Ford Gives Up On Compact Pick Up Trucks - Nissan Stays

[JReazor]

Oh, I dunno about that..
From http://www.autoblog.com  2012/01/08/
"2011 that saw VW brand sales in the U.S. go up over 26 percent and TDI (diesel) sales jump 33 percent"

It'd sure be interesting if VW brought the Amarok to the US

I wonder what percentage of VW's 320,000 sales was made up of diesels and how many of those sales were due to factory incentives and dealers playing with thier commission. My brother bought a Jetta TDI at a pretty deep discount a couple months ago. That's not a great long term strategy for the manufacturer. Those numbers don't mean much with out a whole lot more info.

I would love to see a diesel Amorok in the states but I doubt it'll happen any time soon.

[Hardware]

Regarding real-world mileage on the Jetta, I crunched the numbers and bought the 5-pot 2.5.  Yes, it's a dog of an engine.

However, VW is known for crap electronics, which doesn't speak for reliability; all of the tdi's come with every freaking option possible. Yes, I'm sure a base model tdi exists, but my dealers were unable to find one.

In addition to the tdi premium of a few grand, the mandatory 'options' pushed the price up to almost another 10k. It became a choice between owning a car f/c or financing, so I went with a base model.

Still hate the engine. But I like the rest of the car.

 

I like VWs in general but whenever we've been considering a new vehicle, we shy away due to the electrical/electronic issues they're now known for.

Friends had two new-to-them VWs - he had a Toureg and she had a GTI.  Great vehicles, solid motors and overall good reliability but both had numerous electrical problems.  Nothing that ever left them stranded but feck, it convinced me that if I ever did get a People's Car, it would have minimal electrical doodads.

[CLAY]

Regarding real-world mileage on the Jetta, I crunched the numbers and bought the 5-pot 2.5.  Yes, it's a dog of an engine.

However, VW is known for crap electronics, which doesn't speak for reliability; all of the tdi's come with every freaking option possible. Yes, I'm sure a base model tdi exists, but my dealers were unable to find one.

In addition to the tdi premium of a few grand, the mandatory 'options' pushed the price up to almost another 10k. It became a choice between owning a car f/c or financing, so I went with a base model.

Still hate the engine. But I like the rest of the car.

Good to know.  Thanks man!    What kind of gas mileage do you get?

[sodapop6620]

Regarding real-world mileage on the Jetta, I crunched the numbers and bought the 5-pot 2.5.  Yes, it's a dog of an engine.

However, VW is known for crap electronics, which doesn't speak for reliability; all of the tdi's come with every freaking option possible. Yes, I'm sure a base model tdi exists, but my dealers were unable to find one.

In addition to the tdi premium of a few grand, the mandatory 'options' pushed the price up to almost another 10k. It became a choice between owning a car f/c or financing, so I went with a base model.

Still hate the engine. But I like the rest of the car.

I think your dealer may have seen you coming.

I must be lucky, my Jetta was $2000 more than the gas version.  The TDI standard features encluded cruise control and electric windows that was it in 2000 maybe they have changed things since.  My winter fillups are averaging 49.x mpg and the summer time it ranges from 53 to 57mpg.

With every car you will have some issues or can find people who have had some issues.  

With 473xxx miles on the clock I will be hard pressed to give up the TDI.

[rgbeard]

Would be nice if VW would bring the Saveiro to the USA.

[Mydlyfkryzis]

Oh ,yea , really  ? How ? It is essentially free unless you count that , maybe , 100 W that fan draws . Heater in the car is nothing more then additional radiator . Internal combustion engines generate heat whether you like or not and you have to get rid of that one way or another , so it is FREE . No additional drain on powertrain .

Now , 25 hp to drive compressor in the car ? Gimmie a brake . You could probably cool small mansion with that . In case you wonder it is about 18 KW . Your average room AC is what ? Couple KW ?    
Look at older cars with those tiny , individual accessory belts , you thing they  could handle 25 HP ?
Many , in not most of cars cut AC during WOT acceleration .  

Typical Room A/C is less than 700 Watts nowadays.
My house has a 2 ton (24000 BTU/Hr) and is under 1400 watts.

