Tell me about the ST2

[SummerLove]

So I was down at Moto Italiano (semi local Aprilia, Moto Guzzi and Ducati dealership that is practically an italian racing bike museum in Santa Cruz) and I was chatting up thier sales lady (we've been there alot) while my housemate's new Norge was prepped. I mentioned that I was looking to sell the Monster and get a sports tourer or possibly trade her for an ST or Adventure bike and if it had to another Duc I was very interested in the ST4s and ST3.
For reference my baby is a 99 Monster 750 with a salvage title (minor accident) and she mentioned she'd had several clients come in looking for any classic Monster. She also mentioned one of them was looking to trade an ST2 in. So she is going to contact him and propose a straight trade. Which I think is a pretty good sounding idea (if the monster goes in CL she's going for 3500, right now she's posted on a local forum for trade.. or maybe 3000) my only real concern is I don't know much about the ST2 and I'm a little worried about getting another older Ducati.
So.. tell me what y'all know about 'em.


My baby and only means of getting around.

[Aero]

I bought mine new here in the UK in 1998 and rode it around Europe and for a while in California before selling it in 2006 after about 30,000 miles. I only sold it because I was working on the other side of the Atlantic and the garage where I had been storing it was no longer available. It was one of my favourite bikes ever. Reliable, good on fuel consumption, quite easy to service except for a couple of things (valve adjustment and throttle body synchronisation, although many people do these themselves I didn't trust my abilities and they only had to be done once during my ownership), great handling and braking and comfortable enough for a long day in the saddle. Some owners complained about the saddle or didn't like the riding position, but both were fine for me and can be changed with aftermarket items.

The ST2 might be a little down on power compared with the ST3, ST4 and ST4S models, but maintenance is easier and I never really felt the need for more power although someone used to a Hayabusa might. I am more than happy to trade off excessive power for Ducati-ness any time!

It's a pity that Ducati stopped making the ST range, I would have another if I could find a good used one.

Buy it and enjoy!  

[falconati]

Solid bike.

[atadaskew]

The best Ducati ST list.
Really nice helpful people.
Will answer all you need to know, plus they have an ST wiki:


http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/st2_owners/

[skater69]

Never ridden one....but I doubt I'm missing much.  A buddy of mine had one briefly.  In not so many words, he thought it sucked and was underpowered.  I'd be looking ST3 all the way.  Otherwise...SV650.

[Desmo Demon]

Never ridden one....but I doubt I'm missing much.  A buddy of mine had one briefly.  In not so many words, he thought it sucked and was underpowered.  I'd be looking ST3 all the way.  Otherwise...SV650.

I ride mine about 95% of the time in the mountains and I never complain about it being underpowered (with a 14/41 or 14/42 gearing). The bike also rails and handles like a dream. I have embarassed a lot of people in the mountains.

Personally, I'd rather have my ST2 than a Monster 750 any day of the week (we actually have two ST2 bikes and a Monster 900).

[Aero]

Never ridden one....but I doubt I'm missing much.  A buddy of mine had one briefly.  In not so many words, he thought it sucked and was underpowered.  I'd be looking ST3 all the way.  Otherwise...SV650.

Your secondhand opinion would be worth something if you had actually ridden one. The only thing that an SV650 has in common with an ST2 is the engine layout, and compared to an ST2 it is underpowered...

[ducsbill]

I have an ST3, not an ST2, but the ST2 was a pretty solid machine.  The '98 model had some problems with the  electrics and most people have had to move the regulator up into the nose to keep it cool.  They also had problems with the alternator stator going bad.  There are aftermarket fixes for both items.  As someone else mentioned, changing the sprockets to 15/42 or 14/42 help the acceleration.  Handling will be pretty good.  It is a Ducati.  If setup properly, it will even do well 2-up.  Be sure to inquire after the panniers and brackets.
Bill W.

[SummerLove]

Never ridden one....but I doubt I'm missing much.  A buddy of mine had one briefly.  In not so many words, he thought it sucked and was underpowered.  I'd be looking ST3 all the way.  Otherwise...SV650.

Wow.. that sure was helpful. I'll pass on the bad monster clone though.
 

