Is this good or bad for HD?

[Pshrynk]

Wow.   You must have drank a pitcher of the pirate Kool Aid  

[chornbe]

Wow.   You must have drank a pitcher of the pirate Kool Aid  

You're no County.

[stevent]

Wow.   You must have drank a pitcher of the pirate Kool Aid  

Sorry but I can't help thinking you know not that of which you speak.............

Having owned 7 Harley's, 3 Triumphs, 3 BMW's, 2 Suzuki's 3 Kawasaki's, 2 Hondas, 3 Yamaha MX'rs, a CZ, a Bultaco and a Hodaka over the last 42 years, I can safely say that the Honda's I had were the least reliable. In fact both Honda's an '84 V65 Saber and a '97 VFR 750 left me on the side of the road a number of times with electrical problems and were frankly the biggest piles of shit I've owned. Of the 7 Harley's I've owned, 4 of them were AMF era and were reliable for the excess of 200k miles I put on them, as were the new twin cam 88 and my current TC96... as were the Hinkley Triumphs, as were the BMW's, both airhead and oilhead twins and a K100RS, as were the Kawasaki and Suzuki's


I'm guessing you're just another full of shit idiot parroting the tried and (un)true "Harleys are junk" line in an effort to wind someone up.....I guess what I'm trying to say is .........   and I mean that in the most heartfelt manner....

[chornbe]

I was trying not to offend the poor lad.

I like your approach better.

[Pshrynk]

Sorry but I can't help thinking you know not that of which you speak.............

Having owned 7 Harley's, 3 Triumphs, 3 BMW's, 2 Suzuki's 3 Kawasaki's, 2 Hondas, 3 Yamaha MX'rs, a CZ, a Bultaco and a Hodaka over the last 42 years, I can safely say that the Honda's I had were the least reliable. In fact both Honda's an '84 V65 Saber and a '97 VFR 750 left me on the side of the road a number of times with electrical problems and were frankly the biggest piles of shit I've owned. Of the 7 Harley's I've owned, 4 of them were AMF era and were reliable for the excess of 200k miles I put on them, as were the new twin cam 88 and my current TC96... as were the Hinkley Triumphs, as were the BMW's, both airhead and oilhead twins and a K100RS, as were the Kawasaki and Suzuki's


I'm guessing you're just another full of shit idiot parroting the tried and (un)true "Harleys are junk" line in an effort to wind someone up.....I guess what I'm trying to say is .........   and I mean that in the most heartfelt manner....

So your claim then,  is that Hondas are not reliable and AMF era Harleys are?   You must get your pirate Kool Aid at Sam's Club or Costco.

[chornbe]

Why do you keep trying to make blanket statements based on what is, essentially, anecdotal information?  

I don't understand your blinding anti-Harley agenda.

[Pshrynk]

Why do you keep trying to make blanket statements based on what is, essentially, anecdotal information?  

I don't understand your blinding anti-Harley agenda.

I like Harley's and have owned one -- but they is what they is.  

[chornbe]

Which answers nothing and doesn't explain your blindness to fact, reason and objectivity.

Have a nice life.

[Pshrynk]

Which answers nothing and doesn't explain your blindness to fact, reason and objectivity.

Have a nice life.

Please present the extensive, peer reviewed,  valid & reliable studies on motorcycle reliability that YOU have.

[BobW]

This shit gets old regardless the brand. They are basing their opinion on ownership of multiple examples and therefore they "own" their answer. You are making the statement/taking the position contrary to theirs, so why don't you provide the study supporting your position. Stop being  contrary kunt and go ride what ever the phuck makes you smile and save your "Pshrynk 101" troll posting for another venue.

cheers

[Pshrynk]

This shit gets old regardless the brand. They are basing their opinion on ownership of multiple examples and therefore they "own" their answer. You are making the statement/taking the position contrary to theirs, so why don't you provide the study supporting your position. Stop being  contrary kunt and go ride what ever the phuck makes you smile and save your "Pshrynk 101" troll posting for another venue.

cheers

Thanks for YOUR opinion Bob -- however if ya don't like it don't read it.    Do I need to explain the concept of a DISCUSSION forum?  

There are no comprehensive studies of reliability -- other than relatively few and useless consumer polls -- hence the the point I was making that went way over your head.

