Motorcycle "issues"

[Bravo12]

If they consistently fixed problems after the first year, how would they ever get people to buy new models in their first production year?  Savvy riders/buyers usually wait for at least the second year of a model's production anyway, to lessen the risk of serious design problems coming up.  But if everyone knew the second year of a model was going to be markedly better, why not wait?

[kevin_stevens]

Here's an example (ok, two) of how this thing comes back to bite manufacturers:

1)  I'm very interested in the 2009 CBR1K.  But I won't even consider buying one.  Why?
Some of the 2008s had significant oil burning problems - I've heard reports of up to *well* over a quart per 1K miles.  Honda pulled the covers over the whole issue - some owners apparently got replacements, some got rebores, some got told "that's normal".  

The 2009 is the same bike.  Does it have the same problems?  Don't know - it takes a while for these things to get reported.  Did they fix something?  Don't know, Honda's not saying.  If I buy one and it has a problem, will they take care of me?  Of course the salesman says so - he doesn't have to back that up.

So I won't be buying one.  If they'd said "Yes, there was a ring sealing problem with some of the 2008s, we changed design/suppliers, anything past VIN xxxxx is ok.", they might have my money.

2)  Had a 1999 C5 Corvette.  GM was trying something nifty with the control arm bushings to get better compliance along with solid handling.  May have worked, but under *hard* braking the bushings would pull out of the control arm and allow it to start grinding against the front crossmember.  Not good.

My dealer replaced two sets on my car; the first while I was autocrossing it, and the second after it had been retired and was a pure street car.  Then he said he wasn't going to replace any more, that I was subjecting the car to "racing use".  So I had a choice of paying a lawyer for an exhaustive battle with GM warranty, ponying up $1800 a year to have the control arms replaced, or selling the car.  I sold the car.

A couple of years later they finally admitted there was a problem and issued a TSB for replacement with a different bushing type.  Way too late for me, after I sold the best street car I've had.  I won't be buying another one.

KeS

[Skee]

If they consistently fixed problems after the first year, how would they ever get people to buy new models in their first production year?  Savvy riders/buyers usually wait for at least the second year of a model's production anyway, to lessen the risk of serious design problems coming up.  But if everyone knew the second year of a model was going to be markedly better, why not wait?

Now there is true marketing genius

[chornbe]

More than you, apparently.

How about an accurate speedometer, for starters...1980s Honda cars have more accurate speedos than today's bikes have and there is ABSOLUTELY no reason for it.

I noticed that each time I change my rear tire my speedo is magically accurate again... for a few months, then as the tire wears and squares off, it becomes less and less accurate. The Sportster speedo has been pretty close since day one, but it definitely changes as the tire wears.

[Bjorn Toulouse]

It was so embarrassing, I'd log onto the Tiger 1050 site and read all about the problems that had cropped up with other members bikes, and I had none.  

Same problem with the '02 VFR I had previous to the Tiger.....it just "worked".

WTF??  

Oh, I almost forgot, both bikes had optimistic speedometers. The odometers were very accurate, however.


Rex

[sagerat]

And the single-biggest flaw that cuts across all brands:  stock motorcycle seats are adequate at best.  My Guzzi and my VFR had above average and excellent seats, respectively, but the GS, KLR, and Ural were just adequate.

[Bogie]

Here's one thats a classic....

Harley rocker box gaskets....being replaced with Cometic or James gaskets for 30 years!

[MadMax96]

This is one reason I dig my Bandit.  Modern enough to not have electrical issues that many 80s Jap bikes had, but still basic enough that electronics aren't failing.  Still even have a cable driven speedo and a mechanical odometer.  Simple oil-cooled design, no water pump, no fuel pump, no coolant to change.  

This thing is so reliable and it sometimes shouldn't be.  A couple of winters ago, I parked it for the season in November without any treatment to the gas (full tank though) and didn't touch it until April - no trickle charger or anything.  We're talking Chicago winters here - garage gets cold enough to freeze bottled water.  Went to fire it up and it took a little longer to get the fluids moving, but it fired right up.

Heck - the original battery was 7 yrs old and never let me down before I changed it - finally swapped it out just for peace of mind.

Sadly Suzuki isn't without it's share of "issues."  Those boneheads sold many of the early 2nd gen ('01-02) 1200s with bad pistons causing them to burn a quart of oil after 1000 miles.

[swimmer]

VFR?  According to all the dedicated viffer sites it was fixed with the '06 model, which is a big reason I went with an '06 and only really looked at the '06 and newer bikes.

Honda also did a recall to replace part of the wiring harness on earlier Gen6 VFRs but still, on a motorcycle that is otherwise regarded so highly in terms of reliability they dragged their feet.

