Are you up for an STN International (Dolomites, Alps, Pyrenees, or UK)

[stefrrr]

Vote & comment please! If you know of any particularities that would exclude a certain time frame, post here!

[throttlemeister]

As said in the other thread, avoid may and august. May will have plenty passes still closed due to snow, and august is still holiday season meaning crowded roads and slow traffic.

[bizarro]

Any time is fine (in my dreams).

[greench440]

What happened to July  

The last two weeks of June / first two weeks of July are the time frame I would like.

[Global Rider]

As said in the other thread, avoid may and august. May will have plenty passes still closed due to snow, and august is still holiday season meaning crowded roads and slow traffic.

  the last two weeks in JUNE are the best compromise. All passes are open. It isn't too hot. And the roads and hotels are quite empty.

[Ant]

What happened to July  

The last two weeks of June / first two weeks of July are the time frame I would like.

July is when it starts to get busy with Central Europe peoples going on holiday  

[Aero]

I agree that May is too early for the high passes, although there is beautiful riding at lower altitudes around then. And yes, August is when everyone is on holiday so lots of restaurants in France are closed and the roads are crowded. The snow can fall in the passes in September, so that leaves June or July. I am happy with either.

[uvakat]

Anytime during school holidays would be good

[Lon]

Mods: Sticky?

[DredheadV2.0]

Okie.  

[gforce]

Just returned from Frankfurt, where my wife has a little ancestral house, 10 min from Frankfurt Airport, which we usually occupy during July.  Though we don't have much spare sleeping space, we do have off-street parking space for several bikes (not to be taken for granted in European cities) and plenty of hotel space nearby.  Given the ease, both logistically and economically of shipping bikes to FRA, it might be a very good place to start and/or finish.

I'm seriously thinking of shipping the FJR over there next summer because there are so many enormously enjoyable sport-touring opportunities in nearly every direction in "old Europe."  The old roads wend their way through truly gorgeous country, dotted by towns and villages of varying size, many with an old burg or schloss (small castle) or other notable historical bit.  And, no matter where you may stop, there are almost universally wonderful inns and bistros where an hour, or an evening, can be passed quite pleasantly.  

Add a dollop of GPS and the Autobahn network and you can either get to what you need or get back on schedule in a flash.  

IMO, there's no need to flock to the headline attractions; except for the big cities, you almost can't make a wrong turn.  Europe is the end of the sport-touring rainbow.

[Ant]

 

come oooooon guys... this plan must not die!!!  

[Ant]

Speaking of which... would it be possible for a mod to merge the "Ride the Dolomites" thread with this one? Most of the planning to date has occured in that thread but this one got stickied.

Ta muchly!  

[Cpl Punishment]

Can do most times, with warnings, but I do like the UK...for biking it has some of the most varied country anywhere in the world. Except NZ. But they have the most irritating accents in the universe. And are in the middle of nowhere for that reason.

[Migs]

Just come back from a fortnights hiking in the Dolomites and can certainly vouch for it being drop dead gorgeous . Touble is, the whole world knows about it and it is totally mobbed  

I was based in Pedraces near Corvara, plenty of very nice passes within easy reach but the traffic is so heavy, bikes are just permanantly overtaking.

Slovenia is much quieter and cheaper but more limited in the size of the alpine region.

[Global Rider]

Just come back from a fortnights hiking in the Dolomites and can certainly vouch for it being drop dead gorgeous . Trouble is, the whole world knows about it and it is totally mobbed  

Thats because you went now. Expect to find it crowded July till the beginning of September.

Go in June and the roads are near empty.

[Orson]

Thats because you went now. Expect to find it crowded July till the beginning of September.

Go in June and the roads are near empty.

I was there in June 2005 and it was still crowded  

most notable were the packs of newbie motorcyclists. I say newbies cuz I wuz havin' to pass them incessantly. They'd have to be newbies to be getting passed by a Guzzi on roads that favor a lighter bike  

[Mitcho]

June of next year would be good if I can rent a bike over there.
I have done lots of cycling in June in the Dolomites so I would love to go on a STN INT event there
ciao,
Mitch

[Cpl Punishment]

How about a trip to Romania?

[Ant]

How about a trip to Romania?

What is there? My geography gets hazier the further east you go  

[BossBob]

I don't think there is any need for Romania, this trip is more about our cousins across the pond making a trip to Europe ............. there are lots of tried and tested destinations without getting to far off the beaten track.

Good flight options in the area
Cost effective bike rental
a nice mix of digs and scenery

Oh ........ and a bar  

[Ant]

Oh ........ and a bar  

Someone buy this man a beer  
I don't really mind where we go to be honest, I get to see a lot of it anyway For me it is the ride and its putting faces to names for the people who make the trip over  

[ninjadad66]

Ninjadad chiming in, I agree with Global Rider, the last part of June or the first of July will be the best time.  July and August is big vacation time over here but good deal on hotels can still be found. Besides, Europe is a very big place, don't expect everyone to be in the Alps (ha ha).

