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Topic: '84 Night Hawk 650 w/copper flecks in oil  (Read 1082 times)

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Little John
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« on: May 14, 2009, 06:21:17 PM »

Hi Gang! I'm new to this site. I was surfing the web looking for info/advice on for my '84 Night Hawk 650. I bought two '84 Night Hawks last spring and had a good friend combine the best of both into one very nice bike. Basically one bike had a seized motor, but mint parts. The other had a strong, clean motor and an A- body. I gave him all of the remaining parts to build himself a bike (it's almost complete as of this writing).

A few thousand miles into my ownership of the bike (20k currently) I noticed what looked like copper in the oil when I was changing it out. They are very thin copper colored flakes that range up to 2mm in size. The bike that had the blown engine also had the same condition. My friend completely rebuilt that engine after removing it from the bike (no fun at all!). He found a connecting rod bearing that had worn out and shifted...

I'm assuming that my bike has a similar condition. I have a couple questions for you:

1) Is this a common problem with this engine or am I just very unlucky?

2) Have any of you tried changing the connecting rod bearings after removing the oil pan, without pulling the motor?

3) When I looked up the bearings on line, there were several bearings listed, with both number and color designations? Are they they slightly different sizes, like shims? If so, How the heck do I oder the right ones?

Lots of questions from a newb...I hope one of you guys has some experience and it wasn't all bad.

Thanks for your help
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« on: May 14, 2009, 06:21:17 PM »

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MattsMotorin
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« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2009, 10:46:34 PM »

Yes, the rod bearing was a really common problem with the nighthawk 650. Hell, it was common with a lot of 80's and 90's bikes (ZX-11 included) I had a couple of them that I sold for parts not that long ago and I spun the crank on one when I was a kid.

You could try to pull the pan as I've heard of people changing the rod bearing from below (usually #2, I believe). But it's likely that the problem will just come back because the theory is that the oil journals just aren't big enough. Plus, there's a good chance that the crank could be damaged and require replacement or resurfacing. When the crank is resurfaced, that's when the different size bearings come into play. If they mill down the crank .001 or .002 to get it right, you'll have to compensate by getting a slightly larger bearing. Makes sense right? So, most likely, you'll have to pull the crank which will have you pulling the valve cover to get the cam chain off. You'll take the crank to the machine shop (or you'll have to use a micrometer to see if the crank surface got hosed), get the crank resurfaced, get the right bearing (one clam top, one clam bottom). Then you get to put it all back together and hope you get it right. Then it could be 60,000 miles before it happens again or it could be 6,000 EEK!

Now don't get me wrong, I've heard of quite a few guys getting 80K out of a cb650 with absolutely no problems at all. Some people believe the problem only really occurs at sustained highway speeds. Regardless, if it were me, I 'd look for an 84 or 85 700s nighthawk in great shape or see if it's possible to put the 700s motor in your 650 frame (not sure). The 700s never had the problems of the 650 except when people rode wheelies for too long on them, starving the motor of oil.

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Little John
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« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2009, 07:21:36 AM »

Thank you so much for the reply!

We did the engine pull and rebuild thing on the bike that I didn't keep. It was a a huge job. That engine is "shoe horned" in that frame...I primarily drive my bike in the city and am vigilant about changing the oil and using premium synthetic oil. I'll be happy to just prevent it from seizing. I think I'll drop the pan and see what I can see. If there's no apparent damage, I'll replace the bearings and hope for several thousand miles or better.

The 700S is a very cool motor/bike.  But this bike has sentimental value. I had one identical when I was MUCH younger. I met my wife when cruising on one, totaled it on the highway in rush hour traffic shortly thereafter, but walked away. It's taken 15 yrs for her to give in to my cravings. The bike that I have now is cleaner than the 3 yr old bike I had back then.

If I wasn't laid off from the auto industry, I'd take her in for a complete rebuild. But money is extremely tight. Thanks again for input.
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CLAY
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« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2009, 11:45:25 AM »

Hey Little John- what's your location?  You aren't by chance near Grand Rapids, MI, are you?  I ran into a guy yesterday at a shop with the nearly same story on his nighthawk.
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