I ride mine about 95% of the time in the mountains and I never complain about it being underpowered (with a 14/41 or 14/42 gearing). The bike also rails and handles like a dream. I have embarassed a lot of people in the mountains.

Personally, I'd rather have my ST2 than a Monster 750 any day of the week (we actually have two ST2 bikes and a Monster 900).

I love my monster but I'm moto only at the moment and not looking to change that. Main reason I want an ST bike of some sort is hard bags and a windscreen. The monster sucks when it starts to rain on me.. even in rain gear.

I have an ST3, not an ST2, but the ST2 was a pretty solid machine.  The '98 model had some problems with the  electrics and most people have had to move the regulator up into the nose to keep it cool.  They also had problems with the alternator stator going bad.  There are aftermarket fixes for both items.  As someone else mentioned, changing the sprockets to 15/42 or 14/42 help the acceleration.  Handling will be pretty good.  It is a Ducati.  If setup properly, it will even do well 2-up.  Be sure to inquire after the panniers and brackets.
Bill W.

I was looking hard at the ST3, ST4s, Futura and Sprint ST for the last month or so.  When Nicole mentioned someone possibly wanting to trade an ST2 for a Monster I was interested since it would meet my needs and end up being a lot cheaper and a bit less of a hassle than borrowing my housemate's VF700F or Concours until I bought something else (unless there was something bag wrong with it.. and from what I've been told this one has been dealer serviced it's whole life) I was interested for obvious reasons. It's a 1999, more details forth coming.

[Orson]

This is all good and well, but I suspect that after you ride her Guzzi, you'll be over in the Guzzi section askin' questions.

Best hold off any hasty purchases.

Remember...I'm only here to help.

[chesthing]

The m750 has a value of $2500, but you can easily chop 25% for the S title off that. I'd be a little leary of an ST2 owner willing to trade down approx $1500 in value, either he's really dumb or there's something wrong.
And yeah, saying an SV650 engine is as strong as an ST2's because their peak hp is close is kind of like comparing an FZ6 with a Bandit 1250. People that google peak hp numbers to form opinions really need to get out and ride these bikes, or at least refrain from showing their ignorance.

[tixen]

This is all good and well, but I suspect that after you ride her Guzzi, you'll be over in the Guzzi section askin' questions.

Best hold off any hasty purchases.

This is good advice.  You should listen to it.  

 

[SummerLove]

This is all good and well, but I suspect that after you ride her Guzzi, you'll be over in the Guzzi section askin' questions.

Best hold off any hasty purchases.

Remember...I'm only here to help.

Shh... I can't afford a Norge.. even if I really like it.. and I'm a little hesitant to consider the V11 sport as my only means of transportation. I'm worried I'll end up with same issues I have with the Monster. Getting very wet and no lockable luggage. I'd love to own one as a second bike though!

The m750 has a value of $2500, but you can easily chop 25% for the S title off that. I'd be a little leary of an ST2 owner willing to trade down approx $1500 in value, either he's really dumb or there's something wrong.
And yeah, saying an SV650 engine is as strong as an ST2's because their peak hp is close is kind of like comparing an FZ6 with a Bandit 1250. People that google peak hp numbers to form opinions really need to get out and ride these bikes, or at least refrain from showing their ignorance.

What whacky world do you live in that people actually pay NADA/KBB for bikes, especially Ducati's? The older monsters go for ~4.5k a pop here and I've seen several clean salvage titles go for 3.5k.  2500 is just above the what a running bike in good mechanical order goes for. I'd be crazy to sell the monster for less than 2500 out here while the ST2 goes for ~3k on average.
Sorry if I came off a little defensive. I've done a lot of a research on the local used bike market.

This is good advice.  You should listen to it.  

 

Silence temptress!
 

[chesthing]

I live in reality, it's really hard to sell a bike right now - the fact you haven't sold yours yet should tell you something about your asking price. I'm not trying to irritate you, but if this guy agrees and the bike checks out I wouldn't hesitate more than, say, 2 seconds.

