Track bikes

[Hotbrakes]

How many of us ST'Ners are blazing the local track on a tricked out, dripping in goodies track bike?  Or is it just some beater you got real cheap off a kid who wrecked it?

[Mastros2]

Got a perfect track bike from a friend who had the suspension set up perfectly.  Not a garage queen but perfect for beating up on the track.  Yes, it does have a title too!

[1000lbs]

Ummm... Mine has a clean title, but the previous owner(s) were not kind.  I picked it up less then a month ago and the process has been like rescueing a puppy from the pound.  Its ready and willing, but needs some kind attention to details.  Faired well on the track Monday, and the ups trucks have been stopping daily to deliver the bits to bring it to a respectable level.  Low investment and big grin return.  Plus its just another bike project, which is just fine by me.

[Hotbrakes]

Nice!  Is that the glint from a chrome wheel I see?

Mine have clean titles but one is the MSO from Honda.  The others have been crashed and trashed, but never totaled.  Just got a set of mint street bodywork to convert the old 1000RR back to street legal and put it up for sale.

[phoenix]

I answered Yes but title is no good (mine has PRIOR SALVAGE title). mine can be street legal, but have not had it on the street in a few years other than a ride around the block. It does not take much damage to consider a bike totaled.

[1000lbs]

Nice!  Is that the glint from a chrome wheel I see?

Haha, good eye.  The previous owner had that mounted after he binned the oem wheel.  Also came with a spare chrome front.  I already have the oem rear off ebay and I'm selling off the chrome set to offset the cost of repair/upgrades.

If an adjuster ever had an eye on this bike, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have a clean title.  Still for a track bike it will fit the need well, and resale will be easier, even with full disclosure.  I must admit, I rushed this one.  I don't think I got taken, but would have found something cleaner if I didn't want to get on the track NOW!  An all new two wheeled sickness, just when I thought I'd run out of obsessions  .

[satxbonneville]

Some time back, I bought a lightly wrecked Ninja 500 from a co-worker (clean title) who decided that riding was just not her thing and was rebuilding it for my son to ride while going to school in San Fran. He decided that the Ninja was a bit to small for him (he's a shade over 6' 2") so he bought himself a nice used SV650, leaving me with a good running Ninja 500 that I have decided will be a track bike. It's already shorn of the plastic bits - when the previous owner wrecked it all of the major fairing bits were broken and I wasn't going to pay the long dollar that new parts were commanding so it was rebuilt as a streetfighter - so now I just need to remove the lights and get a belly pan. And do some suspension work. A pipe would be nice...which means carb tweaking.

I also have to convince my wife that 3 bikes are really a good idea...anybody know the proper purse to bike ratio for this type of situation?  

[DogBoy]

Ummm... Mine has a clean title, but the previous owner(s) were not kind.  I picked it up less then a month ago and the process has been like rescueing a puppy from the pound.  Its ready and willing, but needs some kind attention to details.  Faired well on the track Monday, and the ups trucks have been stopping daily to deliver the bits to bring it to a respectable level.  Low investment and big grin return.  Plus its just another bike project, which is just fine by me.

This is so cool that you got track fever so quick and are hooked. Glad you're having a good time.  




My track/race bike is a KTM 450 SMR supermoto. I'm second owner and it has a clean title. These bikes were sold as track-only bikes by KTM already converted for supermoto. I don't have any plans to go crazy on mods as they come pretty well set up. Mine desperately needs a better rider. Still, I'm having the most fun I've ever had on a bike.

[Mastros2]

Check the nesba forums for used track bikes.  The best ones aren't the prettiest but the cheapest and most fun!

[Mastros2]

My track/race bike is a KTM 450 SMR supermoto. I'm second owner and it has a clean title. These bikes were sold as track-only bikes by KTM already converted for supermoto.

Mmmm!  That must be a hoot to track on!  

[Mr Sunshine]

My track bike is my race bike and it is pretty decked out.  Worth about $25k if you had a shop build it from new.  Close to the most expensive SV650 I've ever seen and I still want to do a $2-3k more money worth of work to the motor.

[Hotbrakes]

My track bike is my race bike and it is pretty decked out.  Worth about $25k if you had a shop build it from new.  Close to the most expensive SV650 I've ever seen and I still want to do a $2-3k more money worth of work to the motor.

And I thought having 10k invested in 3 track bikes was overdoing it...

[endo]

I did a track day on my zzr recently and had a blast! Came home and promptly started looking for a bike I can make for a dedicated track bike. My wife thinks I'm kidding.

[MadOzodi]

The Sprint is doing double duty.

