'00 Connie blows all the coolant and runs hot

[Meemuh]

Here's the situation.
I recently picked up a 00 Connie.
Within the first 120 miles, all the coolant went bye-bye - mainly out the overflow tube behind the swing arm, but some out a front side manifold leak....
Good news - I managed to shut it down before meltdown.

So......
Replaced the thermostat - hoping that the old stat was stuck and I was blowing coolant out because of it.
Reassembled, replaced the coolant, and even properly bled the system.
No leaks - except for the front side manifold.

I accidentally overfilled the reservoir (because I can't see through the fricking reservoir), so I wasn't overly concerned that I was still pushing some coolant through - BUT....

29 miles into my short test trips tonight, I am 100% coolant free - and (again) I did manage to shut it down before the dash gage showed red.
Heres the blow-by-blow of  my coolant expulsion as I saw it.


(please see my reply - I'm out of room in this window)

[Meemuh]

Anyway...here's the nitty gritty.
After I overfilled the tank - I started it up and immediately it was puking coolant out the overflow tube at the rear.  It did this until it warmed slightly - I assumed until my sparkling new thermostat opened.  Then, it was an intermittent drip out the tube.
Then - I took short trips - 5-8 miles each, so I can't say what happed with the coolant discharge then.
When I parked and shut it down, it began to puke fluid again - sometimes immediately, sometimes not until I got sick of watching and I walked away (just to come back and be surprised at the puddle).
Each time (at shutdown, anyway) I left a puddle on the ground about the size of a frizbee.
This all happened over the course of 5 short trips tonight.

I only witnessed the start-up blow-by a couple times - but always attributed it to over-filling.  Pretty clearly, that's not the case.

Any ideas - I'm kind of grasping at straws...althought I'm a little nervous at what the final answer might be.

Thanks in advance.

[OMJunk]

As I remember, when the coolant is refilled you must bleed the air from the system or it will not circulate. I do not remember the correct procedure, but cog.net will have the instructions somewhere. Good luck!

[Meemuh]

I wish that was it...
I bled it - unless I didn't do it right.  I did follow the manual instructions pretty closely, though.

I guess it can't hurt to try again.

[Meemuh]

Also - how can I test and/or rule out a waterpump that went bad???
thanks again.

[GS1100GK]

Also - how can I test and/or rule out a waterpump that went bad???
thanks again.

How many miles are on your bike?  Buddy of mine just replaced the water pump and clutch at 150K miles on his '95.  He needed the clutch and decided to do the water pump while he was working on it.  He now has 182K on the thing.

It does sound like the water pump to me.  Makes sense that it would overheat and push coolant out since if it is not circulating through the radiator.  Another culprit could be a clogged radiator as well.  Same symptoms as the pump.  No circulation.  Food for thought.  

[Meemuh]

32,000-ish miles...
hope to get this taken care of and get at least half as many miles as your buddy.

[Paulie]

Check the hoser behind header #2, mine leaked at ~120k. Water pump started oozing oil at ~135, all's well so far at 186. Good luck.

[Bowtie76]

My Connie used to do the same thing, it turned out there was leak/air in the system, air expands coolent gets puked.  Check the manafold on the back of the head for leaks, it is just a pressure fit with o-rings.  Then if I remember correctly there is a bleed valve over the water pump, and one close to the thermostat.  Bleed them both, then top off the radiator and overflow, let bike warm up (thermostat open) and repeat until no air is bled.  Also check the gasket on the thermostat as they tend to get pretty coroded.  Good luck but it really sounds like air in the system to me.

[ConPilot1]

Check the hoser behind header #2, mine leaked at ~120k. Water pump started oozing oil at ~135, all's well so far at 186. Good luck.

  +1 on that hose behind the headers. Mine was spewing a couple tablespoons of coolant @ 16k miles, found the hoseclamp at the top a bit loose.
My '05 spewed coolant out the vent hose all over the swingarm once, it was from overfilling the overflow tank. No problems since then. I do know the system has to be
"burped" quite well to get all the air out.
Paulie knows what he's talking about here but you can head over to COG and get more info those guys just foam at the mouth to assist a
Connie owner.

air expands coolent gets puked.  Check the manafold on the back of the head for leaks, it is just a pressure fit with o-rings.  Then if I remember correctly there is a bleed valve over the water pump, and one close to the thermostat.  Bleed them both, then top off the radiator and overflow, let bike warm up (thermostat open) and repeat until no air is bled.  Also check the gasket on the thermostat as they tend to get pretty coroded.  Good luck but it really sounds like air in the system to me.

+1 on what he said too.

[napper]

My Connie used to do the same thing, it turned out there was leak/air in the system, air expands coolent gets puked.  Check the manifold on the back of the head for leaks, it is just a pressure fit with o-rings.  Then if I remember correctly there is a bleed valve over the water pump, and one close to the thermostat.  Bleed them both, then top off the radiator and overflow, let bike warm up (thermostat open) and repeat until no air is bled.  Also check the gasket on the thermostat as they tend to get pretty coroded.  Good luck but it really sounds like air in the system to me.

