Triumph Sprint ST vs. Duc ST3 vs. BMW K1200RS

[Squiggy]

Wow, that is a pretty insane price for an '04.  Should be less than 10K

I was thinking the same thing.

Squiggy, yes, it was Good Times.  Went in and sat on on 06 on the floor, the pegs didn't seem too bad, just a little higher than the Concours I'm on now.  I think the price was $14K for the new 06.  They had a red ST3S next to it that I would love to have but don't think it's really in the budget.  Called Munroe Motors in the Bay Area and got a little better quote of $800 for the 6K service but that is still a good chunk on change.  I need to learn how to work on these things myself.

Even with Ducati's 50% less maintenance thingy I can't justify spending that kind of money on a ST3, or a used 4, and a valve inspection done 7,500 miles or so. I have read about some stretching it out, though. I put too many miles on my bike to spend an additional amount on maintenence service.

My 2001 Katana has the same valve inspection interval but the bike or service (me) dosen't cost nearly as much. Of course it doesn't look or sound as sexy as a Ducati.

Also, our own Dogboy was a salesman there not too long ago. If you want some inside info, you can PM Steve. I don't know if he can get discounts for you.

[TxRider]

Prshguy,

Like most things in web forums, there is some good information here and some "disinformation".  

In the spirit of full disclosure, I have just sold my 2001 Sprint ST and replaced it with the 2001 BMW KRS, but I will try to be as even as I can and avoid over selling the BMW to defend this recent choice.  The Ducati 907 I have had, and will have forever - it is the grandfather to the ST3.

I bought the Sprint with 2200 miles on it and loved every second of the 4 years and 15000 miles I put on it.  It was a gorgeous British racing green and came with the soft saddle bags and tank bag.  The triple had a lot of character and power everywhere.  The bike handled fabulously and my wife rode with me on many missions to the Texas hill country.  Great brakes, some nosedive if you really got on them, a little bit of a rough idle.  I thought the handling was superb and it felt completely stable with one or two of us onboard.  I eventually put a Sargent seat on, which I liked better - and I got a D&D carbon fiber can which really opened her up but took a slight bit of torque away at the very bottom (huge weight savings).  Maintenance (after the fuel QD recall) was all routine stuff - I did everything but the 12000 mile major and valve adjustment.  The bodywork on this bike is fantastically beautiful and was stunning in the BRG paint I had.  The white face on the tach made it stand out from the other gauges and it just looked feminine to me.  Sexy.  Comfort was good considering the sporting nature of the bike; on long trips my legs would get cramped, especially considering the excellent range this thing had - 225 miles on many tanks.  If this bike were a car it would be a Jaguar XKR.  When selling her I was really concerned that I would live to regret it because I have truly truly enjoyed that bike.  It would be a great choice.

The BMW K1200RS was found with 10000 miles on it - owned by a dentist who wasn't much on details.  I have gone completely through her and caught up all the maintenance, and have taken a few short trips already.  I feel the KRS is getting a bad rap in this thread; the maintenance is certainly far less expensive than the ST3 you are considering, but more than the Triumph.  The only real problem boils down to lubing the splines on the output shaft.  Otherwise the bike is bulletproof.  I think I read you test rode a bad example, and I hate that happened.  (Same happened for me on an Aprilia Futura once and it spoiled me on them forever - even though I know it was a bad example I just couldn't look at them the same.)  The KRS is heavy, stable and hugely powerful.  When I think of the Sprint and KRS back to back the best way to describe their differences is scale.  The Sprint excels on smaller two-lane and more twisty roads and does okay on longer more open roads.  The KRS does okay on twisty roads but likes things to be a little more open for the power and momentum it carries.  The front end on the KRS does not dive at all due to the tele lever front end; only the back end lifts a bit.  The KRS is slower handling than the Sprint and even has a steering damper to go with the long wheelbase and weight.  But there is a payoff to the weight as well, and that is supreme stability at very high speed and in windy conditions.  This bike is at home at speeds much higher than I was comfortable on the Sprint (as long as the roads are a little more open) and I have had to put a radar detector on it already!  Compared to the Sprint, these things are expensive bikes but the launch of the newer breed of K bikes has pushed their prices down just a bit (and into my reach).  This is an incredible platform that compresses time and space so that locations you would normally plan to stop at for the night are now lunch stops!  The KRS has character as well, but not anything like the Sprint or especially a Ducati (more about that below).  The KRS is so quiet with the stock pipe, and delivers so little vibration from the engine that if you don't watch the tach you could easily be bouncing off the rev limiter because you forgot to shift.  This bike is SMOOTHHHH it is like straddling a cruise missile.  Comfort is better than the Sprint (did I mention I was 5'11'' and 185lbs?) there is more legroom and there are adjustments for everything - bars fore and aft, pegs up and down and back, and the seat height is adjustable!  Now at a fuel stop I just raise or lower the seat and I have a whole new position that relieves the strain - and the stock seat is quite comfortable for me.  I may have to put a different pipe on it before this is over, but for now I am enjoying the as-delivered OEM experience.  If this bike was a car, it would be a BMW M6.  Expensive, smooth, heavy, and FAST - and although I will miss the Sprint, I am starting to like this bike a lot!  (note:  there is NO fast idle or choke on a KRS, its all computer controlled)

Finally, the Ducati.

