1 Year Later (a VFR1200F Review)

[ZenMoto]

Ok, so January 23rd marked the 1 year anniversary of me buying the VFR1200, something I was thinking about Sunday as I was navigating the rippled, torn up, gritty, off-camber, crap-shoot that is Deer Creek Rd..

In that year I have managed a paltry 12,000 miles (give or a take a couple hundred) due to various family obligations, etc..

While I was riding around I started to think about the trap I always get myself into with vehicles.  I use them for a while, then something shiny and new comes along, and I find myself thinking "That would be so much cooler / better / more fun than what I have!"  It got me to switch from my trusty Tacoma to the FJ Cruiser (which I still love, but am not IN
love with ...really need a pickup).  And it's happened with several bikes I've owned; ...and I've owned a lot of bikes!

...granted, some, like the KTM 950 Adventure, for good reason, it really did kill my lower back to ride more than a couple hours at a time (unless it was off road, with a lot of standing).  In truth, most of the "I gotta have it" that I've experienced stemmed from a real need or deficiency in my current conveyance; the Magna just wasn't sporty enough anymore, the XR400 was terrible in the sand ...which the desert is full of, etc..

So while I was out and about on the VFR, I started wondering, what will replace the VFR when the time comes?  ...what could a bike offer that would make me want to give up the VFR and go with something else?

...and the answer I kept coming up with was ...nothing!

Granted, my VFR is MUCH improved from stock; it had SERIOUS issues from the factory, many of which are killing it on sales floors around the globe.  So here is my list of complaints / criticisms as it came from the factory, as well as the solutions (if any):

Fuel Range - If I ride in a sporty fashion I'm on the blinking light at 110 miles (but now know I have at least 30 miles until I NEED gas).
        If I baby it, I can get 46 mpg which gets me over 200 miles on a tank ...but I can't ever seem to baby it that much for a whole tank.  ...perhaps on a trip up the coast, at night ...in the fog!
        On the 2012 they've squeezed 0.4 gallons more into the space ...not much, but it helps.
       ***I've learned to live with it.  ...my Magna had worse range, and it never killed me, but it could be an issue should I ever get the chance to do another cross country trip!

Fuel Gauge - Ok, WTF Honda!!!  Very consistently, I will go 48 - 54 miles with before the 1st (of 7) bars on the gauge drops off.
         I will lose a bar every 10 miles after that until I'm blinking on empty (the final bar) at around 110 - 115 miles.  Is it really THAT hard to make a reasonably accurate gas gauge???
         ***not a big deal, just freakin' ANNOYING!!!

Power deliver / 1st & 2nd gear restriction - If you look at this photo you will see how bad the power delivery is in 1st gear from the factory (RED LINES are OEM POWER AND TORQUE):

         

         ...and here is the HORRIBLE 2nd gear, again RED lines are what you are looking at:

         

         ***If you looked at the BLACK lines, you'll see how the Bazzaz Z-Bomb improves performance
                  The Z-Bomb is just a plug in version of a known wiring harness hack, which fools the ECU into thinking you're in 3rd for 1st & 2nd.  The down side is, your dashboard displays 3rd from 1st - 3rd, ...I'm waaaay over caring about the dash display, the bike
is SO much better like this.
                  I'd LOVE to hear someone who knows (from Honda) explain why they felt like fucking up the bike this badly; it REALLY is THAT bad stock!!!  ...bad enough I was having buyers remorse until it was fixed!!!

Suspension - Well, what can I say, I'm not a skinny guy @ 6', 225#, so it's hard to judge stock suspension fairly.
         That said, on a $16,000 bike, it's criminal that Honda puts better suspension on their $10k sportbikes than on their flagship techno-tour de force.
         From the factory the settings all had to be zeroed and slowly dialed in (normal), but nothing, and I mean NOTHING could make the rear feel good (remember, I'm 225#, so this isn't shocking).  There is only preload and rebound damping front and rear, and that's too damned bad!!!  On the rear, with the sag set correctly (preload) you only had rebound left to play with.  
         Dial in more rebound damping and the ride gets brutally harsh and feels disconnected from the pavement.
         Dial in less rebound and suddenly you're riding on a pogo stick, just bouncing your way down the road; ...very unsettling.  The rear was so bad it was impossible to draw a conclusion about the front!

         ***I spent $1000 of my former KTM on an Ohlins shock!  It's still not perfect, and I still need to play with it more, but night and day better!!!
                  I was able to dial the front in to a very usable setting after getting the rear to settle down, which makes me very, very happy.
                  Even though it's still not 100% dialed in, I can now ride the bike as hard as my sight lines will allow, and feel confident in the process; impossible with the stock shock!

No center stand? - I thought this would be and issue ...until I thought about it!
         Honda wants something like $250 to add a factory center stand, PitBull wanted $150 for a rear stand that works in the OEM bracket.

         ***PitBull for the win!!!  I have their rear and front stands for the VFR for little more than the center stand would have cost.  ...it's not like I'm servicing a chain on the road!!!

Black paint on the tank - A minor quibble, but the day I brought the VFR home I noticed that the black section of the tank was already rashed up pretty good from just a quick spin in the Santa Monica Mts..
         The black paint is very soft, and black shows scratches badly!  I didn't want to wear through the paint on the tank like a buddy did on his matte black Speed Triple.

         ***TheTankSlapper.biz to the rescue.  For $30 I got a 3M tank protector kit from them that is nearly invisible and super tough.
         It took some patience to install, but it has proven worth while, and when it starts to wear out, I will install another set ASAP.

                   BEST $30 I've spent on the bike!!!

Buzziness - This is a me thing, I think.  Every VFR I've owned (4th & 5th gens) have made my throttle hand fall asleep; this one is no different.
         Exacerbated by the displacement, no doubt, it would make my hand fall asleep almost instantly on the slab (not good).