[birdrunner]

I'm hoping to end up in Europe next Sept.  A motorcycle trip / honeymoon might be in the works.

I've lots of family in Holland, but the place is full of Dutch people  ( )

Munich isn't that far away,  maybe my 3 loves can get together for October fest.  (bikes, beer, Colleen).

[Mr Sunshine]

Aplejax and I are seriously thinkin about bitting the bullet...slapping down the plastic and doing a 1-2 week motorcycle trip in Europe next year.  Hope this can work out for us!

[Mr Sunshine]

Just realized something.

If I have an Arai helmet....is that going to be legal in Europe?

[Ant]

I'm sure it will be, I can't think of the certification that is required but if my memory is correct the requirements for certification in the States are "below"/"equal" to whatever it is that we have, so it stands to reason that if it is certified over there then it is certified here We all know that reason has no place in Government and other authority  

Basically I have no idea  
If you let me know what it is I can have a look and see whether there is an equivalent over here

[Cpl Punishment]

I think an Arai will be okay...US standards are higher than CE ones...or just buy a gold sticker off ebay.

[Ralf]

Just realized something.

If I have an Arai helmet....is that going to be legal in Europe?

  Uh oh, I think you're in trouble. You're best off to buy a new helmet, leathers, boots, etc. when you're in Europe.

I think this is a valid excuse... er, reason to buy all new gear  

[ninjadad66]

Just realized something.

If I have an Arai helmet....is that going to be legal in Europe?

If you purchased the Arai in the USA, it's not legal here in Europe. I had to write USA Arai and ask the question due to new military laws and SOFA (Status of Forces Agreement) all military members have to purchase a European certified helmet (ECE). Arai states that the DOT and Snell certificiation in America are different from the ECE standard here in Europe. If stopped by the local police and they check the helmet it's a stiff fine, and not to mention if an accident occurs the insurance will not pay.

Please be advised I only know this to be true for military members, not sure if it's the same for riders on vacation.

[Global Rider]

Arai states that the DOT and Snell certificiation in America are different from the ECE standard here in Europe.

The question is, what are the differences in construction for a particular make and model that has a Snell certification for North America and can also be bought in Europe with an ECE certification? I bet you nothing. They're just protecting turf areas as well as it being a power stuggle between certifications.

[ninjadad66]

The question is, what are the differences in construction for a particular make and model that has a Snell certification for North America and can also be bought in Europe with an ECE certification? I bet you nothing. They're just protecting turf areas as well as it being a power stuggle between certifications.

Not sure, but the Rep. did tell me that in the U.S. there's puncture testing, and in Europe there's impact testing. As far as I'm concerened an Arai is and Arai Oh well, it would be nice to ride with some ST-Ners if they make this trip a reality.

[Global Rider]

Oh well, it would be nice to ride with some ST-Ners if they make this trip a reality.

Yes, it would be for two reasons: 1) it would be great if they got to experience some of the incredible riding over there and 2) to put some faces with the names.

Got your PM, but can't reply from this computer. I take it your are based out of Ramstein if you were riding around Idar-Oberstein. I'm in the area every year at the tail end of my month-plus long tour to ride with a friend who lives in the Hockenhiem area.

Surely you've been to the motorcycle treff (meet/hangout) in Johanniskreuz at the intersection of the B48 and L500. Thats about 25 kms northeast of Pirmasens.

[ninjadad66]

Surely you've been to the motorcycle treff (meet/hangout) in Johanniskreuz at the intersection of the B48 and L500. Thats about 25 kms northeast of Pirmasens.

   Yes wonderful Johanniskreuz, I tend to go through there as a warm up when I'm heading out for a ride. I use to go up there everyday after work just to say I got a ride in. Then this "I have to see Europe" bug kicked in and that was all she wrote  Still a nice set of twisties though.

[Mr Sunshine]

So what about flying into Zurich?  The wife is currently finding tickets at $900 each round trip from Seattle leaving June 16th and returning the 30th.

[Ralf]

So what about flying into Zurich?  The wife is currently finding tickets at $900 each round trip from Seattle leaving June 16th and returning the 30th.

Zürich is good and puts you really close to the fun stuff. Especially given the weak dollar, the price sounds pretty good too.

[Global Rider]

 Yes wonderful Johanniskreuz, I tend to go through there as a warm up when I'm heading out for a ride. I use to go up there everyday after work just to say I got a ride in. Then this "I have to see Europe" bug kicked in and that was all she wrote  Still a nice set of twisties though.

