R1200RT Handling Question

[Scoop]

I have the stock Pilot Road 2's.  I also confirmed that my ESA is adjusting preload properly.

[Z50a]

Mine feels fine at 70+ with no trucks.  Stable as a rock.  And I have Metzeler Roadtec Z6.  36 psi front, 42 psi rear.

I hate the way Metzelers ride,    .... they seem / feel un-stable, to me.

[gmcjetpilot]

Sorry this may not be totally "Handling" but more handling when stopped.

I have been dreaming of a BMW RT. I almost bought a used 1150, but now looking at the R1200RT

I am muscular 5'7", 170lbs, girlfriend 120lbs with gear on.

Being on the short side I have ridden dirt and street bikes that were tall for me, but wondering if the R1200RT is for me. You don't drag your feet when you ride. Of course pushing back tippy toe is not easy. I typically dismount and pull it back by the handle bars. I am plenty manly enough to drag it around. I know with any larger bike if it gets over too far standing it tends to go down (preferably as gently as possible).

Any suggestions on saddles, I know there is a low and thick saddle.

Is the R1150RT shorter? I really like the looks of the older design than the 1200RT. Is the 1200 cc boxer that much better than then 1150cc. I can get a 1150cc for a pretty good savings. How many miles are these engines good for? 100K or more?

As far as handling I heard the BMW R1200RT is top heavy with gas and even gear. Is that a big issue. I would think with the boxer engine top heavy should be less of a concern? Thanks for any input.

[twist]

Any suggestions on saddles, I know there is a low and thick saddle.

Get it with the BMW Low Seat.

Is the R1150RT shorter?

I don't know if it's shorter, but it's *significantly* heavier.

[gmcjetpilot]

I don't know if it's shorter, but it's *significantly* heavier.

I did not notice that weight difference.  Weight claimed, wet, is down 7% from 614 to 571 pounds (R1200RT to R1150RT).

SEAT Height for the R1150RT is listed  31.7 / 32.5 / 33.3 inches
The R1200RT seat height was listed 32.3 inches at lowest setting? 0.6 inch is not going to make a difference.

I still like the looks but the R1200RT is a better bike no doubt. THANKS FOR THE TIP. The down side is there are few and far away BMW bike dealers, and the closest one has a bad reputation. I do my own work but that is a draw back with the BMW for me.

[twist]

The R1200RT seat height was listed 32.3 inches at lowest setting?

32.3" is the standard seat in the low position.  The BMW Low Seat has a height of 30.7" in the low position IIRC.

[gmcjetpilot]

32.3" is the standard seat in the low position.  The BMW Low Seat has a height of 30.7" in the low position IIRC.

I've always rode taller bikes that I had to tippy toe a bit. Except for the low chopper cruiser style bikes, most large street (or dirt) bikes I can't flat foot. I have large muscular caves like a gorilla, so I am use to tippy toe.

Not a low rider cruiser kind of guy, I always like sport bikes. Now that I'm older, I want to do more touring, thus the BMW. The gold wings and big Harley's (as nice and cool as they are), are not for me.

The Kawasaki Concours or Honda ST1300.... I have had large Japanese bikes for decades and want something different. Also their seat height is not lower. They also weigh a lot more. Weight is not a concern for picking it up. If I drop it, I can pick it up. I like handling and don't want a pig just for straight line. I equate weight with nimbleness.

I am always surprised to hear people say the BMW R/1100/1150/1200RT feels top heavy?

I saw a Victory motorcycle and was intrigued. I WAS ALSO IMPRESSED with the design, fit, finish, style. I talked to the guy at a gas station convenience store who was on one. He got it new and at a really great price. I could not believe all the bike he got.

Still I love the BMW boxer even if the saddle is a little taller than some of the cruisers. I really need to just go ride one. Like many people, BMW bike dealers are not always close (or good).

[Scoop]

Sorry this may not be totally "Handling" but more handling when stopped.

I have been dreaming of a BMW RT. I almost bought a used 1150, but now looking at the R1200RT

I am muscular 5'7", 170lbs, girlfriend 120lbs with gear on.

Being on the short side I have ridden dirt and street bikes that were tall for me, but wondering if the R1200RT is for me. You don't drag your feet when you ride. Of course pushing back tippy toe is not easy. I typically dismount and pull it back by the handle bars. I am plenty manly enough to drag it around. I know with any larger bike if it gets over too far standing it tends to go down (preferably as gently as possible).

Any suggestions on saddles, I know there is a low and thick saddle.

Is the R1150RT shorter? I really like the looks of the older design than the 1200RT. Is the 1200 cc boxer that much better than then 1150cc. I can get a 1150cc for a pretty good savings. How many miles are these engines good for? 100K or more?

As far as handling I heard the BMW R1200RT is top heavy with gas and even gear. Is that a big issue. I would think with the boxer engine top heavy should be less of a concern? Thanks for any input.