         ***Throttle Rocker, Throttlemeister bar ends, and gel grips have all been employed in an attempt to curb this, as well as some hokey "tuned resonance in-bar dampers" which don't do shit. The result is somewhat less vibration, possibly at a different RPM range, that make the bike much more user friendly for me.
         My hands still eventually go to sleep on the slab, but now I can lock the throttle and give my hand a rest, and it's not as severe to begin with!

Bar reach - Riding a friend's 6th gen VFR back to back with my 1200 confirms that the reach to the bars is just a little more aggressive than previous VFRs, and I notice it.
         At first my neck bothered me, though now I'm used to it. ...now it's just that my wrists get fatigued a bit after a day of riding.

         ***This could be as much due to my flabby core as the reach, but I'm willing to shed pounds more quickly than I'm willing to shed $350 on bar risers!

                   ...I may try Heli-bars in the future, but for now, it's just not worth the $$$ for a 3/8" increase in height.

Tires - Not surprisingly, the OEM tires are CRAP!

         ***Pilot Road 3 ...'nuff said!  These tires are the shizzle!  ...that's right, I just said SHIZZLE!!!

Luggage - It's small, but expensive!  ...but I really like it.  I don't pack heavy on long trips, so there's plenty of room in the 3 bags, and I got them thrown in for a decent price.
         The left bag will let significant water in if left sitting on the side stand out in the rain.  ...nothing seems to get in when in motion, but it definitely gets in while sitting (so use a WP bag when packing)
         Most size large and smaller helmets will fit in the trunk, no helmet (maybe a half shell) will fit in the side bags.  

       ***I love the mounting system and locks, and the look great on the bike.  I've wired and SAE power adapter to the bottom of the trunk, so my phone etc. can be charging while I'm out and about.

So that's my "As honest and thorough as I can be!" assessment of the
V12's negatives.

As for the positives, I'll just run through them quickly:

Power - Pure awesomesauce!  Now that the 1-2 thing is fixed, the bike is sheer joy to ride at any speed, on any surface.  She pulls like a freight train and will allow you to unleash the hooligan inside on a whim!

Comfort - Seats are highly personal, I've never had an OEM seat that didn't kill me  ...until now!  I can do canyons, literally, ALL day on this seat.  On the slab though, 3-4 hours start hurting (not bad for OEM).

Wind Protection - Without any of the overpriced OEM add-ons, it puts the wind right where you want it (for my 6' frame anyway), and I get NONE of the heat on my feet of previous VFRs.

Fit and finish - Simply stunning.  Not only does it look fantastic, but it's the easiest VFR to take apart for basic service yet.  ...I'll know more about valve service this spring!

Maintenance - Speaking of...  No chain!  The shaft not only feels like a well adjusted chain (very, very little noticeable lash) but it's super easy to change the oil (and the service interval is WIDE, though I change it more frequently than required, since it's so easy).

Handling - Have I mentioned, that with the new shock, I can ride the piss out of this thing???  It easily handles as well as my 4th gen VFR (which had Fox shock and Race Tech front and stands as the best handling bike I've ever owned).  ...that is some feat for a bike that weighs nearly 200# more.  

...you seriously don't feel the weight, and the bike only feels big after climbing off, and onto say ...a Superhawk or older VFR!  lol  ...once moving, forget it though, pure heaven!!!

Brakes - Dear Lord!  ...a bike this heavy shouldn't be able to stop this fast, but it does, and it has ABS too!

Bazzaz - Not only did they fix the 1st and 2nd gear BS from Honda, but they gave it the full fuel management system, complete with bar switchable mapping (why? ...who cares!)
         They also gave it traction control, again, complete with a bar mounted dial with settings from off to very aggressive control.  Did I mention the quick shift?  ...I don't use it all the time, but sometimes, it's SO much fun to blast up to 135 mph without ever letting off the throttle!  :wink:

Akropovic - Very, very nice exhaust.  Limited choices due to having the luggage (everyone makes a "hi-mount" system, that is incompatible with the factory bags) but Akro offers both, and it sounds amazing with the baffle out (the way I run it).  ...not annoyingly loud, but sounds great!

Grin Factor - Possibly the most important feature of any motorcycle!
        Grin factor is that thing that gets you out of the house at zero-dark:30
        It is what makes you decide to take Piuma - Schuerin - Saddle Peak - Tuna Cyn. - PCH to get to Malibu Market from the Mulholland / Malibu Cyn. intersection!

        It's why you make excuses not to take the cage to work ...even when it's cold and wet out.

This bike has Grin Factor in it's blood.  When I get on the VFR I find myself thinking things like "Should I run to the beach, or head up to Morro Bay ...I've got a couple hours!!!"

In the past year, there hasn't been a time I've gone out on the VFR and not come home to say "God I love that BIKE!!!".  ...true story!!!

If this one were to die and untimely death, or when it just plain wears out (which, with my lowish mileage of late, should take a long, long time) I don't think there's another bike that I would want. ...this is it.

For me, the VFR, as it currently stands, is pretty damned close to the perfect bike!!!  Could it use more range, sure.  Could I use a custom seat for long days, sure.  Do I wish it were less buzzy on the fwy, yeah, but not enough to get an inline 4.

If I had to buy a new bike tomorrow, I'd go get another VFR1200F; that's as high an endorsement as I can give a bike today!  

...so that's it.  My year in review from the seat of a 2010 VFR1200F.  No punches pulled, and I don't think I missed anything!

[Dan K]

Nice write up.  I guess you like your bike!  First I've heard of the 1st and 2nd gear issue - nice fix.

- Dan

[Justin]

Nice write up.  

- Dan

+1

Glad you are enjoying it. It wasn't what I wanted from Honda, but glad it's what you wanted. And the fuel gauge issue, mine does that too. But mine will go 60 or so miles before it crosses the full line, then drop like a rock in the middle, then do the same at the end. But if you look at the shape of the tank and the position of the arm, it makes sense.

[ZenMoto]

Actually, on paper, it isn't at all what I wanted.  ...I wanted Honda to make the Aprilia RSV4.

But after spending significant time on it, I've come to realize that it is a pretty great all arounder, just like the VFRs before it were.  I hear a lot of people complaining that it isn't a sportbike, or "sporty enough" for them ...makes me wonder if they've really ridden one.

