2010 Region 4 Annual Track day - June 9th, Wed, Blackhawk Farms

[Cheddarhead]

Lesson Learned #3 -- That is also known as target fixation and is something you also don't want to do on the street.
Lesson Learned #4: -- You took miles off of the side of your tires at an angle where you normally wouldn't make it to on the street anyways so it's all good.

Glad you made it out there. That's what this day is for. Honda "ST" fits into the Sport - touring group. It's in the bike's name for gosh sakes.

Re:  LL#3.  Would like to discuss this further....What happened was that I was preparing to enter the corner (turn #6) after coming off the LH sweeper...and was startled by a rider blasting past on my RH side...who then locked up his rear tire.  I "think" I probably started into the rh turn...the jerked it back upright and to the left.  Glad not to have lost it...but I let off the gas and then pulled up to check that the track was clear before re-entering the fray.  By that time I was halfway through turn #6.

Re:  LL#4.  Agreed    At least I'm not embarrassed about flat-spotting them anymore!  

General Question:  I found myself doing better (weight shift, smooth acceleration, etc) when chasing the CR's or other riders.  Of course, I could only do so for a short time "unless" the CR was "dragging me around" the track.  Is this another indication of Target Fixation?  

[Mr. Clean]

Glad to hear that the day was another success.  Going without a track day this year is like getting someone to stop using a drug.  I am having a hard time with it.  Looking forward to seeing you all out there next year.  

[bomber]

Ched LL #3

There's a trick to "seeing" everything on the track (other riders, possible spooge and debris) while looking "through" it at the same time -- this avoids target fixation, which sound like a part of what was going on. You are already doing this, on the street, or a fell of your advanced age would not longer be with us ;-} -- doing on the track is no different, but you were in hyperaltert mode, not having been in this particular situation before.

Additionally, if you are balls to the wall, with nothing left, and something happens in front of you that requires to do something different, you're out of options. Sounds like you were smart enough to ride your own ride (having ridden with you, I'm not surprised), and you DID have options. Sounds like you just wish they included something other than what actually happened. Much of this has to do with trusting your bike -- it was quite likely capable of allowing you to ride elsewhere -- this trust simply comes from riding in these situations more often . . . . .this is why track days were invented.

[FZ1 Matt]

Cheddar,

So you were in the short straight on your way to 6(sharper righthander) when someone shot past you, skidded rear, and kept going straight off into the grass? Was he skidding at a rate where he was past you before your normal turn in point? Or did his pass attempt affect your line where he was in your way if you wanted to turn in normally? If the latter, then you got cut off and the pass  essentially turned from a straightaway, out braking pass, into an inside pass attempt  since  he couldn't get it done fast enough. If he was already past you and everything was clear then continue as normal.

All I could tell was you were on the outside of this corner, on the track on a functional bike and not moving very much. I just saw a giant high viz bullseye for the next person who could potentially stand it up and blow that corner to target fixate on and pile into. That's no good.

I've been passed close and uncleanly (imo) many number of times during other trackdays. It's unclean when you have to adjust your line or take an action to avoid someone who made a pass on you. Keep in mind, if you get passed and it's you who flinched and caused yourself to turn in or brake at the wrong time then that one's on you. It's hard sometimes to not flinch and  being passed is hard to get used to, but that is why they have the 6ft and the outside passes only rule.


My answer to your general question:
I view target fixation as looking at the wrong thing and, in turn, going exactly where you looked.  I don't know if trying to follow someone is thought of as target fixation as much as it could be considered tunnel vision. Maybe they are the same thing, I don't know. I view tunnel vision as trying to follow someone and looking at them, not ahead of them. Always look farther ahead. If you're looking right at the person you're following and that's all you can see, then that's tunnel vision and that's not good. The person you're following should be that blurred out foreground of a vast landscape photograph. They're in the photo, but they are not the central focus of the image. The track and the next few turns in front of you are landscape in which you should focus.