[SummerLove]

I live in reality, it's really hard to sell a bike right now - the fact you haven't sold yours yet should tell you something about your asking price. I'm not trying to irritate you, but if this guy agrees and the bike checks out I wouldn't hesitate more than, say, 2 seconds.

I literally posted it up CL yesterday night.. prior to that I've had several local inquiries but I was more interested in trading it for something with fairings and windscreen than actually selling it at the time.
 

[chesthing]

Well, I won't spar with you on this - I'll simply wish you glws.  

[Orson]

Shh... I can't afford a Norge.. even if I really like it.. and I'm a little hesitant to consider the V11 sport as my only means of transportation. I'm worried I'll end up with same issues I have with the Monster. Getting very wet and no lockable luggage. I'd love to own one as a second bike though!

When a man loves a woman
Spend his very last dime
Tryin' to hold on to what he needs
He'd give up all his comfort
Sleep out in the rain
If she said that's the way it ought to be

lyrics supposedly written about a woman

truth be known...it wuz written about a Guzzi

[Desmo Demon]

The m750 has a value of $2500, but you can easily chop 25% for the S title off that. I'd be a little leary of an ST2 owner willing to trade down approx $1500 in value, either he's really dumb or there's something wrong.

The STx bikes, especially the ST2, are highly under-rated and actually have difficulty selling. I picked up my wife's '98 ST2 three years ago for $3200, and after selling off all the stuff that she didn't want (trunk, tall windshield, Corbin seat, bar risers, etc...) we only had about $2600 in it. I see ST2 bikes in the $2500-$4000 range all the time. We have a couple fairly local on Craigslist with asking prices of $3300-$3600.

I couldn't find the listing, but there was a guy selling a '98 ST2 in the Charlotte, NC area with an asking price of $2800. He had it listed for about two months and there was an '00 in blue for $2600 between Charlotte and Columbia, SC for sale for over a month.

[chesthing]

I've never seen a '99 or later ST2 for sale for less than $3500, the '98's got a bad rap due to charging issues - I've seen those for sale around $3k. I arrived at the $1500 difference because I valued the S titled '99 M750 at $2k - if Summerlove can get more than that more power to him. Like I said earlier, selling anything for decent money is a real bitch these days.

[Desmo Demon]

I've never seen a '99 or later ST2 for sale for less than $3500, the '98's got a bad rap due to charging issues - I've seen those for sale around $3k.

Must be a difference in geographical location. No one seems to be able to move an ST around here. A local dealer had a 2002 ST4s with about 12k miles that they had for sale for two years....to finally sell it for $4700 a couple of months ago.

[chesthing]

The 2002 ST4S bikes had/have lots of main engine bearing failures and flaking rockers, I wouldn't even consider one.  I agree these and the Sprints don't hold much value relative to their original sales price. These are true niche bikes - viewed as too uncomfortable for longer rides and not sporty enough compared to true sport bikes. I'd have to agree, that's why I lowered the footpegs 1", went to an LSL handlebar w/ risers, and installed an 18" Madstad windscreen w/ Robobrackets. I really have no interest in something that weighs close to 700 lbs, did that with an ST1100 for 3 years. The set up I have with my ST2 now is as close to perfect as I can get, maybe someday the manufacturers will come out with a shaft-driven 500 lb bike with hardbags and elec shield (a real shield, not a sportbike style wind deflector) but I'm not holding my breath.

[atadaskew]

The 2002 ST4S bikes had/have lots of main engine bearing failures ...

Never heard of that.  It is basically the 996 Superbike motor.  I think I would have heard main engine bearing failures in that bike too.  But have not.

[Desmo Demon]

These are true niche bikes - viewed as too uncomfortable for longer rides and not sporty enough compared to true sport bikes. I'd have to agree,

I disagree. I've done a SaddleSore 1000 on my ST2 (with lowered bars) and can rail through the curves (with knee on the deck). If anything, the ST bikes are the most practical, do-all bike that Ducati has ever manufactured....which is what kills them. Who wants a practical Ducati?  

My favorite "not sporty enough" shot of an ST bike (2002 ST4s)...



