My 1125R Test Ride

[DaleFranks]

I took my 1125R test ride today.  The conditions of the ride sucked, but I really liked the bike.

My full ride report is here, at my blog, but a few excerpts are below:

Ergonomics are described by Buell as “athletic”.  I’d describe them as fairly comfortable in sportbike terms.  They’re certainly more relaxed than I expected, and you can ride the 1125r without leaning on your wrists, and laying on the tank.  You are crouched forward, and pegs are high, but not so far forward, and not so high that it becomes quickly uncomfortable.  It may be a racing bike, but it is a bike you can ride.

On the street, the broad torque curve is forgiving, and the engine responds promptly in any gear.  Unlike the long-stroke V-Twins on most cruisers, the high-revving short-stroke Rotax engine rewards throttle inputs with prompt obedience,  the power is linear, and willing to surge higher at the flick of a wrist.  While lofting the front wheel on the 1125R could be done with ridiculous ease, the power is easily tameable.  It doesn’t get out of control, and doesn’t surprise you.  It merely does what you ask, when you ask.

The 1125R is not only very stable at highway speeds, the way the fairing directs the airflow was perfect for my 5″10″ frame.  There was no buffeting at all, just a nice stream of clean air at the top of my chest and shoulders.  Dropping into a slight tuck made even that go away.  The fairing design on the Buell is quite effective, which would make highway trips far less fatiguing.

The only major drawback to the 1125R was the leaden ineffectiveness of the rear brakes.  I didn’t like that at all.

[Kootenanny]

Glad you like the bike.  I haven't ridden an 1125R yet...

The rear brake thing is common to all Buells, I believe--at least, my Firebolt has a very weak rear brake.  Doesn't bother me at all.  AFAIK, the brake is purposely made that way, to help prevent accidental overapplication.

[Brad1445]

+1 on the rear brake,

After 5 Great XB Bike I cant figure out why they even put the rear brake pedal there, just for looks?

They could remove it for weight savings if it's not going to do anything.

[JamesG]

Not a design feature. Its a side effect of having the rotor in the exhaust stream that is full of carbon, oil, and other stuff not so good for effective friction.

But because its on sport oriented bikes where the rear brake is used by most owners as a trail braking afterthought, it made it thru testing.

[whodom]

Not a design feature. Its a side effect of having the rotor in the exhaust stream that is full of carbon, oil, and other stuff not so good for effective friction.

It's this way on all Buells, read the posts above.  It will get better with use and you can always substitute pads with more grip if you have to be able to lock up your rear wheel at will.  Once you get the pads bedded in, it works fine for trail braking or holding the bike at stoplights.

[Kootenanny]

Not a design feature. Its a side effect of having the rotor in the exhaust stream that is full of carbon, oil, and other stuff not so good for effective friction.

But because its on sport oriented bikes where the rear brake is used by most owners as a trail braking afterthought, it made it thru testing.

It's a design feature, involving a small disc, 2-piston caliper, and relative sizes of the master and slave cylinders.  And this style of "weak" rear brake is not uncommon on sport bikes, AFAIK.  Just another reminder that a Buell is NOT a Harley.

BTW, when I trail brake, I use the front brake.

[JamesG]

The Buell XB's rear brake disk and caliper is about the same size and capacity as "other" sportbikes and its distinctly less effective under normal operating conditions (ie; dirty).

I own a Uly, and I have noticed a difference when I've cleaned the rotor and pads off.  Haven't you ever wondered why or how the hub of the rotor carrier or your rear wheel turns dark after a while?

Tis no big deal. Like I said, most Buell riders, myself included don't need or use the rear for primary braking.

[Brad1445]

The Buell XB's rear brake disk and caliper is about the same size and capacity as "other" sportbikes and its distinctly less effective under normal operating conditions (ie; dirty).

I own a Uly, and I have noticed a difference when I've cleaned the rotor and pads off.  Haven't you ever wondered why or how the hub of the rotor carrier or your rear wheel turns dark after a while?