I am basing my opinions on 30 years of ownership and experience of different bikes just like they are -- only mine is not skewed by patriotic, made in America Harley love.  Someone actually said AMF era Harleys were reliable and Honda's were not -- that's just simply delusional.   AMF damn near bankrupted the company by building shite when the japanese were building quality stuff.

My simple point is that not all bikes are manufactured equally -- some are simply better than others -- Harley has only been building well engineered stuff for about twenty years or so -- but really this is a f'n company that couldn't figure out how or were too stubborn to use proper modern alloys in engines until the Evolution fer crissake and they still have huuuuge engines with comparatively little power.  

Like I said before,  I actually LIKE Harley's,  just not the unrealistic views of their engineering or functionality.    So phuck you too Bob.      

[stevent]

If you had actually been around that long you'd know that AMF actually saved Harley-Davidson. They introduced to alternator Shovelhead, disc brakes (before the Japanese started using them) electronic ignitions (before the Japanese) turn key touring bikes with the FLH series, alloy wheels and tubeless tires and did the development and testing of the Evolution engine.

During the same time period Honda has had continued documented charging system issues on the 1200 Goldwings, bearing failures on the V4 engines, camshaft failures on Kawasaki, alternator failures on the GS series Suzuki engines, recently the Honda Goldwing and Suzuki GSXR's have had documented frame failures the list goes on.

I'm not saying Harleys are the be-all and end all of motorcycling however current Harleys are every bit as reliable if not mores so than anything else on the road. Also even back in the "bad old days" of AMF ownership they were in stock form as reliable as anything else on the road at that time. The difference was everyone thought they were a mechanic and inflicted their ham-fisted "skills" on "performance mods" which usually wound up with the bike running like shit and breaking down. The key to keeping Harleys reliable is to leave them the fuck alone and ride them.


I can say all this because I was there and saw these things with my own eyes, not parroting some trumped up bullshit I read on a web site

[bomber]

There's a fair amount of engineering that goes into making a reliable motorcycle that looks 80 years old (using HD's 1930's analogy for their gas tanks) . . . . they've got some talenteed folks doing really interesting R&D work. The power the engines make seem to be enough for them to own a major market segment, and their functionality meets or exceeds the level needed to support those sales.

HDI no longer makes anything I want, and many of their customers are annoying in the extreme,  dismissing the brand due to poor quality 20/30 years ago is less than entirely rational.

[chornbe]

I am basing my opinions on 30 years of ownership and experience of different bikes just like they are -- only mine is not skewed by patriotic, made in America Harley love.

I'm 43. Been riding since I was 12. First was a Honda dirt bike. Then a Suzuki dt125, and a few others, all Japanese. Bought my first street bike at age 17. A Kawasaki 440LTD (belt drive!). Then a Goldwing. Then a Yamaha Special II. From there I went through a plethora of Japanese bikes, something from all of the "big four", ranging from little tiny bikes to the Goldwing (again). They ranged in price and quality from basket case to brand new. Then took a few years off riding when I was broke an the kids were very young. In 2003 I bought a Honda Magna. Then a Goldwing (again!). Then a Concours. Then a Shadow. Then a CBR. Then an FJR. Then another CBR. Then a Street Glide. Then a Sportster. Sold BOTH Harleys, bought a Moto Guzzi. This only includes street legal and road-worthy bikes. Had a host of projects, part-outs and a couple of track-only bikes that I never actually used for racing. All Japanese, by the way. In addition, my first career, right out of high school, was an a ASE-certified automobile mechanic specializing in engines, suspensions, electrical and performance modifications. In that time, I also had a small bike business. I got out of pro-wrenching in my late 20s due to a back injury, but have always kept my hands dirty. I've worked on more bikes than you've likely seen, 90% of them, Japanese. Name a bike... yep, fixed it. Another one? Yep, likely that one too. Yeah, one o' them, too... you see where I'm going with this.

Where, exactly, is my blind, skewed, Harley love?

It don't get much more objective than me.

Harley makes a fine bike that is just as reliable as anything else you're going to spend your good, hard-earned money on.

Lighten up and relax. You'll live longer.



