Advice Solicited: Heated Gear

[falconati]

Hi friends,

I'm looking to potentially get some heated gear.  I currently have nothing, so anything is an improvement  

I will be purchasing a jacket, pants, and gloves and want to make sure whatever I buy will all link together nicely.  I'm currently looking at the Tour Master Synergy 2.0 series  (on motorcyclegear.com) - is this a good bet?  Are there other brands that are better, or that I should consider?

All experience and advice would be helpful, this is simply an area where I'm not knowledgeable.

Thanks for any help you guys can provide!

[ST for me!]

Gerbings

[ConPilot1]

Gerbings dude.

Lifetime replacement warranty. Works awesome.

Will cook you on "high". About 1/2 power will be as warm as you'll need for 30° weather.

Best cash I've ever spent.  

[mugwump58]

Gerbings, yup. No hassle replacement if they fail. Only happened once about 5 years ago.

Don't get carried away with too much gear till you know what your bike will support. I can use my stuff on the 250 even, but only so much. Check before you get yourself stuck somewhere.

Take a peek at the "bib" offered by Aerostich. A low watt alternative that may work for you.

[atadaskew]

I had the Tourmaster Synergy gear.
3 sets of it.
Why 3 sets you ask? Because it literally failed w/in minutes of using it.
So it was sent back and replaced - no questions asked - twice by Tourmaster. So at least their customer service is A+. Shame the product is an F.

The last set I gave away for free, as I had completely lost confidence in the product. Spend the extra coin and get something that lasts.
I hear Gerbings is good, plus now there are some decent battery operated vests which is nice as no wiring to get caught up in, and you can wear them off the bike doing other stuff.

[Max Wedge]

I started with the Tourmaster stuff because of the low current drain and cost (first generation) and it all still works, even the original controller. I moved into Warm and Safe stuff, and have been quite happy with it. I made the switch gradually,  as you can get a adapter for the Warm and Safe controller to the Tourmaster stuff.

[Ghost]

Gerbings all the way, I have jacket liner, gloves, and heates insoles for my boots.  Now the limiting factor is the road conditions not the temp.

[ConPilot1]

Falconati you're probably aware of this link by now but if not, this is Gerbing's clearance site where you can get the stuff discounted pretty good.
Definitely cheaper than going to a stealer and plunking down more cash than you need to.

Also, spend the couple extra bucks and get the dial-in variable controller. Well worth it vs. an ON-OFF switch.

http://www.google.com/url?q=http://heatedclothingoutlet.com/&sa=U&ei=-pqwTovCIMj40gGEx_jBAQ&ved=0CBEQFjAA&usg=AFQjCNFTViYePIE2EypSNLuPytHGuoTFPw

[Explorer]

 Don't even bother with the others. Get the Gerbings and be done with it.

[Kyle401]

I'm a big fan of my Gerbings microwire gloves.  

The Heated 'Stich Darien jacket is ok.  I think it is lower wattage than the Gerbings jacket and it feels like it could use a little more.

[falconati]

Awesome, thanks gang!  I really appreciate the input.  It sounds like Gerbings is the ticket (I believe in quality over price, so long as I can afford it).

Should I get jacket liners, or a jacket?  Pant liners, or pants?  I guess I'm a bit confused.  Do jacket liners go inside the jacket I already have, or do they go inside a Gerbings jacket?

[ConPilot1]

Jacket liner and gloves and controller. That's all you'll need. Pants is overkill, IMO. I've never had problems with my legs getting cold.
Might be overkill for your alternator.

Pay close attention to the fitting. Gerbing's has their own and very odd sizing charts/system.

The jacket liner and gloves are compact enough to stow in your sidecases year-round if you need them.

Go for the liners, you can wear them under your favorite bike jacket.


The newer Microwire jacket liner is actually quite nice. I have the old style utilitarian nylon jacket liner.
new style liners have a nice fleece collar and a much nicer cord stowage in the sleeves for stashing the wires when you don't need them.

[cbsnbiker]

Start with the jacket liner.

You may find the other items superfluous, unless you're planning on doing hard core cold weather riding.

Also, how big are your bikes' alternators? Most modern bikes can handle the added current of a jacket, but not all can handle the jacket, pants, and gloves, as well as any additional items on your bike (e.g. aux lights).

[Playinthestreet]

Another vote for Gerbings.