I can, quite seriously, ride it just as hard, just as quickly (only faster in the straights) as my previous generation VFRs.  While I'm not a racer, and have no aspirations of making this a track-day bike, for real world sport riding, I can ride it every bit as fast as my sight lines allow as "reasonably sane" in the canyons.  ...and I'm not a particularly slow rider.

I think the biggest tragedy of this bike, is that Honda missed the mark so widely, in a few key areas, that really kill it for a chunk of the core enthusiasts (of which I generally count myself among).  The suspension lacks adjust-ability (trademark of all VFRs, sadly), and the range is a bit short ...not as short as people try to make it out to be, but short all the same.

If you look up the VFR1200 on fuelly.com, you'll see that mine has the most fill ups (at 94 as of today) with an average of 35.1, and that's mostly very aggressive canyon riding.   ...that's 172 miles to true-empty at an extremely spirited pace.  If you go with my best mileage (done cruising PCH from Morro Bay to Thousand Oaks, CA.) of 49.4, that's 242 miles on a tank ...not too shabby!

The 2012 adds a (whopping) 0.4 gallons, which doesn't help much, but doesn't hurt either.

The big shame is that Honda didn't see the resistance to the new bike coming, and that it was priced so high relative to past VFRs.  If Honda had gone out of their way to let VFR owners really get a feel for the 1200, and avoided some of their stupidity in the development (the 1st & 2nd gear handicap), they could have left a whole different impression on the market.

[Silverbird]

The '12 only adds .1 gallons but I hear they might de-restrict 1st and 2nd because of traction control.

Great to hear you enjoy is but you left out a couple of things that's a deal breaker for most. Looks and price.

[Justin]

Actually, on paper, it isn't at all what I wanted.  ...I wanted Honda to make the Aprilia RSV4.

And I wanted an CBR1100xx replacement  

Honestly, my biggest complaint with the bike when it came out was the price. But that seems to be a moot point now, seeing as you can grab them for $10k these days.

But it's nice to actual hear feedback from someone that has ridden it for a year, rather than the usual threads where us folks who have not ridden it bitch about what we don't like about it  

[mcrider007]

Suspension - Well, what can I say, I'm not a skinny guy @ 6', 225#, so it's hard to judge stock suspension fairly.
         That said, on a $16,000 bike, it's criminal that Honda puts better suspension on their $10k sportbikes than on their flagship techno-tour de force.
         From the factory the settings all had to be zeroed and slowly dialed in (normal), but nothing, and I mean NOTHING could make the rear feel good (remember, I'm 225#, so this isn't shocking).  There is only preload and rebound damping front and rear, and that's too damned bad!!!  On the rear, with the sag set correctly (preload) you only had rebound left to play with.  
         Dial in more rebound damping and the ride gets brutally harsh and feels disconnected from the pavement.
         Dial in less rebound and suddenly you're riding on a pogo stick, just bouncing your way down the road; ...very unsettling.  The rear was so bad it was impossible to draw a conclusion about the front!

         ***I spent $1000 of my former KTM on an Ohlins shock!  It's still not perfect, and I still need to play with it more, but night and day better!!!
                  I was able to dial the front in to a very usable setting after getting the rear to settle down, which makes me very, very happy.
                  Even though it's still not 100% dialed in, I can now ride the bike as hard as my sight lines will allow, and feel confident in the process; impossible with the stock shock!

Nice evaluation!    I have been waiting for someone who actually owns a VFR1200F to document that is comes with some of the worst suspension ever put on a modern motorcycle.  I was only able to ride one for 60 miles but I thought both ends were total pieces of shit...and it didn't matter what the surface was.  One of my friends (who owns a 07 VFR) also rode it because he didn't believe the suspension  could be as bad as I described but afterward he said my comments were point on.   I am surprised you could get the front end to work without new springs and re-valving but maybe that's something you should also consider.  As you said, its (almost) criminal that Honda put such cheap, non-adjustable suspension on their flagship techno-tour de force that they are actually trying to market as a sports bike.  I hope Honda loses a lot of money on this bike because anyone who paid anywhere near MSRP is going to be in the same position.

[ZenMoto]

The front really isn't that bad ...once you get the rear end to actually connect to the road.  The rear, it seemed to me, just had WAY too much compression damping, so no matter what you did it felt harsh and jittery.  ...so it was either stiff, harsh and jittery, or bouncy, harsh and jittery!  lol

With that settled, I was able to dial the front in reasonably well (which I also found surprising)!

[scottzilla]

Cool write up.

Reminds me a bit of the XX.  Overpriced on the showroom floor, inadequate suspension on their flagship Sport bike, long reach to the bars, EXPENSIVE luggage options, Enormous gas tank but it has you pull over with 2 gallons left in the tank (Yup-not quite the same but in the typical Honda gas guage spirit),
Handles better than you would think.
Honda doesn't stray far from it's roots (But I do have a center stand).

[squeezer]

Nice evaluation!    

Darn tootin'. I was hoping someone would give us a real world review. Thanks.  

[garry]

Great review. I haven't followed the bike at all, but was amazed at the before/after dyno curves you posted. How could Honda release something so crippled?

[scottzilla]

Great review. I haven't followed the bike at all, but was amazed at the before/after dyno curves you posted. How could Honda release something so crippled?

I think he's just being brutally honest.    

[mcrider007]

The front really isn't that bad ...once you get the rear end to actually connect to the road.  The rear, it seemed to me, just had WAY too much compression damping, so no matter what you did it felt harsh and jittery.  ...so it was either stiff, harsh and jittery, or bouncy, harsh and jittery!  lol

With that settled, I was able to dial the front in reasonably well (which I also found surprising)!

I thought both ends were way under sprung with way too much compression damping, the worst of both worlds...and the dealership had set up the front with max preload.  I wasn't that concerned about the shock since the shock can always be replaced but I didn't know what I could do with the forks since I live 225 miles from a good suspension shop (GP Suspension) and I figured it would take a couple of tries to get the valving right on a brand new model.... but even if they were able to work their magic on the forks, the compression damping would still be non-adjustable and I ride in temperatures that range from 40 to 105.