You have to watch out for the Polizei on that road. They tend to watch riders like a hawk. We had an unmarked BMW RT ahead of us. Luckily my friend who lives there has a good sniffer and suspected. As the RT took a turn and we went alongside, it was confirmed.

Got my airline tickets already for next June. This'll be year 14...in a row.  

Take advantage of your stay there to the fullest!

[tenbears]

The question is, what are the differences in construction for a particular make and model that has a Snell certification for North America and can also be bought in Europe with an ECE certification? I bet you nothing. They're just protecting turf areas as well as it being a power stuggle between certifications.

Yup... the only thing which separates them, other than the certification passes, is the price. In the UK market forces dictate the importers [Phoenix Arari] can mark up and sell at over 100%. A top of the range RX7 Corsair will go for around £500 in the UK, around $1000 US... but an identical lid can be bought Stateside for less than half that... even including Customs duty it still knocks in at around half price.

They have attempted to justify the massive hyke in price through the mantle of 'customer services' and even pushed out the old marketing gimmick of ~ Buy one & get a genuine Arai free gift. Big deal!  

You'll only require the ACU ranking if you go trackside, in the UK, and even then genuine ACU stickers can easily be obtained through ebay.

[Mr Sunshine]

Oh I should mention that please don't try to only schedule the meet around the time I'll be there.  The price was too good to turn away so if it works out...great...if not...oh well...we're still gonna have fun.

[throttlemeister]

Yup... the only thing which separates them, other than the certification passes, is the price. In the UK market forces dictate the importers [Phoenix Arari] can mark up and sell at over 100%. A top of the range RX7 Corsair will go for around £500 in the UK, around $1000 US... but an identical lid can be bought Stateside for less than half that... even including Customs duty it still knocks in at around half price.

I am by no means an expert on certifications, but ECE-05 and Snell differ quite a bit. Given the difference in requirements between the two, I seriously doubt that a helmet that passes Snell will pass ECE-05 and vice versa. So in order to certify both, you will need different helmets that may look the same, but are structurally different.

Now, if you have a helmet that has ECE-05 and has DOT in the US, that's a different matter. As any helmet passing ECE-05 will also pass DOT, there is no need for different versions. But since this matters most for expensive helmets that are likely to have Snell certification in the US, this is kind of a mood point I guess.

EDIT:
I take all of this back after going to the Arai Europe website and read this particular document on certification testing they supply. Any helmet passing ECE-05 should also pass Snell and FIA regulations, if I read the test requirements correctly.

http://www.araihelmet-europe.com/php/manuals/AraiHelmtest.pdf

[Mr Sunshine]

So is there any change in anybody who might be going to Europe around that time and want to do a ST.N International Meet?

[Ant]

So is there any change in anybody who might be going to Europe around that time and want to do a ST.N International Meet?

Well, I am currently in the planning stages of a thoroughly ridiculous Europe spanning (Scandinavia) trip in Summer next year and I am hoping to be passing through the alpine regions of Germany, Switzerland and Italy on my loop towards the South of France before heading home.

The nature of the arctic circle (cold... ice... etc ) means I will be in the alpine regions around the end of June or early July but my dates are relatively flexible at the moment so I could juggle them to fit in with other people if there is the interest, even if there isn't an official "meet" it'd be good to meet up with people either en route or even just for a few beers one evening if the planets can align that precisely!

[Orson]

So is there any change in anybody who might be going to Europe around that time and want to do a ST.N International Meet?

Well, it looks like "May-June" is leading the polls and that's the time I usually take my vacation, so there's a possibility I can be there.

I'm planning on riding from Italy to Brittany & Normandy in France, so there's a chance I can swing thru the Alps either on my way there or on my way back  

[Mr Sunshine]

Well I'm there the last two weeks of June.  Right now I'm trying to figure out if I rent the bike for the first week or the second. If I did the second I'd be more familier with how the place works before I throw myself to the wolves.  Plus figuring out routes and what not will be easier having a clue as to what the place feels like.

[Orson]

nuthin to it  

the basics are the same. Stop at red lights. Go on green. German roads are well marked but you're gonna get lost and make wrong turns anyway. Just think of it as part of the experience and enjoy it  

Italy is more funner though cuz you can do whatever you want and no one bats an eyelash...plus you get to use internationally recognized Italian hand gestures (jk)  

[Yamonda1]

Croatia works for me  

[Cpl Punishment]

Money willing, Croatia would be fine.

[popwud]

Ok it was me who voted....they dont speak English over there ....although I have travelled in most EU countries, both frieght and camping, I have never been abroad by bike...but would love to go.

[Pete ST]

Or the Tatras mountains in Slovakia?
or the Adriatic coast
or
Anywhere cheap - the dollar is quickly becoming monopoly money..

