replace a single bulb, I was never left stranded and it never had to be towed.  

Now that is what I call a lot of bang for the Buck for an excellent overall experience...

[chornbe]

Again, we already hijacked this thread enough which is not fair.

My point is that the Iron 883, although very cute, it is over priced just like every other bike in the Harley lineup.

Ask any Victory bike owners and they will completely agree with me...

oh come on... Are you *seriously* basing some sort of rational discussion on THAT anecdotal bullshit? Seriously?

Chevy vs. Ford.
Ford vs. Mopar.
Chevy vs. Mopar.
Honda vs. Toyota.
Ferrari vs. Lamborghini.
Suzuki vs. Kawasaki vs. Honda.
Tastes great vs. Less filling.
Mayo vs. Salad Dressing.

I'm sorry, but the rest of your post is absolutely moot now. I'm not even gonna read the rest.

[1KPerDay]

Mayo, dammit.

I'm sorry, but the rest of your post is absolutely moot now. I'm not even gonna read the rest.

You didn't miss anything.

[atadaskew]

I will rest my case with this little story below...

The value of a vehicle is not just about speed, ego or brand name, but the combined overall experience.

More people at work are getting motorcycles and riding to work everyday.

Around the same time I got my new C50, another coworker got himself a brand new 2007 1200cc Sportster, pearl white color, beautiful bike and it sounded great...

One day he rode to work to find all his pants full of oil on the inner thigh area, the bike was leaking oil near the top head and the oil was being sprayed on to his pants with the wind.

Later his bike started burning / blowing the tail, head light bulbs and the dealer did not know what was going on, he still having that problem after taking the bike several times to the dealer.

Finally, one Friday that we both rode to work and got out at the same time, he invited me to a bike meeting with his friend at a local bar so I followed him. After a great night of live music and fun we head out the bar and his bike would not turn on so I had to use my AAA card to have it towed to his house.

In the two years that I owned my C50, I was able to ride it like I stole it and it never complaint, I never had to see a mechanic, it never dripped one single drop of oil, I never had to replace a single bulb, I was never left stranded and it never had to be towed.  

Now that is what I call a lot of bang for the Buck for an excellent overall experience...

Your stories are the best.  Let me get a cup of hot cocoa and tell me another!

[JReazor]

oh come on... Are you *seriously* basing some sort of rational discussion on THAT anecdotal bullshit? Seriously?

Chevy vs. Ford.
Ford vs. Mopar.
Chevy vs. Mopar.
Honda vs. Toyota.
Ferrari vs. Lamborghini.
Suzuki vs. Kawasaki vs. Honda.
Tastes great vs. Less filling.
Mayo vs. Salad Dressing.

I'm sorry, but the rest of your post is absolutely moot now. I'm not even gonna read the rest.

Chevy
Mopar
Mopar
Honda
Ferrari
Suzuki
Tastes great
Mayo

That should settle it.

[weidauer]

And it's another great day here in H-B.N (Harley-Bashers.net)

Harleys are definitely over-priced (I have an Ultra Classic, so I know about over-priced), but so are BMWs, Ducatis and Vespas. My Ultra is slow, heavy, and handles like it has a hinge in the frame. But it's wicked comfy after 10 hours in the saddle, sounds great with the stock pipes, and puts a smile on my face like no other bike ever has. I've owned a dozen other bikes over the past 30-odd years, and I can't say that any of them made me feel as good as this one does.  

I hope you feel that way about whatever you ride. Because I don't know about you, but that's WHY I ride. (Hey, ya think HD might pay me for a testimonial?)  

[chornbe]

And it's another great day here in H-B.N (Harley-Bashers.net)

I think I'm going to go register that right now!  

[SVNET]

And it's another great day here in H-B.N (Harley-Bashers.net)

Harleys are definitely over-priced (I have an Ultra Classic, so I know about over-priced), but so are BMWs, Ducatis and Vespas. My Ultra is slow, heavy, and handles like it has a hinge in the frame. But it's wicked comfy after 10 hours in the saddle, sounds great with the stock pipes, and puts a smile on my face like no other bike ever has. I've owned a dozen other bikes over the past 30-odd years, and I can't say that any of them made me feel as good as this one does.  

I hope you feel that way about whatever you ride. Because I don't know about you, but that's WHY I ride. (Hey, ya think HD might pay me for a testimonial?)  

Great post and I admire you for your honesty...

You like what you like but you admit to what you have and what it is, that is all...

As long as you it puts a smile in your face that is all it matters even if its the biggest piece of cr*p ever made....

Interesting, the C50 was my first cruiser bike and from the first day I realized that cruiser are not for me...

Although it was the most reliable bike I ever had and the one I put the most amount of miles on, I just dislike cruisers.

On the other hand, the SV650 was my pride and joy and I could not help but to stare at the bike and feeling so good about it.

So if your Harley makes you feel as good as the SV650 used to make me feel, then that is all it matters...

Ride and enjoy it even if it carries a $300 payment per month...

[chornbe]

Yeah, yeah.... "ride and enjoy even if...."  

[JGreb]

This bike is going to fly off the showroom floor. Very nice

[atadaskew]

Interesting, the C50 was my first cruiser bike and from the first day I realized that cruiser are not for me...