Tis no big deal. Like I said, most Buell riders, myself included don't need or use the rear for primary braking.

I know no one that uses it or would as a primary brake.  But some reaction from pushing it would be good.

I had a Uly and when on dirt there is many times you are NOT to use the front brake are you will tuck the front end in and crash.

[JamesG]

Yeah, I kept my right hand in "dirt mode" (off the lever) when on dirt.  Engine breaking on a Uly is usually enough.

[Mastros2]

Dale, I agree with your review.  I demo-ed one June 08 and had the same impression as you did; brakes, ergos and wind protection.  

Just don't know if that is the direction I would like to go with a motorcycle purchase. I picked up a 07 Uly a few months back and really enjoy it.  Maybe in a few years I'll reconsider.  

[skater69]

I'd like to test ride a 1125R.  But I disagree with you Dale about v-twins and heat/mirrors.

My naked SV1000N with it's 125hp 90deg V-twin....puts out ZERO heat....of course it's liquid cooled though.  But the mirrors don't shake at all at speed.  I ditched the crappy stock mirrors with bar ends but neither vibrate at all.

The last Buell I rode was an XB9 or XB12 (can't remember which one it was) about 3 yrs ago.  It was like riding a vibrating OVEN.  After 15 minutes, I couldn't wait to park it. The Hoover vacuum sounding fan bellowed the whole time too.  And the power sucked.  Remember thinking  "I just rode the biggest piece of crap on the market today!".  Hopefully the 1125R is a major improvement.

[DaleFranks]

I'd like to test ride a 1125R.  But I disagree with you Dale about v-twins and heat/mirrors.

My naked SV1000N with it's 125hp 90deg V-twin....puts out ZERO heat....of course it's liquid cooled though.  But the mirrors don't shake at all at speed.  I ditched the crappy stock mirrors with bar ends but neither vibrate at all.

The last Buell I rode was an XB9 or XB12 (can't remember which one it was) about 3 yrs ago.  It was like riding a vibrating OVEN.  After 15 minutes, I couldn't wait to park it. The Hoover vacuum sounding fan bellowed the whole time too.  And the power sucked.  Remember thinking  "I just rode the biggest piece of crap on the market today!".  Hopefully the 1125R is a major improvement.

Well, a 90-degree twin is more or less self-balancing. But that's really a L-Twin, not a V-Twin.  I've never ridden a V-twin that wasn't vibey.  Some are worse than others.  And, I'm 45, so I remember riding V-twins without counter-balancers or rubber isolation mounts.  So, I tend to compare modern products with what they used to be--which was much worse.

[Kootenanny]

My naked SV1000N with it's 125hp 90deg V-twin....puts out ZERO heat....of course it's liquid cooled though.  But the mirrors don't shake at all at speed.  I ditched the crappy stock mirrors with bar ends but neither vibrate at all.

The last Buell I rode was an XB9 or XB12 (can't remember which one it was) about 3 yrs ago.  It was like riding a vibrating OVEN.  After 15 minutes, I couldn't wait to park it. The Hoover vacuum sounding fan bellowed the whole time too.  And the power sucked.  Remember thinking  "I just rode the biggest piece of crap on the market today!"

Hmmm...before I bought my XB9R Firebolt, I demo'd a lot of bikes, mostly V-twin sportbikes because that's what I wanted.  My short list included the Buell and the SV1000S; while riding the Suzuki, I kept thinking to myself, "This bike is almost as nice as the Buell, but not quite."  Compared to the Buell, the Suzuki is an appliance

I ride ATGATT, and the summer weather here can get quite hot--yet, my fan never "bellows" and, while the frame can get warm where it surrounds the rear cylinder, I've never had an issue with heat from it.  And yes, the Firebolt vibrates, but I don't find it annoying at all (it vibrates mostly at idle, and I spend very little time sitting at idle...at speed, it smooths out nicely, although it does retain a low-frequency thrum which I quite enjoy, unlike the high-frequency buzz I've experienced on some other bikes).

The Buell's power may "suck," but then why can't my buddy who did buy an SV1000S keep up to me in the corners?

