ABS Really Works

[Global Rider]

Every ABS system I've seen uses wheel sensors to detect when the tire begins skidding.

Exactly, although I think the latest ones prevent a skid.

The reason why it won't work leaned over in a curve is that the ABS system will still apply the same rules. Have you ever tried braking fully leaned over. Good luck braking hard...I'd advise against it.

Basic physics...go and Google Traction Circle.

[delta one]

Exactly, although I think the latest ones prevent a skid.

The reason why it won't work leaned over in a curve is that the ABS system will still apply the same rules. Have you ever tried braking fully leaned over. Good luck braking hard...I'd advise against it.

Basic physics...go and Google Traction Circle.

right so when leaned over it only takes a little bit of braking to exceed the coefficient of friction (static friction) available at the moment; so wouldn't a good ABS system prevent you from going that far with the brakes? or is that where the difference in rotation is too small for the sensors to detect?

[Global Rider]

right so when leaned over it only takes a little bit of braking to exceed the coefficient of friction (static friction) available at the moment; so wouldn't a good ABS system prevent you from going that far with the brakes? or is that where the difference in rotation is too small for the sensors to detect?

If my wheel is about to wash out in a curve while leaned over, it doesn't have to be anywhere even close to locking up for that to happen. And ABS works at near lock-up...or we'd all be sailing into things by doubling our braking distances.

ABS works well in straight line where you are hardly healed over type of situations.

Here is a good one from the ABS industry. Do you remember how we were all told that ABS allows you to steer your car around obstacles, etc. Funny thing is, if the driver is frozen due to a panic situation, what makes you think they are going to steer?  

[delta one]

If my wheel is about to wash out in a curve while leaned over, it doesn't have to be anywhere even close to locking up for that to happen. And ABS works at near lock-up...or we'd all be sailing into things by doubling our braking distances.

at that point I would think that its a stability or traction control issue.  the only thing I would ask of it would be help keep me from locking up the front or rear on all the nasty left over on our Michigan roads. Somehow cars always seem to pull out in front of me while I am leaned over in and intersection. that or try and take the lane I am already occupying.  

Here is a good one from the ABS industry. Do you remember how we were all told that ABS allows you to steer your car around obstacles, etc. Funny thing is, if the driver is frozen due to a panic situation, what makes you think they are going to steer?  

so true!

[paddy_crow]

There is no reason that ABS won't work in a corner. When the computer detects the onset of a skid, it pulsates the brakes. If you apply the brakes hard enough in a corner to skid, the brakes will modulate. Period.

Whether or not it's a good idea to brake that hard in a corner is immaterial.

[Global Rider]

There is no reason that ABS won't work in a corner. When the computer detects the onset of a skid, it pulsates the brakes. If you apply the brakes hard enough in a corner to skid, the brakes will modulate. Period.

I hope you never have to.  

[Dan K]

Are you claiming that all Moto-GP bikes have ABS front and rear? If so, that's news to me.

No, dude, but you clearly missed my point.  Shocking.

I will say that if ABS was effective at less than 1 lb, you would start seeing it on race bikes.

- Dan

[Karmak]

The two constants in the STN universe:
1-Snowbird just doesn't get ABS.
2-Larry just doesn't get that the RC45 isn't the greatest bike ever built.
 
Don't try to change them.  This would be like trying to reverse gravity or something.

You forgot an additional Snowbird axiom:  The world is definitely flat!

[Kat-Rider]

No, dude, but you clearly missed my point.  Shocking.

I will say that if ABS was effective at less than 1 lb, you would start seeing it on race bikes.

- Dan

Also the road conditions on your average Moto GP track are much better than on the roads here.  
I bet if they put gravel on the roads and let SUV drivers on cell phones drive around on the track during races you would see ABS on race bikes.

[Busy Little Whiner]

ABS works to unload 800 bucks from your wallet... adds 20 lbs of dead weight to your bike...
just so you can stop less in the wet but not in the dry???    

