$5.500.00 for 20 over

[jpred]

Was watching the news this morning. New fees in Virginia for traffic violations. one noted was $5.500.00 for twenty over the speed limit. Yes. that's fifty five hundred. The official making the announcement said that the new fines will only apply to Virginia drivers.

[Lawn Dart]

Time to move out of Virginia I guess.  

[Tar Snake]

Virginia is for Lovers, just not speed lovers!

[jschmidt]

I predict this law will be revoked by the same legislature that passed it in pretty short order. They had no idea of the outrage they've generated. The governor is even making noises about a special session. This one is dead as it should be.

[wvrider]

it may, or may not, be a dead law....Maryland is considering how to do this also. Va is not the only state with this kind of fee structure. Its a way to get around tax law so they can say they didnt raise taxes yet they raise revenue. Its a shell game, hide the tax, move it around and see if the public can find where the money went.

Phil

[BlueRidgeKat]

The governor is even making noises about a special session. This one is dead as it should be.

Yeah it will be revoked or altered, the bad part is they said that the people who get a ticket before they change it will still have to pay the huge fine. You get to make monthly payments.... how nice of them to offer the payment plan.  

[mcoyote]

This was covered in a separate post, so I won't belabor it, but -- the extra fines apply when you get popped for anything *other* than speeding where it's a certain amount over the speed limit.

The thing to remember is that in VA if you get stopped for (IIRC) 20+ you will a get reckless driving citation *automatically*. So, this would mean (for example) 65 in a 45, which is incredibly easy to do on many a country road, and not especially unsafe.

Specifically, quoting USA today:

Virginia will institute "civil remedial fees" for Virginia residents who commit driving violations. These are on top of other fines imposed by state law. Some of the new fees:

Fee (made over three payments)

• Driving on a suspended license: $750

• Reckless driving  (such as aggressive driving): $1,050 [automatic at 20+ over]

• Driving under the influence and related offenses: $2,250

• Felony convictions (such as leaving an accident scene): $3,000

...Dunno the disposition of this law, but it is now remarkably easy to get just an outrageous fine if you look at the details.

[MrBadExample]

Here's a link to an online petition to express disapproval of Virginia's civil remedial fees. Feel free to share this link.

http://www.petitiononline.com/va3202/petition.html

[county]

Wow.

[keystonejenks]

This has been discussed since June  

[nanbil]

I guess that the state needs more money.  This way, the pols are able to say that they didn't raise taxes.

[uvakat]

I guess that the state needs more money.  This way, the pols are able to say that they didn't raise taxes.

Don't forget it's good for the children to have "bad" drivers punished...

[arkansawyer]

When fines reach unreasonable levels like these I have to wonder if it contributes to more fleeing.  

[Thor]

When fines reach unreasonable levels like these I have to wonder if it contributes to more fleeing.  

Give it enough press, and yes.

In Minnesota it is an automatic 6 month suspension for speeds over 100 MPH.  You think the kid on the sportbike is more likely to run now?

[discochris]

If it only applies to VA drivers, it's going to get thrown out.
I don't think a state can pass a law that only applies to residents.

[Snowbird]

This was covered in a separate post, so I won't belabor it, but -- the extra fines apply when you get popped for anything *other* than speeding where it's a certain amount over the speed limit.

The thing to remember is that in VA if you get stopped for (IIRC) 20+ you will a get reckless driving citation *automatically*. So, this would mean (for example) 65 in a 45, which is incredibly easy to do on many a country road, and not especially unsafe.

Specifically, quoting USA today:



...Dunno the disposition of this law, but it is now remarkably easy to get just an outrageous fine if you look at the details.

So, where are thse guys who always chime in with "I just consider it pay to play."?

[bluedogok]

I guess that the state needs more money.  This way, the pols are able to say that they didn't raise taxes.

The legislator who introduced this "piece" of legislation is an attorney whose firm specializes in speeding tickets. He admitted that it would generate a large amount of business for his firm.

[cultureslayer]

This is why even though I could move anywhere in the country, I will never live in VA.

[jschmidt]

When fines reach unreasonable levels like these I have to wonder if it contributes to more fleeing.  

Interesting article in the WP today about this. Apparently it does (at least in two other states) and it also contributes to unlicensed drivers because people who can't pay it still have to go places.

[bizarro]

As I said in the other thread on this subject: Never had much interest in visiting Virginia. Now I have a reason not to.

[Clive]

As I said in the other thread on this subject: Never had much interest in visiting Virginia. Now I have a reason not to.

Why? Are you a Virginia resident?

[info]

Can you opt for jail time?  
I need some dental work done.  

[radman]

Can you opt for jail time?  
I need some dental work done.  

Hopeful transsexuals to be are flocking there at a very high rate of speed for this very reason, or so I heard.

[Windblown]

I'm looking to see this law overturned.

On a bright note a local town here in VA near me voted to NOT put the new ordinance on their books. They have stated they will not adopt the new legislation or collect the new fees.  

[mcoyote]

So, where are thse guys who always chime in with "I just consider it pay to play."?

Well, just in case they *do* chime in, 65 in a 45 is absolutely speeding and deserves a notable fine (points aside), but...hell...$1000+? That just doesn't fit.