I really wanted to like the 1200F, and I did except for the suspension, but that was too  much of a deal breaker, even if my dealer were willing to sell it at cost (which they did after it sat in their showroom for a year).  After I did my test ride I went back and re-read every magazine and online "test" I could find and never found any negative comments about the suspension except for one lone comment that heavier riders might want stiffer springs.

[leanin]

I bought a leftover '10 VFR1200 less than 2 months ago and have a little over 2,000 miles on it...best January weather ever for motorcycling in OK, AR.  I'm very surprised at the criticism of the suspension.  I weigh 175lbs and am extremely impressed with the suspension on the new VFR.  The only time I've even considered changing the suspension is when riding 2-up.  I turned the preload up and it handled the 125lb wife just fine.  

For those familiar with the XX, for me the VFR suspension is much better than that on the two XX's I had('97 and '99).  BTW, the suspension on the '99 XX was MUCH better than that on the '97.  I bought all 3 of these bikes new, so the XXs didn't have clapped out suspension when I bought them.

I also have an '08 CBR1000RR and '06 MV Agusta Brutale.  I know comparing the VFR suspension to them is apples and oranges.  But, for the VFR's intended purpose and my purpose... sporty, sport-touring, I'm as happy with the suspension on the VFR as the CBR's... which is extremely happy.  The MV suspension, on the other hand, is quite bone jarring in comparison to the VFR and CBR's.

2 friends also have VFR1200s.  One weighs about 140lbs and the other weighs about 290lbs.  They've both fiddled with their adjusters and are very happy with the suspension on their's as well.  The 290lbs puts about 120,000 miles a year on motorcycles and swears that the stock VFR suspension is better than his Ohlins equipped Bandit 1250 and his Ohlins equipped ST1300.

[mcrider007]

I bought a leftover '10 VFR1200 less than 2 months ago and have a little over 2,000 miles on it...best January weather ever for motorcycling in OK, AR.  I'm very surprised at the criticism of the suspension.  I weigh 175lbs and am extremely impressed with the suspension on the new VFR.  The only time I've even considered changing the suspension is when riding 2-up.  I turned the preload up and it handled the 125lb wife just fine.  

Thank you for your input...and after reading your comments I don't know what to think.    You obviously have a lot of riding experience and some good bikes to use in comparison.  In my case, two of us rode the same bike about 3 weeks apart...over the same roads and at the same speeds.  We both have over 30 years of riding experience and owned dozens of bikes including VFRs.  I weigh about 215 without riding clothes and he is around 195.  Our sport bike riding skills are pretty equal, when we ride different bikes the one on the fastest bike is also the fastest rider.  On the day he rode the 1200F I was riding my C14 and when we got to our favorite twisty section with lots of bumps and broken pavement...he could not keep up with me....stating that the Honda was so unstable going through the uneven corners that he did not have confidence it would stick to the road and he had to back off the speed.  I knew exactly what he was talking about because I did the same thing on the same corners when I was on the 1200F.  

The only thing I can add is that the rebound damping felt fine, all the problems seemed to be with the spring rate and compression damping.  We both thought the engine was great.

[leanin]

mcrider007, wow, your response confuses me too!    I haven't ridden a C14 to make that kind of comparison.  But, now I want too!  I admit my favorite roads for the VFR aren't rough, broken and potholed.  Those are the type of roads I've only enjoyed on the 950 Adventure and other dual sports.  But, to me the VFR1200 handles those roads as well or better than any other sport/sport touring bike I've ridden.  Now, you have me wanting to bum a ride on a C14.  

[ZenMoto]

mcrisder007, I'll add that the OEM tires, combined with the not-so-great stock suspension meant that my first 3081 miles were at a much reduced from normal pace! ...but I still pushed them reasonably hard:





The stock tires SUCKED and made the bike feel even more vague than the suspension did!

The second set of tires I mis-ordered, and got Pilot Powers instead of Pilot Roads (hint, don't order tires online at 2am)!  lol

Didn't shoot the front, but you can see on the Powers that I'm still spending more time in the middle of the tire than the edges, but starting to get a feel for the bike (and favoring the left side a bit):



...this was at 5825 miles, so I only got 2744 miles out of that set.

It literally took me getting the Ohlins shock, a few weeks of dialing in the suspension (with the stock front) and a full set of Pilot Road 3s (about 4200 miles) to finally hit my comfort level on the bike.  Now, on my 2nd set of PR3s, I have them more than half shagged in about 1400 miles of canyon riding.

I don't have any pics of the 1st set of PR3s I took off the bike but they were definitely more worn on the sides than the middle finally, and are definitely THE tire for this bike.

As I said above, I can now ride this bike as fast, or faster, than any of my previous VFRs over the same roads ...definitely faster in the straights!  lol

[atadaskew]

  As you said, its (almost) criminal that Honda put such cheap, non-adjustable suspension on their flagship techno-tour de force that they are actually trying to market as a sports bike.

Honda also does that with their flagship touring bike.  My Wing 1800 had crap suspension too.  A popular mod was to go to Traxxion Dynamics but that is big $ and seeing the Wing now is over $20K...

It seems they only put decent suspension on their CBR bikes.

[mcrider007]

mcrider007, wow, your response confuses me too!    I haven't ridden a C14 to make that kind of comparison.  But, now I want too!  I admit my favorite roads for the VFR aren't rough, broken and potholed.  Those are the type of roads I've only enjoyed on the 950 Adventure and other dual sports.  But, to me the VFR1200 handles those roads as well or better than any other sport/sport touring bike I've ridden.  Now, you have me wanting to bum a ride on a C14.  

Well, I didn't mean to imply that the C14's suspension is all that great.  The front end is over sprung with 1.2 KG springs and the shock has too much compression damping but on that day I was easily out running my riding partner.  He was being conservative since he was riding a demo but he was also very frustrated at how unstable the 1200F was on uneven and broken pavement.  I recently upgraded the C14's suspension with fully adjustable ZX-14 forks (with heavier springs) and a Penske shock.  I think if you rode my C14 today you would be impressed.