Cosmetically they don't look too sporty (especially compared to today's bikes), but with lowered bars using Helicoil adapters and SBK clip-ons, lower windshield, bags and brackets removed, and a rear seat cowl the bike looks fairly sporty...

[chesthing]

Compared to a 996 or CBR1k an ST2 isn't very sporty, and compared to an ST1300 or RT it isn't very comfortable. It's a great all arounder (I wouldn't have wasted money on it if it wasn't), but it's a compromise.
As far as the 2002 ST4S issues, they pop up pretty regularly here http://www.ducati.ms/forums/40-sport-touring/ right now there is a 20+ page thread of some poor sould who tried to replace a bad engine bearing on his ST4S, only to have the problem come back 1000 miles later. From what I gather, there was a bad batch or wrong preload set on a bunch of '02 ST4s models only, the 996's don't seem to have the issue.

[SummerLove]

Compared to a 996 or CBR1k an ST2 isn't very sporty, and compared to an ST1300 or RT it isn't very comfortable. It's a great all arounder (I wouldn't have wasted money on it if it wasn't), but it's a compromise.

This is pretty much what I'm looking for. Still waiting to here back from the ST2 owner about the trade. I don't own a car so a practical jack of all trades with fairings is what I want. Still drool over the Futura and frequently wonder of I could make the Tuono work for me... but I don't know if I'll be able to swing either of those this winter.

[atadaskew]

As far as the 2002 ST4S issues, they pop up pretty regularly here http://www.ducati.ms/forums/40-sport-touring/ right now there is a 20+ page thread of some poor sould who tried to replace a bad engine bearing on his ST4S, only to have the problem come back 1000 miles later. From what I gather, there was a bad batch or wrong preload set on a bunch of '02 ST4s models only, the 996's don't seem to have the issue.

So, one guy had a bad bearing?  And 20 pages were written about it?
(I do not have time to read 20 pages..)

[st2sam]

Great bikes, here is a picture of my 2000 ST2, back in the day. (winter2002?)

It was my first Ducati, over 20,000 trouble free miles.  

Then I bought a 2005 ST3, that to this day I regret selling. It was a ST2 evolution (what Ducati does) and a much improved bike in every way.

The ST2 is a great bike and if that's all you can afford, go for it. "BUT" IMHO - save a few more pennies and get yourself a ST3, you won't be sorry.
If Ducati built a ST bike that looked like the ST3's with the New Multistrada 1200 11* motor and SS swing arm, thats what I would be riding!

[chesthing]

So, one guy had a bad bearing?  And 20 pages were written about it?
(I do not have time to read 20 pages..)

If you aren't willing to do any reading your education of the problem won't happen - sorry.

[Aero]

I have an ST3, not an ST2, but the ST2 was a pretty solid machine.  The '98 model had some problems with the  electrics and most people have had to move the regulator up into the nose to keep it cool.  They also had problems with the alternator stator going bad.  There are aftermarket fixes for both items.  As someone else mentioned, changing the sprockets to 15/42 or 14/42 help the acceleration.  Handling will be pretty good.  It is a Ducati.  If setup properly, it will even do well 2-up.

I should mention that I thought that the charging system on my '98 model was playing up when the red charging light on the dash came on and stayed on, but when I asked my independent Ducati guy about it he suggested checking the charging with a meter. Lo and behold, there was a healthy 14.5 volts at 4000 rpm despite the light being on. What apparently failed is a diode in the voltage regulator which controls only the charging light, the charge stayed healthy and I ran the bike that way for several years until I sold it. Apparently the diode is what usually fails, not the charging circuit itself. I wonder how many voltage regulators were replaced unnecessarily?

I never had a problem with my stator but I think the recall took care of most of the bad ones.

[SummerLove]

Great bikes, here is a picture of my 2000 ST2, back in the day. (winter2002?)

It was my first Ducati, over 20,000 trouble free miles.  

Then I bought a 2005 ST3, that to this day I regret selling. It was a ST2 evolution (what Ducati does) and a much improved bike in every way.

The ST2 is a great bike and if that's all you can afford, go for it. "BUT" IMHO - save a few more pennies and get yourself a ST3, you won't be sorry.
If Ducati built a ST bike that looked like the ST3's with the New Multistrada 1200 11* motor and SS swing arm, thats what I would be riding!