Pete S

How about a trip to Romania?

[servicerifle]

So, are we doing this?  Depending on timing I can certainly be there, or certainly not, LMAO.  Seriously, if the time is right, I'd be there with bells on.  

We are talking about 2008, right?!  

[Mr Sunshine]

So, are we doing this?  Depending on timing I can certainly be there, or certainly not, LMAO.  Seriously, if the time is right, I'd be there with bells on.  

We are talking about 2008, right?!  

I'll be in Switzerland the last two weeks of June 2008.  I'll be renting a bike for 1 of those 2 weeks.  So I'm there.

[Aero]

 Seriously, if the time is right, I'd be there with bells on.

Leave your bells at home, they have lots of great ones over there!  

[servicerifle]

Ok, well, is it happening?  Should I start planning for it?  What year?

It seems the intrest has completely fizzled.    

[Ant]

Ok, well, is it happening?  Should I start planning for it?  What year?

It seems the intrest has completely fizzled.    

I'll be there if a plan forms, I just need 4 or 5 days notice... thats enough time to tell work I won't be in and for me to drive down there
Seriously though, I think it'd be great if some of us could meet up. My calendar is empty so far next year as financial issues have put a stop to my Scandinavian fantasies for this year

[keeptryn]

I'm up for it if it takes place in June.

[Aero]

I'm trying to organise things so that I can be there. Too early to be sure right now, but if it's possible I'll be there!

[Mr Sunshine]

Again...I'm in Europe the last two weeks of June 2008.  i'm on a bike for at least one week of that time.  I'm sure Aplejax and I would love to see fellow ST'Ners while we are there.

[dm_gsxr]

Rita and I want to go too. Anything further going on? I figure we should be paying soon if we want to get good rates.

(Sorry for wandering off. Hazards of different hobbies )

Carl

[dm_gsxr]

Heck, there are 18 right there which is a good showing. And it may not include spouses. I know Rita didn't vote so that's 19. There may be 18 couples which would be a heck of a showing all things considered

Carl

[Twitch]

I´m interested in it, too. Work is looking good, so that I can take time off. End of June is fine!

Just find the dates and I´ll find a way to show up.


What would be the Min / Max limits of the group???

[ninjadad66]

I'm stationed in Germany so please keep me posted, I'm all for it.  Post the date and place, they will come.

[Orson]

I'm stationed in Germany so please keep me posted, I'm all for it.  Post the date and place, they will come.

nobody has stepped forward to be the organizer...

since you guys in Germany are the closest to the Alps, I nominate the German contingent as "ST.N Official Organizers & Greeting Party"  

[Mr Sunshine]

All I need to know is if I should rent the bike for the week of June 15th - 21st or 22nd - 28th.    

[Ant]

All I need to know is if I should rent the bike for the week of June 15th - 21st or 22nd - 28th.    

I was about to say that since we Europeans don't really need to plan ahead so far and Mr Sunshine has already made plans for coming over then it'd make sense to try and organise around one of those time "slots". If nothing else having a choice of dates may galvanise some of the other Americans in to some sort of decisive action!

[Mr Sunshine]

Ok I just started the process to rent the bike from June 16th through June 22nd.  That's a Monday through a Sunday. Rental place is just outside of Zurich in Oberentfelden.

So if you guys want to do a meet I would think Wednesday (June 18th) or Thursday (June 19th) for the offical meet someplace in Italy in the Dolmites.  I need to check routes and what not to see if that is reasonable for us to get there and enjoy our time there.

Can a more local or experienced person with that area make a suggestion as to the specific inn to stay at for the offical part of the meet?  If someone would like to meet up with us (the wife and I) please let me know.  I haven't even thought of a route or what to see or whatever.   Figured I need to make sure I have the bike first.  

Yuppie skippie!

[Orson]

Here's a Motorbike hotel in Arabba.

I've never stayed there, but they cater to riders.

I don't know if this is the one I heard of before or there is more than 1 "motorbike hotel" in Arabba.

[Mr Sunshine]

That seems good enough for me...heck meet or not I should stop there.  Via the shortest route via Maps.Live.com its 265miles which if I then say I'd do less main roads and go for the side streets that would be a good place to stop at the end of the second day.

So Wednesday would be the right day for me considering the start day.

Anybody else have any other ideas?

[Ant]

That hotel mentions "rivers of beer for bikers", I don't know about anyone else but I'm sold!
Any hotel that comes with a bike lift and tools has got to be good! I'd wager good money that they can recommend a lot of good roads as well.
Reasonably priced too! If you only go for breakfast (eat somewhere else for evening meal) then it is only around €30 pppn, thats damn good!

http://www.motorbikehotel.com/ this is the website for the hotel itself, I think the page Orson found was an index of hotels.