And there you have it!  He didn't even like his C50!!!
Must really chap his hide that we love our Harleys!!!  Guess that $6K that he paid for it was not such a deal after all!!!!
Buyer's remorse is a b1tch...

Hmmm, $6K for a bike that from day one I'll hate, or $8K for a bike that I'll love!  What's the better value?  Don't burst a vessel figuring that out..
 

[olderigetfasteriam]

And there you have it!  He didn't even like his C50!!!
Must really chap his hide that we love our Harleys!!!  Guess that $6K that he paid for it was not such a deal after all!!!!
Buyer's remorse is a b1tch...

Hmmm, $6K for a bike that from day one I'll hate, or $8K for a bike that I'll love!  What's the better value?  Don't burst a vessel figuring that out..
 

Feeling the need to justify?

[chornbe]

Feeling the need to justify?

I think his post was very much the opposite of empty justification...

[SVNET]

And there you have it!  He didn't even like his C50!!!
Must really chap his hide that we love our Harleys!!!  Guess that $6K that he paid for it was not such a deal after all!!!!
Buyer's remorse is a b1tch...

Hmmm, $6K for a bike that from day one I'll hate, or $8K for a bike that I'll love!  What's the better value?  Don't burst a vessel figuring that out..
 

First, I guess you still reading my posts... I though you quit.

Second, I rather dislike a bike because of its style then because of the headaches...

I disliked the C50 because it is a cruiser but have nothing but good things to say about its performance and service.

The C50 provided me with two year of trouble free riding and enjoyment.  Something most Harley owners can't claim about their bikes.

By the way, the guy who lived through the Pearl White Misery now rides a 2008 Honda VTX.  I don't get to talk to him much anymore since I switch departments, but I do see his bike on the lot everyday which is a good sign of trouble free reliability.... At least now he gets to ride the thing everyday to work instead of calling the dealer for status on the current issue.

Now if I would had been the one living though the Perl White misery I would had suffer twice, once because I discovered cruisers just don't inspire me, second because of everything that the guy had to go through with that faulty bike.

By the way, the Perl White was a left OVER model that had a MSRP of $12K and he was able to get lots of craftsmanship problems for just $10K, what a great deal...

Now, with regard the SV650, with an MSRP of $6K, there is no doubt it will smoke any Harley, with a bullet proof engine that is as reliable as no Harley will ever dream to be and with looks that I would not mind stare for hours...  That is a lot of bang for the MONEY.

I will leave you with this, the Iron 883 is as OVER PRICE as any other Harley and it offers very little bang for the money other then the ego of owning an Harley full of problems and issues...  And that you can't Argue...

If you like your Harley so much, you should be spending more time riding then arguing here...  At least that is what I did when I had my C50, ride, ride and ride, trouble free may I add...

Happy riding...

[atadaskew]

I disliked the C50 because it is a cruiser but have nothing but good things to say about its performance and service.

The C50 provided me with two year of trouble free riding and enjoyment.

No it didn't.  You said you disliked from your very first day.  Not sure how that is enjoyable.  See here is where I can't believe a single thing you type.  You claim your bike was way faster than a Sportster.  Then we point out it's much slower.  The you claim what a great time you had.  Then you write how you hated your bike from the very first day you got it.  
All I see here is the typical Harley bashing cuz you bought the wrong bike, and had to live with it for two years.  Funny how none of the Harley owners, past or present, on this site have had any of the "issues" that you claim to have knowledge of.
How can that be?
Hmm, real owners with real experiences loving their Harleys.  Shame you couldn't experience that.  But don't be a hater because others do.

[JReazor]

 

[1KPerDay]

Yeah, yeah.... "ride and enjoy even if...."  

"You buy this hat they give you a free bowl of soup with it.

Oh... looks good on you, though."

[SVNET]

No it didn't.  You said you disliked from your very first day.  Not sure how that is enjoyable.  See here is where I can't believe a single thing you type.  You claim your bike was way faster than a Sportster.  Then we point out it's much slower.  The you claim what a great time you had.  Then you write how you hated your bike from the very first day you got it.  
All I see here is the typical Harley bashing cuz you bought the wrong bike, and had to live with it for two years.  Funny how none of the Harley owners, past or present, on this site have had any of the "issues" that you claim to have knowledge of.
How can that be?
Hmm, real owners with real experiences loving their Harleys.  Shame you couldn't experience that.  But don't be a hater because others do.

Once again, let me remind you this thread is about the new IRON 883cc from Harley not about me, why do you keep trying to make it personal.

Some stated that they loved the new little bike, I stated that it is way over priced at the give MSRP, stick to the subject.

Look, regardless of which bike I like or dislike, or what you think of me, none of that is relevant, the IRON 883 still way over priced just like any other Harley out there.

The $6800 Suzuki C50 will out perform the 883 in any comparable way, just accept reality and live with it.

But it is not fair to compare the 800cc C50 to the little 883cc when it actually matches better the 1200cc Sportster which can cost at least $3000 more...

Stick to bikes, leave me out of it...

For the sake of everybody else who is reading this thread, I will no longer be checking this thread, have fun...

[DogBoy]

The best part of this discussion is the argument about which is slow bike is faster. If this thread dies out, I'm heading over the Yamaha subforum to challenge Brand Y owners on DRZ400 vs. WRX250 1/4 mile times.  