[mcrider007]

Honda also does that with their flagship touring bike.  My Wing 1800 had crap suspension too.  A popular mod was to go to Traxxion Dynamics but that is big $ and seeing the Wing now is over $20K...

It seems they only put decent suspension on their CBR bikes.

Been there, done that.  When I tell people the GL1800 has crap suspension they think I am a noob and give me strange looks when I tell them the GL1800 only has a cartridge in the right fork and and a pretty useless damper rod in the left fork.   I had Traxxion rebuild the OEM shock and went for the cheap $125 spring upgrade kit for the forks.  It still did not have as good as ride as my FJR but was a huge improvement over stock.  If it had been my only bike I probably would have written Traxxion a check for $1200 and got the AK-20s for the forks.

[mcrider007]

It literally took me getting the Ohlins shock, a few weeks of dialing in the suspension (with the stock front) and a full set of Pilot Road 3s (about 4200 miles) to finally hit my comfort level on the bike.

You seem to be burning through tires at a pretty fast rate.     If you are OK with the OEM springs and have any adjustment left in the rebound damping, you might get better performance/ride by reducing the compression damping with a lighter fork oil.  Go to:

http://www.peterverdone.com/archive/lowspeed.htm

and look at the oil viscosity chart at the bottom of the page.  I think Honda puts SS-7 is their sport bikes so you can use that as a baseline.  I would guess you need an oil that is about 15-20 percent lighter to overcome the excessive compression damping.

[atadaskew]

Been there, done that.  When I tell people the GL1800 has crap suspension they think I am a noob and give me strange looks when I tell them the GL1800 only has a cartridge in the right fork and and a pretty useless damper rod in the left fork.   I had Traxxion rebuild the OEM shock and went for the cheap $125 spring upgrade kit for the forks.  It still did not have as good as ride as my FJR but was a huge improvement over stock.  If it had been my only bike I probably would have written Traxxion a check for $1200 and got the AK-20s for the forks.

On the upside, the suspension on the Wing was better than my Valk Interstate.

[Meemuh]

The '12 only adds .1 gallons but I hear they might de-restrict 1st and 2nd because of traction control.

Great to hear you enjoy is but you left out a couple of things that's a deal breaker for most. Looks and price.

Nice write up...I like the first hand info better than what you find in a mag.
I won't buy one, but I like how they look.  

[Rincewind]

Thanks for the very informative write-up, ZenMoto.  

[FJRmgm]

interesting write-up on the bike.

For what that bike costs to purchase, the list of deficiencies should be much smaller..  

I've never owned a bike with a 110 mile fuel range - that is a deal killer to me.

But, glad you are happy with it.

[TwoWhldTerror]

interesting write-up on the bike.

For what that bike costs to purchase, the list of deficiencies should be much smaller..  

I've never owned a bike with a 110 mile fuel range - that is a deal killer to me.

But, glad you are happy with it.

How in the hell does a company make a sport TOURING bike with such pitiful fuel range?

[Silverbird]

I am glad you are happy with it as well and I'd love to own one but having to put all that money and mods into a bike that expensive and considered a do-it-all bike.

[leanin]

interesting write-up on the bike.

For what that bike costs to purchase, the list of deficiencies should be much smaller..  

I've never owned a bike with a 110 mile fuel range - that is a deal killer to me.

But, glad you are happy with it.

I always get at least 160 miles out of a tank on the VFR1200.  I had a SuperHawk that would only get 110 miles out of tank.  It was a FUN SPORT touring bike.  But, I definitely had to plan the gas stops in Montana and I never took a big trip without a siphon hose.  

[Acadian Rider]

Nice write-up ZenMoto.  

I have a weakness for Honda products (see my avatar) but the range would be a deal breaker for me.  

I did a 4,300 mile trip with 3 other riders lat year and one of them had to fuel every 150 miles.  That was a pain in the butt.  

 

[ZenMoto]

Glad you guys liked the write up.  ...I forgot to mention the grips (a definite negative).  The OEM grips are terrible; no other word for it.  My preference is a set of the ribbed (for her pleasure?) BMW grips, which make my hands much, much happier.

The range is definitely not tour-worthy, but is easily sport-tour worthy.  On a cross country burn it would be a paint to stop every 150-160 miles (which is exactly what I had to do on my VFR 800 when I rode that cross country).  I haven't seen a VFR get over 200 miles on a tank since my 4th gen (carbureted bike), but on the freeway I can average 40+ mpg on the 1200, which is good for 196 miles, if I take it really easy I can get mid 40s.

...most of my riding is in the canyons these days, and with the tight roads we have here, that means an average of 32ish mpg ...but that's NOT touring mileage!  lol

My list of complaints seems long, but it's really not significantly different from any other bike I've owned; it's just the sticker price that makes it seem overly-harsh.  Every bike has a bunch of foibles, some people just refuse to admit them!  lol

My evaluation was 100% honest (and somewhat picky), but VFR owners are a picky bunch.

All that said, I've yet to have someone ride my bike who didn't come back saying "Hmm, I could really get used to that!".  

[Paul B]

Thats really suprising. I have had 22 motorcycles, Mostly sportbikes (R1, GSXR750 & 1000, 2 Hayabusa's, 1100XX...) and currently ride an FJR. I am 46 years old, 5'10", 225 and got to take a new VFR for a 60 mile test ride. I loved it. I thought the suspension was great. I didn't think the reach tot he bars was to far at all. Felt like they made it for me. I'm thinking of buying one this week because I liked it so much. I also thought the grips felt great.

Paul B

[DaleFranks]

Thats really suprising. I have had 22 motorcycles, Mostly sportbikes (R1, GSXR750 & 1000, 2 Hayabusa's, 1100XX...) and currently ride an FJR. I am 46 years old, 5'10", 225 and got to take a new VFR for a 60 mile test ride. I loved it. I thought the suspension was great. I didn't think the reach tot he bars was to far at all. Felt like they made it for me. I'm thinking of buying one this week because I liked it so much. I also thought the grips felt great.

