2011 Ninja 1000 (Seat)

[Stuntflyer]

The stock seat, for some riders, won't be good enough for long days of sport touring. I sent pictures to Sargent and called them to see if they had any interest in developing a better seat for the bike. They expressed great interest in doing so and mentioned that they had already received some calls inquiring about a new seat. They need more calls however, before they will get involved in making an off the shelf seat. They asked me to get the word out. If any of you are interested then please call them at 1-800-749-7328 and let them know.

[marc11]

Is the bike even out yet to know that the stock seat is so bad people who don't own the bike should start calling about making a seat for a bike no one owns yet?  I am guessing prototyping could be problematic at this stage no?  

[DogBoy]

Looks to be identical to the Z1000 seat.

[chornbe]

Looks to be identical to the Z1000 seat.

... what with it being largely the same bike and all.

[Stuntflyer]

I visited my local Kawasaki dealership last week. The owner had just come back from the Kawasaki dealer meeting. He rode both the Ninja 1000 and Z1000 for 2011. He said that both bikes had the same seat. I sat on the 2010 Z1000 and had the immediate impression that the seat was hard and sloped forward. Two things that are not great to have IMO on long rides. Sargent would level it, dish it a little, widen it toward the rear, insert their super cell atomic foam among other things to make the seat better over long distance.

[DogBoy]

... what with it being largely the same bike and all.

I was trying to be nice.

[chornbe]

I was trying to be nice.

Don't be. Some times you just gotta calls it likes ya sees it.  

On another note, I have fallen completely out of love with my Breva's seat and am considering options. So maybe I'll just buy a Ninja 1000.  

[gritsngravy]

A potential issue with the new Ninja 1000 is Kawasaki's own C-14, specifically left over '09's & '10 models.   I've seen them sell for less than the listed msrp of the Ninja and then there is the whole ready to tour out the box thing that every concours has.    Adding bags to the Ninja will only bring it's price closer in line with the c-14 and those warts hanging off the side certainly won't improve handling.   If the c-14's additional weight, power, shaft drive , and comfort are tolerable I'm sure more than one Ninja will be passed over for the purpose built c-14.  

[KodiakRS]

A potential issue with the new Ninja 1000 is Kawasaki's own C-14, specifically left over '09's & '10 models.   I've seen them sell for less than the listed msrp of the Ninja and then there is the whole ready to tour out the box thing that every concours has.    Adding bags to the Ninja will only bring it's price closer in line with the c-14 and those warts hanging off the side certainly won't improve handling.   If the c-14's additional weight, power, shaft drive , and comfort are tolerable I'm sure more than one Ninja will be passed over for the purpose built c-14.  

I don't see this happening, the ninja 1k and the c-14 are drastically different motorcycles.  I highly doubt that someone looking at the ninja has any interested in the c-14 or vice-versa.  

As far as the seat is concerned, does anyone have any experience auctually riding the z1000 that would be willing to comment?  

[DogBoy]

The C-14 is a great and very capable bike but I would still pick the Ninja 1000 if both were the same price.

[Shimmer]

The price difference between a C14 and Ninja 1000 is about 6K plus tax up here in Canada. That is a pretty big chunk of change. I think the purpose built C14 may be the one getting passed over. There dont seem to be too many leftover C14's in these parts.

[Indy Raven YZF]

I'd like to try out a new Ninja 1000.  I have an FZ-1, so it'd be like that with more of a fairing (which is nice in the rain).  I can't even consider a C-14 as I sat on one and the tank is so wide that it is not confortable to me (which is too bad as I do like those bikes), so that may deter others also.

[gritsngravy]

The price difference between a C14 and Ninja 1000 is about 6K plus tax up here in Canada. That is a pretty big chunk of change. I think the purpose built C14 may be the one getting passed over. There dont seem to be too many leftover C14's in these parts.

That's a shame.   Plenty of leftover '09 C-14's available out here in California that are selling right now for less than the MSRP of the yet to be released ninja.    Slightly used prices are really off the hook.    If I were looking to do some serious mileage over multiple days the cramped z1000 based ninja wouldn't work for me so I'd look toward the big boy.   I'd have to first get over my allergy to Kawasaki's though.  

[chornbe]

That's a shame.   Plenty of leftover '09 C-14's available out here in California that are selling right now for less than the MSRP of the yet to be released ninja.    Slightly used prices are really off the hook.    If I were looking to do some serious mileage over multiple days the cramped z1000 based ninja wouldn't work for me so I'd look toward the big boy.   I'd have to first get over my allergy to Kawasaki's though.  