Cars run 18000-24000 BTU/Hr. About 2 HP max for the cooling part. However, due to mechanical loss, and the need to run at varying RPM (Electric Units run at constant RPM), the losses are higher. This is about 5 HP on the outside. Older cars, with reciprocating compressors (Piston) used more, due to inefficient designs. I don't know any car that doesn't use a rotary compressor nowadays.

If you Google some information, many cars get lower mileage with the windows open and no a/c then the same car with A/C and windows shut, due to wind resistance changes.

The other factor is weight.  You add 20-40 pounds with the compressor, plumbing, and condenser and evaporator. Even those have been getting lighter.

A/C is probably using 1-2 MPG. Windows down, on a modern, streamlined car, probably has the same effect.

[Rogue]

Oh ,yea , really  ? How ? It is essentially free unless you count that , maybe , 100 W that fan draws . Heater in the car is nothing more then additional radiator . Internal combustion engines generate heat whether you like or not and you have to get rid of that one way or another , so it is FREE . No additional drain on powertrain .

Now , 25 hp to drive compressor in the car ? Gimmie a brake . You could probably cool small mansion with that . In case you wonder it is about 18 KW . Your average room AC is what ? Couple KW ?    
Look at older cars with those tiny , individual accessory belts , you thing they  could handle 25 HP ?
Many , in not most of cars cut AC during WOT acceleration .  

There is no need to get you panties in a bunch if you disagree.  Why don't you look it up yourself.

I read it in a Motor Trend article a while back.  An automotive A/C can consume up to 25 horsepower on startup, and about 10-12 continuous.  Obviously, once you have the interior cooled down you can turn the A/C down and the power consumption is lower.  

Yes and this is why many (but not all) cars cut the A/C at WOT because it does absorb a lot of horsepower.  You are forgetting that it's not just the draw from the compressor but the load on the generator.  On older vehicles, there is also the draw from the radiator fan that used to be connected to the motor.  So yes.  25 horsepower on initial start up when you are trying to quickly bring the interior temps down.

Relax.  It's just a discussion about auto A/C.    

[Baz]

Here is the real reason why Diesel automobiles will not ever be a big hit here.

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/7641


North American refineries are configured to produce gasoline, and you don't just switch over to make diesel. (You basically must build a new refinery) Due to the oil boom here, we have actually seen shortages of diesel fuel as of late. It gets really messy when one of the refineries shut down for maintenance. There has been very high diesel consumption here as of late due to the truck and equipment use.

As for the Ranger.

Ford actually issued a press release stating that F-150 sales had badly cannibalized Ranger sales to the point that they were not selling many. I believe Dodge has axed their Dakota for the same reasons.

[Fourstring]

Good to know.  Thanks man!    What kind of gas mileage do you get?

About 26 in mixed driving- nothing stellar.  Long trips, I can do maybe 30.

The car is basically our 'truck'; I use it to take music equipment downtown, put the bikes on the hitch, carry home improvement stuff, haul a ton of people, but still be able to drive (and park!) like a car, which is a big deal in Chicago.

[JonS]

About 26 in mixed driving- nothing stellar.  Long trips, I can do maybe 30.

The car is basically our 'truck'; I use it to take music equipment downtown, put the bikes on the hitch, carry home improvement stuff, haul a ton of people, but still be able to drive (and park!) like a car, which is a big deal in Chicago.

My 95 Jetta had the 2.0L, 4 cylinder version of a slug motor. It really wasn't bad to live with. It had 250,000 miles on the car and the power train was still going strong when I sold it. Never even had to replace a cv joint. There were some little, annoying electrical problems, like the cruise didn't work anymore.

[Joey Stalin]

The 2.slow is a completely uninspiring engine, I can't believe that they brought it back for the new Jetta. I really despise what they've done with that car, completely dumped it down for the US market. Everything is cheapened. But back to the engines, the 2.0 is a dog, but the 2.5 was a nice engine, plenty of power and torque, stone reliable, but you paid for it with some loss of fuel economy. On the flip side, an exhaust on a 5 cylinder engine sounds very very nice.

Although it's in a different price category (and complexity level), my 2.0 liter turbo in my GTI has returned a solid 27 mpg in all types of driving over the last 6,000 miles. It struggles to break 31 on the highway, but I can't argue with the overall mileage.