[Ant]

Oh and as for specific days I have absolutely no preference, I'm just going to take time off work and ride around until the road ends to I can just make sure I'm in that neck of the woods on time

[Ant]

You say you're getting your bike in Switzerland? That give you a damn good opportunity! According to the TV show Top Gear the Stelvio pass is one of the ultimate driving roads (they spent an episode driving around Europe in super cars trying to find the best road... it's a tough job isn't it?)

Note sure if this will work but we'll see...
Map of the area

Number 1 is where you're getting your bike,
Number 2 is the Stelvio pass. That entire area looks to be extremely good riding.
Number 3 is where the hotel Orson suggested is.



Stelvio Pass  
I know I'm going to go this way to the meet!!  

[dm_gsxr]

I passed the info on to Rita to see if she still wants to go.

Carl

[servicerifle]

I was planning on going with you guys to this, but it sat around so long with no activity I started looking at the Isle of Man.  I can still change plans to hook up with you guys, but it needs to be official soon.

What's the word?


YOU GUYS ARE TALKING 2008 RIGHT?

[Ant]

I was planning on going with you guys to this, but it sat around so long with no activity I started looking at the Isle of Man.  I can still change plans to hook up with you guys, but it needs to be official soon.

What's the word?


YOU GUYS ARE TALKING 2008 RIGHT?

Yup... When is the TT this year? Not being funny but if I were you I think I'd rather do the TT than meet up with us lot
Depends what your time limitations are, with you talking about Scotland I was thinking I might ride up there for a day or two and then make my way through Europe to this. No reason other than funding why you couldn't do something similar

Just keeping your decisions difficult

[Orson]

I was planning on going with you guys to this, but it sat around so long with no activity I started looking at the Isle of Man.  I can still change plans to hook up with you guys, but it needs to be official soon.

Do the TT.

The Alps will always be there.

A TT ferry ticket might not  

[Ant]

Do the TT.

The Alps will always be there.

A TT ferry ticket might not  

Any chance of you gracing us with your presence at this little get together Orson?

[Mr Sunshine]

Why yes I am geting the bike in Switzerland.....road suggestions like that are just what I need!  Thanks.

[dm_gsxr]

Ok, I put in that week (16th-20th) for a possible vacation (that beginning of year question by managers ). I'll pester Rita so we can be all set up soon.

Carl

[Ant]

  you mean something might come of all this ummm-ing and ahhh-ing!?  

[Mr Sunshine]

Sweet!

Let us know your plans when you figure them out.

[Ant]

If we can get a rough idea of numbers then we can give that hotel a ring and get some rooms reserved. I dare say that a place like that will book up fast in the summer

[Mr Sunshine]

If we can get a rough idea of numbers then we can give that hotel a ring and get some rooms reserved. I dare say that a place like that will book up fast in the summer

I say call them and let them know 6 people are coming.  

2 for me
2 for dm_gsxr
1 for you and
1 for Orson  (you damn well better come!   )

[Mr Sunshine]

Perhaps we should make a new post that basically says "ST.N International Meet: Italy blah blah blah"  ?

[Ant]

Done  

[Mr Sunshine]

Danke!

[servicerifle]

I dunno...I am very tempted to just come with you guys.  Seriously.

[notarian]

I wrote the following for a group of friends who wanted to bike the Alps last summer. I did the trip in August 2006. Only the Dolomites were a bit crowded, the Alps themselves were much less so - especially all of the French Alps.

I'd like to post the pictures that go with the report, but have tried on other sites and the file is too large.

Anyway, maybe this will help and keep your interest up (as if you need it!). I own a Multistrada and have seen from the STN thread 'Ride the Dolomites' mirroring this one that the Multi's are available for rent in Milan. Given the choice of any bike to ride the Alps, I would take the Multi. It is probably the most perfect bike for this type of riding and the price for the bike is very good. Personally, I'd opt for arranging my own accommodations. I always have in the past and have always been satisfied, whether booked in advance of just showing up on the day. However, it is preferable to book in advance if based in the Dolomites because of the amount of holiday tourists. Also, the locals are beginning to crack down of bikers - although we add substantially to the economy, they don't like the sound of motorbikes thundering through their mountains and really take offence to speeding in the villages. Slow down when entering and passing through any village, town, city. It's there that the police will nail you.

As stated below, I very much recommend the Hotel Evaldo in Arabba. I have heard and read that La Fontana in Corvara is a little less expensive and a very good option with superb meals.

Also, as written below - I can't recommend highly enough for anyone considering a motorcycle holiday in the Alps to buy John Herman's book about motorbiking the Alps. It is worth its weight in gold.