Back in 2009, I was debating gettin a motorcycle or adopting a rescue pet.  The motorcycle won the coin toss.

I just volunteered at Stray Rescue of St. Louis (props to Randy Grim!) and have been chewing on adopting a doggie again.  Of course, I did my first two track days earlier this year and want a track bike too...

Since I haven't reached the point where I want to be in terms of finances, I'm targeting 2012 for another coin toss.

[DogBoy]

I did a track day on my zzr recently and had a blast! Came home and promptly started looking for a bike I can make for a dedicated track bike. My wife thinks I'm kidding.

With Reno Fernley Raceway close by, you would have so much fun. Never ridden that track but everyone raves about it. Remember to use the "its cheaper than speeding tickets" argument (even if its not true in the long run).

[Mastros2]

My wife thinks I'm kidding.

Sometimes they just don't get it...

[DNA]

My wife actually suggested that I stop doing Long Distance rallies and buy a track bike.
 
Sitting at the award dinner a few weeks back - I started counting the number of very serious injuries (shattered pelvis/ compound fracture femur type stuff).  Most of the top riders had spent a year in rehab.  Possibly more.


It is an interesting thought.   She might be on to something...

[Mr Sunshine]

My wife actually suggested that I stop doing Long Distance rallies and buy a track bike.
 
Sitting at the award dinner a few weeks back - I started counting the number of very serious injuries (shattered pelvis/ compound fracture femur type stuff).  Most of the top riders had spent a year in rehab.  Possibly more.


It is an interesting thought.   She might be on to something...

At least they are alive.  5 people I know of died on the track last year....2 within my own racing club.

[DNA]

At least they are alive.  5 people I know of died on the track last year....2 within my own racing club.

That is alarming, quite troubling actually.  Might be time to find a new club unless they were anomalies.  

There are a few LD rally deaths each year - but the number of participants is quite a bit lower so the ratios might be similar.

 What was the cause of the deaths?  Is there a serious safety issue that was not addressed?

I though tracks were a "safer" alternative...

[Fourstring]

I though tracks were a "safer" alternative...

I'm not a track pro, but IME, they are safer at the lower levels.  We were at Blackhawk yesterday and a guy low-sided into the barrier at about 60.  Picked it up and rode away.  

My street bike does double duty, so I'm a permanent novice.  I don't need a dedicated bike to suck.

[Windblown]

That is alarming, quite troubling actually.  Might be time to find a new club unless they were anomalies.  

There are a few LD rally deaths each year - but the number of participants is quite a bit lower so the ratios might be similar.

 What was the cause of the deaths?  Is there a serious safety issue that was not addressed?

I though tracks were a "safer" alternative...

I would guess most if not all the deaths were related to racing versus regular trackdays, two completely different venues.

[Raptormn]

i have two. i have my old street bike which an R1 which i totaled on track and rebuilt just for the track. I picked up a wrecked R6 which is my second track bike. i have the FJR as my street bike. i love riding on the track but i also love doing long distance cross country riding.

[Mr Sunshine]

That is alarming, quite troubling actually.  Might be time to find a new club unless they were anomalies. 

There are a few LD rally deaths each year - but the number of participants is quite a bit lower so the ratios might be similar.

 What was the cause of the deaths?  Is there a serious safety issue that was not addressed?

I though tracks were a "safer" alternative...

The two in my local club died because:

1. might have had a heart attack at the fastest part of the track then went straight into a tire wall at over 130mph. Broken neck

2. He was a novice, crashed and I believe he just landed wrong on a berm on the outside of the turn.

Last year was extra ordinary and I'm told is not close to the norm.

[Mr Sunshine]

Btw. The track is safer but you can die doing anything.

[AZFZDude]

Street trim vs track trim.  Bought my ZX6R  from the California Superbike School in 2005.  It was an instructor bike and had never been down.  Still doesn't have a scratch on it.  When I eventually get a new trackbike, it will go back on the street.  It's just a great all-around bike.

[VT636]

Street trim vs track trim.  Bought my ZX6R  from the California Superbike School in 2005.  It was an instructor bike and had never been down.  Still doesn't have a scratch on it.  When I eventually get a new trackbike, it will go back on the street.  It's just a great all-around bike.

+1 - Picked one up in fair condition in 2008 for $1500 from a classmate who had received it as gift from his big bro and didn't really know the value. Did some heavy ST'ing on it as well as some aggresive riding. Wish I'd kept it for a track bike! Kudos.

I finally have the right gear to allow me to do a track day at Loudon. I'd much rather use my better half's SV than my CBR - its a tight course. But I don't want to leave her without a bike... anyone care to weigh in on your trackday-to-crash ratio?