[weidauer]

I think I'm going to go register that right now!  

It's all yours...you'll have no shortage of posts. I need to ride...

[atadaskew]

For the sake of everybody else who is reading this thread, I will no longer be checking this thread, have fun...

Instead he is now going over to the Ducati forum and letting everyone know about all the Monsters he's smoked on his SV650 and how a co-worker had a Ducati and it blew up and and and and...

 

[Johnny Monsoon]

The 883 will ALWAYS be a better performance buy than the 1200.  It wears an 883 displacement VIN, so insurance is cheaper.  Re-jug to 1200+ with the same 883 heads and you bump up the compression.  Better engine.  Better bike.  Less money.  Since when is that a bad combo?

I think they look great.  Not every bike has to be an exercise in performance anyway though.  Hell, we have folks here riding MotoGuzzis that can hardly get out of their own way, handle like crap, and weigh a ton, yet everyone drools over them because they're pretty.  Show a good looking HD like these, and people balk just because it has HD on the tank.  I don't get it.

Good looking bike.  Pretty decently priced.  I dig.

[chornbe]

Look, regardless of which bike I like or dislike, or what you think of me, none of that is relevant, the IRON 883 still way over priced just like any other Harley out there.

See? That's what people are pushing back about... your opinions are not rooted in actual facts.

First, let's look at what Harley makes.

With minor noted exceptions, Harley makes CRUISERS and CRUISER-STYLED TOURERS. Now what you need to do is compare models, feature for feature, engine for engine, design for design.

For the twin-shock cruisers and touring cruisers, Harley has the Dyna series, ranging from $11k to ~$17k. If you compare features to Star and Victory, and to a lesser extent Kawasaki and the VTX abomination, you will see the prices are right in line, and in fact, feature for feature, Harley is often *not* the most expensive game in town.

The same could be said for the soft-tail styled bikes... most manufacturers offer analogs to Harley's Soft Tail models... Harleys soft tails from $14k - $18k, and include "factory custom" models, tour-dressed models, etc.

Next are the cruiser-styled TOUR bikes... and this, my friend, is where Harley eats *everyone* else's lunches.

The Touring Frame Harleys, which include the Road King, ElectraGlide (et al) and Road Glide models, run from $16k to ~$21k, and include full luggage, windshield or faring (including a model with a fixed-mount fairing), tour trunks/backrests, floorboards, stereo systems on some models, CBs/intercoms on some models, cruise control (which ROCKS) and a host of other features. I own one of these bikes and I can tell you, feature for feature, I paid *way* less than I would have for the K/LT or the Goldwing, and with the exception of the BRAND NEW Kawasaki touring cruiser (which *is* a cruiser frame bike), no other manufacturers offer the same upright touring bike in a cruiser-esque package. Maybe the Victory Vision... another market place anomaly. Now factor in amazing dealer service support, after market support, an awe-inspiring range of factory and after-market upgrades and customization options, warranty options that include loaners in some cases (try THAT with the big-4), and prices that are not only right in line, but often CONSIDERABLY cheaper than other dedicated touring bikes, and you have a recipe for success that Harley has been - rightfully - enjoying the hell out of for at least 2 decades.

Now then... the Sportster... ah, the red-headed step child of the motorcycle world.

Let's call it $7k for an 883, $9500 for a 1200, let's stick to last year's base models because they weren't lowered (all current Sportsters in their lineup, excepting the XR1200 are now lowered). This bike is really a sport/standard, not a cruiser (tho' it can be dressed an configured as a cruiser-esque bike). The bike comes from the factory undersprung and with shitty tires... wow, that's very unique in the motorcycle world, isn't it? Fine, let's factor in a *very* generous grand for new suspension and new tires. Hell, you can get a new seat for that grand, too. Why not.

Now you have a $8000 or $10k sport standard that will - directly - compete with other so-called "overpriced", and "underpowered", yet iconic machines that people love. I'm thinking the Ducati Monster on this one. You have the 695/696 and you have the 1000. The Ducs definitely will out handle and out brake the sportsters, and I know from experience, the 695 will top-end the 883 sportie. No argument in any of that. But the points you have to get to in order to *truly* demonstrate the performance limits of these bikes are just not places you should go on the street. So really, it comes down to style, sexiness and "I just want this bike" desire - WAY more than price. Which is awesome. THAT is what fuels our market place and why it's so diverse. Having said that... Sportsters outsell Monsters maybe... what? 100 to 1?

I was going to buy a Monster when I got my Sportster. I got a way better $$$ deal on the Sportie and the upkeep and maintenance on the Sportster is dirt cheap... I mean, DIRT cheap. A belt drive that I'll likely NEVER have to replace, no valve adjustments, the best FI in the industry (show me a smoother FI system stock than a Harley and I'll show you someone who hid a Power Commander under his seat), and an overall "gas-n-go" machine that just works.

I paid $6k for mine and put under $1200 into upgrades, and it is, to date, the most enjoyable motorcycle I've ever owned, and in the top 3 or 4 of the most enjoyable I've ever ridden. It's not all about flat-out performance, and it's not all about base $$$ numbers.