"Thirty one day holiday, 26 days in the Alps, 6000 miles, 5000 hairpins, countless thousands of sweepers. All weather conditions, -10C to +42C, sunny, showers, hard rain and hail. Crossed over 83 mountain passes in total, some of them 3-4 times – just because they were so good. Good tarmac, bad tarmac, no tarmac. Met a few interesting characters, as one does.

Grindelwald and Interlaken, Andermatt, St. Moritz, Merano, Arabba and the Dolomites, Riva di Garda, Napolean’s Route (starting in Nice winding north to Annecy and Mt. Blanc), all in that order.

Throughout it all, the Ducati Multistrada 1000 ran faultlessly. Not a single moment of hesitation. Only a new rear tyre needed as the Alps eat tyres. However, beware if you do need a Ducati replacement part and it’s August, every Ducati shop in Italy and France close, at some point, during the month of August – often for 3 weeks. Therefore, I assume that all Ducati’s have an electrical management chip that tells the bike when its August and in Italy or France and knows it must not, cannot breakdown.

Riva di Garda was mainly for some well earned R&R, a bit of people watching, ice cream and pastries and some sailing. Arrived about 5:30 pm, checked into the Hotel, quick shower and an hour nap. Woke up with a bit of a sore lower back. After dinner, I could hardly get out up from the table, barely stand or walk without excruciating pain. It could hardly be the riding, after all, I had been riding the mountains 6 – 8 hours / day, every day for 16 days.

Rising the next morning, still in pain and thought, ‘Boy, this is swell. I’m in the middle of an Alpine motorbike holiday, 2,500 miles from home and I’m totally incapacitated’. Truly afraid I would not be able to ride until I healed (at some point I would, wouldn’t I?), I went out and sat on the Duc.

I could hardly believe it. The riding position, being slightly leaned forward at the waist and some weight taken by arms and shoulders on the bars = a completely painless position. Well, there was nothing in it but to go riding and the hell with the very painful ‘rest and relaxation’. Took about 7 days for the back to slowly heal.

Several pics below – saving ‘The Roads’ for last. The Roads, why else does anyone come motorcycling or bicycling to the Alps?

Tremendous respect for bicyclers in this environment. However, it would take decades to cover the ground a motorcycle does and, at 60, I am not one to endure my tongue hanging out for weeks on end.

The Road of Alpine passes. There is only the Road and there something immensely satisfying about crossing an Alp pass. It connects one valley to the next for communication, commerce, and information. Without it, one must travel the length of one valley into the next and up that one to reach the nearest town. A journey of 200 miles, but with the pass road, 20 miles.

So, the roads do something important, are main routes for are for commerce and are not there just for being a road to ‘somewhere’ or ‘anywhere’. But, as such, they are the roads for the finest biking in the world.

The Splugen Pass, to take one Alp pass for instance, is a wild climb from the south. Hairpin after hairpin, climbing a gorge, often with tunnels and turns and hairpins inside the tunnels, where the road cannot be carved on the cliff, bridges are cantilevered out over a 1000 metre drop with hairpins on them – a wild, insane, winding, twisting mountain pass that has buses and trucks taking people and produce from one valley to the next. It’s a crazy thoroughfare, if you wish, but one that connects Switzerland and Italy, people and commerce.

Coming over the Col du I’lseran, you realise without this pass connecting Val d’ Arc and Val d’ Isere is a journey around that would be about 300 miles.

Most of the Alp passes are OLD, the labour and engineering that to build them is incredible and, because of their importance, they are being updated constantly – if not rapidly.

The original St. Goddhard pass is there, a hard cobblestone road for miles, winding up the mountain. Personally, I’ll take the new road rather than muscle the cobblestones, but the ancients didn’t have that option. It remains a significant pass.

The Passo di Stelvio is the hairpin champion of the Alps. Built on an alluvial mountainside, one with constant subsidence, it has about 50 hairpins on each side. It seems that the maintenance of the road is to fill in the subsidence cracks with tar unless one of the rock ‘hold um up ums’ decides to let go. The Stelvio is an exhilarating road and I road it twice in the rain on the way to Merano.  

There’s an outstanding route from St. Moritz to Merano that needs mentioning – the Bernina Pass, Passo di Mortirolo, Passo di Gavia and the Stelvio.

Only the Dolomite passes are young, as a result of World War One. Some of the bloodiest fighting of that War took place in the, now, Italian Dolomite mountains. When the Austrians, or the Italians took a valley by fighting for it, a road had to made to supply the victors. Hence, most of the roads in that part of the Alps were the result of re-supplying troops and keeping territory.

