What are the Euro mfgs doing that the Japanese aren't?

[Croak]

There's also status appeal.  Roll up on a European bike, you are generally accorded more "cred" by the civilians, you stand a little taller, you shine a little brighter, and your breath is fresher.  

[cbsnbiker]

Hmmm.  Well, I guess difference is the spice of life.

If I want "utilitarian," I drive my SUV (sport-utility vehicle).  I can carry stuff, tow a utility trailer, go through the snow, etc.

I ride a motorcycle more for enjoyment than for utility.  The actual riding experience is important to me.  I don't want "smooth and quiet," I want a bit of noise and commotion; I want to ride a motorcycle, not a utility vehicle.

Dealer support?--well, where I live, unless you have a Honda or Yamaha, there is NO dealer support no matter which brand you own, so...  Being somewhat mechanically competent has it's own rewards.

But, that's me (although, judging by this thread, I'm not alone...).

It's just a different mindset.

Of course, I do not claim to be *merely* utilitarian about this. If I were, I wouldn't own a motorcycle, since it would not be practical for me to do without a car.

I just find that I'm closer to the utilitarian side of things than many (most?) other riders I've met.

Re dealers: if I had to, I could walk to the BMW dealer from my domicile. (I could take the bus part way.) Ditto a Japanese dealer with which, unless its reputation changes, I won't be doing business. OTOH, the nearest, say, Triumph dealer is over 100 miles away (last I checked).

There's also status appeal.  Roll up on a European bike, you are generally accorded more "cred" by the civilians, you stand a little taller, you shine a little brighter, and your breath is fresher.  

OTOH, chicks tend to pay less attention to BMWs.   At least most of the time.  

[sagerat]

You want the babes, you want a Ural.  It will draw them faster than a 75% off shoe sale.

And with that, he runs for the door like a scalded cat  

[NoGear]

People here (America) always wonder why motorcycle sales in Europe tend to be better than in the US. Well, having lived in Germany for over 10 years and still having a son living there let me see if some light can be shed on the subject.

First is the fact that you can get a moped license at the age of 14 and a graduated motorcycle license at 16. You  can't get a license to drive a car till you are 18.  Next comes the cost of those licenses.  To obtain the moped and motorcycle license you are going to spend close to $1,000. You must take mandatory classes and training. None of this "well I learned from my dad".  To get your automobile license you are going to spend close to $3,000!  Many people can't afford that kind of money at that age so they tend not to get their automobile license till around 24-28 years old. After they've finished school and are working a full time job. Many never do get it.   Owning a motorcycle or moped is more economical.

Secondly, the cost of car ownership. Did you know that it is cheaper for a German to fly to the states, buy a BMW here, ship it back to Germany, and convert it back to German specs?  The cost savings is even enough to cover the cost of their vacation.  I helped several people do it over the years.  You aren't even allowed to change your own oil in Germany unless you first buy reclamation equipment (cost me $9,000 in 1993), then apply for the permit (cost another $800 in 1993)  and the permit may still not be granted. The cost of maintaining a vehicle over there is so much greater than in the U.S. which keeps many people from owning a car.

(I know someone will ask why I spent that money since it cost so much. First I was building a house at the time so I put in a pit under the garage so I could do it myself. The cost for an oil change at the local shop back then was about $150 a pop so I figured in the long run I'd save money. Also I was buying oil thru the PX which was a quarter of the cost on the local economy and I was changing other peoples oil also and only charging them $75.  My cost was about $8-12.)

Also, lets not forget about the cost of fuel in Europe. While we complain about the price of gas in the U.S. in Europe they can be paying as much as four times as much as we are. When I left Germany in 1997 I was paying over $4 for a gallon of gasoline. In Houston at the time gas was $1.12.

Lastly, with stores within walking distance in every town and a great public transportation system many people don't feel the need for a car.  I had several friends that only had bikes. They'd have a streetbike for the summer and a dualsport that they put spiked tires on in the winter.

[Kootenanny]

...You aren't even allowed to change your own oil in Germany unless you first buy reclamation equipment...

This explains much about BMW cars...

Actually, that's a very informative post, and it does explain a lot about the differences between the NA and Euro markets.

[atadaskew]

Actually, that's a very informative post, and it does explain a lot about the differences between the NA and Euro markets.

Indeed.

I've never seen a car on stands on the front lawn in Europe either.
Nor have I ever seen cars driving around w/o license plates and/or expired registrations.  In LA it seems 1/3 of the cars have expired tags.

[cbsnbiker]

Nogear, what an interesting post. Thank you for sharing with us your insights.

I once had a student, an American of Japanese descent, who was serving in our military, stationed in or near Japan. He flew home to the States from Japan to take the MSF course and get his license here, then flew back to Japan. It was cheaper for him to do so than to be trained and licensed in Japan.  

[Kootenanny]

I once had a student, an American of Japanese descent, who was serving in our military, stationed in or near Japan. He flew home to the States from Japan to take the MSF course and get his license here, then flew back to Japan. It was cheaper for him to do so than to be trained and licensed in Japan.  

I was talking to a student at my wife's art college a few years ago; he was Japanese, just here to attend school.  He was very interested in my Buell (and knew more about it than most North Americans I've discussed it with); of course, he was a motorcyclist, and described for me the licensing program in Japan.  It is very strict, and heavily regulated in terms of displacement and experience required to step up each tier.  I can imagine it would be much easier to get a license here in North America than in Japan (or Europe, or many other places...).

[atadaskew]

 I can imagine it would be much easier to get a license here in North America than in Japan (or Europe, or many other places...).

All I had to do in California was ride around some dots, make a u -turn , and pass a multiple choice test.  Which if I failed I could immediately re-take.

[steelerider]

Well,
Lets see. Sales of sport-bikes are in the toilet - the bread and butter of Japanese mfg's. My local Suzuki dealer told me that in the "good ol days" he was selling 4-5 600cc bikes a week. Now he sells 4-5 a month. Back in the day, if you had a heartbeat you could get a loan for a bike. Younger dudes were lining up to buy them. Not so much anymore. Think about how many sport bikes you see around anymore? It go so bad for Suzuki that in 2010, they imported nothing into the US.
Plus - I hate to say this but their bikes are just boring. Does a Gixxer stir your soul - like a Monster, or Street Triple?
Sure, they're well engineered, efficient machines, but just...... blah. As for BMW, and Ducati - both premium brands mostly available to those who have money, and the wealthy always spend. $21k for a new Multistrada is no joke.  Triumph has managed to capture the soul of yesteryear with the Bonneville brand, and the ST3 bikes are fun, comfy, and easy to ride.
Charlie and Ewan have managed to sell more adventure bikes than BMW could have ever imagined - concurrently BMW and Triumph, and now Ducati were smart and have capitalzed on that opportunity. What adventure bikes do the Big 4 from Japan have? Ok - The V-strom (great bike, like a laptop) and the Super Tenere, which looks like it got punched in the face. Honda - they're not even on the map yet.

[Papa Lazarou]

Look, we make and sell better bikes than anyone else.


FIN.

[crispiegee1]

It's very obvious why the Japanese are not improving sales like the Europeans: They have no triples!  

[steelerider]

Look, we make and sell better bikes than anyone else.


FIN.

True story.

[atadaskew]

Well,
Lets see. Sales of sport-bikes are in the toilet - the bread and butter of Japanese mfg's

Japanese sport bike sales are in the toilet.
Not European sport bike sales.

[black hills]

Look, we make and sell better bikes than anyone else.


FIN.

the technology is amazing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKEuzxC4eGc