Paul B

+1

I was in almost exactly your situation last month. Except, I DID buy it. 4 weeks and 1100 miles later, I've discovered one horribly disappointing thing about the VFR1200.

It BEGS you to...do things. Awful, illegal things. Adrenaline-surging, V-4 growling things. Things you absolutely, positively, cannot do. It is a minute-by-minute struggle not to lay my palm heavily on the throttle, feel and hear that growly V-4 surge, and take off like a rocket. 100MPH on the VFR 1200 is nothing. It’ll do that in third, with plenty of top end to spare before redline. It is positively painful to obey traffic laws on the VFR in a way the FJR never was.

And now I live with that pain every day.

[staedtler]

And now I live with that pain every day.

hang in there bro...hang in there  

[falconati]

Thats really suprising. I have had 22 motorcycles, Mostly sportbikes (R1, GSXR750 & 1000, 2 Hayabusa's, 1100XX...) and currently ride an FJR. I am 46 years old, 5'10", 225 and got to take a new VFR for a 60 mile test ride. I loved it. I thought the suspension was great. I didn't think the reach tot he bars was to far at all. Felt like they made it for me. I'm thinking of buying one this week because I liked it so much. I also thought the grips felt great.

Paul B

If it feels right to you, get one - they're an absolute steal at the 10/11k you can get one for brand new.  I was looking at one, but realized I only wanted it because of the great price.  I haven't been able to ride it, otherwise I might just buy it.

[Kraz]

Very nice write up!

I certainly like seeing all the thoughts in one nice, well-thought out post from someone with plenty of experience.

 

With all the differences in opinion here - it's no wonder nobody can build the perfect bike.  

[Silverbird]

I just don't get the crap suspension thing. I weigh 160 and as an example think the stock ST1300 suspension is excellent.  I guess I just don't ride that hard.  Could anyone who dislikes the stock VFR suspension say the same thing about an ST1300?  All the mags adore the suspension, not that you can trust them.

[MisterSmooth]

Nice writeup and thorough explanation of both the good things and the bad things about the 1200F.  Thanks for taking the time.

And that opening photo is terrific!   Lovin' that!

[evilted]

I'm "only" 185 lbs, but most Japanese bikes seem under-sprung and insufficiently damped to me.  

If the widely held/oft cited belief that Japanese manufacturers use a 160 lbs rider as their suspension tuning reference is correct, then it seems likely that you'd find the stock suspension on most Japanese makes to be better sprung and damped than a heavier rider will.

I just don't get the crap suspension thing. I weigh 160 and as an example think the stock ST1300 suspension is excellent.  I guess I just don't ride that hard.  Could anyone who dislikes the stock VFR suspension say the same thing about an ST1300?  All the mags adore the suspension, not that you can trust them.

[Silverbird]

Maybe so, my XX stock was garbage all the way around but that thing was designed in the mid-90's.  Getting on my Dad's ST1300 surprised the hell out of me.

Time to piss some people off/conradict myself/plant tongue in cheek

The ideal body weight for a 5'10" man is about 155-160lbs. The average American is probably closer to 175.  You can't scream at Honda for not suspending a bike that won't hold up your fat ass.  The aftermarket has your solution, but just like your double bacon cheeseburgers, you are going to have to pay for it.

[evilted]

Hah, let's not pretend Honda's indifference means they give a damn about the average American's health.  

Even assuming that the "ideal" figure you're quoting has anything to do with anything  (the US Dept of Health has a BMI calculator that claims I'd be in the "healthy" range at a weight so shockingly low that I can't imagine being strong enough to carry a single bag of groceries to the car.)  The Big 4 are sending under-sprung bikes -- bikes that do not fit the requirements of the average American -- to the American market to save themselves a few bucks.  If Honda wants to assume that the average CBR600RR rider is 160 lbs, they can do it under the pretense that such bikes are race replicas, but a Goldwing or an ST1300?  C'mon.  

BMW riders may disagree as I lack firsthand experience here, but Ducati and BMW seem not to have this problem (all of my Ducs have had vastly better suspension, including the non-Ohlins bits).  As far as the Japanese are concerned, the American motorcycle market is small, and does not account for enough of their annual output for the Big 4 to feel motivated enough to make the bikes fit the market better.  Compare this with the history of Japanese cars in the comparatively large and lucrative American car market, where the product has continually been changed and refined to fit American needs rather than trying to make the American fit the product.

Japanese motorcycle sales in the US have cratered since 2008, whereas BMW and Ducati have done pretty well.  I think there might be a connection.   So, Honda can do whatever it wants, and it will suffer the consequences accordingly.  

The ideal body weight for a 5'10" man is about 155-160lbs. The average American is probably closer to 175.  You can't scream at Honda for not suspending a bike that won't hold up your fat ass.  The aftermarket has your solution, but just like your double bacon cheeseburgers, you are going to have to pay for it.

[Silverbird]

SO I just read the DCT wet weight it 644!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WTF!!!!  With a centerstand and hard bags that 100lbs heavier than a blackbird...on 30 lbs lighter than a C14, and roughly the same as an FJR! Dammit! Just when I was getting excited! What is it about the bike that carries it's weight so well? Does having a narrow V4 make that much of a difference?

[Silverbird]

I just rode a '10 w/o DCT.  Not all that impressed. It feels every bit as heavy as it's 600lb spec sheet says, contrary to every single review I've read.  The motor is fabulous, but mine had horrible fueling around 3-4K. I do love how they ditched the George Jetson whiney gear driven cams. Those 800's are so gay sounding! 1200 now sounds like a muffeled Motogp bike, it's sweet. Even though it vibrates quite a bit aound town, it was smooth as silk on the highway.  I didn't like the way it turned though, I didn't hit any canyons but it just feels so long. Suspension on the highway is also pretty rough. Shaft drive is perfect, so is the gearbox, and I swear it's a ton faster than my bird below 8K, but I didn't take it above that.

