So, what is it about the new VFR?

[Sprintboy]

Just reading through the posts, it looks like about a 70/30 split.  About 70% don't like the new VFR1200 and 30% do.  I fall into the "don't like the new VFR" camp, but I haven't been able to put my finger on exactly why.

Is it the looks?  Looks are subjective and people can get used to an "interesting" looking bike if the total package is there.

I don't think it's the motor - high-tech V-4 with plenty of power.

Could be the seating position - in the bike instead of on it.

Price tag? - pretty spendy for an all-rounder

Probably the weight - it is about 100 lbs heavier.

What say you?

[veefer800canuck]

Price and fuel range have been common complaints I have heard.

[Bryan217]

They can be had for reasonable prices now if you shop around.

The things that bug me, a 6th Gen VFR owner, is the smaller gas tank which limits range, and the smaller side cases. Why put a smaller tank and bags on a bigger bike?  

[scottzilla]

It doesn't fit a particular group.  It's too heavy to be a sport bike, not heavy enough to be a sport tourer.
Seriously, Like the original VFR, it's expensive too.
Motorcyclists love labels, so this is it's biggest flaw imo.

[Orson]

comparing the specifications side by side with the K1300S and it looks like a close match other than the lack of electronic gizmos.

Now that the VFRs are going for $12,000, I'm assuming all the hate will come to a stop  

[M.Brane]

 Reg Pridmore likes his DCT. I believe him too since the tires were worn to the edges with a blue tint. His wife said the pillion seat is quite comfy.

 His 6th gen had a lot of dust on it.

[zzrwood]

Probably the weight - it is about 100 lbs heavier.

100lbs heavier than what?  I think you'll find it's about 45lbs heavier than a VETEC VFR800 - and about 20lbs heavier than a K1300s...

Also, I would have thought that sitting in the bike is preferable, no?

I think most of the people who don't like the VFR1200 have never ridden one.  I have, and now I own one - brilliant bike.  I paid about 2/3rds of original retail and feel I got a bargain. It is the best bike I have owned by a long shot - and that list includes a new series K1200GT, R1200ST and R1150GS BMWs, a Ducati Multistrada and an ST4s as well as a VETEC VFR800r.

It has way better factory luggage than a K1300s (which is its obvious competition, even Honda admitted it was their development target) - not to mention a much nicer motor, IMO. It gets about the same mileage and has about the same tank size. To me, the VFR's build quality far exceeds the BMW.

I am continuously perplexed why people have a hard time figuring out what the new VFR is, yet seem to have no problem getting what the K1300S is...

Anyway, here's what Motorcycle.com had to say when they did a shoot-out between the K1300s and the VFR1200 (and preferred the Honda):

"Honda haters have derided the VFR as being too heavy and not attractive enough for serious consideration, but those people likely haven’t ridden it. Running the 1200F through a tank of gas is a sure way to win over the skeptics. Consider us converted."

Cheers from Oz

[kevin_stevens]

Do you have the super-slidy "Inertial System" trunk that slides back and forth an inch with an annoying "thunk" every time you change direction?

The VFR seemed a lot more like a K1300GT than a K1300S to me when I rode it.  But I did like the DCT.

KeS

[Sprintboy]

You are correct, sir.  I was thinking about the weight on my '98 VFR, which was about 490 if I remember correctly.

I guess I was looking for a replacement for my trusty Sprint and old Interceptor.  Perhaps a high-tech, updated version of the original with more power.  Instead, I got a completely different bike altogether.  Honda's answer to the K1300S that sat like a K1300GT with the pegs too high (thanks, Kevin).

I still haven't recalibrated my concept on what a VFR should be (or now is).  Maybe that is where my dissapointment is.  

[Jetpilot5]

I really want to like it and now that the prices are coming down that should make a difference but I just can't get past the way it looks.  With the short tail section it looks so front heavy, not balanced and sporty.  Even the styling of the bike makes it look heavy.  I should ride one and give it more of a chance.

I'm so superficial.

[Orson]

I am continuously perplexed why people have a hard time figuring out what the new VFR is, yet seem to have no problem getting what the K1300S is...

I scratch my head over that one too.

While the two bikes seem to be closely matched, the K1300S is lauded as a competent bike, while the VFR1200 is seen as a portent signaling the end of western civilization as we know it  

Maybe the years of anticipation and build up of hype led to a backlash.