I am about 5'10", but have short legs.  I have always been tippy toes on the VStrom (unless it is loaded up).  On the RT, I can easily flat foot with the seat in the lower position.  I am on the balls of my feet in the high position.  But, I find the bike feels a lot lighter than the Strom and certainly not top heavy.  It is nicely balanced, has good low speed manners and is very easy to handle.  Compared to the Strom, it is definitely not top heavy

[twist]

I am always surprised to hear people say the BMW R/1100/1150/1200RT feels top heavy?

I don't know who said that R1200RT is top-heavy.  It's not.  My old FJR felt a lot more top-heavy than the RT is.

[gmcjetpilot]

I don't know who said that R1200RT is top-heavy.  It's not.  My old FJR felt a lot more top-heavy than the RT is.

Yes I know, I was starting to wounder where I read it? So I GOOGLED: "r1200rt top heavy"

"Weight loss is always good and '05 R1200RT feels less top-heavy and more agile than the 1150" (better than R1150RT)

"I'm considering purchasing a used R1200RT (my LT was a bit too top heavy for me)." (Not R1200RT)

"the entire front end, fairing, everything..just looks way to busy for me..almost kinda top heavy.. " (LOOKS?)

"I owned a 1150RT for 3 years. The 1200RT is lighter, has more HP & TQ, available with cruise control, adj windshield, heated grips and seats, ESA suspension, and lots of luggage capacity. It was a touch top heavy (compared to HD's) but nowhere near the larger BMW LT. My bike was reliable and I had an excellent local dealer. Dealer maintenance is a bit expensive. The aftermarket has plenty of accessories." (This was on a HD forum and the HD is a lower bike overall that you sit down int, but I really doubt the HD is going to handle a twisty road like the BMW)

"I have had 2 bikes in the past 8 years. First was a BMW R1150RT. Nice bike, great air management, quiet and nimble, but top heavy and not that much fun to ride around the streets of Los Angeles." (OK its not a Ninja sport bike)

"I ride an '05 R1200RT, and my annual miles seem to be a balance between solo exploring and two-up touring. Excellent ride for all desires - better than any Wing or H-D I've put miles on. Low center of gravity and good lean angle makes control a given."

"I got my ’05 R1200RT in January ’06 as a showroom leftover with 600 miles on it, not enough for a factory demo discount. This is a top-heavy bike, to be sure, so maneuvers at low or no speed require care. I have found that all heavy motorcycles have similar limitations with so much weight on similar contact patches. Overall, the R1200RT is a great motorcycle."

Sport-Touring.net forums: R1200RT vs Moto Guzzi Norge 1200
"I own an RT and bought it after going on a BMW ride day.  I rode the RT and the K1200LT in heavy rains and crosswinds on the test rides and was impressed with how stable both bikes were in shitty conditions. I've never ridden any Moto Guzzi and I've only looked at a Norge briefly in a dealership.  IIRC the Norge looked smaller (maybe lower seat height) than the RT.  The RT is a big bike and it tends to be top-heavy."

"Handling-  If there is ONE area the RT is the best, it is how it handles in the twisties.   It has a very light feel, and the steering takes less effort of any bike I've been on in a long time.  It does NOT feel top heavy, and it inspires confidence over any road surface.  Finding yourself in a curve with a rough surface does not upset the RT.  It has the best suspension in the business, and smoothes out whatever you come into.  At 571 pounds, the bike is close to the VFR.  The RT has enormous ground clearance, more than I'd ever use."

BOTTOM LINE: Every one has an Opinion. Some opinions are wrong or come from never riding the Bike. I think people perceive it is top heavy by looks or more upright seating position, NOT because it is the CG is actually TOP HEAVY. It is a taller bike. Any "cruiser" with a 26-27" seat height is going to feel less TALL. However riding I'd bet the BMW is better on a twisty road. Look forward to getting one.

[Z50a]

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 26-27" seat height is going to feel less TALL. However riding I'd bet the BMW is better on a twisty road. Look forward to getting one.[/left]

Almost every BMW dealer does DEMO rides (even if you don't catch an event with the BMW factory Demo Truck).

Go test ride a couple of models.....  AND almost every dealer will let you ride a used bike (in stock / for sale).

and form your own opinion  

[Mr Sunshine]

Is the 1200 cc boxer that much better than then 1150cc. I can get a 1150cc for a pretty good savings. How many miles are these engines good for? 100K or more?

I used to own a 204 R1150RT which I put 17k on before trading it for a SV650s (yeah crazy I know).  This past year I rented a R1200RT while in Europe.  The 1200 is more than head and shouldars better than the 1150.  So much I wouldn't even look at an 1150 if I could afford the 1200.