Overall, if I was looking for a direct XX replacment, I'd probably get one with the DCT and mod it out, but I'm moving on from sportbikes. Also rode a Tiger 1050 and friggin loved that thing. Me want!

[expatbrit]

Overall, if I was looking for a direct XX replacment, I'd probably get one with the DCT and mod it out, but I'm moving on from sportbikes. Also rode a Tiger 1050 and friggin loved that thing. Me want!

And you can get a used Tiger 1050 for not too much. I (did) see them around a lot on CL and similar for cheap.

[supergonzo]

I bought the VRF1200F DCT model in 2010.

I have this bike as well as a Victory Vision Tour Bike 2010, A Harley Street Glide 2009, A Vengence Chopper, and during the past 3 years I have had:

Harley Road Glide, Harley Heritage Softail, Suzuki GSX 1100.

First let me say thanks for the great review of the VFR1200F, Nice honest opinions, here is my take on your comments  after riding 9000 miles so far on the bike.

Fuel Range...exactly my experience 100 miles without any bars dropping , then 1 bar every ten miles.......after 130 miles I need gas most times

Power Delivery... I have no issues with mine although I have the DCT model and I have not used any Bazzaz products nor would they fit the DCT model

Suspension.... I am 215lbs and 6'3  and the suspensions seems fine, actually rides a bit smoother then my much adjusted Victory Vision.

No Center Stand.......I agree should have it, although don't think I have missed it in my rides all across the country with the bike

No Black Paint issues

Buzziness........Yes there is a mild vibration at speed, although its certainly no Harley after miles on the super slabs you can notice it.........Going to try the Gel Grips, I have tried the foam grips, this is NOT a big issue for me though

Bar Reach....stock position is too aggressive and I have the Heli Bars... I was probably the first one to order them! and they Help a bit, although they can't made any taller or wider without interfering with the fairing, so there is a slight improvement only, but I'll take it

Tires.... They are Okay, but certainly no world beaters, although they wear well......  Pilot Road 3's sound good

Luggage... I have the trifecta of luggage and yes small, expensive.....BUT I LOVE them, top box fits any full face helmet, side bags will take a half helmet only.

------------------

Not mentioned.......

Not having a clutch.......leads to very careful throttle control especially at off-idle around parking lot speeds, since you cannot slip the clutch to smooth things out....very annoying but expected

Instant throttle response .....when planning to go slow this is very touchy abd difficult to manage properly....however the reverse is also true, when you want instant throttle at stoplight dragracing its there

Do I need  DCT....NO ...Do I love it YES...why not the bike shifts faster than I possibly could and smoother at speed, and engine has enough power in any gear, I live in long Island NY, where 5 million people live in an area 10 miles wide, its the perfect commuting/around town solution and it can blow the doors for almost anything else on the road!!

No Cruise Control...(supposed to be a sport tourer??), No radio, No heated grips ( unless you for go the 12 volt accessory outlet), No Traction Control,

Gauges... well they are sport bike gauges at best, and as mentioned the fuel gauge sucks big time.

============================================================================

Now for the good stuff

Power....completely BAD-ASS, Torque is EVERYWHERE in EVERY gear...above 6000 RPM has catapult like acceleration.

Comfort... I thought I would hate this bike on long rides....wrong seat doesn't look like much but is comfortable, have been on the bike 300 miles at a time with no issues

Wind Protection...great if you duck below the winshield, have tried many aftermarket windshields, nothing helps, this is a sport bike windshield so live with it.

No heat issues even on hot days from this bike

Fit and Finish....perfect looks like a well designed and finished product

Maintenance.....NONE has always started and run perfectly, suspension after much bashing just fine

Handling.......IF you are tall like me, you will tend to ride it in a more upright position which will almost make your elbows lock out...not great for handling, but fine for straights......when the twisties come calling you bend forward behind the windshield and it will  handle very pleasantly...to quote the cliche....it feels lighter than its size....not bad for 600+ pounds

Brakes...Great

Exhaust...Perfect

Grin Factor........OKAY here we go. the important stuff........ Lets put it this way....If my house and all my possessions burn to the ground, I would be most sad if this bike was damaged. This bike rocks, I want to ride3 this bike every day, and almost everywhere , even out west... My friends are always telling me " take the Victory, on this long ride"  I dont care.... I only wanna ride this bike... How much so.

I recently just put in an order for the Traction Control, re-mapped 2012 Blue Version, I shall have it next week, And I am trying to convince my wife who rides a Sportser to use this bike on long rides, since it does have bags.
If that doesn't work I end up with twop almost identical bikes, one of which I will not need...... so will I sell this 2010 VRF1200F         Not a chance I'll keep it, even if I am not riding because I'll have a new one.

Nobody who has this bike dislikes it, anyone I ever gave a test ride to on my bike can't believe how much fun it is.... and thats the point of riding isn't it??

[supergonzo]

Got this today

[supergonzo]

Always liked the look

[supergonzo]

and it now has this

[supergonzo]

And has these shoes.......I like them MUCH better than the Dunlops, these babies really grip nice, feels like a quicker turn-in, smoother as well

[supergonzo]

Changes

Seat significant change, has backrest for aggressive riding, now you dont slide off the back of bike while pinning the throttle !  A slight bit taller seat height I think

Brakes   Linked ABS works well, consistent controlled stops

ECU remapped no more twitchy throttle upon initial acceleration, who needs a clutch

Torque appears to have more low end grunt then before, much quicker throttle response

Traction Control...haven't tested its limits yet , but sure nice to have

Tires....Much more grip and smoother ride than Dunlops...and makes the bike feel nimble, quicker turn-in response

Gauges appear to be the same with addition of Traction control light

Vibration at top end, appears to be less, although the bike is brand new as of today

[Yokel]

Pretty Bike Gonzo!

Congrats!  Thanks for the update on changes!

[DosEquis00]

My local dealer was kind enough to let me try out the VFR and I have to say it is a solid machine. Better get up and go that I was expecting and it will stop on a dime. I have to add that the paint looks magnificent in the sunlight.