[scottzilla]

The K1300S is an obvious rip off of the CBR1100XX.

[garry]

I will reserve judgement until (if) I ever get the chance to ride one, but it's heavier and more expensive than I want. The looks and technical complexity do nothing for me. What I want is a full on sportbike with slightly relaxed (but sporty) ergos and hard luggage.

Had Honda come out with a 1000cc V4 in a Kawasaki Ninja 1000-like package (weight, price, etc), then I'd be interested. Instead, the Kawi is at the top of the short list (pending a test ride).

[zzrwood]

I know we all like to defend our choice of bikes, but I've had heaps of bikes, a few which I could admit didn't suit me (R1200RT comes to mind).

The VFR could definitely do with a few more litres of fuel - and the panniers could be a bit bigger - BUT, every time I ride it I can't stop grinning like a fool and muttering how much I love this bike...  The only place I know how much it weighs is pushing it around the garage - after that it feels every bit as good on the road (if not better) than my old Ducati ST4s.

My wife and regular pillion, who has always hated Hondas (it's a MotoGP thing - she is/was a mad keen Ducati fan), has commented on how incredibly competent the bike feels, planted yet great handling.

These days I'm not all that fussed on how bikes look - but the VFR must look OK - I've never had so many people come up to me to look at it and comment positively (or else they are being polite!).  Here is a shot of ours when we were trying out a sheepskin seat cover.  We are setting the bike up for a tour of Europe next year so it has a Bagster tank cover and bag to add some more storage.

Cheers from Oz

[BamaBiker]

Looks
Price
DCT

[UFO]

I could see owning a 7th gen VFR (I bet it would have 0 problems compared to my MTS).  I hated it when I first saw it, but it's grown on me and has some features I like.

But I would never pay full retail for one.  Not even close.  Maybe a used one, or one marked down to $10-$12K.  I'm still a sucker for V4s, even if this one doesn't sound like a proper V4.  And it can't be red...so I guess I'm screwed.

[Rogue]

My main beef with it is weight.  600 lbs. +?  That's not a sporty bike.  I wanted one that weighed no more than 550 lbs. wet.  But I guess that's asking too much.

Price is an issue too due to the presence of the BMW K1300S.  

I need more time to justify replacing my VFR800 for a VFR1200.  

It's kind of like the US Army deciding on which new combat rifle to choose to replace the venerable M16/M4 family.  The current one is so good and very well developed, they can't decide which rifle justifies the cost of switching over.  So meanwhile they keep soldiering on with the M4.

[gritsngravy]

The VFR800 has so much going for it that it would be a tough sell to move on to the 1200.   Both are great bikes with hard luggage options.   Obviously there is a huge power difference but I certainly don't consider the 800 to be a slow bike.  The shaft of the 1200 is great but the center stand and SSS of the 800 make living with chain upkeep a snap.    It makes me wonder how many 800 owners have moved on to the 1200.  

[Joey Stalin]

ugly as sin front end. who thought up that trainwreck of a design that is the headlights?

[Blunder]

Looks good in that color. We only get the whore's lipstick over here.

[Joey Stalin]

Looks good in that color. We only get the whore's lipstick over here.

Funny...painting the VFR any color is like putting lipstick on a whore...it still sucks.

[Akumu]

Funny...painting the VFR any color is like putting lipstick on a whore...it still sucks.

More negative comments, please. You've not exhausted your seething, burning, driving, raging contempt for this motorcycle yet, have you?  

[zzrwood]

Funny...painting the VFR any color is like putting lipstick on a whore...it still sucks.

And you've ridden it, right?  Probably not, more likely you just can't deal with change - guess what, design moves on...  

Luckily, some innovative companies still strive to try new things - and those stuck in the past rail endlessly about it.

Bottom line, to any serious motorcyclist, the VFR1200 is a very good bike.

Cheers from Oz  

[Rogue]

The VFR800 has so much going for it that it would be a tough sell to move on to the 1200.   Both are great bikes with hard luggage options.   Obviously there is a huge power difference but I certainly don't consider the 800 to be a slow bike.  The shaft of the 1200 is great but the center stand and SSS of the 800 make living with chain upkeep a snap.    It makes me wonder how many 800 owners have moved on to the 1200.  