So, no... when viewed with an objective eye and comparing feature for feature, Harleys are, in fact, *not* over priced. But they are a premium-priced product for which you get a lot of positives that other manufactures might not offer at all, or make prohibitively expensive.

In that regard, they fall right in line with Ducati, BMW, MV, etc.

Dude, you don't like 'em, that's cool... but at least base your arguments in fact. That's what people are calling you on.

And we haven't talked about the XR1200 or the V-Rod which both help to usher in a new age for Harley, if Harley's got the collective balls to stick with making them and accepting their initially-low sales numbers. They're game-changing machines for Harley.

[atadaskew]

How dare you muddy these waters with facts Chornbe!

[falconati]

Wow.  What a totally awesome derailment!  That was a blast.

Anyway.

I think this is a great addition to the Sportster family, and agree with many of you - these will sell.  Great styling at a price point to get into the Harley line.

[SVNET]

>>> See? That's what people are pushing back about... your opinions are not rooted in actual facts.

Neither are yours, all this spell you just gave us here is soley your own bias opinions and nothing else, completey bias by your blindness towards Harleys.

>>> Now then... the Sportster... ah, the red-headed step child of the motorcycle world.

You mean of YOUR motorcycle world.... and the rest of the Harley Fanatics...

>>> So really, it comes down to style, sexiness and "I just want this bike" desire - WAY more than price.
>>> It's not all about flat-out performance, and it's not all about base $$$ numbers.

I think I have stated that same line in as many possible way already, so you are not saying anything new here and it also doesn't make justice for the over priced Iron 883.  Two wrongs doesn't make it right, Just because you are careless about how you waste your money in junk, that doesn't make the Iron 883 any better or worth of $7K.

It is your money and you can spend it in what ever junk that floats your boat, but just because you choose to own a Harley that doesn't make the brand any better or any worse.  It is what it is and you have learned to love it the way it is...  Yet another way...

>>> But they are a premium-priced product for which you get a lot of positives that other manufactures might not >>> offer at all, or make prohibitively expensive. In that regard, they fall right in line with Ducati, BMW, MV, etc.

You must be dreaming...  The reason Harley are so over priced is not because they are PREMIUM high performance vehicles in the same line as BMWs, Ducati, etc...  On the other hand, if there is one true FACT about Harleys is that they are everything but PREMIUM...

Reason #1.  Here at the US we have minimum wedges laws so the high cost in labor does show up on the MSRP.
Reason #2.  The factor that really has an effect on the over priced MSRP.... Harley still doesn't have the technology to mass produce vehicles with minium over head cost, so we the costomers end up picking up the tap on their lackings...

I once read an Article about the History of Harleys, this was actually an article FOR Harleys, not against them, but unlike some of you fanatics, who ever wrote that article was not afraid to expose the truth.  It was said that Harley factories were like a laberint, there was no logical organization for the assembly line which affected their efficiency in many different ways, for example like the amount of time it took to produce one unit, time is money, and also the quality of each units.

The same article also stated that Harley's original answer for the reliability issues of their own vehicles was to produce as many spare parts to make sure they could keep up with the failing bikes and so that there will aways be parts available for the suffering customers.  Completely backwards, they choose to invest in huge inventory of bound to fail parts instead of investing on figuring out why the failures and coming up with ways to make vehicles that would not fail.

So there you have it, the only thing PREMIUM about Harley's has been their backward thinking from day ONE.

Also, while we are in the comparision mode, there is a difference between HIGH MAINTANENCE and UNRELIABILITY.

Harley's are just plain unreliable vehicles that produce very costly performance in any sense of the word and if there is anything that you can call performance about a Harley, it comes at a wastful high cost.  It takes a lot to buy a Harley, to get a Harley moving and to get it to stop.  A complete waste in all sense of the word.

Now, PREMIUM performance vehicles like Ducati's are high performance vehicles that require frequent maintanence in order to deliver outstanding performance. But we are not talking about ureliability issues here.  I doubt that any 2007 Ducati's are burning bulbs and spraying engine oil all over your jeans in your way to work.  Don't confuse on thing with the other...

>>> Dude, you don't like 'em, that's cool...

Actually, I think the Nightster looks very cool and I would love to own a Buell City X, loving the looks of Harleys aint the issue.
Now being so blind that one fail to accept reality and have good judgement, that is sureal...

>>> but at least base your arguments in fact. That's what people are calling you on.

1. Actually it is not people that are calling on me, just the Harley Fanatics.
2. I am being call on what I like and what my favorite color is, or what I can afford or not, all non relevant comments.
3. The only true fact is that Harley's are over priced and for the wrong reasons, it aint because they are PREMIUM vehicles.
4. Harley just doesn't know how to procude reliabile vehicles at a low cost instead they produce high cost wasteful bikes.

>>> So, no... when viewed with an objective eye and comparing feature for feature, Harleys are, in fact, *not* over priced.

Yeah, it has to be seen through a very specal objective eye, one that is so stinky that can only produce such a blindness.

And here is the Kicker...

>>> Sportster have the best FI in the industry (show me a smoother FI system stock than a Harley and I'll show you
someone who hid a Power Commander under his seat), and an overall "gas-n-go" machine that just works.

Well, I really hope that the FI that you are referring about is not the one described in the article below... But seeing how backward thinking Harley seem to be, I would not doubt that they saved the better fuel system for the $7K Iron 883 instead of using it on the $12K Buell Cafe Racer.  Not that I am being sarcastic here...

