VFR1200 being sold for $12K at some shops

[Rogue]

Have you compared features?

Like?

Heated grips?  The bigger tank?

Those are not deal breakers for me.  But hey, it's a BMW.  

[atadaskew]

I wonder how much of the blame is Honda's?

BMW produced a K1300 with a 5.0 gallon tank and receives accolades.

Honda produces a VFR1200 with a 4.9 gallon tank and the pitch forks are out  

Let's be honest here.  It has nothing to do with the size of the gas tank.  It's because the bike is too ugly to sell at $16K.
If this thing was gorgeous people would be all over it.  And Honda has done gorgeous before - RC30, NC 30, 1984 VF1000R etc
You think Ducati has any chance of selling its 1098/1198 bikes if they were ugly?  Look what happened to the sales of the 999.
But people willingly pay the cash for the 848 and 1198 (and soon 1199) not just because of the way they perform, but because of how they look.

I ran into a bunch of Honda engineers test riding the VFR12 before it was released (I  have a pic of my old Guzzi 850 Lemans next to them), and the head engineer told me that he knew it was called 'Shamu' by the press.
Pretty much writing on the wall right there.

But still, for $10K new it is unbeatable.  
Posted on: December 28, 2011, 10:18:19 AM

I am intrigued by this the VFR12, but not enough to actually buy one.  Maybe in a few years when I see a great deal on a used one.

What is a great deal used?  Right now they are $10K new, discounted from $16K.
You will not be able to beat that used for a loooooong time.  And then you will be buying a used bike...
I'm thinking after this year Honda will only offer it as a special order model.

[Tpoppa]

What is a great deal used?  Right now they are $10K new, discounted from $16K.
You will not be able to beat that used for a loooooong time.  And then you will be buying a used bike...
I'm thinking after this year Honda will only offer it as a special order model.

As slow as sales of new ones have been, I expect resale value to be low.

[gritsngravy]

Let's be honest here.  It has nothing to do with the size of the gas tank.  It's because the bike is too ugly to sell at $16K.
If this thing was gorgeous people would be all over it.  And Honda has done gorgeous before - RC30, NC 30, 1984 VF1000R etc
You think Ducati has any chance of selling its 1098/1198 bikes if they were ugly?  Look what happened to the sales of the 999.
But people willingly pay the cash for the 848 and 1198 (and soon 1199) not just because of the way they perform, but because of how they look.

I ran into a bunch of Honda engineers test riding the VFR12 before it was released (I  have a pic of my old Guzzi 850 Lemans next to them), and the head engineer told me that he knew it was called 'Shamu' by the press.
Pretty much writing on the wall right there.

But still, for $10K new it is unbeatable.  
Posted on: December 28, 2011, 10:18:19 AM

What is a great deal used?  Right now they are $10K new, discounted from $16K.
You will not be able to beat that used for a loooooong time.  And then you will be buying a used bike...
I'm thinking after this year Honda will only offer it as a special order model.

Gotta love the fickle shallow nature of some motorcyclists.    For those that love the pose factor of certain bikes it seems no price is too high for them, it's just gotta look good parked up at Starbucks.    Not my bag but whatever floats the boat.     I'm not seeing anything ugly about the vfr 1200 but hell if it drops the price more, hell ya it's ugly and that gas tank oh my god!! You will die while riding that small tank....oh no let's not forget about the 'soft' paint and the ugly exhaust & headlight.    WA WA it's so uglyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

[atadaskew]

Gotta love the fickle shallow nature of some motorcyclists.    For those that love the pose factor of certain bikes it seems no price is too high for them, it's just gotta look good parked up at Starbucks.    Not my bag but whatever floats the boat.     I'm not seeing anything ugly about the vfr 1200 but hell if it drops the price more, hell ya it's ugly and that gas tank oh my god!! You will die while riding that small tank....oh no let's not forget about the 'soft' paint and the ugly exhaust & headlight.    WA WA it's so uglyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

It's not the fickle nature of some motorcyclists but apparently most motorcyclists.  Otherwise the VFR1200 would be selling at or close to the MSRP.
What explanation do you have for it not selling?  It's not the economy as many mfgs have shown gains in these trying times - including Ducati, Triumph and BMW.
The reality is once you price a 'toy' at $16K, it becomes a luxury and needs more than performance to sell.  It also needs looks.
Not just my opinion, but obviously the opinion of those in the market who have avoided it while buying other high end/high priced brands.

No matter to those who are getting a killer deal at $10K.  A black eye for Honda's perceived flagship - selling for less than their 600cc sport bike! - but a bulls eye for the savvy shopper.