The SSSA is a blessing for chain driven motorcycles.  It's also a blessing when it comes time to change tires....5 minutes to remove and replace!  I'm serious!  Chain adjustment.....another 5 minutes.  The VFR does NOT need shaft drive if it has that SSSA.

[birdrunner]

Fact is,  after all the false calls and waiting for the "New, Bigger, Better" VFR.  This thing had to be able to ride on water, and cost less than a V-Strom for the internet masses to like it.  After all,  what they wanted was "lighter and faster",  not heavier and technologically advanced.

Then on top of it, Honda starts to think they're "Premium" brand, and price ordinary bikes at premium prices.

I've love to try the new VFR,  but after the suspension upgrade, my own Honda dealer said, "Why bother, you've more power, lighter and better suspenders on your 'Bird".  

The only thing I'd prefer on my XX is a bit more pillion knee room.



And a Flux Capacitor.  

[scottzilla]

Honda is an odd company some times.
They have a long history of overpricing bikes and watching them die on the vine while ignoring the ground breaking, competitively priced bikes that they sold a ton of.
The HawkGT, CB400, CB1000, Trans Alp and ever the original VFR750 are all examples of cool bikes that were priced way too high.
Conversely, the CBR900 sold like mad, as did many other bikes that they priced right (V65Magna, Pacific Coast).  Hell, the CB750 sold in huge numbers due in large part to it's price.  That chopper thing they make sells good becasue of the price.  By chopper standards the thing is dirt cheap.

Had they come in at $11,999 from the get go, they would be selling the shit out of the VFR1200.  By all accounts it's an exceptional motorcycle.  
  

[Orson]

Then on top of it, Honda starts to think they're "Premium" brand, and price ordinary bikes at premium prices.

Just my opinion but, given Honda's history in GP racing (250cc six cylinder   )

and some impressive production bikes (Honda Hawk, CBX-6)

throw in a couple Formula-1 world championships

ya hafta ask yerself, whut da heck does it take to be considered a premium brand?

[Rogue]

A high price.

[atadaskew]

Price and fuel range have been common complaints I have heard.

So early reports of dodgy R/Rs are inaccurate?

[JimNtexas]

Maybe if Honda had a demo team and gave people in the U.S. a chance to test ride their bikes people would like them more.

[zzrwood]

Just my opinion but, given Honda's history in GP racing (250cc six cylinder   )

and some impressive production bikes (Honda Hawk, CBX-6)

throw in a couple Formula-1 world championships

ya hafta ask yerself, whut da heck does it take to be considered a premium brand?

Maybe you have to be European?  In Australia I could have had a Multistrada with bags and topbox for $35k or the VFR with the same for $21k...

What was that about being over-priced?

[Blunder]

Ducati Multistrada 1200 S Touring lists at $19,995 (US) here- http://www.munroemotors.com/bikes/ducati/indx_duc.html

Honda 2010 VFR1200F DCT listed at $17,499 (US) here- http://www.leeshonda.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?sid=04136316X4K20K2011J11I36I14JAMQ1840R0&veh=197949&CatDesc=Motorcycles&ModelYear=2010

Not much difference considering they're both the top line versions of each model. The Honda requires more if you want bags, though it's been heavily discounted. I was in the Honda store last week and they had a leftover VFR on the floor listing at about $13K. It had been dusted but I doubt it had been moved in months.

I think the Honda is disliked because people had expectations that were not met, especially so when price is taken into account.

[Joey Stalin]

Ducati Multistrada 1200 S Touring lists at $19,995 (US) here- http://www.munroemotors.com/bikes/ducati/indx_duc.html

Honda 2010 VFR1200F DCT listed at $17,499 (US) here- http://www.leeshonda.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?sid=04136316X4K20K2011J11I36I14JAMQ1840R0&veh=197949&CatDesc=Motorcycles&ModelYear=2010

Not much difference considering they're both the top line versions of each model. The Honda requires more if you want bags, though it's been heavily discounted. I was in the Honda store last week and they had a leftover VFR on the floor listing at about $13K. It had been dusted but I doubt it had been moved in months.

I think the Honda is disliked because people had expectations that were not met, especially so when price is taken into account.

For $17,500 (MSRP), I don't know how I could justify the VFR over a 175 hp K1300 S. $18,100 MSRP with all the options. Base is something like $15,800.