Here are the words used to describe the Buell's (Harley related product) fuel distribution system... by The person who tested the bikes for the article below, someone who claims to have spent the last 33 years riding and dealing with PREMIUM ITALIAN bikes.

Wacky Traits of the Buell/Harley Premium FI
Unruly, Abrupt and Surging Throttle Response described as a Pitbull ( unpredictable / uncontrolable ).
Always have to be Conscious of the Judicious Throttle, which sucks the fun out of riding.
Always having to be one step ahead when riding at a spirited pace.
All of the above translate into wasted mental engergy that leaves very little room for casual enjoyment.

I don't know how much more factual it can get but I would imagine that riding a bike with such characteristics could be as dangerous as riding a WILD horse that has not been tamed yet by the Harley Premium Team.

You are entitle to your bias favorable opinion as much as I am entitled to my own opinion.

I am wasting a lot of time here but it is not devoted to you fanatics, it is senseless to bring fanatics into sense...

I do believe that all sides and all opinions deserve equal exposure for those individuals who will read this thread.

Then they can decide for themselves...

Again, let me bring it back to the original post... It is all about the IRON 883, not about SVNET....

This thread is not about me, what I like, what I can afford, or how much you like me or how much you dislike my stories...

This thread is about the Iron 883 and what we think of it.  I think it is just another OVER PRICED Harley.

I do have to give Harley credit for the best thing they have ever done and what might be the reason they are still around. Their marketing ideas to push Junk and sell it for a lot of money.  In that sense, they are geniuses, they have created a culture backward cult of blind and senseless people...

I always like to finish with a little story...

I live in a state where Harley's rules, no doubt I ride with plenty of people who ride Harleys, must of which do not believe on wearing helmets, to them, Harleys = No helmets.

One day I made the silly mistake of showing up to a ride with sneakers and no socks.

I had a good motorcycle jacket with my full face helmet, gloves and jeans, but no socks...

I was made fun of and looked down because I was not wearing the proper gear, shoes with no socks.

They did not have a helmet, but they were well geared up with Harley branded boots and chaps vests...

It is more important to protect toes with a set of Harley branded boots then it is to protect your head with a good helmet.

They went on to make fun of sport bike riders which they hate with a passion.  To Harley Fanatics the most funny thing is a sport bike rider on T-shirts, shorts, and sandals, they are thought of as a watermelon when you get a squid with a helmet.

The most hilarious thing to Harley fanatics is see someone ride with sandles while exposing your toes, but riding without a helmet exposing your brains is perfectly fine...  

And like you, I found those comments the most Hilarius, I could not believed what I was hearing...

That is how backward thinking and weird you fanatics are...

http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs/2009-streetfighters-shootout-aprilia-tuono-1000-r-buell-1125cr-triumph-speed-triple-87798.html

[1KPerDay]

I always like to fishish with a little story...

I live in a state where Harley's rules, no doubt I ride with plenty of people who ride Harleys, must of which do not believe on wearing helmets to the point that to them, Harleys = No helmets.

One day I made the silly mistake of showing up to a ride with shoes with no socks.  I had a good motorcycle jacket with my full face helmet, gloves and jeans, I was made fun of and looked down because I was not wearing the proper gear, Harley branded boots.  Like if it is more important to protect your toes with a good set of Harley boots then it is to protect your head with a good helmet.  They were making fun of sport bike riders that look like a watermelon wearing a helmet with a wife beater style t-shirt...

BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!! THAT IS THE MOST HILARIOUS STORY I'VE EVER READ!!@#!@#!@#!@#!!!

 

[Johnny Monsoon]

Whine, blahblahblah, whine...

Whut?

[atadaskew]

Man does SVNet have the Harley envy bad!
 

[Poweranger]

Man does SVNet have the Harley envy bad!
 

SVNet, I have a 2008 Nightster for sale.......I'll give you a good deal on it!

[chornbe]

SVNet... please re-read my post. Clearly you missed the point.

Clearly.

You need to just take a breath, man. Really.

I think the 883 Iron is silly. I'm not defending it in any way. IF you were to go back and read my earlier posts, and actually switch on the reading comprehension this time, you would see this.

Of course, you would also see that my previous post was actually a tad bit more thought out than most of the ones you posted, and is certainly more cohesive than the way you chopped it up. My opinions on the matter are, in fact, rooted in reality and fact. Do the price comparisons yourself, but again, match feature for feature, etc.

For instance, I talked about the soft tails... Honda's only Soft Tail style bike is the 600cc VLX, and not a big-bore, 2-up capable full-sized cruiser. See, it's about fair comparisons... as one example.

Also note, Mr. Reading Comprehension of 2001, 2002, 2005 and 2009, I said that Harleys are a premium-priced product. I never once said anything about performance. So if you're going to continue failing to correct me, please at least make the attempt to remain on the correct topic. Thank you.

Again, for the umpteenth time, Cruisers and Tourers are not about performance, they're about effectively moving people and gear at a comfortable pace and at a reasonable level of engine vibrations, chassis harshness, etc. Any sport bike made in the last 20 years will outperform *any* cruiser built... ANY TIME.

