THE UTTER FAILURE OF THE POLICE

[Royal Tiger]

Come on RT.  Income generation?  From charging at single vehicle accidents?  You don't really believe this do you?  My former agency back in the 70's had this same policy and it was the feeling of the administration that if there is a crash (not accident) then someone did something wrong.  Not saying I agreed with that all the time but there is a lot of truth to this.  The problem with this though is it can be difficult to convict without witness testimony or an admission from the person at fault.  Luckily we moved away from this policy over time but it never had anything to do with income generation.  If an agency can make decent income over single vehicle crashes then I'd hate to see the stats there for crashes.  

I can agree, but what purpose is served in citing a driver or rider in a single vehicle crash?  If you come across a motorcycle that low sided due to gravel in the roadway, the guy has already had a banged up bike, crashed gear, and probably needs a new helmet.  What does a ticket for careless driving do for him or his perception of the police?  That's why I said "reeks of income generation" as it is unnecessary.

[county]

Well, maybe people need to start paying attention and stop crashing with such frequency.  

Yeah, I support that....

[PatM]

I can agree, but what purpose is served in citing a driver or rider in a single vehicle crash?  If you come across a motorcycle that low sided due to gravel in the roadway, the guy has already had a banged up bike, crashed gear, and probably needs a new helmet.  What does a ticket for careless driving do for him or his perception of the police?  That's why I said "reeks of income generation" as it is unnecessary.

Like FKB says, I doubt if that would generate anything worthwhile. It may not be revenue generation but maybe preempting lawsuits? 

[Formerly Known as Bigfoot]

I can agree, but what purpose is served in citing a driver or rider in a single vehicle crash?  If you come across a motorcycle that low sided due to gravel in the roadway, the guy has already had a banged up bike, crashed gear, and probably needs a new helmet.  What does a ticket for careless driving do for him or his perception of the police?  That's why I said "reeks of income generation" as it is unnecessary.

I agree that LE does not need to cite in every case.  I think it's more dumbass policy makers instead of income generation.  

[tomek]

I`ve personalty started couple cop bashing threads but this one is extremely lame . OP was ridiculous .

As far as ticketing drivers in single vehicle accidents with property damage , I can compare it to punching someone who has already been knock down .

Friend , sort of ,  low sided , oil on the pavement , blah , blah , he was not going fast by any means . He is a good rider , ATGATT , etc .
 Bruised ego , scratched fairings , broken clip on . Bike not ridable but just barely . He calls for towing but while he waits cop shows up and gives him a ticket   .

He lives in Madison WI , it happened not far form his home although I`m not sure what agency gave him a citation .    

[spd2918]

He lives in Madison WI , it happened not far form his home although I`m not sure what agency gave him a citation .    

Prolly da State Patrol.




My ex-father-in-law owns and drives a flatbed semi hauling steel tubing.  He keeps his equipment in top shape and he is a careful driver.  He had an idiot in Michigan try to pass him on a slick road.  The idiot spun into his drive wheels and forced a jackknife.  The Michigan Trooper cited my father-in-law for not securing his load because the tubing shifted when he totaled his truck and trailer.  That was some bullshit there and I'd tell the trooper that to his face.  That's the shit that makes people prejudice against cops.  

I agree that LE does not need to cite in every case.  I think it's more dumbass policy makers instead of income generation.  

This, though I am not convinced they are strongly encouraged to deny themselves common sense.  The dumbass policy Bigfoot is talking 'bout is this:
Sergeants want to show their officers are doing more under their watch while captains want to impress their bosses.  When it happens it is BS and leads to unnecessary tickets.  I get yelled at about once a month to write more, but it is not about income.  We don't see a dime; in fact it costs my department money for court.  I won't write one more ticket than I think I should and here's why:

Nice people that work, pay their taxes, and try to do the right thing end up getting tickets that are not necessary (i.e. speeding cites in an area where there are no accidents).  They generally pay the fine because they are good people and don't want / can't to miss work to fight it.

Dipshits that don't have licenses, drive drunk often, don't have insurance, and will flee after hitting your wife in her Toyota will never pay the fines on the tickets you write them.  They are the same pukes that beat their girlfriends and don't pay for their babies.

So if I were to go out and hammer traffic (to make my boss think I am not lazy) then nice people will get screwed with fines and the dipshits will continue to not have any consequence.