[Fast Eddy]

General Question:  I found myself doing better (weight shift, smooth acceleration, etc) when chasing the CR's or other riders.  Of course, I could only do so for a short time "unless" the CR was "dragging me around" the track.  Is this another indication of Target Fixation?  

What you are referring to here is commonly called "getting a tow". Nothing wrong with having someone to help you identify/reference turn in or the right line.

That said you don't wish to target fixate on them. If they make a mistake, you probably will too. Like Matt make it part of the big picture. That's hard to do at first cause you're experiencing a lot of new stuff for the first time.

I wasn't working you're group, but came out in it a few times. From what I saw everyone was doing well. Riding in there own comfort zone and learning to trust the machines more.

Glad you guys had fun. It was perfect weather. If any of you are interested in coming out again, let me know and I will give you my discount code that can save you a few bux. Even if you come alone, the track is a friendly place.

Scott, you were missed.  

[gixxer188]

Hi guys!

I just wanted to pop in to say thanks for a great day at the track yesterday; I really enjoyed working with your group.  I was the CR on the Red, Black &White GSXR 1000 #188 with the camera on the front.

All of the video I shot from each of the I2 sessions can be found at this URL -> http://www.madisonsportbikes.com/vids/ under the MotoVid_06_09_10 folder.  Each video is from a GoPro HD camera and is 1.5GB in size and they are uncompressed and unedited videos so you’ll have to search through each one to find yourself as I circled the track.  The video entitled “Brian” is all Brian, the guy on the Blue SprintST.  He asked me to follow him for an entire session so if you see yourself in the video it won’t be for long because I was focusing on following Brian.  Just right-click and Save as...

Again, thanks for the great day and I hope to see you all back at the track very soon!  And if you have any questions of me just post them here and I’ll check back to read up on your stories.  Or you can email me directly.

Todd Carlson
MadisonSportBikes.com
MotoVid Senior CR

[phoenix]

VIDEO!!



Will get another one loaded tomorrow.

I just uploaded this sothe quality is going to be a little grainy probably until late tonight.

[keeptryn]

It was a blast yesterday and it was good to see many of the same people back again.  Missed you Scott. hopefully you can fit it in next year.
Samal - thanks for setting this up and coordinating it.

Dave

[Cheddarhead]

Cheddar,

So you were in the short straight on your way to 6(sharper righthander) when someone shot past you, skidded rear, and kept going straight off into the grass?

Yes.  He was the 3rd guy to pass me on that straight...and I guess he ran out of real estate, so he blew the turn and skidded straight off and into the grass...

Was he skidding at a rate where he was past you before your normal turn in point? Or did his pass attempt affect your line where he was in your way if you wanted to turn in normally? If the latter, then you got cut off and the pass  essentially turned from a straightaway, out braking pass, into an inside pass attempt  since  he couldn't get it done fast enough. If he was already past you and everything was clear then continue as normal.

Couldn't swear to it, but I think he locked up either just after I started to lean into the R-Hander...or just after.  Him passing me didn't startle me (happened often enough by that point in time...HA!...and he was the 3rd guy by me in that section of the track)  My "perception" was that I needed to adjust my trajectory either lean-in hotter and harder (tuck and trust) or abort (roll off and get back upright) to avoid a bumper tag incident.

It probably wasn't a noteworthy pass...one that wouldn't even get noticed over the course of a day for other riders...but it was noteworthy because I lost concentration, and waved off...

In retrospect, I am probably fortunate that I was at the shallow end of the talent pool in that Intermediate Group...had I been with a whole bunch of others as inexperienced as myself, my hiccup may have daisy-chained one or more others...which is the one thing I was most worried about...hurting somebody else.

All I could tell was you were on the outside of this corner, on the track on a functional bike and not moving very much. I just saw a giant high viz bullseye for the next person who could potentially stand it up and blow that corner to target fixate on and pile into. That's no good.