Having spent a little more time getting to know the C14, on road and in the garage... from a rider's experience, it continues to be every bit as awesome as people say.

From a wrencher's perspective... jeezuz h. frakkin' chirstmas, if I never have to tear one of these down this far again, it'll be too soon.  

[David Morrow]

I don't see this happening, the ninja 1k and the c-14 are drastically different motorcycles.  I highly doubt that someone looking at the ninja has any interested in the c-14 or vice-versa.  

That would describe me. I'm currently on an FJR but am always looking for something new. The new Connie is of no interest to me ( I did put 100,000 miles on my 2000 Connie though.) I'd really like to try a newer technology, lighter, 1000cc ST bike. This new Ninja looks like it might fit the bill.

[Bizzzzzzz]

I now have my new Kawasaki Ninja 1000  red 2011...

And after 1400 km I can say that I'm not confortable for a long ride . It can be my pans, I means, it's cold here rigth now and I have multiple layers. Those multi layer finish to be in one pack where you can imagine.

If someone develop a new seat I will look at it for sure!

For the rest, I love that bike!!

Thanks
Eric

[scottzilla]

I was trying to be nice.

the two bikes do have different seats.  The Ninja 1000 has more padding per the various reviews i've read.

I held that in for a long time.

[DogBoy]

I hope you feel better now. In the interim, I've read the Ninja 1K has a 10mm taller seat than the Z1K .

[scottzilla]

I hope you feel better now. In the interim, I've read the Ninja 1K has a 10mm taller seat than the Z1K .

Well, you should have come back to this thread and posted your new learned information.

[DogBoy]

Truth. I have failed ST.N by not reporting this information in a timely manner.



I'll have to come up with a troll thread for General Discussion to make up for my transgression.

[scottzilla]

Truth. I have failed ST.N by not reporting this information in a timely manner.



I'll have to come up with a troll thread for General Discussion to make up for my transgression.

Kawasaki could have lost a sale because of your misinformation.  What would you do then?

[squeezer]

Why not go the Rick Mayer/Bill Mayer/Russell Day-Long custom route? Any of those three saddles kick ass (no pun intended, mostly) on the off-the-shelf aftermarket saddles (okay -- IMO). Yeah, you have to send them your seat pan, but you can set it up now to have the work done during the impending off-season.

I'll have to come up with a troll thread for General Discussion to make up for my transgression.

Always a worthy task. Our standard ones, though (FJR is a pig, county is a pig, raj is a dickwad), are kinda worn. Give us something new.

Here's an idea: Since the AMA has a series devoted to the XR1200 but not the (insert common sport-tourer here), it's proof that the Sportster is a more sporty SPORT-tourer than (common sport-tourer inserted above). That ought to be good for several pages.

Back to the topic...

[DogBoy]

Kawasaki could have lost a sale because of your misinformation.  What would you do then?

I'd wonder if the typical sport-touring rider did his exhaustive research and then played "stump the salesman" at the dealer with every speculative issue that was brought up on ten or twenty different internet forums by non-owners. I'd also slide a pea underneath the tenth mattress to make sure the potential buyer was a true princess...uh...sport-touring enthusiast.

[DogBoy]

Always a worthy task. Our standard ones, though (FJR is a pig, county is a pig, raj is a dickwad), are kinda worn. Give us something new.

Here's an idea: Since the AMA has a series devoted to the XR1200 but not the (insert common sport-tourer here), it's proof that the Sportster is a more sporty SPORT-tourer than (common sport-tourer inserted above). That ought to be good for several pages.

Back to the topic...

It will probably be more along the lines of how pathetically small the ST market is and that is why most of the opinions expressed by our experts don't mean sh*t to the OEMs.  

[JSharp]

the two bikes do have different seats.  The Ninja 1000 has more padding per the various reviews i've read.

I held that in for a long time.

Yes they're different. And it's the difference between siting on a 1X4 and sitting on a 2X4.  The Ninja has a little bit more poorly shaped rock hard plastic.

A few companies make replacement seats now for both bikes. I'm going to order a Sargent next month once I replenish my m/c fund.

[Squidlius]

Kawasaki could have lost a sale because of your misinformation.  What would you do then?

Hopefully no one here is silly enough to believe what's posted here without verifying it for themselves.