[motormike]

The DCT model is $1,500 MSRP over the regular VFR1200F model.

If you're making comparisons, I would think you would choose the regular VFR1200F model to compare to other bikes.

Edit to add:

VFR1200F $16,000 MSRP
VFR1200F DCT $17,500 MSRP

[Dan K]

Never had the chance to ride the VFR, but that k1300S...

One day, a K1300S will be mine.

- Dan

[Rogue]

For $17,500 (MSRP), I don't know how I could justify the VFR over a 175 hp K1300 S. $18,100 MSRP with all the options. Base is something like $15,800.

The VFR1200 is right in line with the K1300S as far as price.  As far as quality & reliability I would give the nod to the VFR.  So I would say the VFR1200 is a better value.  You can farkle up the K1300S in ways that you can't with the VFR.  

I think it's a tie.  I do believe the K1300S has had more time to get refined and is a better performer.  It's also lighter.  Those who want a BMW will lean that way.  Those who are on the fence would probably lean towards Honda if their dealer works with them on price even just a bit.

[Dan K]

The VFR is heavier than the K1300S?  I would have thought otherwise....I like the adjustable suspension on the fly.  WOW does it make a difference when you dwitch from great to crappy roads. Plus, the bottomless pool of torque...smooth handling (though sharp like an axe, not a scalpel...), great fueling, confortable ergos...yes, I want one, but it's not happening while I have a second bike for the track...or until the used ones drop about 30-40%...

Don't get me wrong, would love to throw a leg over the new VFR.  But since the first day I made friends with that K1300S, I've wanted one.

- Dan

[Jetpilot5]

The VFR is heavier than the K1300S?

According to the respective manufacturers websites, K1300S wet weight 560lbs, VFR1200 wet weight 591lbs.

[zzrwood]

The VFR1200 is right in line with the K1300S as far as price.  As far as quality & reliability I would give the nod to the VFR.  So I would say the VFR1200 is a better value.  You can farkle up the K1300S in ways that you can't with the VFR.  

I think it's a tie.  I do believe the K1300S has had more time to get refined and is a better performer.  It's also lighter.  Those who want a BMW will lean that way.  Those who are on the fence would probably lean towards Honda if their dealer works with them on price even just a bit.

Not everyone thinks the K1300s is a better performer - Motorcyclist had the VFR faster over the 1/4 mile and, to quote, "The VFR prefers fast, sweeping corners to cut and thrust work, but it will still drop BMW's new K1300S like a bad habit in the tight stuff."

Doubt it would make much difference in the real world, let alone the way I ride...  

I think they're both great bikes, but I'm surprised at how many people seem to really dislike the VFR, and I can't figure out why.  Everyone says its too heavy (not that you can notice that riding it) and that is is too expensive (not anymore, at least not here).

The only thing it might be missing out on is the nifty feature of the Multistrada - where if you put your clothes in the panniers, and then ride through rain, it automatically rinses them out for you!  Cool...

Cheers from Oz  

PS - I have owned a lot of BMWs, and the Honda's finish and feeling of quality is better, IMO. BMW themselves will admit, off the record, that they dropped the ball on quality around 2005-2010 - but it is much better now, of course...  

[kevin_stevens]

PS - I have owned a lot of BMWs, and the Honda's finish and feeling of quality is better, IMO. BMW themselves will admit, off the record, that they dropped the ball on quality around 2005-2010 - but it is much better now, of course...  

Show me a picture of your heelguards.  The press demo bikes I rode were already all scraped up after one day of riding.

I dunno - I have nothing against the VFR, but it doesn't feel at all like a K1300S to me.  It feels like a K1300GT, or even more like the old K1200RS (that's really what it reminds me of more than any current bike).  The K1300S feels like it belongs in a group with the Hayabusa and the ZX-14.  The VFR... doesn't.  

KeS

[Croak]

So early reports of dodgy R/Rs are inaccurate?

That was just nostalgia.  

[Rogue]

All heel guards get scuffed up.  That's what they're there for.  

[swimmer]

That was just nostalgia.  

lol

[atadaskew]

All heel guards get scuffed up.  That's what they're there for.  

Owners on the VFR12 sites are also reporting the paint is extremely soft.
Shiny, but not durable.

That also was an issue I had with my Wing 1800.  After just one ride wearing jeans the area around the 'gas tank' would be scuffed/dulled.