I've been passed close and uncleanly (imo) many number of times during other trackdays. It's unclean when you have to adjust your line or take an action to avoid someone who made a pass on you. Keep in mind, if you get passed and it's you who flinched and caused yourself to turn in or brake at the wrong time then that one's on you. It's hard sometimes to not flinch and  being passed is hard to get used to, but that is why they have the 6ft and the outside passes only rule.

Absolutely agree...at that point in time I became a hazard to safe navigation on the track...so I tried to make myself small (not so easy to do at my displacement!...not referring to the ST, either...) and check for track clearance before I rolled on and re-engaged.

Would I have been less of a risk to others if I'd put it on the grass?  At least then I would have not been an inconsistent variable for others...

My answer to your general question:
I view target fixation as looking at the wrong thing and, in turn, going exactly where you looked.  I don't know if trying to follow someone is thought of as target fixation as much as it could be considered tunnel vision. Maybe they are the same thing, I don't know. I view tunnel vision as trying to follow someone and looking at them, not ahead of them. Always look farther ahead. If you're looking right at the person you're following and that's all you can see, then that's tunnel vision and that's not good. The person you're following should be that blurred out foreground of a vast landscape photograph. They're in the photo, but they are not the central focus of the image. The track and the next few turns in front of you are landscape in which you should focus.

I tried (...with varying success) to be focusing through the visible turn and onto the next...so I don't "think" that I was fixating during the "tow" (Great Expression, BTW...) but I know that I wasn't doing this as consistently as I should have been through the Carousel and through Turn 6, in particular...both long RH Sweepers that i "should have" been able to carry through with great speed and consistency.  I seemed to have greater difficulty in the RH turns than in the LH ones...but neither was particularly great, by comparison.


All of this gives me something to contemplate...and to focus on...for the next one!

[samal]

Hi all!

Thanks for coming out and making it a great day!  Michael, from Motovid asked me to thank you all for coming on his behalf.  
There is only one bunch or riders that I know that can be assembled in one group on the track ranging from track newbies to NESBA advanced group riders and everyone staying friends and safe all day and having fun on the track.  That's ST.N!

CRs were impressed by our mature way of riding and being gentlemen and we are invited again for next year event.

I have couple videos, but my camera mount was malfunctioning, so I got lots of shaking and tilting.  I will have more uploaded tonight, got one already last night, but for most of the this video I was following same guy - as he asked me:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7plfmUGNag

[Dan K]

Can't believe I missed this....  

I will make a point of attending next year.  I miss everything...need a less demanding job.

- Dan

[FZ1 Matt]

Hey Todd,
Vid - 51 I can only get 439mb to download and 52 I can only get 500mb to download. Do you know why that could be? I've tried initiating the 'save link as' through 2 different browsers and same deal.

and right where vid 51 stops working is right when I show up.  

Hi guys!

I just wanted to pop in to say thanks for a great day at the track yesterday; I really enjoyed working with your group.  I was the CR on the Red, Black &White GSXR 1000 #188 with the camera on the front.

All of the video I shot from each of the I2 sessions can be found at this URL -> http://www.madisonsportbikes.com/vids/ under the MotoVid_06_09_10 folder.  Each video is from a GoPro HD camera and is 1.5GB in size and they are uncompressed and unedited videos so you’ll have to search through each one to find yourself as I circled the track.  The video entitled “Brian” is all Brian, the guy on the Blue SprintST.  He asked me to follow him for an entire session so if you see yourself in the video it won’t be for long because I was focusing on following Brian.  Just right-click and Save as...

Again, thanks for the great day and I hope to see you all back at the track very soon!  And if you have any questions of me just post them here and I’ll check back to read up on your stories.  Or you can email me directly.

Todd Carlson
MadisonSportBikes.com
MotoVid Senior CR

[gixxer188]

matt,

I uploaded them from work, three 100MB pipes to the Internet, gotta love working for the Government.  They all uploaded successfully so it could just be my host (Bluehost.com) doing some funky thing to the download bandwidth.  I'm at home and I'm downloading #51 now over my 4MB DSL connection and I'll let you know if I get it all or not.