[Rogue]

The success of BMW motorcycles rest mostly on their GS models (twins and singles).  In addition, BMW offers aggressive and very convenient financing options.  Bottom line, it's not BMW's K1300S that is pushing BMW motorcycle sales!

OTOH, Honda's financing deals suck and they are weak.  Not even near competitive.  Honda dealers are not pushing their financing deals either, which is a problem with most of the Japanese makes (not just Honda).  Keep in mind that Suzuki didn't even import much of any bikes in 2010 and/or 2011?  I can't recall which year.  Sportbikes are just NOT selling and it doesn't help that Financing for younger buyers are not easy to get if impossible.  

Honda gave VFR naysayers just about everything they wanted:  more power, hard bags, shaft drive.  Yet the same naysayers who said they will buy a VFR with all these features did not materialize in 2010.  Of course not.  They were unemployed or struggling or cautious.  I agree that $16k is a big pill to swallow and those who did were not in the market for a VFR1200 nor a BMW K1600S either.  My theory is a large majority of buyers with this kind of coin are older and fatter so they go buy more upright riding position sport-tourers because they are all old and want to be pampered.  

[Orson]

Let's be honest here.  It has nothing to do with the size of the gas tank.  It's because the bike is too ugly to sell at $16K.
If this thing was gorgeous people would be all over it.  And Honda has done gorgeous before - RC30, NC 30, 1984 VF1000R etc

This is the sport touring segment...

we appear in public wearing an aerostich suit without a hint of shame, so it stands to reason we would feel the same about our motorcycle's appearance  

[speedie]

Picked it up yesterday, short testride, ergos are a little tight, heli bars for sure, can't speak to the power as it only has 5 miles on it so didn't even hit the real power, handling seems very good, seems smaller than it is. i've been interested in this bike when it came out but $1600k was just too much. but at $10445 otd i couldn't pass it up. I know bmw has more standard features but for $6000 more $$ it should have! more impressions as i break it in.

[falconati]

Can somebody let me know where you're finding these for ~$10k OTD?

[swimmer]

Let's be honest here.  It has nothing to do with the size of the gas tank.  

I don't understand why people focus so much on gas tank size when the real problem is the shitty mpg.  If you look at Fuelly and check the stats on this motorcycle for the riders who have 25+ tanks in their stats you see that it's mid-high 30's for avg. mpg.  That's pathetic. That's about equal to my wifes Civic.  I normally get about the best mpg for a given vehicle compared to others on Fuelly so realistically I'd be looking at very low 40's for my avg. mpg.  No thanks.  Other than that I think the VFR has a lot to offer IMO.

[Rogue]

My VFR800 gets mid to high 30's.  It may get into the 40's on the highway but not average with twisties, city, and highway.

It's the same with my Buell 1125R with its stingy fueling.  

To be honest, those kinds of mileage numbers are plenty high enough for me.  If I wanted more I would get a Yamaha T-Max 500cc Scooter (which I really like too).  

As for overall range, if I can ride 180 miles on a tank of gas that is way plenty!  After 120 miles I'm ready to take a break!  I did the SS1000 on my VFR800 and I was regularly pushing 160-180 miles at a time in the Hwy, and trust me, I NEEDED to stop by then.  So people complaining about not having 200+ mile range boggles my mind.  

[atadaskew]

This is the sport touring segment...

we appear in public wearing an aerostich suit without a hint of shame, so it stands to reason we would feel the same about our motorcycle's appearance  

Sez the dood who owns an Aprilia Mille, Guzzi Le Mans and Thairumph Thruxton.

Wearing a 'Stich while riding those bikes reminds me of the scene where James Bond swims to shore to a party in a dry suit.  Once he gets to shore he takes the dry suit off, revealing a tuxedo underneath.  Sure it was a little crumpled, but it was still a tux..
Posted on: December 29, 2011, 09:12:05 AM

My VFR800 gets mid to high 30's.  It may get into the 40's on the highway but not average with twisties, city, and highway.

It's the same with my Buell 1125R with its stingy fueling.  

To be honest, those kinds of mileage numbers are plenty high enough for me.  If I wanted more I would get a Yamaha T-Max 500cc Scooter (which I really like too).  

Not good.

My Duc St4s makes a lot more powah than your VFR, and I average about 40mpg in the twisties, closer to 50mpg on the highway.
It also has a 5.8 gallon tank which gives it about a 250 mile touring range.
The point is not how long you can bear to sit on the bike - I too like to stretch after about 150 miles - but the fact that you can stop and relax anywhere.  Instead of having to look for a gas station.

p.s. the Tmax only gets about 55mpg.  The MP3 500 that I had got about 65mpg.