[Squidlius]

I know they're not for everyone but I'm liking my Sargent seat so far.




.

[DogBoy]

Your bike looks great Squidlius.

[scottzilla]

I agree.  Kawi really nailed this bike and you improved upon the only critical area that needed to be tampered with-the exhaust cans.  

[nevinfs327]

Your bike looks great Squidlius.

+1  

How do you like those chain adjusters?  Looks like a simpler for maintenance system than what all of my bikes have (well, except the Guzzi's shaft I suppose).

[Squidlius]

Your bike looks great Squidlius.

Thanks!

[Squidlius]

+1  

How do you like those chain adjusters?  Looks like a simpler for maintenance system than what all of my bikes have (well, except the Guzzi's shaft I suppose).

I'm mixed on the chain adjusters. They rotate independently so keeping them even as you torque the axle is a pain. I actually prefer the bolt and nut type adjusters. They also don’t affect ride height like the eccentrics do.

[nevinfs327]

I'm mixed on the chain adjusters. They rotate independently so keeping them even as you torque the axle is a pain. I actually prefer the bolt and nut type adjusters. They also don’t affect ride height like the eccentrics do.

Hadn't thought about the ride height change.  Seems odd that would be a side effect of that adjuster style.  Thanks for the response  

[Justin]

I know they're not for everyone but I'm liking my Sargent seat so far.




.

Great looking bike   - that seat looks pretty slim and not tons of support. Hope it works well for you though. I sat on one at the dealer, and the position did not work for me

[DogBoy]

I'm mixed on the chain adjusters. They rotate independently so keeping them even as you torque the axle is a pain. I actually prefer the bolt and nut type adjusters. They also don’t affect ride height like the eccentrics do.

I had the same eccentric chain adjusters on my ZRX1200. Loved them. Just loosen the pinch bolts and not the axle and they won't rotate independently. You just have to rotate one side and both sides will move together. If your wheel is aligned correctly to begin with, you never need to loosen the axle to adjust the chain. I thought it was kind of cool that you could adjust ride height so easily. Just my opinion.

[nevinfs327]

Just loose the pinch bolts and not the axle and they won't rotate independently.

That's what I was most interested in - I hate lugging around a 10" adjustable wrench to loosen the axle to adjust my chain when on the road, kneeling in dirt at campsites to make sure both sides are perfectly equal according to the little (often dirty) dots or hash marks on the swing arm.  Easy in the garage, but a hassle on the road.

[Squidlius]

Great looking bike   - that seat looks pretty slim and not tons of support. Hope it works well for you though. I sat on one at the dealer, and the position did not work for me

The seat is thin and while better than stock it should definitely be considered a sport bike seat. It is not a sport touring seat. For that matter I think most people would consider the Ninja more of a sport bike than a ST bike.

[Squidlius]

I had the same eccentric chain adjusters on my ZRX1200. Loved them. Just loosen the pinch bolts and not the axle and they won't rotate independently. You just have to rotate one side and both sides will move together. If your wheel is aligned correctly to begin with, you never need to loosen the axle to adjust the chain. I thought it was kind of cool that you could adjust ride height so easily. Just my opinion.

The thing for me is that I never have to adjust my chain between tire changes so leaving the axle tight has not been an option. I'm on my 4th set of tires and I finally figured out the best way to tighten everything back up. I've changed out hundreds of tires and these eccentrics are without question more of a pain than conventional chain adjusters for me.

[DogBoy]

I understand that you are changing tires more often than chain adjustments. Sounds like a fun bike.   I'm jealous.

Let me make a suggestion. Both eccentric adjusters should always move as one piece. I'm not sure why you are moving them separately. When doing remove and replace on the rear wheel for tire changes (if you can't remove the chain without moving the adjusters) try the following:

1) loosen the pinch bolts, rotate the adjusters to allow for most chain slack then snug the pinch bolts again.  
2) Loosen the axle nut and remove the axle.
3) Remove and replace the rear wheel.
4) Install the axle and tighten the axle nut.
5) loosen the pinch bolts and set chain tension.
6) Tighten the pinch bolts.
7) Go burn up another rear tire (not optional).

Thats what I did on my ZRX after some trial and error. Obviously I haven't done a rear wheel R&R on the Ninja 1000 so I may be completely out of line (wouldn't be the first time) so I apologize if this procedure is totally wrong and won't work for you.  