Anyway, I think the $12K price point that the VFR now is apparently selling at in some markets makes all these points moot.  That is an incredible price.

[kevin_stevens]

All heel guards get scuffed up.  That's what they're there for.  

Really?  Like this?  After one day?  None of my bikes ever have.


KeS

[Rogue]

Owners on the VFR12 sites are also reporting the paint is extremely soft.
Shiny, but not durable.

That also was an issue I had with my Wing 1800.  After just one ride wearing jeans the area around the 'gas tank' would be scuffed/dulled.

Anyway, I think the $12K price point that the VFR now is apparently selling at in some markets makes all these points moot.  That is an incredible price.

You still haven't bought one yet?  


Also, I've owned different makes of bikes and all of them scuff up their fuel tanks even after only a day's ride.  My current VFR will do that in the belt area if I'm not careful.  You can't avoid that.  Any time you take a bike out dust and debris will cover it.  Now rub your belly (or tank bag or whatever else) on that and see what happens!  If you don't keep your bike clean and/or religiously wax the tank, the paint will wear very quickly.

That's why tank protectors around the belt area sell really well.  They used to sell those Second Skin colored tank covers, which were great but have fallen out of vogue.  

[Rogue]

Anywhere you have a contact point, it's going to wear.  

If you don't want it to wear, don't ride it.   Or put a cover on it or practice splaying your feet out so it doesn't touch any hard parts.  Geezus.  Or how about just don't buy the dang bike?  I can understand the price point issue, the weight issue, or even the aesthetic issues.  But scuffing the heel guard and the tank from usage?  

[kevin_stevens]

Anywhere you have a contact point, it's going to wear.  

If you don't want it to wear, don't ride it.   Or put a cover on it or practice splaying your feet out so it doesn't touch any hard parts.  Geezus.  Or how about just don't buy the dang bike?  I can understand the price point issue, the weight issue, or even the aesthetic issues.  But scuffing the heel guard and the tank from usage?  

The point is that someone was contending that the VFR has superior quality and finish.  In my very limited experience, it doesn't.  As an example, I offer a picture of what I consider to be extreme wear on the heelguards of a brand new demo bike.  It wasn't just that one, they were all like that.  That's not what I would expect to see from a single day's wear - that looks like *years* of wear.

It wouldn't affect my decision to buy or not buy a VFR, but it is a valid observation in a discussion about material choice and overall quality.

Go facepalm yourself.

KeS

[Rogue]

The quality argument in VFR vs BMW is mentioned often whenever the new bike is tested.  I seem to remember it being mentioned back when the VFR800 was tested against the F800ST by a few magazine rags and online tests.  It existed back then and it continuous to exist with the new models according to them.  Of course none of them mentioned tanks and heel guards scuffing.  I don't know...maybe because they understand these are main contact points on bikes and it happens to all bikes, and maybe they understand that no bike is going to remain in showroom condition if it's ridden.    

What do they know right?  They only get to ride and test at least a dozen bikes a year if not more....

So here it is again:  

[kevin_stevens]

The quality argument in VFR vs BMW is mentioned often whenever the new bike is tested.  I seem to remember it being mentioned back when the VFR800 was tested against the F800ST by a few magazine rags and online tests.  It existed back then and it continuous to exist with the new models according to them.  Of course none of them mentioned tanks and heel guards scuffing.  I don't know...maybe because they understand these are main contact points on bikes and it happens to all bikes, and maybe they understand that no bike is going to remain in showroom condition if it's ridden.    

What do they know right?  They only get to ride and test at least a dozen bikes a year if not more....

So here it is again:  

You can keep saying it happens to all bikes, but that doesn't make it true.  None of my extensive collection of bikes has looked like that.

KeS

[Rogue]

So you don't scuff your heelguards at all huh?  Not your tank either?

[kevin_stevens]

So you don't scuff your heelguards at all huh?  Not your tank either?

Jordan, are you trying to be a dick here?  It's not like you.

Yes, I scuff my heelguards a little.  Never, anywhere in this thread, claimed I didn't.  Eventually.  I powdercoated my ZX-14 guards, which should be less durable than aluminum, and they didn't show a mark for two years.  I have clear-coated carbon fiber ones on the S1000RR and they don't have marks.  Nothing has been torn up after a day of use to the point where I notice it and make a point of taking pictures of it because it's *conspicuous*.