[stromgal]

Gerbings, and I'll second skipping the heated pants liners.  With the jacket liner keeping your core warm, you can get by with thermals under your leather pants. If you want to ride in real cold, the heated gloves are a necessity.  I've got heated socks, too, but only use them if I'm going to be riding many hours in sub-30-degree weather.

As others mentioned, pay close attention to Gerbings sizing... read their info and use a tape measure on your chest. You want the liner to fit close to you.

[D-Mac]

Gerbings. Start with the microwire jacket liner and you'll be AMAZED at how easy it is to ride in the 30s, and how much more comfortable you'll be in cooler evenings in the summer. You wear a light layer underneath and your regular jacket on top.

I also agree that you don't need the pants.

[1KPerDay]

+1 to Gerbings

First priority: Jacket liner.

Next: Gloves

Lesser/later: toes.

I have the old style heated socks and have only used them once on a trip. Too much trouble to hook up otherwise. The gloves make a huge difference in below freezing temps, even if you have heated grips.

The jacket liner is by far the best money I've spent on anything moto-gear related.

[jesse v]

i have the Tourmaster Synergy jacket liner, and it has been reliable for 2 years on 2 different bikes, not to mention PLENTY warm.  However, in hindsight, I think the Gerbings w/ its lifetime warranty would be the best decision.

[Spanky]

I have the gerbings jacket liner, T5 gloves, heated insoles, and the ex outer pants. I got the outer pants because I read about the pant liners having hot spots that made them uncomfortable, and the ex pants go over your jeans so if you are going inside, they are easily removed so you don't overheat. I agree that the pants are the least needed of the group, but they are nice to have. The heated socks would be another option if you don't want the heated insoles. I could not be happier with the heated gear. I can ride all day in freezing temps and be nice and warm. Like others have mentioned, check how many amps you have to work with on your bike. The gerbings website will tell you how many amps/watts each piece of gear takes so you don't overload your alternator. I suggest the dual controller also. The variable control is much better than on or off. Full on will be too hot in almost every situation, and the last thing you want to do in cold weather is sweat.

[DNA]

Jacket liner and gloves and controller. That's all you'll need. Pants is overkill, IMO. I've never had problems with my legs getting cold.
Might be overkill for your alternator.

Pay close attention to the fitting. Gerbing's has their own and very odd sizing charts/system.

The jacket liner and gloves are compact enough to stow in your sidecases year-round if you need them.

Go for the liners, you can wear them under your favorite bike jacket.


The newer Microwire jacket liner is actually quite nice. I have the old style utilitarian nylon jacket liner.
new style liners have a nice fleece collar and a much nicer cord stowage in the sleeves for stashing the wires when you don't need them.

This - Gerbings owns the LRD crowd for a reason.

[Justin]

+1 on Gerbings - current jacket/gloves are still going strong after 6 years. The new microwire stuff is even better. Only thing that has ever gone bad is one side on a mutual-channel controller.

I have the old style heated socks and have only used them once on a trip. Too much trouble to hook up otherwise. The gloves make a huge difference in below freezing temps, even if you have heated grips.

I have the old style socks as well, and concur, they are a pain. I don't have the pants liners, so need to run a long connecter wire. I have only used them a handful of times.

[Mastros2]

I have a pair of Gerbings gloves and love them.  Like others said, 1/3-1/2 heat and you are nice and toasty.  

[stk0308]

I've been very happy with my Tourmaster Synergy jacket.  The first controller failed, but the free replacement has been working just fine these past 2-3 years.  I hardly ever use more than low temp setting.

[cognosticator]

Gerbing sucks in my opinion, I went through 2 jackets and not happy with them.

I am completely happy with my Warm n Safe jacket and gloves and wireless t'stat and I saved 20% off their prices

[Cablebandit]

Warm and Safe here.  Why bother with a 77watt Gerbing when you can have a 90 watt flamethrower from Warm and Safe.  Also if you ever have any issue call Mike (the Owner) and he takes care of you.  Might as well go with the guy that invented the Heat-troller and coax connections for heated gear instead of the company that just copied it all.

[cougar8000]

Have you looked at Powerlet? They have a lifetime warranty as well. What sets them aside they are not using wires to heat the jacket rather FAR infrared technology.

[Cablebandit]

I believe Powerlet heated gear is just Warm and Safe stuff with a different label.