[Clive]

So, where are thse guys who always chime in with "I just consider it pay to play."?

Well, just in case they *do* chime in, 65 in a 45 is absolutely speeding and deserves a notable fine (points aside), but...hell...$1000+? That just doesn't fit.

Anyone who's not living under a rock knows about there new fines and how severe they are.  If someone chooses to blast through a back-country road at 20+ over the posted limit, I'm not having much sympathy when he comes crying about his monster ticket.

Still, those fees/taxers are ridiculous.

[awlittle]

Anyone who's not living under a rock knows about there new fines and how severe they are.  If someone chooses to blast through a back-country road at 20+ over the posted limit, I'm not having much sympathy when he comes crying about his monster ticket.

Still, those fees/taxers are ridiculous.

So you don't have empathy for someone who has something ridiculously unfair happen to them?

As to the person that posted that a State can't impose different fees on its own citizens as non-citizens, that is inaccurate.

I drove thru VA last month.  The use of minivans, jettas, and other uncover vehicles by the State Patrol and Local Yocals is just..."mean man."  

[Clive]

So you don't have empathy for someone who has something ridiculously unfair happen to them?

Sure I do, but this isn't one of those things.  If you lived in a culture where shoplifters and thieves had a hand chopped off, you KNEW that was the penalty for that crime, you nonetheless stole something, got caught, and had your hand chopped off ... well, it sucks about your not having that hand anymore.  But geez, my disagreement with the proportionality of the punishment doesn't affect that you knew what would happen if you got caught and you did it anyway.

[JIMLARCH]

Sure I do, but this isn't one of those things.  If you lived in a culture where shoplifters and thieves had a hand chopped off, you KNEW that was the penalty for that crime, you nonetheless stole something, got caught, and had your hand chopped off ... well, it sucks about your not having that hand anymore.  But geez, my disagreement with the proportionality of the punishment doesn't affect that you knew what would happen if you got caught and you did it anyway.

Two hundred years ago in England (that's the U.K.) people were shipped to Australia for stealing a loaf of bread.  They knew the result of stealing also.  So with your reasoning they deserved it because they "knew what would happen if they got caught and did it anyway."    So if the government stated that anyone doing more than 20 over the speed limit would go to jail for 6 months months, by your reasoning, that would be ok?

[JIMLARCH]

Anyone who's not living under a rock knows about there new fines and how severe they are.  If someone chooses to blast through a back-country road at 20+ over the posted limit, I'm not having much sympathy when he comes crying about his monster ticket.

Still, those fees/taxers are ridiculous.

20 over isn't really that fast a speed in my opinion.

[Clive]

Two hundred years ago in England (that's the U.K.) people were shipped to Australia for stealing a loaf of bread.  They knew the result of stealing also.  So with your reasoning they deserved it because they "knew what would happen if they got caught and did it anyway."    So if the government stated that anyone doing more than 20 over the speed limit would go to jail for 6 months months, by your reasoning, that would be ok?

I'm not willing to equate stealing bread to survive with blasting some country roads for fun.

As I've already posted more than once, I don't agree with these "remedial taxes".  But by my reasoning, the more severe the punishment becomes, the less one should be willing to commit the offense that invokes it.  Work to change the law, by all means.  If they passed a law saying 20-over would get you six months' imprisonment, I'd condemn that law, and I'd work to get it repealed.  But if newspapers reported that reckless drivers were being caught and thrown in jail with six month sentences, who would be stupid enough to go out Sunday morning and blast some back roads at 20+ over?

20 over isn't really that fast a speed in my opinion.

I've passed no judgment on the offense; my point has been solely directed to the offender's prior knowledge of the punishment awaiting him if he got caught and, armed with that knowledge, his go/no-go decision.

[bizarro]

Why? Are you a Virginia resident?

 

[keystonejenks]

As I said in the other thread on this subject: Never had much interest in visiting Virginia. Now I have a reason not to.

You'd have nothing to worry about. Your Guzzi cannot do 20 over.   I kid, I kid.

[Clive]

Nothing nefarious.  I just meant that the weird fines are only applied to VA residents, so it's not like out-of-state STNers would get hit with them for doing what they do on the roads.  If you just meant you'd stay away out of principle, that's cool.  

[FunkyJunk]

It should be noted that the sponsor of this part of the transportation bill is also a lawyer who owns a large traffic-law firm. Coincidence?

[bizarro]

You'd have nothing to worry about. Your Guzzi cannot do 20 over.   I kid, I kid.

Bah!  

[PhilBiker]

This is why even though I could move anywhere in the country, I will never live in VA.

Because of course VA is the only state ever to have a dumb fine.  Give me a break.

[PhilBiker]

It should be noted that the sponsor of this part of the transportation bill is also a lawyer who owns a large traffic-law firm. Coincidence?

It has been noted in this very thread.  Comprehension?

[FunkyJunk]

I skimmed but didn't see it. Thanks for the condescending remark.

[PhilBiker]

Thanks for the condescending remark.

Hmm.  No sense of humor either.....

[cultureslayer]

Because of course VA is the only state ever to have a dumb fine.  Give me a break.

Not the only, but one of the more stupid.  No Cali for me either.