[desertxxrider]

It was so embarrassing, I'd log onto the Tiger 1050 site and read all about the problems that had cropped up with other members bikes, and I had none.  

Same problem with the '02 VFR I had previous to the Tiger.....it just "worked".

WTF??  

Oh, I almost forgot, both bikes had optimistic speedometers. The odometers were very accurate, however.


Rex

Car and Motorcycle forums are not allways 100% accurate on issues. Half the people bought it used, that can allso mean wrecked, repaired, worked on by goobers, squid driven, modified and resurrected junk in hopes of saving money. Then they make their list of problems and complain about it on forums because the seller said it was like NEW. I've seen alot of these wonderfull purchases that non savy buyers gobbled up.

[Brad1445]

Most all new bikes seem to be of good design build quality and reliability.  

Except the New Buells.  You will never get to ride, but you will get to know your dealer service manager very well.  All the other bikes will make fun of you also.

[county]

Well, nobody much posts about how their water pump or fuel mapping is working.

So, on the internet we get to hear about m/c problems all over the country and we get to hear about what some newby thinks is a problem.   And as previously stated we here about problems caused by owners or previous owners.  (Or dealer shops)

[sammyseaman]

I'm agree with FBRR, I 've had enough "character" over the years myself, and have found the "bland" brands , Honda's for me, to be much more reliable and rewarding.

Keep telling yourself that.

[scottzilla]

First, I don't agree that bikes are better today (From a mechanical/durability perspective) than they were 20 years ago.  I think bikes have a great 20 year track record of dependability.  At least, they have been consistant.  From a performance perspective yes-absolutely-bikes are better today.

Next, I agree stock seats suck.  At least suspensions are better today.  And tires.  Remember up until recently the first thing you did was take the OEM tires off because they sucked.  Not so today.

Now, this will piss everyone off.  Look at Japanese bikes the last twenty years and tell me there is a huge gap in relialbility from 1989 to 2009.  You can't.  It's been consistant.  They built fine bikes then and they build fine bikes now.  In 1989, the weakest part on most Hondas was the stator and today, the weakest part on a Honda is the stator!  Consistant.  The Japanese have always built great motorcycles.
So the biggest change has come from companies that aren't Japanese, some of whom don't have a 20 year record to speak of!  KTM wasn't selling shit in the USA 20 years ago!  So these "Problems", the way I see it, are coming primarily from companies that aren't building bikes as well as the Japanese.  

[Bjorn Toulouse]

Car and Motorcycle forums are not allways 100% accurate on issues.  

But, but, it's the Intertube!  


Rex

[Justin]

First, I don't agree that bikes are better today (From a mechanical/durability perspective) than they were 20 years ago.  I think bikes have a great 20 year track record of dependability.  At least, they have been consistant.  From a performance perspective yes-absolutely-bikes are better today.

Next, I agree stock seats suck.  At least suspensions are better today.  And tires.  Remember up until recently the first thing you did was take the OEM tires off because they sucked.  Not so today.

Now, this will piss everyone off.  Look at Japanese bikes the last twenty years and tell me there is a huge gap in relialbility from 1989 to 2009.  You can't.  It's been consistant.  They built fine bikes then and they build fine bikes now.  In 1989, the weakest part on most Hondas was the stator and today, the weakest part on a Honda is the stator!  Consistant.  The Japanese have always built great motorcycles.
So the biggest change has come from companies that aren't Japanese, some of whom don't have a 20 year record to speak of!  KTM wasn't selling shit in the USA 20 years ago!  So these "Problems", the way I see it, are coming primarily from companies that aren't building bikes as well as the Japanese.  

+1 .. here I go agreeing with Scott again ...  

I rode an XX for most of this decade.. and the only mechanical failure... STATOR

[Thundergod]

If they were SIGMA 7 build quality....bike would be $300K.

Overall, I have had wonderful experience from YAMAHA.
Every new bike, especially new-models will have their issues ironed out.

Lest not forget NEW COKE!

[Justin]

Overall, I have had wonderful experience from YAMAHA.

Same here with Honda.. I can accept one stator failure in 70k miles on a bike.

[Gsam]

Keep telling yourself that.

With over 35 years of riding different brands and working for two different cycle shops i don't have to tell myself, it (for me) is a proven fact!

[zx12rdude]

Same here with Honda.. I can accept one stator failure in 70k miles on a bike.

And I would have to add that I've experienced the same with Kawasaki. 30k miles on my current bike, nothing that would be considered a problem. A couple of recalls, half of which could be considered.. precautionary.