[Papa Lazarou]

Another Gerbings fan here.

[bomber]

ALso a Gerbings fan -- my jacket liner (first suggested buy) is over 10 years old, and works like a champ.

Next would be gloves, or perhaps glove liners (I got gloves, as I thought the liners may be too fiddly) . . .

I use a switch, rather than the controller -- this, after noting the a large number of "my heated gear isn't heating, what should I do" threads ending with a controller goen south. I could not fixe a controller to save my soul (if I have one), but I can kimchee rig a switch with a paper clip and some bubble gum.

[cougar8000]

I believe Powerlet heated gear is just Warm and Safe stuff with a different label.

Not sure where you got that, but it is not correct. Do not look alike. Different technology.

Powerlet allows those with a weak charging system to still have 100% of the heat, but while using less power. Dual Heat 105 / 60 Watt convertibility by a simple cable disconnect.

[Cablebandit]

I got it from the fact that W&S used to make Powerlet and Firstgear heated gear.  It appears now powerlet is making some of their stuff in-house now.

[cougar8000]

I got it from the fact that W&S used to make Powerlet and Firstgear heated gear.  It appears now powerlet is making some of their stuff in-house now.

Correct. I was just typing in further explanation

I need to clarify what I said earlier.

Powerlet used the same factory and were working side by side with Warm and Safe owner a while back. At least 2 yrs ago they have went their own route as evident by the use of FAR Infrared technology. They utilize different factory. Controllers base is still what Warm and Safe designed but with modification and a Lifetime warranty. So, if your controller goes boom, you get it fixed or a new controller.

Not official yet, but next year for 2012 lineup expect to see heated pants and socks.

[bomber]

Powerlet allows those with a weak charging system to still have 100% of the heat, but while using less power. Dual Heat 105 / 60 Watt convertibility by a simple cable disconnect.

Wow! Powerlet has found a way to alter the laws of physics!

Very cool ;-}

[dm_gsxr]

Gerbings here as well. I'd have to go with getting the gloves first though. Cold hands are worse than anything else. I can throw on a sweatshirt under my Joe Rocket Alter Ego jacket and be nice and toasty all the way to work but if your hands are too cold to operate the levers and gas on the bike, you're done.

I have heated grips and heated gloves. I've had the gloves replaced for free twice and the jacket once. Last year I didn't need the jacket at all so I'll be sending it off as the sleeve plugs have failed.

Carl

[Reddog*]

Warm and Safe here.  Why bother with a 77watt Gerbing when you can have a 90 watt flamethrower from Warm and Safe.  Also if you ever have any issue call Mike (the Owner) and he takes care of you.  Might as well go with the guy that invented the Heat-troller and coax connections for heated gear instead of the company that just copied it all.

Same here Warm &Safe  with the remote heattroller. Pays to get both the pants and jacket liners.
First gear liners are made by W&S also.
Email Rose and see what she has. rose@warmnsafe.com
I went with a Gen4 jacket and Gen3 pants. They are both instant heat. I have not been able to run above 50% on the heat troller yet, it's just to much heat.

[Cablebandit]

Does the Gen 4 stuff use a panel for heat, or does it have the wires running back and forth?

[cougar8000]

Wow! Powerlet has found a way to alter the laws of physics!

Very cool ;-}

it is great isn't it

I will have a full detailed answer for your shortly on this

[1KPerDay]

23f on my 40 mile commute this morning... thanks to gerbings it was positively pleasant.  

[Reddog*]

Does the Gen 4 stuff use a panel for heat, or does it have the wires running back and forth?

My understanding is a carbon heat panel.

[cbsnbiker]

Gerbings here as well. I'd have to go with getting the gloves first though. Cold hands are worse than anything else. I can throw on a sweatshirt under my Joe Rocket Alter Ego jacket and be nice and toasty all the way to work but if your hands are too cold to operate the levers and gas on the bike, you're done.

I have heated grips and heated gloves. I've had the gloves replaced for free twice and the jacket once. Last year I didn't need the jacket at all so I'll be sending it off as the sleeve plugs have failed.

Carl

I disagree about the priority of choosing heated gloves vs. jacket.

Cold hands, in general, is an indication that your core temperature is dropping. Wearing warm gloves may make the hands feel better, but it is not addressing the primary issue: the dropping core temperature, which could lead to hypothermia.