[Hotbrakes]

I finally have the right gear to allow me to do a track day at Loudon. I'd much rather use my better half's SV than my CBR - its a tight course. But I don't want to leave her without a bike... anyone care to weigh in on your trackday-to-crash ratio?

Out of 50 or so trackdays and about 10 races I've crashed ONCE.  Ride the track like you would ride the road.  Speed will come with time and training.  If you feel uncomfortable slow down, it's not a race, even if it is a race.  I would ride a bike that you are familiar with though.  If you are doing this to improve your skills you should ride the bike you ride everyday to learn it.

[Mastros2]

If you feel uncomfortable slow down, it's not a race, even if it is a race.  I would ride a bike that you are familiar with though.  If you are doing this to improve your skills you should ride the bike you ride everyday to learn it.

Exactly!  

[VT636]

 I would ride a bike that you are familiar with though.  If you are doing this to improve your skills you should ride the bike you ride everyday to learn it.

I ride whichever one I feel like when I leave the house each morning. But point taken - and I appreciate the statistic as well as the advice.

[Fourstring]

My wife and I have a half dozen track days between the two of us.  One lowside with minimal damage and no injury.

[Windblown]

... anyone care to weigh in on your trackday-to-crash ratio?

I only have 3 trackdays this year but if I add in trackdays from '05 & '06 I'm running at about 35 trackdays - Zero crashes (so far).  It really does come down to how you approach the day and what your goals are. It's not a demolition derby out there (unless you're racing in the meatgrinder, LOL).

[phoenix]

... anyone care to weigh in on your trackday-to-crash ratio?

Crashed 3 times on the track in 19 trackdays (since late 2007).
One I can blame on painted stripes on the track (and not talking about the edge of the track)
The other 2 may have been tires pushed beyond their usable life, or rider error. Probably 85% rider, 15% equipment.
On all 3 occasions, I could have continued to ride my slightly damaged bike that same day.

[gradus]

Crashed 3 times on the track in 19 trackdays (since late 2007).

Yikes - that's not very encouraging.

[DogBoy]

3 crashes in 19 track days doesn't seem excessive to me. He said he could have continued to ride. Trouble starts when someone repeatedly injures his (or her) self or others.

[phoenix]

Yikes - that's not very encouraging.

I'm not entirely happy with that statistic either. Within my group of close track day friends, I would say I'm a little above average in that area. I am sure I know people who have not crashed in their first 20 trackdays, but I bet its really rare.

I will say they were all lowsides. My worst crash was when I was riding some twisty hilly roads up in South Dakota and I completely gave up in a corner, trying to just stop the bike rather than try to make the corner. I had not been on the track before then and I was not too proficient. Nowadays, I'm sure I would have made that corner, although I probably would not be riding at that same speed on the street. I felt like I had a broken rib after that crash. My track crashes? I've only had a minor amount of rash, not even enough for a band aid.

Incidentally, Rossi / Spies / every other professional rider crashes probably once a month or more.

[VT636]

16% of the time - that doesn't seem terrible to me either as long as its a dedicated track bike. I would not want to pound on my daily like that.

That probably reflects the fact that he pushes it a bit more than others who have reported a 0% crash stat.... Good to hear from both sides of the spectrum.

[Windblown]

16% of the time - that doesn't seem terrible to me either as long as its a dedicated track bike. I would not want to pound on my daily like that.

That probably reflects the fact that he pushes it a bit more than others who have reported a 0% crash stat.... Good to hear from both sides of the spectrum.

Exactly. Folks that have never ridden the track really shouldn't take what someone else has or hasn't done as an indicator of how their day will go because it is how THEY approach the day that will dicate the odds of a crash. If a rider pushes hard then one of two things will probably happen: They'll exceed either their or the bikes limits and have fairly high odds of crashing. I don't personally know any truely fast riders who have not crashed. It takes a VERY long time to find the limits if you don't punch through to the other side occasionally.

Then there are folks like me who go to trackdays just for fun, and don't find crashing fun. Our type progress VERY slowly but odds are extremely good the bike comes home in one piece at the end of the day.

[hovmaven]

I'm with Windy, although when I brought my VFR to the track (I was between track bikes), he threatened to hang an orange triangle from its rear.  

FWIW, I'd go with a dedicated track ride for many of the reasons above -- the more you push the performance envelope, the likelier you are to bin it, and your road ride is most likely an awfully expensive bike to bin.  