[Royal Tiger]

Again people I never said that was the purpose, I have said "reeks" of income generation, which means that the people that don't deserve to be cited feel target for the purpose of making money over safety.  It's all a part of the negative public image that gets perpetuated by this kind of nonsense, and what spd said in his opening paragraph above this post.  There are times when you shouldn't cite.  That was my point.  

[sisurider]

I guess I can't speak for the cops in anyone else's region, but in my not-so-humble experience in Northern MN and the Upper Peninsula of MI, the cops have been pretty reasonable. They don't bat an eye at 10-15 over in low traffic areas, and once when I was parked at a local river to chase some trout I had a state trooper pull over just to talk about fishing for a few minutes. I figure if they see fit to give me a ticket, I probably earned it.

This excludes college/university public safety officers though, who in my experience have always been overly eager to pull everyone over. Of course, if I had to keep watch over a bunch of college students I'd probably not be the friendliest guy either.

[ZenMoto]

I figured this would be a multi-pager when I saw the thread title!  lol

I love people who say one person's perspective is BS because it's not like that *where they live* with no experience whatsoever of that person's region.  For instance, here in SoCal the tickets are retarded ...on every level.  I've been cited twice in the past 3 years during my commute to/from work.  Both times in my truck, both times driving no faster than the traffic around me.  ...just a random "road tax" pull over; it's just how it works around here, and it is complete BS!  I don't speed excessively (I say that, because around here, traffic generally moves, when it moves, at about 75mph in a 65 zone).  So I don't speed *excessively* just move with traffic, get to work, go home, etc..

Strangely, I almost never get pulled over on the bike, because the cops who patrol the canyons aren't out there to write the statistically desired number of citations per review period (it's not a quota, but you'd better not be far off the average).  ...the cops in the canyons are looking for ass-hats, and that's who they pull over and cite. ...I don't ride / drive like a squid, and when I do haul ass, it's in an out of the way area, where I'm no danger to anyone and highly unlikely to see many other vehicles, let alone cops.

So I've had those 2 tickets ...in my truck.  Both were, miraculously, for 81 in a 65.  In both cases, as confirmed by my GPS, I was doing between 72 - 76 mph, and there were faster vehicles to my left.  The cost of these tickets, all said and done, NOT counting traffic school, was in the range of $300 each!  ...add another $25 for traffic school, and you get the idea.  ...RETARDED!!!

Conversely, riding from NY to LA via the northern states, I got pulled over just outside of Rapid City, SD, and I was doing probably 75-80 in a 65.  ...short chat with the Statey, he let me go with a verbal warning.  FFWD to the next day, middle of Wyoming, Hwy 16 between Ten Sleep and Worland I got tagged doing 80ish coming over the crest of a big rolling hill; that earned me a ticket.  ...$75 (NOT RETARDED).  I earned the ticket, and the cost was reasonable to the offense.  ...I mean, let's be fair, if you've ever ridden across SD or WY you know just how freakin' empty it is.  ...but I paid that ticket with a smile.

This is what kills the reputation for the police in some areas, random enforcement (which I think is kinda' the OP's point, though poorly stated), and ridiculous fees (in some areas).  Growing up in Illinois was about the same as SD and WY; a basic moving violation cost about $75, and I never got pulled over in Illinois where I wasn't actually breaking the law ...in an obvious way!  lol  

Here in SoCal, it's just the luck of the draw!  

...and to be fair, I know several cops in LA (really all over, many of my old Marine Corps buddies are now police officers somewhere).  Some are dicks, most are cool, ...but you remember the dicks (and you're more likely to meet them).  As someone who has "protected and served" in the Marines it does get under my skin any time I meet someone in any uniform who behaves in an unprofessional manner, or who is clearly abusing their authority; luckily those kinds are generally the exception!

[Hardware]

...I love people who say one person's perspective is BS because it's not like that *where they live* with no experience whatsoever of that person's region...

It's just as asinine for someone to say that because a cop treated them badly in Buttfuck, Alabama, or Broken Bone, Manitoba it's clear that all cops everywhere are corrupt and that all traffic stops are simply revenue collection exercises.

[ZenMoto]

It's just as asinine for someone to say that because a cop treated them badly in Buttfuck, Alabama, or Broken Bone, Manitoba it's clear that all cops everywhere are corrupt and that all traffic stops are simply revenue collection exercises.

That's basically what I'm saying.  ...and that argument goes both ways!