The jacket (and, if needed, the pants) will address the main issue, by helping to keep your core temperature up.

Unless you have a circulatory disorder, e.g. Raynaud's phenomenon, or unless you're riding in *really* cold temperatures (or are using summer gloves), cold hands are the symptom, not the major problem.

It's nice to have comfy hands, of course, so I'm not arguing against buying heated gloves.

As I mentioned earlier, I have a Gerbings jacket. I've had it since the '90s. It works well.

Maybe I'll buy gloves at some point. Two of my bikes have heated grips (and the third one has the lowest capacity alternator), so it's been less of a priority of mine.

[Mr. Whippy]

I was a dyed in the wool Widder fan for years.  They are now gone and I switched to Gerbings when one of my gloves went cold.  I ordered directly from Gerbings, which was a mistake.

However, After 1 full season with them and starting into the second, I'm really impressed with them.  Never had a problem with them. (I can't say the same for my Widders which used to need a bit of work every fall).

Yay Gerbings.

[ConPilot1]

Well here's my scenario for the past two nights. I leave work in the dark, last night there was frost on my seat. For two nights now, I thought I'd just wear the jacket liner,
and tough it out with my leather gloves and knit glove liners. Toasty warm on my torso, neck, and arms. Fingers, starting to go uncomfortably cold.

4 miles down the road I'm pulling over and getting my Gerbings Classic gloves out. Ahh much better. Dumbass me should have just put them on in the first place.

So anyway IMO the moral of the story is get the liners, and the gloves, and the controller at the same time, be done with it, have versatile modular warmth on demand.
Falconati, from what I've seen you probably dump 20K in bikes over a course of two years. The Gerbings setup is money very, very well spent.

[Mr. Whippy]

For me, riding as low as 13F for a 45 minute commute to work (upto 60 mph )  Gerbings full jacket liner and gloves.

Add Turtle fur balaclava, neck gaiter and wool socks and I'm good to go.

[ConPilot1]

For me, riding as low as 13F for a 45 minute commute to work (upto 60 mph )  Gerbings full jacket liner and gloves.

Add Turtle fur balaclava, neck gaiter and wool socks and I'm good to go.

18 was the best I've ever been in. That was cold enough for this cat, thank you.  

25 is easy-peasy. 35 is enjoyable!

One further IMO noter about the Tourmaster. I looked at them a couple years ago, and the damn heat controller unit was attached and hanging in front of the jacket liner like a SCSI dongle.
I was like "where the hell are you going to put that comfortably and how the hell are you going to get to it?" I don't know if they are different now, but the controller setup looked like
a really bad design to me.

[bomber]

Whip -- why was ordering direct from Gerbings a mistake? Full list vs discounted elsewhere?

[Rincewind]

My Widder vest is eating fuses, so this is a good thread for me too.   Luckily I have a backup Widder for now.

Warm and Safe vs Gerbings liners - they are both the same price $199.95 w/o controls - imagine that!  

I may just get another vest to reduce arm bulk.  A vest and heated grips has been good enough for me for the past few years.  

[ConPilot1]

You can get a Gerbings liner for $99 bucks on the outlet web store.

[Rincewind]

You can get a Gerbings liner for $99 bucks on the outlet web store.

Thanks, I assume you mean http://heatedclothingoutlet.com .  It says they are non-current (no pun intended) models and without any warranty.

[Mr. Whippy]

Whip -- why was ordering direct from Gerbings a mistake? Full list vs discounted elsewhere?

Gerbing had to fulfill orders to their retailers first, so my order was delayed 6+ weeks before it shipped.  If I had paid (minimally) more from an online retailer, I'd have received them within a week.  That's a lot of cold weather riding.

[cougar8000]

Just spoke with my rep at Powerlet regarding 60 vs 105 watt usage. He said that with 60 portion of the panels are completely off, but the way those panels are laid out you are not getting any cold spots.

He rides speed triple and uses it at 60 watt and said he rode in it in 33 and was still using it only 3/4 turn.

I hope it helps.

[ConPilot1]

Thanks, I assume you mean http://heatedclothingoutlet.com .  It says they are non-current (no pun intended) models and without any warranty.

I didn't know that, didn't check the site carefully, was just going by best price available.
If that's the case, then I'm glad I spent the $300 from a retailer, because I know I have the full replacement warranty.  