[Roaddog]

It's a design feature, involving a small disc, 2-piston caliper, and relative sizes of the master and slave cylinders.  And this style of "weak" rear brake is not uncommon on sport bikes, AFAIK.  Just another reminder that a Buell is NOT a Harley.

BTW, when I trail brake, I use the front brake.

If you think the rear brake on a Buell is numb, you should ride a Ducati. If I owned a Duc, I would remove the rear m/c, rotor and caliper because it's nothing more than excess dead weight.

[Roaddog]

I took a test ride on an XB12 Lightning 2 years ago during the Sturgis trip and I thought the Sportster motor was a little chuffy. I'd have to at least put a pipe on it, because it was way too quiet. This year at Topeka, I took a spin on an 1125CR and the Rotax l-c twin made impressive power. Ergos seemed a little better than the a-c bike. Although the bars were still way too low for my taste, they were a lot closer to the seat than the older iteration. If they come out with something ergonomically similar to the Uly with some decent wind protection I'll start to get a lot more interested.

[skater69]

author=Kootenanny link=topic=42896.msg998702#msg998702 date=1251322876]
The Buell's power may "suck," but then why can't my buddy who did buy an SV1000S keep up to me in the corners?

Must be the superior Buell...

Put equal riders together and your Buell with 30 less hp, 10lbs less torque and 30lbs MORE weight than the SV1000S will be struggling to keep up.  I don't know....I have 2 bros pipes on the SV1000N and it makes some nice thumping mean music.  Every Buell I've heard sounds like a runaway dump truck with a missing muffler.  Don't get me wrong, I really hope I like the 1125R but the XB I test rode in '06 was really shitty......and I wanted to like it.

[Kootenanny]

Put equal riders together and your Buell with 30 less hp, 10lbs less torque and 30lbs MORE weight than the SV1000S will be struggling to keep up.

Hmmm...you might wanna check those weight figures; according to the manufacturers' specs, the Buell weighs almost 30 lb. less than the Suzuki.  But no matter...I agree, on a straight road, going flat out, the Buell ain't gonna hang with the Suzuki.  However, I avoid straight roads like the plague--and thankfully, I live where there are lots of twisty roads right close at hand.  

To me, riding isn't a race.  I ride because I enjoy the experience of riding, and the Buell delivers a superior riding experience IMO.  It may have less power, but it feels powerful, and hey, it goes fast enough that many of my riding buddies can't hang with me if I wick it up in the twisties (this might have as much to do with riding ability, mind you--but the fact is, I'm seldom "struggling to keep up").

You don't like it, that's the way it is--many people don't.  But for me, the Buell is the "superior" bike (that's why I put my money where my mouth is and bought one...like I said, I could have had an SV1000S, in fact that was the closest "contender," but it just didn't turn my crank like the Buell does).

[DaleFranks]

Don't get me wrong, I really hope I like the 1125R but the XB I test rode in '06 was really shitty......and I wanted to like it.

Well, I have zero interest in an XB bike, either.  You can massage an air-cooled pushrod motor all you want, but unless you're looking for a ca. 1973 "sportbike" you'll never get what you want out of it, in terms of either vibration or power.

The 1125R is different.  For the price, and the belt drive instead of a chain, I'd buy one.  I'm seriously considering it.  It'd be a bike I could do track days with, and commute with when I felt a little salty.

I wouldn't trade my FJR for it, of course, but I wouldn't mind it at all for a sporty second bike.

[skater69]

I'm sure with the new engine the 1125 will be much more to my liking than the XB was.  I like having a v-twin in the garage which is why I have my SV1000 along with my Blackbird.  Switching bikes everyday is fun.  
The Buell would replace the SV if I got one but I'd really have to like it a lot since both of my bikes are long paid for and I got them used......for about 1/2 the price of the Buell combined.