PS... "AMF ERA" (perhaps something of a misnomer of intent) refers to the years when Harley was bought and financially bolstered by AMF. As noted by others, AMF's money enabled them to spend time and engineering resources to modernize a bit and increase quality, but during some of these years, Harley had lots of questionable quality issues, due in part to crappy manufacturing and due in part to growing pains, and due in part to major changes to how they were doing things. Yes, during the time that AMF owned Harley, some pretty shitty bikes rolled out of the factories... Not necessarily due to the fault of AMF.

I'm not saying Harleys are the be-all and end all of motorcycling however current Harleys are every bit as reliable if not mores so than anything else on the road. Also even back in the "bad old days" of AMF ownership they were in stock form as reliable as anything else on the road at that time. The difference was everyone thought they were a mechanic and inflicted their ham-fisted "skills" on "performance mods" which usually wound up with the bike running like shit and breaking down. The key to keeping Harleys reliable is to leave them the fuck alone and ride them.

This is an EXCELLENT point. Even today, the same holds true; I'd put a STOCK Harley - "overbuilt and understressed" - on a par with ANY machine built and known for reliability.  

[Playinthestreet]

This is an EXCELLENT point. Even today, the same holds true; I'd put a STOCK Harley - "overbuilt and understressed" - on a par with ANY machine built and known for reliability.  

Yup!

[BobW]

Like I said before,  I actually LIKE Harley's,  just not the unrealistic views of their engineering or functionality.    So phuck you too Bob.    

  Consider me phucked  

They are what they are and don't advertise to the contrary. My reply was perhaps too simple and not that it has ever been found in a HD thread, but I'm sure some discussion boards still have troll posts VS true desire to learn/share information    

BTW, I've been riding (and in my younger days amateur competition) for over 45 years on everything from HonYamSukawi's, Hodaka, Husqvarna, Maico, MG, BMW, Duc, HD, Laverda, BSA, Bultaco, et al. It was a great era in motorcycling and still is despite the economic issues going on today. I was a Honda Factory trained tech as well as Husky and Maico ( VW/Audi too). I love motorsports and am well aware of the warts every brand can have. Much is lost when not talking "face to face" so perhaps having the same conversation with you in person would not have left the impression you were just trying to have a pissing contest regardless what reply was given. Either way, buy what makes you smile.

Cheers all and have a safe and happy 4th of July!

[Pshrynk]

 Either way, buy what makes you smile.

Can't argue with that.  

[zam70]

I have owned many of the current brands of bikes and from many different countries - they are what they are...don't try to pretend an HD is something that it isn't and you'll find it is an excellent purpose built motorcycle.

The problem and confusion arises when people try to act like a certain motorcycle is something that it is not (a sport bike/long distance tourer, a cruiser/Sport bike, a thumper is a land barge, a goldwing/dirt bike...).
Different styles of Motorcycles are designed with different purposes in mind...HDs main focus is cruisers and they make a better cruiser than any other manufacturer...they have been doing it for over 100 years, they have the practice and experience  
 
As for HD cruisers VS Metric Cruisers - I have owned both and put alot of miles on both (most recently a VTX1800 and 03 RoadKing) and there is absolutely no comparison...the Roadking IS a much better machine.  Even with "less" power, it handles 2 up better, fit & finish is better, switchgear is better, paint is better, etc etc....there honestly is no comparison in quality...the 2 bikes are in completely different leagues with the VTX trying to be what it isn't...what it is, is a cheap effort at a cruiser style motorcycle.

Here's the kicker....I hated HDs...until I actually rode one.

[chornbe]

Here's the kicker....I hated HDs...until I actually rode one.

 

[atadaskew]

Are you honestly saying that a Harley Cruiser is as reliable, and is engineered as well as a Honda Cruiser?

My Harley was more reliable than my Wing 1800 and VFR750.  My Wing 1200 had electrical issues but that was at about 80K miles so I'm not counting that (stator)
Posted on: September 03, 2010, 05:32:00 PM

The average age of HD riders goes up 1 every 12 months. The number of riders is going down as per the obits... sous like an out of business strategy to me. I give them 3-5 years unless they make some seriouhanges to their business model. It's a shame,,,,,

Fantastic!
Let's do some math to back up Roadscum's statement..
Harley is now 107 years old.  Let's say the average age of an owner when they started out was 20 yrs old (too low I'm sure but it doesn't matter)
Then according to Roadscum the avg age of a Harley rider is now 20 + 106 = 126 years old!

Wow!