Still not bad IMO, 300 for liner, gloves and controller. A bit pricey, but one hell of a a farkle that's not just good, but mandatory if you ask me.
Extending my riding season for another 2 months or even indefinitely if the roads are dry is well, well worth it to me.

[Mrs. DantesDame]

Late to the party ....

One more vote for Gerbings here.

Here's my priority list:
- Gerbings jacket
- Gerbings troller (trust me, it is well worth the money to have the variable heat option   )
- heated grips


I have both heated grips and heated gloves, but I find that the grips are often warm enough. It probably doesn't help my my heated gloves are older and bulky and probably not even the right size, so I don't always like to wear them unless I know that I'll be riding for a long time at low temps.

I also have Gerbings heated insoles, but have yet to go on a ride that warranted using them, so I can't say how well they work. But my toes often get cold, so I felt that it was a worthy investment.

[Max Wedge]

I wouldn't necessarily rule out pants as not needed. Depends on the bike, and wind protection. I bought the Synergy chaps, and plug them into the Warm and Jafe jacket for commting, as the chaps are easier to take off at work. The WnS socks plug into them, but I only use the socks when it is 20's and I will be out for a few hours. Despite the cylinders being at my ankles, the GS does let your toes get cold. The length of exposure is as important as the temp.

I originally bought the heated chaps so I would have an extra controller in case my original failed, but it is a different controller.   Which is why I bought the Heat-Troller from WnS. So far nothing has failed. The glove liners were a Christmas gift, so I can use the gloves I like.

[MuddDawg]

This is my set up and it works great

Gerbings Jacket liner - had some warranty work for wiring.  They fixed and I have no complaints
Gerbings Dual Controller - Replaced under warranty, but dont recall why, but works awesome and recommend over on/off switch
W&S Gloves - replaced 1st gen of ultimate rider gloves under warranty, but had excellent service and no complaints.

I also run Dual-Star heated grips when its really cold out or get caught without heated gear.

[J-Mac]

I have the Gerbings jacket and pant liners, and love them. With my heated grips, I no longer use my heated gloves.

They are Firstgear, and worked well for me. I think they're XXL, and I'll sell them for $50 to the first taker. They have the same plugs as the Gerbings.
Only used one season a few times.

[mack82097]

I use the new Powerlet jacket and gloves with the wireless dual controller. They warm up almost instantly and make early morning rides to work a pleasure. My recommendation is to get the jacket and gloves. Never had an issue with cold legs.

[expatbrit]

Just to be different, I use the EXO2 vest; I wish they made a full liner. It has it's disadvantages, but it's super-low power draw made it attractive when I was riding the 950SM. It'll probably even work on the WR250, but I haven't tried that yet.

 So far I've coped without heated gloves, and just with heated grips, handguards, and good gloves.

GF has Gerbings and loves them! Definitely get the dual 'troller; she had some near burns on her hands when trying to use the gloves without it they generated so much heat.

[falconati]

Thanks so much for the input, everyone.  I really appreciate it!

I know what I'm going to get, I just have to get it (and pray that I don't fuck up my electronics).  I don't really have any sort of wrenching skills, but the setup seems easy enough (famous last words?)

[Mr. Whippy]

Thanks so much for the input, everyone.  I really appreciate it!

I know what I'm going to get, I just have to get it (and pray that I don't fuck up my electronics).  I don't really have any sort of wrenching skills, but the setup seems easy enough (famous last words?)

There's no need to splice into your wiring at all.  Just bolt the positive lead to the positive battery terminal and the negative to the negative terminal.  It won't be switched power (ie it will still be hot when the key is off) but the flipside is you can use the same hookup to charge the battery.

[Mrs. DantesDame]

I know what I'm going to get, I just have to get it (and pray that I don't fuck up my electronics).  I don't really have any sort of wrenching skills, but the setup seems easy enough (famous last words?)

I used to hold a fall Tech Day every year, as many of the people I knew had changed out bikes that year and wanted to install heated grips/SAE plugs on their bikes in anticipation of colder days.  Maybe have yourself a "Garage Party" and collaborate ideas/techniques

[CanadianBird]

Gerbing here. Jacket liner only with  controller. Gerbing leads can't be used for your batter tender, according to them. I rode today at 40F but I get worried about black ice so my riding season is almost over here in the Pacific NorthWest.