[Dave W.]

I learned alot reading this review and the comments.

I think the bike is gorgeous, sounds like the suspension from the factory is rider specific and aftermarket solutions are out there if needed.

I have been eying the K1300S, maybe I will go look closely at a VFR.

[supergonzo]

BTW, just as a side note, since I still have both bikes. I did get to drag race the new 2012 blue VFR1200F DCT against the 2010 model. The new bike with only 200 miles on it, is probably still a little tight in the engine. ( I know drag racing it, not a good idea this early on)  Anyway with swapping drivers and using manual and both DCT modes the 2012 Blue VFR1200 definitely has more low end torque. The newer bike is much faster out of the hole and will easily get 2-4 bikes lengths up on the 2010 before the power between them appears to even out.

The 2012 seat as I suspected is a bit higher but also has more cushion to it, I like it better then the old seat and no doubt when available to order separately could be interchanged with the 2010 bike.

I still ride the red bike often as the new 2012 Blue bikes do not have the color matched optional bags available yet to purchase, so unless I am fiddling around town, I take the 2010 red bikes since I have storage space.
I am tempted to buy another set of red bags and paint them blue if I cant get any bags for the new ride in the next couple of months!!  Although I am hoping possibly the 2012 version of the saddle bags might offer more room, so I am holding out

[DosEquis00]

BTW, just as a side note, since I still have both bikes. I did get to drag race the new 2012 blue VFR1200F DCT against the 2010 model. The new bike with only 200 miles on it, is probably still a little tight in the engine. ( I know drag racing it, not a good idea this early on)  Anyway with swapping drivers and using manual and both DCT modes the 2012 Blue VFR1200 definitely has more low end torque. The newer bike is much faster out of the hole and will easily get 2-4 bikes lengths up on the 2010 before the power between them appears to even out.

I believe the ECU was reprogrammed to allow more torque in the lower gears. Hopefully in the future there is an update for the 2010.

[supergonzo]

DosEquis00   Glad you enjoyed the VFR1200F on the test ride, it is most certainly a solid bike. And for me as you can probably tell I happen to like it alot.

The problem I think with this bike is it looks like a sport bike, and therefore the pure Cruiser guys automatically disregard it here in the states. The pure sport "superbike" guys have lighter and more importantly cheaper bikes to choose from and therefore it doesn't float their boat either.

Although in Europe this bike has a relatively decent following as there isn't alot of big cruisers on the road, and most of the riders have smaller displacement bikes with no clip-on saddle bags, so this bike is kind of a step up for them without having to pay an enormous amount for a full dresser type. And is easier to get around town in as well.

SO Although I am a big fan of this bike and anyone who rides it will be too, the fact is for most here in the US, its

Too Expensive
Not Cruiser looking enough or for that matter not enough Cruiser amenities  in it
Not pure sporty enough for the Rice Rocket crowd

Again that doesn't make it a bad bike, its a wonderful machine, technically ahead of its time .....it just needs an audience that feels it fits their needs.

[DosEquis00]

supergonzo,

Thanks for the response. One of the things I am fine with on a bike is not falling into a niche. The seating position of the VFR was just comfortable for my size. The narrowness of the rear cylinders makes this bike feel more like a twin. The fit and finish is superb and handling is truly impressive. Honda has always had a knack of making the weight disappear once the bike is moving. It is only a matter of time before the bike is in my garage. I have been test riding a lot of bikes over the summer and this one stands out as a total package.  

[atadaskew]

Although in Europe this bike has a relatively decent following as there isn't alot of big cruisers on the road,

When I was in Europe last year I was surprised as to how many big cruisers there were.  Quite the opposite of your remark.

[Dave W.]

I went and sat on a '12 VFR

Top notch fit and finish, seat felt good, I didn't feel the riding position was too agressive. What's more is 15 minutes prior I was sitting on a brand new K1300S but the VFR just felt a little more like a bike I would ride.

I have been on a spending spree this year so maybe I can pick up a left over '12 VFR in the spring. I do think it's my next motorcycle though!

[Rogue]

Whenever I think about replacing my 2007 VFR800, one of the very few bikes that come to mind is of course the VFR1200.  

However, I feel like the Marines looking to replace their beloved M16's!  What will I gain by spending $16k?  

More Power - This is nice but how often will I use it?  It seems I don't use the 800's 100rwhp as much as I should already.
Shaft Drive - I like this one a lot.
ABS - Nice to have but don't care.  I have a car if I want to be safer.
Hard Luggage - I love lane splitting with impunity in SoCal so wide bags on a bike will limit me.  Probably will rarely use it so don't care.
More Weight! - This is Bad!  My 800 is already 550 wet.  Who needs another 50 lbs. on top of that?

So more power and shaft drive for $16k and new bike smell.  Not sure it's worth it so I'm holding off.

Having said that, if my VFR800 was worn out I would definitely strongly consider the 1200 to replace it.  As it is, my 800 barely has 22k miles.

[motormike]

ABS - Nice to have but don't care.  I have a car if I want to be safer.

That's an interesting viewpoint.  I keep waffling back on forth on whether or not I want the ABS version of the VFR800.  Although, I think I look at it more from more of a "saving plastics" viewpoint.

: )

[Rogue]

I'm not against ABS, just don't care if it's there or not on a motorcycle.  If it's standard, great!  I'll take it.  

My point of view is, the biggest threat to me on a bike is a red light runner that will hit me from the side, or a head-on collision on a mountain pass.  The best ABS won't save my life in that situation.  OTOH, being in a safety cage with airbags and side impact protection probably will.  In any case, there isn't much I can do about those two major killers of motorcyclists except drive a very safe automobile.

[Carbonero]

In that year I have managed a paltry 12,000 miles (give or a take a couple hundred) due to various family obligations, etc..

That's more than most of the know-it-all blowhards around here. (sadly, I have to include myself in that this year)

As for the other blowhards with free time, there's no excuse for not riding; it's been a wonderful summer.