[Hotbrakes]

Exactly. Folks that have never ridden the track really shouldn't take what someone else has or hasn't done as an indicator of how their day will go because it is how THEY approach the day that will dicate the odds of a crash. If a rider pushes hard then one of two things will probably happen: They'll exceed either their or the bikes limits and have fairly high odds of crashing. I don't personally know any truely fast riders who have not crashed. It takes a VERY long time to find the limits if you don't punch through to the other side occasionally.

Then there are folks like me who go to trackdays just for fun, and don't find crashing fun. Our type progress VERY slowly but odds are extremely good the bike comes home in one piece at the end of the day.

I've found, though not personally, that the best way to get fast is to not waste precious track time fixing my bike and my body.  I have friends who seem to enjoy crashing, I am much faster than them.  It has taken me a long time to get to this point, but every day was spent making gradual and steady progress.  Same applies to the street although there was a time when I first started that luck was on my side, all the time.  

Crashing can be a substantial mental obstacle that many people struggle to overcome.  It can also be a huge financial set back that I cannot afford.  Not crashing other than that one little mishap has paid off and I am consistently finishing top 5 or better in club races.  Slow, incremental gains have yielded fantastic results and the only thing hitting the ground are knees and elbows.  And I can afford to come back next week and chip away at the lap timer.

[XRacerX]

My track/race bikes have clean titles, and I have spent some $$$ building them.  I race WERA Vintage on a pair of 89 GSXR 7/11s.  I also work as an Instructor/Control Rider at Jennings GP, using my old track bikes.  Its great to show the young kids that the rider makes more of a difference, than the bike does.  I also have a 91 GSXR 1100 with 230K + miles.  I recently bought a 05 B12 to replace the 91 as the daily rider.  What can I say, Im an 'Oil-cooled addict'!  Began racing in 1989 on a brand new GSXR 750, still riding the same bikes now in Vintage.... you know you're getting old when........

[Dan K]

I've been using my Daytona - in street trim - for track days for 2 years now.  Maybe 6 track days.  I haven't binned it yet, hope not to, but I have gone off track twice and been able to keep it vertical.  Also somehow avoided a high side after swinging the back wheel 2-3 feet to the left, then a foot or two to the right, and kept it upright.

Off track was once on my first track day (a little excited after I was in a groove) and took a turn way too hot.  Last track day, prior to STAR school with Jason Pridmore, I was at Gingerman in Michigan and on the last session (felling good having learned a lot that day), I took the short straight WAY too fast, pounded on the brakes, and hit a lip in the end of the straight before turn 1 the front wheel momentarily came off the ground and and due to the heavy braking, locked. When returned to the pavement, I got a real strong wobble that I couldn't tame quick enough (even with the stabilizer).  No way I was making that turn, and I rode straight into the grass.  Corner worker waved me back on and after a couple more laps, we were done for the day.

I am trying to take the slow learner approach, but it's so fucking amazing to take these turns at high speed on the edge of your tire that sometimes you get a little excited...need to get some track plastics.

[hovmaven]

I am trying to take the slow learner approach, but it's so fucking amazing to take these turns at high speed on the edge of your tire that sometimes you get a little excited...need to get some track plastics.

I know.  I did. . ..

[Hotbrakes]

I love the ready to go race bike (at VIR N) with the big "B" sticker!  The pic doesn't look like you're in Beginner anymore though...

[hovmaven]

No.  

The ride was built up by a canadian racer -- hence the stickers.  What's cool about a pre-made race ride is that all the bits are there, and the track plastics are just fare better when you bin it.  Now, it did have a Canadian coke can for a overflow coolant reservoir, and tons of zip ties, but i thought that just gave the ride character.

[FireRunner]

I've just got one bike, my little Ninja 650R, and she does double duty.  A nasty crash in my first 6 miles on the street this February meant converting her to a streetfighter, so I go unfaired on the track.  I got an interesting sensation this weekend after getting bumped to Intermediate at CMP when at higher speeds, my helmet started pushing on my nose.

As far as crashes on the track...  I've had my bike for 6 months, and didn't ride for the first 6 weeks because the bike and I had to "heal" from my little incident.  Got back on in April (had one little crash after that on wet pavement, was able to ride home) and have done 6 track days in the 6 months I've been riding.  ZERO crashes on the track, 8000 miles on the street without incident since my rough start, bumped to Intermediate. I think I got a pretty good track record, pun intended.