And again... I have no vested interest. I've already conceded that most of the bikes you mentioned will tear up my 883 in a straight line (but if I pick the road, you haven't got a prayer....). All I'm saying is, if you're going to trash a product, be a little more educated and a LOT less blind about it.

Bottom line... You. Are. Wrong. It's ok man... we all learn from being wrong.

[CosmicGS]

The Iron 883 is a nice looking ride. I saw one in person yesterday. Not cool enough to make me want to dump my XL1200R, but i appreciate what they are about. I am sure they will sell well.

SVNET -- STFU already!!! We get it, you don't like Harleys.

Is it all about performance to you? In that case STFU and let's all get on Ducati 1198s. Otherwise, just STFU already!!!!     Face it dude, my lowly piece of shit 1200 will smoke your C50..... That must suck, huh?  

One question before I go: how many old Sportsters do you see on the road versus old C50s? You want to talk about quality? HD may not have it on the stat sheet, but they have it where it really counts: in the build, fit and finish.

[staedtler]

  

found it at a blog from a helmet manufacturer...http://www.biltwellinc.com/index.php



"High top Vans? Check.
3/4 Helmet? Check.
Flannel? Check.
Machine Shop? Check.
Hot girl with bangs? Check.
Pit Bull? Check.
"Rat" Rod? Check.
Imitation Chopper Dave's sticker on helmet? Check.
I'm surprised it didn't have a guy doing a kick flip over it.

I'm not a hater, I like the bike. Cheaper and blacker the better. hell, it'll probably sell some helmets for us. I just wish the Factory would make the picks and shovels and let the riders dig for gold. Try to shape a scene and you are sure to gay it up, HD. Whatever."

[st ryder]

  

found it at a blog from a helmet manufacturer...http://www.biltwellinc.com/index.php

Hey, isn't there a video for the C50 you can post? I mean, they blow HDs away, so they must inspire some pretty nice videos too.

[JReazor]

Cheaper and blacker the better.

Yeah, too bad this one is Euro only.

[staedtler]

 

[chornbe]

If I ever get rich enough to burn tires like that and just not give a damn, can someone come to my house and hit me?

Please?

(ps... I don't need to work that hard to spin the rear tire on either of my Harleys... I'm just saying)

[Playinthestreet]

The more I see that bike the more I think I need to own one...

This one would spin it up just like the video..

[st ryder]

Yeah, too bad this one is Euro only.

Yes, that's one sharp looking Buell.    

[1KPerDay]

 

Hilarious... crappy replica Hog won't even pull a burnout in 4th.  

[DogBoy]

Doing my part to get this thread to page five:

[atadaskew]

  

found it at a blog from a helmet manufacturer...http://www.biltwellinc.com/index.php



High top Vans? Check.
3/4 Helmet? Check.
Flannel? Check.
Machine Shop? Check.
Hot girl with bangs? Check.
Pit Bull? Check.
"Rat" Rod? Check.
Imitation Chopper Dave's sticker on helmet? Check.
I'm surprised it didn't have a guy doing a kick flip over it.

I'm not a hater, I like the bike. Cheaper and blacker the better. hell, it'll probably sell some helmets for us. I just wish the Factory would make the picks and shovels and let the riders dig for gold. Try to shape a scene and you are sure to gay it up, HD. Whatever.

Hey, just watched it and I think it's cool!  Guess what? It's called marketing.  They're fitting it to a life style that lots of people imagine they're living.  I know lots of people in the Venice/Santa Monica area that look like (or want to look like) they fit into that image.  At least there are no beanie helmets.
What do you want Harley to do?  Have a bunch of dorky middle age guys wearing cordura and hi-viz vests ride to a library?...

Compare this vid to what the various Japanese cruiser mfgs are offering on their sites (if any).  Best they can do is show a fat middle age man wearing a beanie helmet (not even 3/4   !  ) with a bleach blonde 20 year old super hot girl on the back.  Like that is ever gonna happen on a Kawi cruiser!
Or it will be a bunch of doods cruising the mean streets trying to replicate the Harley scene exactly with the big failing of not hooking up with chicks.  Talk about gaying it up...

Next complaint.  How dare mfgs show video of the sport bikes on race tracks with the riders in full leathers! What a cliche!

[st ryder]

Doing my part to get this thread to page five:

Nice bike, but it's no C50.

[staedtler]

Hey, just watched it and I think it's cool!  Guess what? It's called marketing.  They're fitting it to a life style that lots of people imagine they're living.  I know lots of people in the Venice/Santa Monica area that look like (or want to look like) they fit into that image.  At least there are no beanie helmets.
What do you want Harley to do?  Have a bunch of dorky middle age guys wearing cordura and hi-viz vests ride to a library?...

Compare this vid to what the various Japanese cruiser mfgs are offering on their sites (if any).  Best they can do is show a fat middle age man wearing a beanie helmet (not even 3/4   !  ) with a bleach blonde 20 year old super hot girl on the back.  Like that is ever gonna happen on a Kawi cruiser!
Or it will be a bunch of doods cruising the mean streets trying to replicate the Harley scene exactly with the big failing of not hooking up with chicks.  Talk about gaying it up...