[Mr.Black]

I have a related question.

I recently saw a members one piece Olympia Riding Suit.

Is there a spot for the connector to pass through something like this?


A side comment,

The Oxford heated grips from Twisted are in their second year and work well down to 45ish. After that my finger tips begin to suffer.

[Mr. Whippy]

The Oxford heated grips from Twisted are in their second year and work well down to 45ish. After that my finger tips begin to suffer.

IME, heated grips are only good to about 40F.  Below that the windblast on the tops of my fingers is overcomes any heating from the grips.  That's the break point where I switch to electric gloves.  

When it's below 30, I use both electric gloves and heated grips.

[three west]

hmm, nobody with any Kanetsu gear?

[Frankienuckles]

Yep, I got the Kanetsu vest with zip off sleeves. It's my first item of heated clothing and I love it! Just an on/off switch, but that works for me.

[Justin]

I have a related question.

I recently saw a members one piece Olympia Riding Suit.

Is there a spot for the connector to pass through something like this?

Unless they changed the design recently to include it, there is not.

[Mr.Black]

Unless they changed the design recently to include it, there is not.

tx

[cognosticator]

I have a related question.

I recently saw a members one piece Olympia Riding Suit.

Is there a spot for the connector to pass through something like this?

I had an Olympia one piece and cut a hole in the liner for the cord to pass through.  You could not tell it and it didn't have an effect on the suit.

[Indefatigable]

What ever brand you go with just make sure it's a snug fit.  Heated gear works best with a snug fit.  I have a jacket liner that no longer fits snug because I lost 35 lbs so I will need a replacement .  

[Cablebandit]

Good advice.  If I'm going to be out all day when it's really cold, say never above 20°, then here's my setup.  I put on a thin base layer, followed by the heated jacket.  I'll them throw a long sleeve compression shirt over that.  The compression shirt keeps the heated layer right next to the skin.  Having a heatroller is essential because you can burn yourself even down to single digits with this setup.

Above 20° that setup is too hot though.

[Indefatigable]

Good advice.  If I'm going to be out all day when it's really cold, say never above 20°, then here's my setup.  I put on a thin base layer, followed by the heated jacket.  I'll them throw a long sleeve compression shirt over that.  The compression shirt keeps the heated layer right next to the skin.  Having a heatroller is essential because you can burn yourself even down to single digits with this setup.

Above 20° that setup is too hot though.

Maybe I'll try your compression shirt first before I buy a new liner.  Thanks.  

[Dan K]

What about battery powered gear?

[cougar8000]

What about battery powered gear?

You have to have that battery somewhere on your body. Don't know about you, I know I would not be comfy with that.

Had a friend that had a cell phone in his pocket while skiing. Fell down, broke few ribs with it. Very few times you catch me with my cell phone in my pocket now days on the bike.

[Justin]

Maybe I'll try your compression shirt first before I buy a new liner.  Thanks.  

It helps a lot, that's what I have to do as well, now that I am down to a svelte 230.

[Bain Dramage]

I own Gerbing's (the older model) jacket liner and pants. Even when riding when the pre-dawn temp is in the 20's, I have never had to wire up the pants - I used them as an insulator only. (I should also note that I also have heated grips, and have never used heated gloves).

The Gerbing's jackets can really cook. The temp-controller is a MUST to vary the heat.

That said, if I were starting out and buying today I would buy Warm & Safe Heated Gear because the W & S uses an elastic panel to hold the heated clothing snugly to your body. This snug fit is critical for heat application and distribution (it eliminates having any "hot spots" and "cold spots"), it allows you to stay warm using less power, and - by using lighter material - you can wear the gear over a broader range of temperatures.

This last feature - wearing the gear over a broader range of temperatures -  is important on long rides. Say you depart at 5 am, and it's 30 outside. You put on your liner and turn it on. As the day dawns (and the sun helps warm you), you turn your heat down. By the time the day reaches around 50 you have your heat off completely - but you can still be comfortably wearing a lightweight liner (but not a thick, heavy liner). The opposite is true as you ride into the evening, just reversing the order.

I ride in areas where, over the course of 12 hours, I can be in temperatures from 63 (valley) down to 23 or less (mountains). Stopping to take off and put on heated gear is a pain.