Hey Todd,
Vid - 51 I can only get 439mb to download and 52 I can only get 500mb to download. Do you know why that could be? I've tried initiating the 'save link as' through 2 different browsers and same deal.

and right where vid 51 stops working is right when I show up.  

[samal]

another video



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XLV2zZ5EiI

[gixxer188]

Matt,

I was able to download both 51 & 52 without a problem.  I can try cutting them up and posting them to YouTube this weekend for those that can't get them downloaded.

Hey Todd,
Vid - 51 I can only get 439mb to download and 52 I can only get 500mb to download. Do you know why that could be? I've tried initiating the 'save link as' through 2 different browsers and same deal.

and right where vid 51 stops working is right when I show up.  

[FZ1 Matt]

hmm. I don't know what's up then. I couldn't get vids from other days to get over 500mb either. Maybe a limitation of my isp or the package we have.  If you could break some up that would be cool. Don't work too hard though.  

Thanks for riding around and taking vids! Those gopro people must have made a lot of money on those cameras! Everyone's got one.

[Fourstring]

 C'mon guys! 

Stayed at the Rodeway No-tel the night before.  Jad's mom came up to babysit with the implied promise of taking her Porsche on a few hot laps during lunch break.  Thanks, grandma!





Come in and get settled.  Pack n' plays should be standard kit for all factory teams.  ST.N and Russian Riders bedded down in the same spot as last year.









These guys set down with us on accident. 



These two were a really cool addition.  Father and son team, two days before the son's 21st birthday.  They built up a pair of KZ400s themselves and were doing their first track day together in the novice class.  When I first talked to them, they were a little nervous about getting snobbed down to because of their kit and were surprised how enthusiastic we all were to see them ride.  The look on their faces after the first session was priceless.  Bud, Kerry, I was glad to meet you both.



Rider meeting in the morning.  I'd like to thank our sponsors, which we will now list in inscrutable detail.



One little incident.  Stupid ziptied stands!  (Sorry, Charlie; you asked me to take a pic)



The advanced group shows us how it's done:





I think we hooked the next generation.  Start 'em while they're young!







  to Cheddar and Jadzia for finishing out their first track day with aplomb.  I started out the day at an entirely different pace from Maggie, ended it sweating to keep up with her.  Pic of Maggie's tires.... 



Huge props to Rory, Shaul, Kris, Matt, Charlie, Johnny (thanks for the front stand tips!) and especially to Bill for making this the day I look forward to all year.

[phoenix]

Miles sure was a trooper! You guys are so fortunate.

Rider meeting in the morning.  I'd like to thank our sponsors, which we will now list in inscrutable detail.

no kidding. Dang. I don't know why they don't pass out flyers with all this information contained rather than have you try to remember dates and other info. But whatever.

Another video, I forget which session this was. And it appears there were some folks from Wisconsin Sport Bikes mixed in our group, otherwise they did not appear Russian and I didn't see them talking with the rest of us. But I kept getting behind a guy with Valentino Rossi 46 decals on his bike.

[bomber]

looks like a great time was had by all (specially the father/son duo -- what a great way to celebrate birthdays!)

Well done, all . . . . .

btw, be careful -- baby drool on the seat sounds like a bad time waiting to happen -- if there is a more slippery substance, I don't know of it ;-}

[samal]

Miles sure was a trooper! You guys are so fortunate.



no kidding. Dang. I don't know why they don't pass out flyers with all this information contained rather than have you try to remember dates and other info. But whatever.

Another video, I forget which session this was. And it appears there were some folks from Wisconsin Sport Bikes mixed in our group, otherwise they did not appear Russian and I didn't see them talking with the rest of us. But I kept getting behind a guy with Valentino Rossi 46 decals on his bike.

These are video chasers - there was guy in red adn white leathers on orange bike, and another guy with ponytail and silver leathers, don't remember what bike - there are about 5 of them and they rotate - 2-3 at a time in all groups