Next complaint.  How dare mfgs show video of the sport bikes on race tracks with the riders in full leathers! What a cliche!

dude, i didn't wrote that,... it was at that blog (i posted the link above the vid)

[atadaskew]

dude, i didn't wrote that,... it was at that blog (i posted the link above the vid)

dooood!  missed that you posted it from the blog.
 
 

[1KPerDay]

Nice bike, but it's no C50.

[CosmicGS]

When did Cosmic GS get a XL1200R?  

Several years ago!!!!  Here they are both together:

[CosmicGS]

The more I see that bike the more I think I need to own one...

This one would spin it up just like the video..

And break your leg kicking starting it!

[Playinthestreet]

And break your leg kicking starting it!

You ain't shittin, it had a stroker kit in it.

[CosmicGS]

That's a real nice Sportster.    

I got confused with the Harley letters for a minute, I thought you had gotten one of the new XR1200R's.  

XR1200 - cool bike. I wanted one until I saw one in person at a recent 'cycle show. It just did not do it for me. I'll stick with my XL1200R. I sat on the XR and it felt like it'd be a real fun bike to ride. But, the "x" factor was missing for me. Conversely, I sat on a Ducati 1100S Multistrada all decked out with touring accessories (handguards, 3 cases, etc) and it DID have the "x" factor and I really wanted one.

[chornbe]

XR1200 - cool bike. I wanted one until I saw one in person at a recent 'cycle show. It just did not do it for me. I'll stick with my XL1200R. I sat on the XR and it felt like it'd be a real fun bike to ride. But, the "x" factor was missing for me. Conversely, I sat on a Ducati 1100S Multistrada all decked out with touring accessories (handguards, 3 cases, etc) and it DID have the "x" factor and I really wanted one.

I hear you. I have Ulie-XT lust right now, but no gots da cash

[weidauer]

Hey, just watched it and I think it's cool!  Guess what? It's called marketing.  

As a marketer by profession (if there is such a thing), what I want to know is if this video can make black horn-rimmed Buddy Holly glasses cool again. The four-eyed masses want to know.

[Johnny Monsoon]

As a marketer by profession (if there is such a thing), what I want to know is if this video can make black horn-rimmed Buddy Holly glasses cool again. The four-eyed masses want to know.

Dude, they've always been cool.

[weidauer]

Dude, they've always been cool.

My wife will be thrilled to know that I'm cool.  

[JamesG]

It has style, and it's $2000 less than a Nightster.  I think they'll sell a butt load of them.  

Yup. Esp. with the 100% buy back/up program HD is doing. A very clever "entry level" strategy.

I've been thinking of hacking a 1200 Nightster when I get back from A-stan.  I'll be able to tote the baby and/or gear around and it will have all of the coolness of a slammed Harley without the ground clearance drawbacks.

[Tar Snake]

OK, just made my way through all 5 pages of this Nighttrain wreck of a thread and I'm left with the same opinion of the bike as when it started.

 :inlove:It's great looking, I'd fill in the scoop in the seat, level it from the hump in the back to the gas tank and hopefully then fit on the thing, get longer shocks, enjoy leisurely backroad romps since I'm not terribly fast anymore anyway.

I think it will sell, I see a lot of Nightsters running around town.

[atadaskew]

OK, just made my way through all 5 pages of this Nighttrain wreck of a thread ...

Hey, the Nighttrain is a softail!
http://www.harley-davidson.com/wcm/Content/Pages/2009_Motorcycles/2009_Motorcycles.jsp?locale=en_US#/model/fxstb

[Nodaclu]

How the hell did I miss this thread?

The Iron is a beautiful bike, and HD is the smartest and best marketing company in the world.

Why?

They took my previous bike - a Standard 883 - MSRP for the last year in 2008 was $6795.



Then they:

1. Degraded the suspension by lowering the bike, removing travel
2. Replaced pricer chrome bits with their cheaper black (powdercoated) counterparts
3. Took away all color options and pretty much went the Model T route "You can have any color you want, as long as its black".

And increased the price by $1,100.

So ultimately, HD took their entry-level model, made it slightly cheaper to produce, increased the MSRP to increase their margins, and changed how they marketed the bike.

They will sell far more of these then the previous standard 883, and they will make more money on each bike in the process.

That, ladies and gentleman, is how HD is so successful with what so many consider to be an inferior product.

I'm not bashing here. I've owned one and loved it. I "get it". But never forget the HD is a marketing machine first, and a motorcycle manufacturer second.

[Motophoria]

Nice bike Nodaclu!
And you describe HD's methodology to a T.

They are so skilled in fact that I am considering buying my first HD (883 Iron) after owning about 20 different bikes from offroad singles to RC51's and SV650's, GSXR, ST1100 and even a Goldwing over the last 40 years...I just sold my 1150GS which was a blast, but now I'm looking to experience something different...(of course I'm keeping my GSXR 750...) but I'd like to try em all

[Motophoria]

OK
So I went to my local HD dealer all excited about the 883 Iron...
They had one left on the floor, sale was pending, so no test rides on that one.
The salesman was very nice, no pressure, and I did ride my second choice, a new Nightster (essentially a 1200cc version of the Iron) about 15 miles of interstate and 2 lane back roads.