You can't go wrong buying either Gerbing's or Warm and Safe (I would not consider other brands because, as the saying goes, you get what you pay for), but if it were me, I would buy the Warm and Safe.

[Bain Dramage]

One last note - if you already have heated grips, buy the jacket liner only. If you do not have heated grips, buy the jacket liner and gloves (or glove liner).

Don't buy the pants until you have been out in "extreme cold" to see if you need them. It may save you some $$.

[three west]

snip

That said, if I were starting out and buying today I would buy Warm & Safe Heated Gear because the W & S uses an elastic panel to hold the heated clothing snugly to your body. This snug fit is critical for heat application and distribution (it eliminates having any "hot spots" and "cold spots"), it allows you to stay warm using less power, and - by using lighter material - you can wear the gear over a broader range of temperatures.

You can't go wrong buying either Gerbing's or Warm and Safe (I would not consider other brands because, as the saying goes, you get what you pay for), but if it were me, I would buy the Warm and Safe.

so do you have any thoughts on the kanetsu with the air bladder to force the liner close to your body?

http://www.aerostich.com/aerostich-suits/kanetsu-electrics/aerostich-kanetsu-airvantage-electric-liner.html

[cougar8000]

Do not forget Powerlet liners. They utilize ProForm stretch panels, and unlike others they utilize newer technology Far Infrared technology to provide fast, deep, soothing warmth. And I think another big point is they provide lifetime warranty.

As others have said already. Heated Pants is most likely one of the least things that you need to worry about it. I have been riding in low 30th and never found my legs or feet too cold to a point where I had to stop and I am using perforated SIDI Vertigo boots

[Bain Dramage]

so do you have any thoughts on the kanetsu with the air bladder to force the liner close to your body?

Looks like a great idea, but it seems pricey. 'Stitch makes great gear, though.

[three west]

Looks like a great idea, but it seems pricey. 'Stitch makes great gear, though.

indeed, I was thinking the Gerbings is $300 with the controller everybody agrees that you need, I foolishly assumed for $327 you'd get a controller with the kanetsu, unfortunatly it looks like that's another $70 making for $397 for the jacket alone.

[cbsnbiker]

FWIW, I don't use a controller with my '90s-vintage Gerbings. A controller would be nice, but I find using the on-off switch works just fine.

[Papa Lazarou]

same here.

[mugwump58]

I use the Gerbings controller. One reason is I use the gear on 3 bikes of varying output. I've made a scale on the controller so I don't overdue what that particular bike can put out. The other reason is I find it a convenience

[dan88z]

I don't have any heated gear, but my wife has the Gerbing gloves and jacket liner, and she loves it. She had a problem with one of her gloves and they are replacing it no questions asked. She bought it from their clearance store too, so there is warranty on some of that stuff. She has the dual controller so she can set separate levels on the gloves and jacket.

[the drummer]

Gerbing all the way! The Micro-wire jacket liner is the ticket!!  Get the controller and pouch,NO REGRETS!!!  
    Michigan......Got to have one!!

[mugwump58]

Just as soon as my "old" Gerbings stuff stops working  

[cbsnbiker]

Just as soon as my "old" Gerbings stuff stops working  

If my "old" ('90s era) Gerbings stops working, I'll just send it in for repairs.

[mugwump58]

Understood, I've done the same a couple times. So let me ask you this...Will they upgrade the old stuff to the micro-wire under warranty?

[cbsnbiker]

Understood, I've done the same a couple times. So let me ask you this...Will they upgrade the old stuff to the micro-wire under warranty?

I have no idea.

[ConPilot1]

I have no idea.

I do believe they will. Don't hold me to that but I've heard of a standard old type liner getting replaced with Microwire for somebody.

[Poustman]

My Gerbings heated jacket is utterly fantastic.  I only have the off/on capability, but the zipper on my rain gear/leathers serves if I'm too hot.  I have no concern about being too cold, as my face would freeze in my closed full face helmet (visor closed) long before my Gerbings jacket would be insufficiently cozy.  It is amazing.

[Justin]

Understood, I've done the same a couple times. So let me ask you this...Will they upgrade the old stuff to the micro-wire under warranty?

Yes. I know one of one person that went into the store to get an old one fixed, and the gave him the new micro-wire model instead of fixing the old. When he asked how much he owed them, they said  "what part of lifetime warranty didn't you understand?".  Just one of many great Gerbings customer support stories I've heard.