Yes, I scuff my tank, or I would if I didn't use tank protectors.  The VFR *comes* with one built in, BTW:  .  The demo bikes had a second one added.

I haven't posted anything in this thread about paint or tank protectors at all, so don't know why I'm getting that particular load of crap.  I was responding, as I've said multiple times now, to someone who thought that the VFR had quality and finish superiority over the BMW.  I said I didn't think so and backed it up with pictures.  I don't have to respond to random inquisitions on the subject from you, and won't after this.  Take it... somewhere else, dude.

KeS

[atadaskew]

Also, I've owned different makes of bikes and all of them scuff up their fuel tanks even after only a day's ride.  My current VFR will do that in the belt area if I'm not careful.  You can't avoid that.  Any time you take a bike out dust and debris will cover it.  Now rub your belly (or tank bag or whatever else) on that and see what happens!  If you don't keep your bike clean and/or religiously wax the tank, the paint will wear very quickly.

Not true.

I've only had paint wear issues on my Hondas.  My Ducati still looks like new, I kid you not.  My Harley also had no paint wear issues - well until a Subaru hit it  

I treat all my bikes the same - clean them after every ride.  Did not make a difference with the Hondas.
http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php/topic/65810-vfr-1200-paint/
FWIW the paint on my 1987 Wing was much more durable than the Wing 1800.

[Joey Stalin]

i've never had scuffing issues like that on 6 different bikes i've had. wouldn't keep me from buying the bike, though.

[gritsngravy]

So perfect was Adolph Hitlers personal bmw that Tojo himself begged relentlessly until Hitler gave him the bike to take back to Japan.   Like all Bmw's of the time the well crafted heel guards and superior tank  paint stood out like a gleaming V2 rocket.   Tojo was so caught up with perfection and grace of the heel guards and superior ultimate bestest paint that he fucked around and lost the war.   Still the decendants of Tojo continue to attempt to duplicate the vaughted heel guards and paint but sadly they have yet to create a superior heel guard or wear proof paint!   Thankfully in the late 50's a bloody revolution in Japan resulted in an agreement to return to simply making great bikes for those that ride rather than obsess.

[zzrwood]

Show me a picture of your heelguards.  The press demo bikes I rode were already all scraped up after one day of riding.

I dunno - I have nothing against the VFR, but it doesn't feel at all like a K1300S to me.  It feels like a K1300GT, or even more like the old K1200RS (that's really what it reminds me of more than any current bike).  The K1300S feels like it belongs in a group with the Hayabusa and the ZX-14.  The VFR... doesn't.  

KeS

The VFR is like the K1200RS?  Really??  Apart from the handling, obviously - oh, and the performance - but apart from that they both had two wheels...  

Every bike magazine, Honda and BMW themselves will tell you that the VFR and the K1300S are direct competitors. That is, high-powered sport-tourers with shaft drive and very similar ergos.  The Hayabusa and ZX-14 are much more in the hyperbike space.

I have owned about 8 new BMWs in the past 15 years or so and think the K1300S is a great bike - would have bought one except the luggage doesn't work for me - and I don't find the engine as interesting or refined as the VFR.  What I still can't understand is how much people really like to hate the VFR, or claim it is in some weird category all by itself...  

And here is a picture of my heelguards - no scuffing to be seen after 4000kms.  But I don't think that would have really swayed my buying decision...



Cheers from Oz

[kevin_stevens]

The VFR is like the K1200RS?  Really??  Apart from the handling, obviously - oh, and the performance - but apart from that they both had two wheels...  

Every bike magazine, Honda and BMW themselves will tell you that the VFR and the K1300S are direct competitors. That is, high-powered sport-tourers with shaft drive and very similar ergos.  The Hayabusa and ZX-14 are much more in the hyperbike space.

What I still can't understand is how much people really like to hate the VFR, or claim it is in some weird category all by itself...

 I've ridden all these bikes multiple times, and owned a couple of them.  I don't get to have my own opinions?

Glad your heelguards are ok.  It looked very strange to see a dozen VFRs with each of them torn up.

KeS

[zzrwood]

 I've ridden all these bikes multiple times, and owned a couple of them.  I don't get to have my own opinions?

Glad your heelguards are ok.  It looked very strange to see a dozen VFRs with each of them torn up.