Nice looking bikes! If I end up selling the Monster instead of trading it I'll definitely be keeping eye out for a good deal on an ST3 or ST4s along with the Futura. Originally I was out for a Futura, ST, Sprint ST or VFR800 but after throwing a leg over a Sprint GT I'm not so sure about the Sprint... (It felt huuuuge) I liked the triple a whole lot. I may eventually get a street triple to sate my desire for one. The ergos on the ST4s work well for me and I've liked every Italian bike I've ridden so far.. I think I might have a small problem their.
We'll see how things go when I get a chance to meet the guy with the ST2 that wants a Monster (scheduling conflicts so far). The one advantage the ST2 has over the ST3/4 along with the Futura and Tuono is that the nagging little voice in the back of my head doesn't think 80hp will get me in trouble.  
After riding Tixen's Norge I'm less concerned with that though I did power wheelie it for almost block when first go on it because of how light the throttle felt compared to my bike. That didn't happen unintentionally again after I got a better feel for the bike. The Guzzi is quite nice and I can see what people love about them. I may own one.. eventually. I don't want to hop on a 600lb beast as my only ride just yet! I've only been riding for 6 months.. granted it's 6 months everyday in all conditions but still only 6 months.
Whoops.. I was babbling.

I should mention that I thought that the charging system on my '98 model was playing up when the red charging light on the dash came on and stayed on, but when I asked my independent Ducati guy about it he suggested checking the charging with a meter. Lo and behold, there was a healthy 14.5 volts at 4000 rpm despite the light being on. What apparently failed is a diode in the voltage regulator which controls only the charging light, the charge stayed healthy and I ran the bike that way for several years until I sold it. Apparently the diode is what usually fails, not the charging circuit itself. I wonder how many voltage regulators were replaced unnecessarily?

I never had a problem with my stator but I think the recall took care of most of the bad ones.

That is interesting and something I'll keep in mind! I'm a little sad they neutered the ST2 and 4 in 01.

[atadaskew]

If you aren't willing to do any reading your education of the problem won't happen - sorry.

No.

I am an active member of the main Ducati St group, and this has never come up.
So your one story of one person is not worth 20 pages to me.

[falconati]

I've owned both the ST3 and Futura. They're both great, and it would be tough to pick a winner.

[Orson]

Ducatis are ok for around town...

but 3 out of 4 experts advise against riding farther than the city limits without a shaft drive.

[chesthing]

No.

I am an active member of the main Ducati St group, and this has never come up.
So your one story of one person is not worth 20 pages to me.

What is "the main Ducati ST group"? the forum I posted is a very active ST forum, and this issue with '02 ST4S models comes up regularly, that 24 page thread is just one example. If you were to take the time to read the first couple pages, the discussion focuses on the frequency of complaints and narrowing down that the whining noise the original poster complains about is indeed another case of a bad main engine bearing. Flaking rocker arms on 996 engines are another recurring problem (if you haven't heard of that your Ducati forum must be a graveyard), and has been cited as a possible cause of some bearing failures (not caught in time the flaking chrome gets into the bearings). I'm not suggesting all '02 ST4S bikes will suffer bearing failures, but I've read enough that I wouldn't take a chance on one.
If you are interested in learning more you will have to exert a bit of effort from here, I'm done holding your hand.  

[SummerLove]

Ducatis are ok for around town...

but 3 out of 4 experts advise against riding farther than the city limits without a shaft drive.

I know! Wouldn't want to end up like this guy...

 

[atadaskew]

I know! Wouldn't want to end up like this guy...

 

As long as it didn't catch on fire, you're ok.

[tixen]

As long as it didn't catch on fire, you're ok.

So splitting in two is okay, then?

[tixen]

Great bikes, here is a picture of my 2000 ST2, back in the day. (winter2002?)

Did you build a house around your ST2?  

[atadaskew]

So splitting in two is okay, then?

Yes, you can fix that with popsicle sticks and duct tape.

[maddjack]

 I had a 2000 I loved it, a few minor niggles, but I wish I still had her