[paddy_crow]

I hope you never have to.  

My one accident happened because I hit too much brake in a large radius turn (20 years old, first bike). Rear skid, let off brake, tires grab, tank slapper, nose dive into ditch. I put the odds at better than 90% that ABS would have prevented it.

[paddy_crow]

adds 20 lbs of dead weight to your bike.

Modern ABS units weigh about 4-5 pounds.

Edit: I stand corrected, I see total system weight adds on the order of 20 pounds.

[Global Rider]

My one accident happened because I hit too much brake in a large radius turn (20 years old, first bike). Rear skid, let off brake, tires grab, tank slapper, nose dive into ditch. I put the odds at better than 90% that ABS would have prevented it.

Your right to believe what you want, but I highly doubt it. Are you sure that wasn't 89%.  

But we were talking about full braking while fully leaned over. Sorry, but it isn't going to work, but feel free to try it if you think it will. I'm not responsible for the outcome and advise against doing so.

[Busy Little Whiner]

2-Larry just doesn't get that the RC45 isn't the greatest bike ever built.
 

Larry says that the RC45 is the greatest V4 Honda ever built...

Ranking of all the V4s that you can own...

Ducati D16R

Aprilia RSV4

Honda RC45

Honda RC30

[paddy_crow]

But we were talking about full braking while fully leaned over. Sorry, but it isn't going to work, but feel free to try it if you think it will. I'm not responsible for the outcome and advise against doing so.

Obviously, we're talking about different hypothetical situations. I'm talking grabbing a little brake while cornering which results in a skid. You don't have to hit the brakes all out for ABS to have an effect.

[Snowbird]

No, dude, but you clearly missed my point.  Shocking.

I will say that if ABS was effective at less than 1 lb, you would start seeing it on race bikes.

- Dan

From this:

My skills can always use a little help from technology.  As can every Moto-GP racer on the planet.

 -Dan

Yeah, right. 


Look, let's get something straight, everyone. I have no problem whether or not you choose ABS for your bike or not; as I've previously stated, I even have a rudimentary version of ABS on my '06 FJR that has resulted in the second or third longest stopping distances of any bike *ever* tested by MCN, at 144 feet from 60 mph. Wonderful. A figure unseen since drum brakes in the 1960s.

I'd still buy the bike (even if I wish the brakes worked better in the dry) because of the riding role for which I bought the bike.

What I object to is people making unsubstantiated claims like the original poster of this thread. He comes on with an anecdote claiming that ABS-- and only ABS-- is responsible for the outcome of an accident. He and his riding partner could have helped themselves more than ABS ever could by taking steps I clearly delineated in an early post. Then, in an admission of guilt, he went off in a huff. 

Others have made similar claims and I call b.s. I'll name one example if anyone wants. And, when I feel like doing so, I'll continue to call b.s.

Why? Because I believe that individuals deserve choice in the market and because All-ABS-All-The-Time gets as sickening as ATGATT.

AAATT.   

Choice. Affordability. Proficiency. User servicability.

[Bjorn Toulouse]

....I believe that individuals deserve choice in the market and because All-ABS-All-The-Time gets as sickening as ATGATT.

Never try to reason with zealots, it's all about the anecdotal "evidence".


Rex

[paddy_crow]

Why? Because I believe that individuals deserve choice in the market and because All-ABS-All-The-Time gets as sickening as ATGATT.

I don't think anyone has suggested that ABS be required on all motorcycles. At this point, the choice of what to offer the buying public is up to the manufacturers.

[Snowbird]

I don't think anyone has suggested that ABS be required on all motorcycles. At this point, the choice of what to offer the buying public is up to the manufacturers.

http://www.sport-touring.net/forums/index.php/topic,41567.0.html

[paddy_crow]

To clarify: I don't think anyone IN THIS THREAD has suggested that ABS be required on all motorcycles.