[CLAY]

I think your dealer may have seen you coming.

I must be lucky, my Jetta was $2000 more than the gas version.  The TDI standard features encluded cruise control and electric windows that was it in 2000 maybe they have changed things since.  My winter fillups are averaging 49.x mpg and the summer time it ranges from 53 to 57mpg.

With every car you will have some issues or can find people who have had some issues.  

With 473xxx miles on the clock I will be hard pressed to give up the TDI.

You are getting 49-57 MPG?  You have the TDI Jetta?  Wow.  More info please!  That mileage and longevity make the car and engine worth the premium, I would think...

[Cablebandit]

Friends don't let friends buy a VW (that doesn't have a bumper to bumper warranty)

[Rogue]

The 2.slow is a completely uninspiring engine, I can't believe that they brought it back for the new Jetta. I really despise what they've done with that car, completely dumped it down for the US market. Everything is cheapened. But back to the engines, the 2.0 is a dog, but the 2.5 was a nice engine, plenty of power and torque, stone reliable, but you paid for it with some loss of fuel economy. On the flip side, an exhaust on a 5 cylinder engine sounds very very nice.

I thought the 2.5 liter was standard on the Jetta/Golf with 2.0 Tdi optional?  That's what I read recently.

VW's goal is to be #1 by 2016.  Part of that plan is to expand production and sales worldwide.  This is why they re-opened a factory in the USA that can produce 500k+ cars a year.  Also part of that plan is to have wider standardization across the board and the general lowering of overall build cost (and materials) for all their cars.  VW sold a mere 12k Passats in 2010 and a big part of that was due to its price, which was uncompetitive.  Today’s Passat starts at $20k and of course that big drop in price means cheaper components and interior materials.  

[Fourstring]

As much as I like my 09, I wouldn't buy a new VW. 2010 and onwards are a huge drop in quality, especially the interior feel and base engine. (The 2.5 is now an 'upgrade' from a base NA 2.0)

[Joey Stalin]

I thought the 2.5 liter was standard on the Jetta/Golf with 2.0 Tdi optional?  That's what I read recently.

VW's goal is to be #1 by 2016.  Part of that plan is to expand production and sales worldwide.  This is why they re-opened a factory in the USA that can produce 500k+ cars a year.  Also part of that plan is to have wider standardization across the board and the general lowering of overall build cost (and materials) for all their cars.  VW sold a mere 12k Passats in 2010 and a big part of that was due to its price, which was uncompetitive.  Today’s Passat starts at $20k and of course that big drop in price means cheaper components and interior materials.  

Yes, and I don't care for that business plan. Doesn't matter to me if they make more profit or not, but the cars used to be relatively fun to drive across the board, and offer a unique alternative to the Japanese crowd of bland Camrys, Civics, and Accords. If I didn't want a soft riding, generically designed, large family sedan that doesn't like to be hustled through the curves, I used to look to VW. Well, not anymore.

[Rogue]

Nevertheless, the Passat is still winning comparisons.  A recent article by either C/D or M/T tested the Passat against the Camry and Sonata, in the following guises:

Base model
Hybrid (Passat had Tdi)
Sport (Passat had VR6)

Guess which model won all three?  Yup.  Passat.  The performance is still there, and now it's also competitively priced.  Having said that, the Passat is still a softly sprung mid-size sedan for the masses.  If you want better, try the CC.

[Cablebandit]

Guess which model's buttons all still work after a year or two...

[Rogue]

Toyota.  Of course we knew that.

[tomek]

There is no need to get you panties in a bunch if you disagree.

Hmmmmm , basic physics and reality of automotive design disagree with your posts , it is not a matter of my opinion or not .
Sometimes , frankly , you spew nonsense in your auto related posts .

Nothing wrong with Motor Trend but if you are trying educate yourself about engineering and basic physics perhaps it is not the best source .

There is no effing way A/C draws 25 hp , start up or not . The only electrical loads related to AC operation are  interior and radiator fans . The much bigger one may draw 30-40 amps top  , it translates to about  400-600 Watts or about 0.5-0.8 hp .

You still have not addressed how heating system loads up the powertrain .