Little did they know, they had built, what may be, the best of the best motorcycling roads imaginable. Spent 2 full days just riding the figure eight (Passo’s Pordio, Gardena, Sella, Valparola, plus Falzarego and Giau) = 1200 hairpins alone. Sound boring? It’s not, trust me! If the road is worth riding, its worth riding it twice – once for the road, once for the scenery. Some roads you never tire of.

Any day in the Alps is weather changeable. It might start sunny and dry, then turn cloudy by 1pm, showers at 2pm, dark skies and hard rain at 3pm in the lower valleys and hailing at the fog top of Passo Pordio at 4pm. A long, hard day’s ride and the last 39 torantes (hairpins) down from the Pordio summit to Arabba and it’s hailing – riding a sea of pelting marbles.

If you plan to ride the Alps, I highly recommend John Hermann’s ‘Motorcycle Journeys Through The Alps’. It’s an amazingly accurate description of rides and roads, geared for North Americans, but applicable to anyone who reads the English language. Hermann’s book, a Kummerly & Fry Alpine Roads map and some common directional sense is about all you need. No GPS, sorry – even the K & F map doesn’t show all the passes, for sure, neither will any GPS.

Besides, if you take a wrong turn, who cares?

Not everyone can get a month to ride about, but we all get a couple of weeks – don’t we? In that space, there’s a lot of riding adventure to be had. Depending on where you start, figure on 2 - 4 days to get there and back. Make a beeline to Andermatt, Switzerland and stay for 4 days. Take 2 days riding to the Dolomites and Arabba, Italy. Make that your base for at least 4 days.

Having a base lets you take the bags off, reset the suspension and play without the hassle of daily loading and unloading. Some of the major Dolomite roads can get very busy, but generally it is before 9am and from 4-6pm. 10 – 3 is just simply ‘Play Time’.

There are plenty of accommodations in Andermatt. A good one is the small, family run Gafthaus Sternen and just over the bridge on the main street. Owned by David Shani and has the best restaurant in town. 35 Euros including breakfast.

In Arabba, check out the 4 star Hotel Evaldo. They have built an underground garage specifically for motorbikes, have a free power washer and a 5 star dinner included in the cost of the room. I’m not one for ‘salad bars’ (if I wanted to fix my own meal, I’d stay home), but Evaldo has one of the best salad selections I’ve ever encountered. It’s 100 euro’s per night (£65) and well worth it. Oh, the chef does eggs any style for breakfast (an Alp rarity).

For North Americanos, the hassle of shipping a bike may be too much. There are plenty of Motorcycle Tour companies for the Alps. One lot of 20 Gringos descended on Arabba for a couple of days. They were on a Beach Bike Tour, complete with 3 suitcases and 200 lbs of luggage each. Beach has a bike leader, but you don’t have to follow him, a mechanic and van for breakdown spares and the tons of luggage the Yanks are fond of bringing. A tour isn’t cheap, but for what you get, it isn’t expensive either. $5,000 = 14 days in the Alps, breakfast and dinner, a wide range of sturdy BMW’s, excellent accommodations, continuous bike maintenance / repair / mechanic – sherpa, guide and bike insurance.

Perils of the Alps? Damn near anything with 4 wheels. Pay attention.

A red and white license plate is a Belgium. ANY red and white plate being driven by a silver haired person is extremely dangerous. Reason? Until about 1983, Belgium did not require a driving test of any kind to secure a driving license. The elderly still do not know why there is a rear view mirror.

Any top down sports car being driven by a man with a young babe passenger is a potential killer.

No Swiss public bus will stop for any obstacle whatsoever, whether it be campervan or crawling infant. Hence, when rounding corners, the bus driver toots his distinctive 4 - note horn.

Most infuriating = the Dutch. NL (Netherlands) on a plate is someone with no mountain driving experience. The highest point in the Netherlands is a building. Hmmmm…

Most careful = the British. The driving position is on the wrong side of the car, which gives them the worst road vision possible.

Most attentive, courteous, watchful, playful and fastest = Motorcyclists. We are the best, not a boast, it’s a fact.

Most vulnerable = Bicyclists."

About 60 pictures rounded of the report. Maybe this site will take a few?

Nope. I didn't think so - couldn't even get one in.

[Orson]

About 60 pictures rounded of the report. Maybe this site will take a few?

Nope. I didn't think so - couldn't even get one in.

try hosting your pictures on photobucket.com  

as far as bicyclist being the most vulnerable...an image that will forever be seared into my memory was the time I was climbing a pass...I forget which one. I was entering a switchback just as a harried-looking old man in a Mercedes sedan was exiting the switchback, going in the opposite direction. Behind him was a large pack of Italian bicyclists in training, hurling insults and casting aspersions on the old man holding them up  

[throttlemeister]

Most infuriating = the Dutch. NL (Netherlands) on a plate is someone with no mountain driving experience. The highest point in the Netherlands is a building. Hmmmm…

I take offense! This should read "Dutch with their trailer caravans and/or Germans with their RV's"

As long as there are dozens of Swiss burning their brakes coming down a mountain, we as flatlanders have nothing to be ashamed off!