[Rogue]

I can tell you right now that the 1125R has MORE vibration all across its rev range than the XB Thunderstorm except at idle.  In fact I have always said that the XB12R is smoother than the 1125R above 2,500 RPM.  At top gear, they are both smooth but the more you rev the 1125R, the harder its jackhammer vibration becomes.  It's not the kind that will numb your hands but you can feel the difference.

Having said that, the 1125R will leave the SV1000 for dead in any speed contest.  It just won't be as smooth.  It's a 75 degree V-Twin designed for compact packaging, and Buell designed in a very direct feel to the motor and practically the whole bike.  Nothing is numbed down for comfort except the ergonomics.  The 1125R is raw and direct in the way it responds to your throttle hand and your steering and body motions.  It is also very much like the XB12R Firebolt in many ways (except the vibes at idle).  It even has a fan that runs when the engine gets hot.  

So I honestly don't believe you will like the 1125R one bit because it makes very little concessions to comfort and refinement, just performance.  

[Brad1445]

You forgot two things you get with the 1125 series.

1. weekly visits to your dealer
2. Odd looks from people trying to figure out why the saddle bags are on the front forks, or if they are big dust busters.


The XB bike is far more refined even after 3 years of 1125 production Buell has done little to bring the bike up to the reliability, competitions level of quality.  They will be selling the 2008 models well into 2012 at this rate.

[Rogue]

......even after 3 years of 1125 production Buell has done little to bring the bike up to the reliability, competitions level of quality.  

So, do you happen to have the stats on the reliability of the 1125R from 2008 to 2009?

Are are you referring to hearsay?

[BobW]

So, do you happen to have the stats on the reliability of the 1125R from 2008 to 2009?

Are are you referring to hearsay?

You guys almost cancel each other out with the extreme position on every post    JMO, but the bottom line is a factory doesn't shut down when what it produces is being sold. My friend just bought a XR1200 and he loves it. He rides very well and has explored it's handling to the point he lifted the rear tire on our lovely mountain roads. The Buell motor tweaks are a treat and the fit and finish are beautiful. It's a keeper even lacking the extra handling of the Buell platform(s). Why not just get the Buell? The Buell sitting next to it looks shabby and cheap in a way that is embarrassing/repulsive (?). Not hearsay, he voted that opinion with his $.

That is the point that applies to all brands, to keep the doors open you must MAKE money (sales). Everyone in motorsports is feeling the pinch and want conquest sales to bring in new cash. You guys that say they shouldn't offer what new customers want should buy more of what they are not selling now and/or mail em a few bucks for investment with the current status quo. Tossing personal insults won't solve anything and riding what you enjoy is always subjective.

Cheers

[Thunderbox]

I ride a Buell my buddy rides a Hayabusa.  We both went to the Buell ride at the dealer this spring.  We rode every bike Buell makes, some more than once.  We both walked away with the same conclusion.  For the shear enjoyment of the ride the XB bikes were way more fun to ride than the 1125s.  I don't know how to explain it but the old lunk XB engine just has it in spades.  It puts a smile on you that can't be wiped off.  In not so many words that is what motorcycling is about, fun.

[Brad1445]

+1 Thunderbox

There is something magical about that bike/ The torque the belt drive the handling all work together beautifully.

[Kootenanny]

I don't know how to explain it but the old lunk XB engine just has it in spades.  It puts a smile on you that can't be wiped off.  In not so many words that is what motorcycling is about, fun.

Well put, Dave.


(I cant' believe it--I'm agreeing with Brad...)

[Rogue]

Tossing personal insults won't solve anything and riding what you enjoy is always subjective.

Cheers

I wasn't insulting anyone.  Brad knows where I stand and all I was asking for is a source.  

I have personally seen the XR1200 up close and personal.  To be quite honest, I did not see any quality differences between it and the Lightning that was sitting next to it.  I would say they were very much each other's equal.  Why buy a Buell?  That's easy!  The Lightning is faster and handles much better and can go farther on a tank of gas.  All that for less money.  The XR1200 is for people who refuse to buy Buell and/or loves the look of the retro-XR1200.  Nothing wrong with that.  