[Rogue]

I think the VFR800 tanks is smaller than 5.8 gallons.  I have to check.

In my limited experience of riding on even the longest day rides, 120 mile range is minimum requirement.  It's barely adequate really but will do as long as you pay attention to distance traveled.  I had to deal with that with my XB12R and it was a pain sometimes.  With the VFR800's 180+ mile range, I found it to be plenty and gave me ample opportunity to explore roads less travelled.  

Yes I hear you on the convenience of not having to look for a gas station every 180 miles.  But here's the rub:  if you have a 250 mile range you postpone fueling up 100 miles before the VFR800.  Fair enough.  What happens when you do that and you get to the end of that 250 miles and there is no gas station around?  Meanwhile, the VFR800 rider who filled up at 180 miles now has more fuel than you!  It's a theoretical situation at best.  Just saying that if you are not traveling across Hwy 50 in Nevada regularly, it shouldn't be such a big deal.

[Orson]

I don't understand why people focus so much on gas tank size when the real problem is the shitty mpg.  If you look at Fuelly and check the stats on this motorcycle for the riders who have 25+ tanks in their stats you see that it's mid-high 30's for avg. mpg.  That's pathetic. That's about equal to my wifes Civic.  I normally get about the best mpg for a given vehicle compared to others on Fuelly so realistically I'd be looking at very low 40's for my avg. mpg.  No thanks.  Other than that I think the VFR has a lot to offer IMO.

This VFR1200 owner sez fuelly told him he got a 42-43 mpg

Clearly being biased as I have VFR1200(!), i'm just back from a touring trip of just over a couple of thousand miles to the south of France and back in just over a week.  I'd classify the trip as high speed touring too i guess in general  - much of the motorway mileage in France is at a speed significantly higher than is legal in other countries

My best tank on the trip was 47.7 US MPG (over 57 UK MPG!) according to fuelly, and the average tank was around 42-43 US MPG I'd guess.

My average over more than 5200 miles is over 38 US MPG

[FJRmgm]

Let's be honest here.  It has nothing to do with the size of the gas tank.  It's because the bike is too ugly to sell at $16K.

+16,000

[robrm250]

Can somebody let me know where you're finding these for ~$10k OTD?

Abernathy Honda Union City,TN. I just bought one 0 miles brand new no demo $9600 OTD and they have on left.

[speedie]

Just got back from a break in ride, this bike is very fast, granted I'm not a racer and have never owned a sportbike but i do like to ride fast and this is the fastest bike i've had so far. still think the ergos are too tight for long days, i'm 50 years old so probably will take some getting used to. heli bars should help. handling is very good, still getting used to the bike but was able to do some high speed sweepers and was impressed. I agree with and am following the break-in on this site  http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm. have 45 miles on it now and going to change oil and filter. don't care for the stock exaust, better when the valve opens but aftermarket pipe is comming. taller windsheild also, i'm 6 ft and was getting a lot of wind on the face, not sure what kind yet, any input on what others have and how you like it would be appreciated. love the sportbike power just need to make a little more TOURING friendly.

[staedtler]

Can somebody let me know where you're finding these for ~$10k OTD?

 

http://www.cycletrader.com/listing/2010-Honda-VFR-1200F-(Manual-Transmission)-98407492



temptiing...tempting  

[robrm250]

Just got back from a break in ride, this bike is very fast, granted I'm not a racer and have never owned a sportbike but i do like to ride fast and this is the fastest bike i've had so far. still think the ergos are too tight for long days, i'm 50 years old so probably will take some getting used to. heli bars should help. handling is very good, still getting used to the bike but was able to do some high speed sweepers and was impressed. I agree with and am following the break-in on this site  http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm. have 45 miles on it now and going to change oil and filter. don't care for the stock exaust, better when the valve opens but aftermarket pipe is comming. taller windsheild also, i'm 6 ft and was getting a lot of wind on the face, not sure what kind yet, any input on what others have and how you like it would be appreciated. love the sportbike power just need to make a little more TOURING friendly.

I put the heli-bars,givi shield,putting lower pegs on tom.I like the shield I am 6'2.I also cant stand the exhaust ,I e-mailed DAM exhaust to get a quote on one shipped to me should here back soon.I like the DAM exhaust because I probably will eventually get hardbags.

[speedie]

nice, where did you get the lower pegs from? I also want the dam exaust,let me know what they say! I guess great minds think alike!!