So there!

 

[Cpl Punishment]

I take offense! This should read "Dutch with their trailer caravans and/or Germans with their RV's"

As long as there are dozens of Swiss burning their brakes coming down a mountain, we as flatlanders have nothing to be ashamed off!

So there!

 

What about the tulip boom? That was your fault, wasn't it? Sending the eurpoean econmy into a flat spin with your overpriced bulbs...

[Bill@MIssion]

As said in the other thread, avoid may and august. May will have plenty passes still closed due to snow, and august is still holiday season meaning crowded roads and slow traffic.

Half right - speaking for the Pyrenees - most roads will be open in May for certain - my picture was taken in Andorra early April.

In full sunlight it was 16 degrees - snow piled up 2 metres at the side of the rod. Temperature drops like a brick in shadow/at dusk so be warned - Andorra (Pas de Cas) is one of the highest passes we have - so most of the roads will be clear.

[Global Rider]

Most infuriating = the Dutch. NL (Netherlands) on a plate is someone with no mountain driving experience.

There will be notices, either on the map or at the base of a pass "no caravans, buses, etc" and yet you'll find them clogging up the pass roads with their caravans. Don't get me started on the Dutch...very friendly, but not quite all "there". It must be the weed.  

The highest point in the Netherlands is a building. Hmmmm…

Good one!!! 

[Aero]

I wasn't able to attend the 2008 STN International but I'm going to do my best to be there in 2009 - wherever 'there' is!
I'm thinking maybe some people might be interested in combining a European meeting with a Moto GP race. My choice would be either the Italian GP at Mugello on May 31st, the Dutch TT on June 27th, the Czech GP on August 16th, or the San Marino GP on September 13th but I am open to other suggestions. Anyone interested?

[vfr boy]

I've done Assen and Brno and both are great venues with a brilliant atmosphere.

Don't forget the UK!

[Papa Lazarou]

Interested but very broke.

[stefrrr]

You know, if we do this between my courses (June 23 - July 3rd), I might be able to do it. No success so far though with "borrowing" a bike. Although there was that offer, but I'm not sure it would still stand...  

[ninjadad66]

I wrote the following for a group of friends who wanted to bike the Alps last summer. I did the trip in August 2006. Only the Dolomites were a bit crowded, the Alps themselves were much less so - especially all of the French Alps.

I'd like to post the pictures that go with the report, but have tried on other sites and the file is too large.

About 60 pictures rounded of the report. Maybe this site will take a few?

Nope. I didn't think so - couldn't even get one in.

Great write up.  Any luck with the pictures ?

[Gritty_Kitty]

Well I'm going to be there the last 3 weeks of June doing the Alps. This'll be my second time over. I'm taking my wife on the ulimate passes and castles tour of luxembourg, northern France, Switzerland and south western Germany which I've laid out myself. I've got 4 days worth of business I've got to attend to at the LeoVince plant in Italy then I'm back touring.

I've done a lot of research and have a good connection for rental bikes in Frankfurt.

Anyone is welcome to join me for a few legs of my journey and leech off my logistics in exchange for an occasional beer and the promise to pull over if I've got a flat. I'll be renting a K1300GT, my speed is sport not race but certainly not cruise. I intend to use that torque.

Aside from that offer. How would everyone like to converge on Andermatt, June 22,23 and 24th?

[John L]

Bill - I was planning on spending 10 of riding through the Pyraness and the Picos or Pyraness and French Alps. I am really interested in your site b/c I need some good routes and must do roads in the area. Its been 8 yeras since I have been there. Is it to ambitious to cover both the Pyraness and the French Alps in ten days? I did the Picos and the Pyraness before (although I lost all my notes and maps) and it was pretty easy to cover the ground.

If anyone is traveling to Switzerland and Dolomites I will be glad to help with some killer routes. I rented a Tuono in 06 and had an absolute blast. Late June was perfect - 1o days and no rain. Pick up the John Hermann book - its loaded with helpful info.  

Half right - speaking for the Pyrenees - most roads will be open in May for certain - my picture was taken in Andorra early April.

In full sunlight it was 16 degrees - snow piled up 2 metres at the side of the rod. Temperature drops like a brick in shadow/at dusk so be warned - Andorra (Pas de Cas) is one of the highest passes we have - so most of the roads will be clear.

[yotes65]

About 60 pictures rounded of the report. Maybe this site will take a few?

Nope. I didn't think so - couldn't even get one in.

How about posting the link to the "other" forum so we may check out the photo's...