[Squidlius]

I understand that you are changing tires more often than chain adjustments. Sounds like a fun bike.   I'm jealous.

Let me make a suggestion. Both eccentric adjusters should always move as one piece. I'm not sure why you are moving them separately. When doing remove and replace on the rear wheel for tire changes (if you can't remove the chain without moving the adjusters) try the following:

1) loosen the pinch bolts, rotate the adjusters to allow for most chain slack then snug the pinch bolts again.  
2) Loosen the axle nut and remove the axle.
3) Remove and replace the rear wheel.
4) Install the axle and tighten the axle nut.
5) loosen the pinch bolts and set chain tension.
6) Tighten the pinch bolts.
7) Go burn up another rear tire (not optional).

Thats what I did on my ZRX after some trial and error. Obviously I haven't done a rear wheel R&R on the Ninja 1000 so I may be completely out of line (wouldn't be the first time) so I apologize if this procedure is totally wrong and won't work for you.  

Thanks, that is a great idea. I was so pre-occupied with re-installation that it didn’t occur to me to try that during removal. It might even say that in my shop manual, I’ll look tonight and have a good chuckle if it does. If it doesn’t, I’ll owe you one for the great tip. I will certainly give that a try the next time I change my tire and let you know. With the weather getting crappy it looks like this tire will last longer than two months  

[JSharp]

The seat is thin and while better than stock it should definitely be considered a sport bike seat. It is not a sport touring seat. For that matter I think most people would consider the Ninja more of a sport bike than a ST bike.

I'm one of the few guys that the Sargent seat doesn't fit. The construction quality is great and the rise in the front is good. No more sliding forward all the time. But it's too hard for me and the pocket in the center is too pronounced. It puts way too much pressure on my legs.

I was going to send it back but I traded a couple of emails with Spencers and instead I'm sending it there over the winter. He commented that it would never be a touring bike seat and of course that's not what I expect. But he thinks he can make it better, more the way I want it. I figure it's worth a shot.

Spending under $350 total for a seat that's really 'made to order' doesn't sound out of line to me. It's my only major complaint with the bike and if that's all it takes to fix it it's money well spent.

[Squidlius]

I'm one of the few guys that the Sargent seat doesn't fit. The construction quality is great and the rise in the front is good. No more sliding forward all the time. But it's too hard for me and the pocket in the center is too pronounced. It puts way too much pressure on my legs.

I was going to send it back but I traded a couple of emails with Spencers and instead I'm sending it there over the winter. He commented that it would never be a touring bike seat and of course that's not what I expect. But he thinks he can make it better, more the way I want it. I figure it's worth a shot.

Spending under $350 total for a seat that's really 'made to order' doesn't sound out of line to me. It's my only major complaint with the bike and if that's all it takes to fix it it's money well spent.

I think there are more than a few who have issues with Sargent seats, myself included. It’s hard to believe that companies that have been making seats for so long still don’t quite get it. I guess it’s really difficult to make a one size fits all. The Ninja Sargent is much better than my FZ1 Sargent was. This one has some padding and is usable, my FZ1 seat was not. This seat digs into my legs as well ever so slightly at the outer front part of the dish. I don’t know if this will be an issue on the 4th day of a 4 day ride but I’ll find out. For me this seat is noticeably better than the stock seat so I’m gonna stick with it and see if it gets better with time.

[JSharp]

I think there are more than a few who have issues with Sargent seats, myself included. It’s hard to believe that companies that have been making seats for so long still don’t quite get it. I guess it’s really difficult to make a one size fits all. The Ninja Sargent is much better than my FZ1 Sargent was. This one has some padding and is usable, my FZ1 seat was not. This seat digs into my legs as well ever so slightly at the outer front part of the dish. I don’t know if this will be an issue on the 4th day of a 4 day ride but I’ll find out. For me this seat is noticeably better than the stock seat so I’m gonna stick with it and see if it gets better with time.

+1 on the part I bolded.

I rode my kid's GPz 550 some lately and the seat is 10X as good as either of my Ninja seats. It's an '83 model so they had discovered dual density foam but didn't get too creative on shape or angle. It's pretty much flat and nondescript with just a little rise to keep you from sliding back. Just like the stock seat I had on my '81 GPz 1100. You can ride it all day and not hurt.

I'm hopeful I can make the Sargent work out. The construction and styling are first rate.

  

[Squidlius]

+1 on the part I bolded.