Hey Eric,

I'm sorry to read about this problem.  (I'm the PO in this case.)

Follow Bowtie's recommendations.  There are two bleed valves you have to open to bleed the air from the cooling system.  (IIRC, the manual covers this procedure pretty well.)  The cooling system manifold was leaking past the o-rings all last summer, but never enough to cause overheating, even after a full day's  (500 + miles) riding.  (The o-rings were new, I was just never able to get them set correctly, but never leaked more than a slow drip.)  When I replaced the cooling hoses last spring, I used NAPA hoses, not the big money Kawi hoses.  After replacing the hoses, I read on COG that these hoses were more likely to leak (past the hose clamps) than OEM's.  You may want to check for leaks at the hose ends.

You may also want to check the radiator cap.  Your description sounds like coolant may be pushing too easily past the cap into the reservoir.  (There is an auto application radiator cap that fits, if I can find the cross-referenced list, I'll post that up here later.)

As far as I know, you're still running the original water pump.  May be the place to check after double-checking the easy stuff.  After the WP, I'm afraid I'd be thinking head gasket.

BTW, did you replace the brake disks or were you able to live with them as is?

(Also, I am fairly certain the petcock did need replacing, I had tried to tighten it when the leak first developed.)

Good luck figuring this one out.  Let us know what you discover.

[napper]

Are you sure you have the two hoses to the  reservoir situated correctly?  The lower one runs to the filler neck and the higher one connects to drain tube out back.  (Of course if these were reversed, you'd never be able to overfill the reservoir.)

[napper]

The radiator cap is the same as for a '78 Ford Fiesta.

Eric, I sent the part cross-reference guide by e-mail.

[Meemuh]

Thanks guys...

I'm hoping I'm just dumb....I bled the system at the waterpump, but I never bled it at the thermostat housing - you have given me a glimmer of hope here.

I will also replace the thermostat cap.

The manifold below the carbs does not leak, but I do have to change the o-rings on the manifold below the headers - that is on the to-do list.

I'm pretty sure the waterpump is good, since I seem to have good coolant pressure - and (despite some research on COG on an earlier post), I can't imagine it's a head gasket, so it shouldn't be anything too terribly difficult.

Martin - I picked up some used rotors on the cheap for the front on COG.  I haven't checked them for flat yet, but I've got my fingers crossed.  Hopefully in this case, you get more than you paid for.  They aren't too bad unless you really have to get on the front brakes, but I would like to take care of that soon, too.

I'm sure I'll still be able to pack on some good miles yet this summer...we're still getting frost here, so it's not exactly warm yet anyway.  Plus, it gives me a chance to remember why I don't want to sell my 650.  I'll keep you posted, and thanks for the cap cross.

[ConPilot1]

so how'd you make out.??

[napper]

so how'd you make out.??

I'm hoping he's not posting because he's too busy riding.

[Meemuh]

Sorry guys...I haven't posted 'cause I've been too stupid busy w/ other stuff...
I REALLY hope to tear into it Saturday.

Thanks for checking - I'll try to post an update Sunday.
Have a good weekend.

[Meemuh]

Okay,
Here's the plan as of now...I tore apart the coolant mani on the front, and the sealing rings were pulled out of the groove further than I would have guessed.  As I knew from Martin, there was a leak there - and I'm guessing that the leak got quite a bit worse after she sat for a while w/o running (as a new-to-Michigan bike from Az - she's got the winters off).
I was going to just fix that up while I was dealing with this whole thing - but then I signed up as a paying member of COG.  Somebody commented on my free forum post about a tech article in the pay site, so I checked that out.  Based on that tech article and my own thinking, my guess is that I'm loosing coolant and sucking air at such a rate that it's messing up whole system.
So - crossing my fingers that carefully replacing these o-rings (2 of them were messed up pretty bad - 1 was medium messed up), my problems will be solved.
BTW, Martin - May 11 in Holland, MI, the HIGH temp was 49 degrees.  That's the kind of life you sold the Kaw into.

[napper]

As you can tell, that coolant manifold gave me hell.  Good luck getting it sealed back up.

The Coggers are invaluable.  I think I only had to ask one question on the forums.  I was able to find every other answer I needed archived.

49 degrees?  In May?  The only time she's ever seen temps like that were above 6000 feet.

[Meemuh]

Finally!  Got my parts from bike bandit...now, just to find time to put it back together.

[Meemuh]

Delicate part is done - o-rings & manifold re-installed....
Now, just put it back together (oil line, radiator,fan, etc) and see how it goes.

[Meemuh]

Putting coolant in tomorrow...wish me luck

[Meemuh]

Yee-hah!!!!

Damn!!

Well - it appears the front o-rings were the problem.  Ran it for 5-10 minutes after filling it up w/o any spewing out the back.
Then, I shut it down and was checking out a couple hose clamp leaks...and PPSSTTTT!!  The two left rings gave out AFTER I shut her off.

Now I get to do it all over again - and I get to figure out how to not have that happen again.

[camaroz1985]

Did you replace all of them last time?