KeS

Of course you can have your opinions, and I get that you don't like the VFR - but making statements that the VFR is more like the K1300GT than the K1300S, and that it is even more like the K1200RS is just misleading...

I have owned both a K1200RS and a K1200GT (the beta version of the K1300GT).  The K1200GT had the worst engine of any bike I have owned - BMW pulled it from the market and got Ricardo to redo the engine, and then released it as the K1300GT - and have now discontinued it. I couldn't wait to get rid of my K1200GT, it was a dog.

The K1200RS had a very smooth engine but could not compare with the VFR1200 in either handling or performance - as I said earlier.

All I'm trying to do is separate fact from prejudice...

Cheers from Oz

[Joey Stalin]

So maybe therein lies the problem - the previous VFR was never confused with being a competitor with BMW's K bikes. A difference of 50 horsepower and 5 to 8 grand separated them. Now the new generation comes out, and its like Honda saying, "If you liked the previous generation, well guess what: we don't care! Because we're not designing this one for you!"

It's almost similar to the complaints that the Concourse riders had when the C14 came out. Problem is that Connie fans loved the bike because it was 15 year old design, 15 year old paid for tooling, and a price that seemed to ignore inflation. They would only have been happy if Kawi continued making the old Concourse. I'm betting most of them transitioned to Urals.

[aks801]

Looks: as soon as the real photos began to emerge shortly before official bike release, I loved the styling at first sight.  Just thought "right on!" (only thought it, as I don't think anyone actually says that anymore).  Looks fresh and functional.

Weight: this really got under the skin of the VFR faithful.  One nice aspect is it helps the bike feel planted during "spirited" touring.  Not the most flickable, though, but that hasn't been a VFR strong-suit for several generations now.

Engine: fantastic from what I can determine (have not yet RIDDEN one, though).

Price: Honda is rather proud of the bike, aren't they?  Current discounted pricing has brought it back to market levels.

The bike has always seemed to be a "tweener", and still is.  One honk called it a "very fine ride" years and years ago, and it sure seems to hold true now.

I intend to take a very close look while contemplating my next bike purchase.

[Rogue]

Jordan, are you trying to be a dick here?  It's not like you.

Kevin, I'm not trying to be a dick.  I stated that road tests that I've read said the VFR1200's quality was above that of the BMW K1300S.  You don't need me to tell you that, all you have to do is read the reviews and you will see.  You brought up the scuffing and another poster brought up the tank scuffing.  My response to that is any part of a bike that contacts you on a regular basis is going to scuff.  All my bikes have had the heel guards scuff.  If you don't scuff your heel guards then great!.  Apparently, there are people who don't.  I'm not one of those people.  My point is heel guard scuffing and tank scuffing is part of bike ownership anytime you ride a bike.  At least it is for me and I just don't see that as being a decision point to either buy or not buy a bike.

You are taking this way too personally and I really don't understand why.  You stated above that you should be entitled to your opinion when zzrwood posted his opinion that countered yours.  So how come you are upset that I am stating MY opinion?  This is just the internet dude and we are only talking about motorcycles.  Relax.

[UFO]

I saw my first VFR12 on the road today.

It passed me in my truck...didn't hear a damn sound coming from it.

[drbenjamin]

Back to the original question ...

I gave serious consideration to the VFR, but what did it in was the price. Especially after adding in the bags that came standard with my Sprint GT. The range was a concern too, but I could overlook that given the praise about the bikes power and handling.

At 12K (what I paid for my Sprint including bags and centerstand) it would have been a serious contender.

[spinalator]

I rode the 12 as soon as I was able to, and I liked it, thought the pegs a little high for my 40 year old knees, and the price made me sh!t my pants in anger.

Now that prices are being adjusted it looks more better-er to me.

As a data point, I have scuffed the heel guards of every bike that I have owned. I seem to have tough boots and a weird heel clicking obsession when I ride, apparently. I also destroy every tank I own, but that is also part of my charm.

[Rogue]

I gave serious consideration to the VFR, but what did it in was the price. Especially after adding in the bags that came standard with my Sprint GT.... At 12K (what I paid for my Sprint including bags and centerstand) it would have been a serious contender.

Well the Sprint GT is what the VFR800 should have morphed into.  It's ironic that Triumph listens to VFR customers more than Honda does!  LOL!