In any case, nobody is immune to low sales, even H-D.  Didn't they lay off a bunch of people not too long ago?  

Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki, all have much larger parent conglomerates that can absorb losses of their tiny motorcycle divisions.  H-D does not have that luxury.  Don't blame the products of a company not selling in an economy where consumers are cutting back on basic staples like groceries and clothing!  

[00buck]

I can tell you right now that the 1125R has MORE vibration all across its rev range than the XB Thunderstorm except at idle.  In fact I have always said that the XB12R is smoother than the 1125R above 2,500 RPM.  At top gear, they are both smooth but the more you rev the 1125R, the harder its jackhammer vibration becomes.  It's not the kind that will numb your hands but you can feel the difference.

Jackhammer vibration...yes, good description. I test rode an 1125CR with the now standard upright style bars. It was comfortable except a bit cramped for legroom. The power was stunning, I've never experienced such intense violent power in a sportbike. Pretty exciting but I still  prefer the XB's power curve, it's a very satisfying streetbike motor.

[Tpoppa]

XBs certianly won't light up a spec sheet, but on a twisty back road I have yet to find a bike that will get through the corners quicker.  I have yet to meet someone who actually owns one that doesn't thouroughly enjoy it.  I've owned 20+ bikes (2 XBs), and while I've had more powerful bikes, the Buells were the most engaging.

I've yet to ride an 1125, although I may in the spring.  I was disappointed in the preproduction & '08 model fueling issues.  I think Buell rushed to get the 25th anniversary models to the showroom (thanks HD shareholders).  They would have been better served to hold the realese for a few months.  Buell has done a good job of resolving the '08s issues and the '09s seem to be better out of the box.  I believe in function over form, but I still shake my head when I look a those radiator pods.

[oldenslow]

Just curious, can you run the bike without the airscoops?  Any pics of the bike without them?

[scottzilla]

Just curious, can you run the bike without the airscoops?  Any pics of the bike without them?

Yeah,  Surely someone has removed those hideous scoops.

[Rincewind]

Just curious, can you run the bike without the airscoops?  Any pics of the bike without them?

Yeah, until it overheats and seizes up.  The bike is liquid-cooled...

[oldenslow]

Yeah, until it overheats and seizes up.  The bike is liquid-cooled...

I thought the scoops were just for airbox induction.

[Rincewind]

I thought the scoops were just for airbox induction.

They are hiding side-mounted radiators.

[oldenslow]

Ahhhh, I'd still like to see some pics without them.

[garry]

How about these options:

http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2008/03/10/buell-1125r-full-fairing-kit/

http://www.buellparts.net/content-product_info/product_id-2224/1125r_side_fairing_kit.html

[DogBoy]

The 1125r looks so much better with the full fairing. It should have been produced with full bodywork. No scoops.

[chornbe]

It's this way on all Buells, read the posts above.  It will get better with use and you can always substitute pads with more grip if you have to be able to lock up your rear wheel at will.  Once you get the pads bedded in, it works fine for trail braking or holding the bike at stoplights.

Hmm... Isn't "trail braking" named so because of the "trailing off the brake into the turn" which should be done primarily with the front brake like every other braking application?

google books link

And the wiki article says...

Guides such as the Motorcycle Safety Foundation Basic RiderCourse teach that the safest way for a beginning rider to approach a corner on a motorcycle is by performing all of the slowing before the entrance of the turn, discouraging the use of any brakes while the motorcycle is leaned over.[1] Opponents of trail braking claim that because of the steep learning curve trail braking is or should be an exclusively race track or racing technique. However, proponents of trail braking believe that knowing and understanding how to slow while entering a corner gives the rider a greater safety margin, particularly in blind, decreasing radius or downhill corners.