Although I loved the look and sound of it, all black and thumpy, and I did like my reflection riding it past some plate glass windows,
I just did not enjoy riding it as the rock hard seat was lower than my knees, which were just hanging out there away from the bike on the left and up against the air cleaner on the right (not comfortable...) essentially the classic "sit up and beg" riding position.  I didn't feel "one with the bike" as I do on my sport bike...and to me that was a bit unnerving...I like to feel more "in control" when I ride.

I clearly felt every small bump as a jolt to my spine because the shocks have very little travel.

The transmission was very smooth (with only about 66 miles on the bike), clutch effort not bad.

The brakes didn't have much feel or stopping power.  No gear indicator or tach, just a speedo.

Rode back to the dealership and tried a beautiful used 09 Sportster 1200 Custom with forward foot controls and stock handlebars which are higher and pulled back a bit...with only 95 miles on it.

That bike had a stage 1 jet kit and aftermarket LOUD pipes which are obnoxious sounding when the bike is started...but  once I was on it, the pipes actually really sounded good...although I'd probably put the stockers back on just so I wouldn't annoy other people...the motor ran noticeably better than the Nightster since it had been modified...lots of torque and very smooth.

However, with the 21 inch front wheel, the bike just wouldn't turn corners as quickly as I would like...

Craigslist is loaded to the gills with newer used ones, with low mileage and reasonable prices...I could buy one there and still have money left over for a 250 dual sport...

But after giving HD a fair chance, I've decided against one and am looking more toward a new Concours (in black of course)  .

That's a totally different bike, I know, but the test rides just reinforced what it is I like in my motorcycles...power, handling and current technology.

However, I do understand why some people like Harleys...they are pretty cool after all, kind of like going back to the 60's...but hey, I already experienced that about 45 years ago...(I really enjoyed my 63 Impala SS 327 when I had it, but I wouldn't buy one again...)
So I guess they are just not my cup of tea.

Remember I made all of the comparisons above with my most current/recent bikes in mind... an 07 GSXR 750 and
01 BMW 1150GS.

Ride Safely!

[chornbe]

FWIW, I don't know anyone who feels "one with the bike" after only 15 miles on a new bike they've never ridden before, of a style you've never ridden before.

[Motophoria]

I know it's not alot of miles, but with my GSXR, RC51, ST1100 and several others over 40 years of riding, the bike just "felt right" as soon as I sat on it or rode it a few miles.  With the Harley, it never felt "right"...some bikes fit and some don't, it's that simple for me.
I really "wanted" to  like the HD and I had the cash to buy it, but I just couldn't...
YMMV 

[atadaskew]

It's fair enough not liking the bike.   But some bikes take longer to get used to and enjoy if they are so very different from the bikes that you usually ride.
Before I bought my Dyna, I rented one for a day.  I absolutely hated it for the first 45 minutes or so, just could not get used to it's weird feel compared to my Ducati.  But then after about an hour it all clicked.  By the time I had to return the bike I did not want to stop riding it, and so I bought one.

Your experience could have been the opposite even after renting!  But at least there is the opportunity to rent and so go on a 'real' test ride.

FYI, renting the Street Glide made me NOT want to buy one.   I loved the idea of the bike until then, so that rental worked out the opposite of the Dyna rental for me.

[Playinthestreet]

Any H-D is to some degree quite different than the bikes most of us on STN ride.  When I ride the Dyna it takes a different mindset and some "getting used to".  It's a lot more enjoyable to ride than my Tiger when it's a "see the scenery, smell the roses" kinda day.  I wouldn't, however, take it on a ride with DogBoy and Heinee, et al....

[BobW]

I wear socks and boots so now I know why Harley guys and gals talk to me when I meet them along the road. Must have kept them busy looking at my feet so they never mentioned nor appeared to care I was on a Triumph, BMW or, or, or, at the time. Too flippin funny. Y'all got way too much mileage out of poor SV.

Chornbe, it really is ok if everyone doesn't want to buy a HD. Your defending every sigh a poster makes will give ya a heart attack buddy. Relax and enjoy, life's too short and you know the old saying about arguing with fools.  


Cheers all.

[Tar Snake]

FWIW, I don't know anyone who feels "one with the bike" after only 15 miles on a new bike they've never ridden before, of a style you've never ridden before.

Eons ago I rode a bunch of H-D's at a demo when the EVO motors came out. I rode an 883 and it felt a lot like the experience Motophoria had; basically just not my cup of tea.

The same day I rode a big twin, Low Rider, and clicked immediately with that bike, the ergos, the feel, it all worked for me. Going in it was a bike I thought wasn't me at all, a long chopperish cruiser. If I had been 45 instead of 25 like I was at the time, I might have had the ability to actually buy one and would have seriously considered it.

Some bikes you do just click with immediately. The 1st time I rode a Sprint RS (about a year before I bought mine) I knew from crowded, rush hour, city streets test ride I was going to end up with one sooner or later and I did.

...but your point is valid too, the 1st K75 I rode I hated, weird switches, jacking shaft drive, who would buy one of these? Me and I've had it for 20 years now First ride out of town and into the hills and we clicked.

[st ryder]

...The same day I rode a big twin, Low Rider, and clicked immediately with that bike, the ergos, the feel, it all worked for me....

HD's best, non-bagger bike IMO.  

[Rabon1]

HI Guys, new here.
BTW I like the looks of the 883 Iron.