I rode my kid's GPz 550 some lately and the seat is 10X as good as either of my Ninja seats. It's an '83 model so they had discovered dual density foam but didn't get too creative on shape or angle. It's pretty much flat and nondescript with just a little rise to keep you from sliding back. Just like the stock seat I had on my '81 GPz 1100. You can ride it all day and not hurt.

I'm hopeful I can make the Sargent work out. The construction and styling are first rate.

Yep, the issue there is a one piece seat vs a two piece seat. The Gen 1 FZ1 and the Bandit have great seats (1 piece) like your kid's GPZ and the Gen 2 FZ1 and the Ninja have full on sport bike seats which are planks to protect the paint on the tail section.

[JSharp]

Yep, the issue there is a one piece seat vs a two piece seat. The Gen 1 FZ1 and the Bandit have great seats (1 piece) like your kid's GPZ and the Gen 2 FZ1 and the Ninja have full on sport bike seats which are planks to protect the paint on the tail section.

I call it an upholstered battery protector on my bike.

[mesmotized]

I believe it was previous mentioned, but has anybody tried a Rick/Bill Mayer or other custom saddle on this bike yet?  If so, how did it turn out?

[Squidlius]

I understand that you are changing tires more often than chain adjustments. Sounds like a fun bike.   I'm jealous.

Let me make a suggestion. Both eccentric adjusters should always move as one piece. I'm not sure why you are moving them separately. When doing remove and replace on the rear wheel for tire changes (if you can't remove the chain without moving the adjusters) try the following:

1) loosen the pinch bolts, rotate the adjusters to allow for most chain slack then snug the pinch bolts again.  
2) Loosen the axle nut and remove the axle.
3) Remove and replace the rear wheel.
4) Install the axle and tighten the axle nut.
5) loosen the pinch bolts and set chain tension.
6) Tighten the pinch bolts.
7) Go burn up another rear tire (not optional).

Thats what I did on my ZRX after some trial and error. Obviously I haven't done a rear wheel R&R on the Ninja 1000 so I may be completely out of line (wouldn't be the first time) so I apologize if this procedure is totally wrong and won't work for you.  

DogBoy, been meaning to say thanks. The service manual does not mention your trick. Your method works great and has saved me a lot of grief!

[blakebird]

for some the stock seat is fine....I'm 56 and would ride this bike to the coast and back as is.


you might give these guys a call and see if they plan a Ninja 1000 / Z1000 option.
http://www.saddlemen.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=476_479_491

Their current Kawasaki sportbike offerings look good

[DogBoy]

DogBoy, been meaning to say thanks. The service manual does not mention your trick. Your method works great and has saved me a lot of grief!

Glad it worked for you.

[blakebird]

I emailed Saddlemen and they responded, they will be coming out with a line of their 'Gel Channel' seats for the Z1000 in early March.

[sportrider]

would like to hear as well.  thanks.  

[JSharp]

My Sargent went off to Spencers today to have him modify it. Nice that I still have the stocker so I can ride while the Sargent is being worked on.

[blakebird]

I've had this a couple of weeks now....pretty happy with it.

Had the seat pocket raised just enough to maintain the oem seat height.
I do that on every Corbin, if I don't buy it from their traveling big rig at the races. I've had a number of their seats, overall a very happy customer.

[NinjaTourer]

So how do you like the corbin seat now that it's been a while.  I bought the sargent and it's hurting my back because I'm raised up a bit higher so now I tend to want to slouch when I'm riding.  I'm also slipping a lot on it and feel like I have to push on the bars in order to stay at the back of the seat.  any issues like that with the corbin?

THanks,

[blakebird]

So how do you like the corbin seat now that it's been a while.  I bought the sargent and it's hurting my back because I'm raised up a bit higher so now I tend to want to slouch when I'm riding.  I'm also slipping a lot on it and feel like I have to push on the bars in order to stay at the back of the seat.  any issues like that with the corbin?

go down a thread  
http://www.sport-touring.net/forums/index.php/topic,69699.0.html

When I ordered the Corbin, I did what I've done on a few of their seats - asked for the seat pocket to be raised back to stock height, sometimes 3/4" more or so (ZX-14). I'm pretty happy with the results, though they could have raised it more beneath the crotch.

I still have a tendency to slide a bit under braking if I don't squeeze the bike between my knees a bit....which you kinda need to do anyway with the upright seating position when riding in a sporty mode.