Prominent motorcycle authorities disagree on the effectiveness of trail braking. Keith Code, founder of the California Superbike School teaches that the only way to effectively and accurately direct and turn a motorcycle is with countersteering, even going so far as to say in his 1983 book A Twist of the Wrist that "To tighten a turn and increase your lean angle, you must countersteer again".[2][3] However, Freddie Spencer, founder of Freddie Spencer's High Performance Riding School as well as Nick Ienatsch, author of the 2003 book Sport Riding Techniques and chief instructor of Yamaha Champions Riding School, both teach that trail braking should be used in nearly every corner as a means to help the motorcycle change direction, advocating that trail braking gives the rider more control and significantly increases rider safety.[4]

Additionally, Spencer and Ienatsh's programs advocate that the slower a motorcycle is going, the tighter the radius of the corner it can navigate. By using the brakes to slow the motorcycle down, the rider is effectively changing the motorcycle's direction by decreasing the radius of the corner. Conversely, applying throttle will increase the motorcycle's speed and effectively increase the radius of the corner. This is opposed to Code's teaching that only countersteering can affect the motorcycle's direction.

Eight time World champion, Valentino Rossi, has been quoted to say that trail braking is a racing technique and not a street technique. Rossi, unlike most world class racers, spent years riding on the streets and roads of Italy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_braking

[chornbe]

Jackhammer vibration...yes, good description. I test rode an 1125CR with the now standard upright style bars. It was comfortable except a bit cramped for legroom. The power was stunning, I've never experienced such intense violent power in a sportbike. Pretty exciting but I still  prefer the XB's power curve, it's a very satisfying streetbike motor.

I haven't ridden the 1125 yet, but REALLY like Buell's treatment of the 1200cc mill.  

[oldenslow]

How about these options:

http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2008/03/10/buell-1125r-full-fairing-kit/

http://www.buellparts.net/content-product_info/product_id-2224/1125r_side_fairing_kit.html

Thanks, it looks much better to my eye.  I know the scoops give the bike its unique look, but they really look like some weird tack on part for a movie or tv show.

[Castaway]

The 1125r looks so much better with the full fairing. It should have been produced with full bodywork. No scoops.

Agreed.

I hope this bike can make it through the Buell crisis.

[garry]

I'm seeing that you can buy a NEW 1125R for about $5K plus no bullshit fees. That's some serious fire sale pricing there. Wish I had room in the garage because I have that kind of money in the bank... I do worry about the supply of parts and service on the 1125s though. The XBs will likely have better support in coming years.

[Rincewind]

That fully faired 1125R would be a very special possession. It is the last big flight of Buell's fancy, and the wind management is superb they say.  XB's are fun but the 1125's have much more power in my experience.

[Castaway]

The "scoops" - aside from their ugly appearance, IMO, I don't get how they are the best design Buell could come up with from an engineering POV. It seems to me - and I'm no engineer -  that they would trap incoming air, unless it exits out back and towards the motor. Does anyone have a clearer idea about this?

(The Honda side mounted radiators, from the VFR to the VTR, use negative pressure to pull air from behind the radiator.)

[malbojah]

The "scoops" - aside from their ugly appearance, IMO, I don't get how they are the best design Buell could come up with from an engineering POV. It seems to me - and I'm no engineer -  that they would trap incoming air, unless it exits out back and towards the motor. Does anyone have a clearer idea about this?

(The Honda side mounted radiators, from the VFR to the VTR, use negative pressure to pull air from behind the radiator.)

The air going in, through the radiator, then over the engine and exits down by the riders feet

[Thunderbox]

Must be the superior Buell...

Put equal riders together and your Buell with 30 less hp, 10lbs less torque and 30lbs MORE weight than the SV1000S will be struggling to keep up.  I don't know....I have 2 bros pipes on the SV1000N and it makes some nice thumping mean music.  Every Buell I've heard sounds like a runaway dump truck with a missing muffler.  Don't get me wrong, I really hope I like the 1125R but the XB I test rode in '06 was really shitty......and I wanted to like it.

Your figures are a little, well wrong.  The Torque of the SV is 102 NM @ 7200 RPM and the torque of the Buell xb12 is 113.9 at 6000 RPM.  The Hp of the SV is only 16 HP more than the Buell and it is a heavier bike by 9 KG.  maybe you should do some research before you make statements that are less than fact.