I have a 1991 Ducati 907ie and it is the sweetest bike there is.  The look of the thing is sensational and still draws stares even though it is 17 years old!  The styling was done by the same guys who did the more memorable Bimotas and the shapes are what hooked me - along with that RED paint.  The feel of everything is very very direct and crisp, there is no play or take up in any of the controls.  Handling is very dynamic and agile compared to the other two bikes and the riding position is just a touch more sporty than the Sprint.  I have no luggage for this bike other than the tank bag, so use it for day trips and over nighters for which it is perfectly suited.  I mentioned scale earlier and the 907 loves tighter roads like the Sprint (or tighter) because of the great handling.  It feels like you are gripping extensions of the front axle!  But the best I saved for last, and that is the SOUND.  This bike has the OEM black chrome pipes, but they have been "cored" meaning they are empty!  The delicious sound emmanating from these pipes is just amazing.  The Italians really put soul into their machines, and just like a Ferrari or some other exotic, the sound from this bike is intoxicating.  Even on over run between gear changes or the burbling aaaaahahhhhggg  when coming up to a stop light makes me grin like a mad man.  If this bike was a car, it would be a Ferrari GTO!  This bike will not need a new home until I am gone from this earth.  You can only hope that its grandson, the ST3 is as sweet a machine.  The mission of this bike now is to wash away the grime of everyday monotony and give me a new outlook on life.  Thank God for showing men how to create such a machine!!

I hope this post has added to your knowledge on these bikes in some way.
Good luck - don't stress over your decision too much, this is supposed to be fun - any one of these three choices is an excellent mount!  

[SCAL53]

Make no bones about it, I am a beemer guy but will try not to be too bias but that probably can't be helped. The K1200RS can be best summed-up in an interview with Jay Leno back in 2002:

"…The great thing about it (K12RS) is that the speed of it is so deceptive compare to a lot of other bikes. I was on the freeway and I looked down, I see 115 (I had it for about 3 days) and I thought that it is in kilometers of course, but I looked down again and I said this is not kilometers this is Miiiles. It was like 185km. It is deceptively fast… And that's what I like about it, high torque all the time, which is fabulous, it's not peaky at all. It just pulls in any gear… I am just impressed with the workmanship of it, it's almost sort of an aircraft spec. Even more so… You know there's motorcycle spec, and then there's automotive spec and there's aircraft spec. The thing I like about this BMW is that it's built to aircraft specification… As an overall bike I love it, excelling in any one category, there are probably other bikes that might take it. But I don't think if there's any other bike that can do all the things that this can do as well. I think it is the best bike they (BMW) have ever built… A wonderful, wonderful bike…" -- Jay Leno (Interview with Shahram Shiva, June 2002).

We all ride a particular model of bike for a reason. I am not one who has a garage full that picks one depending on my mood. I have one bike and ride 8K-10K annually all on trips (non-commuting). To say that the bike pulls in any gear is a gross understatement. This bike has unbelievable power and muscle that will take you anywhere you want to go and sometimes places you'd rather not be. It's a sport touring machine with very few equals. It's a heavy bike (650 lbs wet) and at the end of a long day in the twisties your upper body will feel it. But, when you are running down an open road with 40mph+ crosswinds you'll be thankful for the extra weight. There is no perfect bike that will excell in all categories, but the K1200RS is the best all-around bike I have ever owned.

[DrMikey]

Let me add my $.02 for the K12RS. The maintenance issues (worn final drives, blown seals, heat from the exhaust) are overstated. The only melted side cases I've heard of were with aftermarket pipes (a waste of money, IMHO). Could it be that those are the only ones that get the attention?

I've had my '04 RS for two years plus, put 15K on, including one Saddlesore 1000. It will handle the twisties, and be comfortable getting there & back. The pegs can be adjusted downward below the stock limit with readily available kits. Ergos can be further addressed with bar backs from several vendors. Seats can be custom fit if you like. Much of the maintenance can be done at home.

it's got the torque of a locomotive. It's the smoothest moto I've ever owned. It may take a while for you to get the ergos dialed in, but once you've got them, you may find yourself pouring over the IBA's rally calendar.

[awlittle]

The guy I do all my riding with has a KRS.  Engine is amazing.  Not a single problem in 24K miles.    One of the most unrated bikes in recent history in my opinion, and an incredible mileage eater.  When I'm practically dragging a knee down the highway in high winds, he's barely swaying.  Sure it doesn't handle the tight stuff like the VFR, but it loves the sweepers.  

[prshguy]

Great feedback, thank you one and all!

Here's how things have worked out:

After the not-so-great first impression with the 1200RS I ended up buying a beautiful 04 ST3 but the honeymoon unfortunately didn't last too long.  While it is hands down the most beautiful bike I've owned in 40 years of riding I don't think it is the bike for me.

It has a very snatchy thottle response that some say can be worked out with the right dealer/mechanic, but that combined with a lack of tall windshield options (losing my hearing and want to protect it) has lead me to an ST1300.  This was kind of unexpected since I had discounted the 1300 due to the weight but then figured if I was going to consider the K1200RS at 650 lb. then I should keep an open mind about the ST13.

Anyway, found an ST13, price was good and it came with some nice farkles so it came home.  Thus far I am very surprised how much I am enjoying it so it looks like this will be a good bike for me. 

Selling the Duc will be really hard because darn, that thing is gorgeous.  I just sit and look it thinking "Wow".  But, in the end function has to win over looks so for me at least the ST13 is working better.

Regards, R.

[st ryder]

Yes, a ST3 needs a steady and practised hand to get the most out of it and sometimes mechanical adjustment even if only to set the cable right. Too bad you couldn't get the feel for its responsiveness and gave up so soon, because riding it feels as sexy as it looks when you get the hang of it. Good luck with the ST13.  

[Windblown]

Selling the Duc will be really hard because darn, that thing is gorgeous.  I just sit and look it thinking "Wow". 

Sounds like a canidate for a wall sculpture in the living room then.  

Condolances on not getting along with the ST3. Enjoy the ST1300!