[gmcjetpilot]

The 1200 is more than head and shouldars better than the 1150.  So much I wouldn't even look at an 1150 if I could afford the 1200.

Thanks, good info. Really the 1200 has been around long enough you can find good deals on used clean low mile rides. I was leaning towards the 1200. I did find an interesting article on the web comparing the 1150 and 1200. The 1150 has nice qualities as well, but I might as well get the better bike. The faring and side bag style is growing on me. The 1200 gets better mileage and as you say from your ride, its a better bike. You have to love they made it +40 lighter.

Thanks for the tip that relieves my mind. Bikes like everything are not selling, so deals around, so I might go new. Tour in Europe on a R1200RT, a slight twinge of jealousy just came over me.,   and I'm never one to be jealous.

Just so I am informed, as suggested take a test ride. I might as well try the Kawasaki Concours-14. I know it does not have all the goodies and weights 100lbs more, but the price is right. They say the shaft drive is like a chain, no jacking? I'd like to try it. (edit: I just look and they are selling new 2008's Concours 14's for $10K, $3,500 under MSRP!)

Also I want to ride the Victory Vision for grins. I went to their web site and saw their monster Vision. American Iron (TV) did a whole show on it, which they have linked to their web site. Amazing bike, but not for me. May be for me in 15 years when I retire. I still like sport and local riding. Right now I only do real XC once a year and a few shorter jaunts. Even if I was a hard core XC touring rider, at some point a bike gets so big, you might as well add two more wheels, a body and call it a car.

[Mr Sunshine]

Tour in Europe on a R1200RT, a slight twinge of jealousy just came over me.,   and I'm never one to be jealous.

Don't go the Europe section or...go look in ride reports for a write up about a Europe trip that another ST.Ner just recently took.    

[bonnieboomer]

Just back in VA from a trip to Utah. Tested several K1200GT and RS models before renting an R1200RT, which felt just right. Following a local on his 07 K1200GT with Valentine, covered 220 miles in a little over 2 hours riding time. Some of that was on I-80 and I-84 with semis around, then across the windy high plains of Wyoming. Compared to the bagger Triumphs I used to ride [Sprint ST, Tiger and Trophy], the RT was as stable as a rock, windshield up or down. My last bike that felt this solid at 125 was a 1974 R90S with no bags and a little quarter fairing.

Prime suspect has to be the rear tire. Let's all hope that proves to have been the problem.

bonnieboomer [thinking hard about getting a used R1200RT]

PS - I'm 5'8" with 30" inseam and felt much more in control than with Tiger [Steamer] or Trophy at 0-5 mph.

[Mr Sunshine]

This freaking thread is 3 weeks old.  Did you ever get someone to look at the bike or are you just smoking crack?  It must not be that bad if there is no answer here by now.

[tigertom1965]

I was out of town for a week (From Saturday to Saturday) and only have weekends to bring bike to the shop.

Last Saturday they were closed for July 4th. I will try to get there on Saturday this week. They are just waiting for me to bring my bike in.

This past Monday it seemed to be more stable than before.  

If I rode around with 1 lb of stuff in one side bag and the other empty would that be enough to upset the handling?

I do have Pilot Road 2 tires on order but the rear is on backorder until July 23 so if all else fails I have one more thing to try.

[tigertom1965]

Brought the bike in for a test drive by the BMW mechanic.

Supposedly the bike handles just like all of the other bikes even in the windy conditions we had on Saturday.

The mechanic told me I could drop another 2 lbs of pressure in the tires but no more than that. Fronts were 37.5 after my trip to the dealer plus 20 minutes of wait time. Don't think he tested the rear pressure. So I am guessing it is all in my head?

Hopefully the Pilot Road 2 will help the hyperactive feeling in the bike at highway speeds. I guess after riding around on a 2006 Concours's stock Dunlops everything else will feel like a hyper handling tire? I guess I am down to a tire change to see if that helps any.

Everything else was working like it was supposed to. No dragging brakes or tight wheel bearing in the front to cause anything unusual. I heard a whooshing sound from the front but was told it was the air intake possibly (Nothing out of the ordinary was heard by mechanic).

It does seem to handle unusual when I don't pay as much attention to balancing the load between the side cases like I should. I wouldn't think 1 or 2 lbs would make a big difference?

[Mr Sunshine]

Run 36 on the front and 42 on there rear.  


1 or 2 lbs makes a big difference to me on the track.  3 or 4 on the street and I notice it.  Honestly 37.5 is WAY too high.

[trapp120]

BTW- The Pilot Road 2's are fantastic tires.  I just went past 9,000 miles on my set and there is still too much tread left to justify replacing them.  The grip and handling are first rate also.

I have over 6k on my PR2's and they look new. Absolutely ideal tires for grip in wet/dry while maintaining long distances, daily, at very high speeds with little wear. AKA, the perfect ST tire.