Got to buy another bike though.  Been trying to decide what to do next.  Keep the 650R as a track bike (she's fun as hell on the track).  Move her to just the street and set up for touring, hard bags and all?  But what do I buy for another track or street bike?  I'm only 5'5", and small framed, so the bike has to be low enough and light enough to handle, cause I'm not messing with the suspension, and we're talking less than 400lbs dry.  The SMT looks H-O-T, but maybe a little too pricey.  I've toyed around with the thought of a Duke, the the single cylinder thing gets me.  Seems like I'd want to do double duty with it also, lol, which is what I'm *trying* to get away from.  Hmmm..... Suggestions?

[nater]

I know.  I did. . ..

That's what the guy with the GSXR 750 in the background wished he did  

[nater]

 Seems like I'd want to do double duty with it also, lol, which is what I'm *trying* to get away from.  Hmmm..... Suggestions?

Having never ridden the track (but really, really want to try...), I probably shouldn't offer my opinion.  However, I'll give it to you anyway, simply because I'm full of opinions.

If I were getting a 2nd bike for the track, I would look for someone's track bike for sale so I wouldn't have to set it up.  Also, older track bikes tend to sell for pretty cheap.  My 2nd choice would be a 10 year old Yamaha R6.  There are plenty around and available for $3500 or so.

[FireRunner]

If I were getting a 2nd bike for the track, I would look for someone's track bike for sale so I wouldn't have to set it up.

Yeah, that makes sense, except that I'm 130lbs.  I've sprung the forks on the 650R for my weight already, and the difference is phenomenal.  So if I'm picking up a used track bike, with goodies already, they're probably gonna be set up for someone much heavier than I am, which means the forks and rear are still gonna have to be redone.    I actually find something very cathartic (albeit expensive) about working on my own bike and modding it up.  All the mods (and repairs) on the 650R were done by myself (with the help of my wonderful bf and his extensive garage).  But you're right, it would be cheaper to buy a track bike already set up for that.

[hovmaven]

The race ride i purchased (see above) was ridden by a canadian racer who was all of about 5 foot nothing, and less than 130 lbs.  Keep looking, i bet you find a setup that works.

The WERA site is a pretty good spot to locate previously enjoyed race rides.  

[tomek]

The race ride i purchased (see above) was ridden by a canadian racer who was all of about 5 foot nothing, and less than 130 lbs.  Keep looking, i bet you find a setup that works.

The WERA site is a pretty good spot to locate previously enjoyed crashed race rides.  

 

[tomek]

I've been using my Daytona - in street trim - for track days for 2 years now.  Maybe 6 track days.  I haven't binned it yet, hope not to, but I have gone off track twice and been able to keep it vertical.  (soon or later you will bin it , just a matter of time  

..need to get some track plastics. [/i]

+1 , I would also recommend aftermarket clip ons and rear sets . OEM parts are ridiculously  expensive and don`t take crashing well . Even stupid slow  speed lowside can cancel your day . Aftermarket bits usually can be made operational with some creativity . ( hammer and long enough pipe   ).    

[CMS_Sprint]

I bought the best 600 I could find at an action a few years back. Rode it on the street until I got 600 miles on it (it had 387 when it was repo'd..)
Converted into a track bike and it hasn't looked back since.
http://www.sport-touring.net/forums/index.php/topic,16137.160.html
Since those shots, its received:
Penske Shock and fork internals
Brembo Master cylinder
Race body work (Hot Bodies, don't ever buy them, spend the extra $$ and get armour bodies, trust me)
Vortex clip ons
Vortex Rear sets
Case covers
520 chain/sprocket conversion

It's been to about 15 track days (not down once, and 2 of them were in rain! Yes I have "wet" tires... )

Totally reliable, makes 110 HP at the rear wheel with ECU, headers, filter and stacks, which is PLENTY!

Having a dedicated machine means for me that I know it's done right for the track and I can just enjoy it for what it is.

Now if I could just keep work from getting in the way of track time, that would be much better....

[hovmaven]

I did run my VFR at the track when I was between race rides (note the cool track stand), but was signifcantly more worried about binning it (as it turned out, Mother Honda did that for me a few weeks later, but that's another story . . ..).  



The next race ride was this (shared with another STN'r):

[Hotbrakes]

What did Mother Honda do to your beautiful VFR?

[hovmaven]

Well, long story short, in fixing the cam chain tensioner, put it out of commission for 3 mos, Honda techs from Mother Honda couldn't fix it, I got a new Honda. . ..  

Hence, the "I survived the 2007 VFR Hostage Crisis" in my sig line.    

[The Shepherd]

I have a previously crashed CBR that I ride out on the track.

SInce I've owned it....it's been crashed another 2 times. Glad I didn't have the K1200S out on the track when I cartwheeled her into the infield.

At Calabogie Motorsports Park,