My friend wants his first bike--A Monster 1100s

[jesse v]

Hi all,

My friend really wants to get into motorcycling.  He's been picking my brain over the last few weeks (I'm glad to help), and I've been encouraging him to (a) take his MSF BRC, and (b) get a 650cc twin or smaller standard as his first bike (in that order).  He doesn't seem to be taking me seriously on either account, even after I pointed out that our BRC courses in this area fill up FAST:  All of 2012 is almost booked already.

But here's what really bothers me:  He has his heart set on a '10 Ducati Monster 1100s that has an $11,000 sticker at a local consignment shop.  I can't seem to get it into his head that buying such a powerful bike as a first ride is a guaranteed crash.

Fortunately, on the phone this morning he told me that his wife nixed the bike idea--I'm assuming for financial reasons.  So maybe his puppy-love w/ the Duc is a blessing in disguise.

So, how do I get him to focus on motorcycling and not buying a look?  I have tried to tell him that fun can be had for a very reasonable cost, and I've pointed out options such as SV650's, Bandit 600's, Ninja 650's, etc, and explained how these "sport/standards" are comfortable and reasonable choices.  

Perhaps I should point out that "lowering his standards" will allow him to get into motorcycling all the sooner.

Thoughts?

[caasland]

That's a good question - focus on "what is motorcycling". It is different for all of us.

For the group I ride with, a large part of that is cameraderie. We've introduced a new member by finding a bike for him to borrow, and he has understood that it isn't much about the bike itself, but rather that he is ON a bike. He has since purchased his own first MC: a modest Shadow 750. "keeping up" isn't an issue .. we always wait and look out for each other.

Is there a modest bike in your group of friends which can be loaned to your noob buddy? If he takes the BRC and then follows up with parking lot exercises and instruction from yourself, will he "get it" that the focus of your riding group isn't about looks, speed and power, and thus set his sights a bit lower?

On the other hand, if he wants to get into motorcycling for the speed and looks, perhaps you won't want to ride with him anyway.

[Papa Lazarou]

Could he take a test ride on a few bikes before he buys?

[Kootenanny]

I helped a friend of mine get into riding some years ago.  He wanted a cruiser...I couldn't convince him otherwise, but due to finances, he ended up buying a mid-80's Maxim "pseudo-cruiser," which was actually an OK starter bike.

He soon realized that it's more about the ride, and when he upgraded, he bought a VFR.

He just told me of a friend who's recently bought a first bike--a Honda CBR250R (dunno, do you guys have the little 250 in the States?).  An excellent choice, IMO.  Looks like I'll be helping this guy out a bit, to start (the local motorcycle school is no more, closest one that I know of is in a city 4 hours away...and motorcycle training is not subsidized here, ya gotta pay full price, over $500).

[cbsnbiker]

Hi all,

My friend really wants to get into motorcycling.  He's been picking my brain over the last few weeks (I'm glad to help), and I've been encouraging him to (a) take his MSF BRC, and (b) get a 650cc twin or smaller standard as his first bike (in that order).  He doesn't seem to be taking me seriously on either account, even after I pointed out that our BRC courses in this area fill up FAST:  All of 2012 is almost booked already.

But here's what really bothers me:  He has his heart set on a '10 Ducati Monster 1100s that has an $11,000 sticker at a local consignment shop.  I can't seem to get it into his head that buying such a powerful bike as a first ride is a guaranteed crash.

Fortunately, on the phone this morning he told me that his wife nixed the bike idea--I'm assuming for financial reasons.  So maybe his puppy-love w/ the Duc is a blessing in disguise.

So, how do I get him to focus on motorcycling and not buying a look?  I have tried to tell him that fun can be had for a very reasonable cost, and I've pointed out options such as SV650's, Bandit 600's, Ninja 650's, etc, and explained how these "sport/standards" are comfortable and reasonable choices.  

Perhaps I should point out that "lowering his standards" will allow him to get into motorcycling all the sooner.

Thoughts?

Here's one way: go to the Ducati dealer, give the service guy a gift certificate to the local steakhouse (or other nice gift) and ask him to create a sample repair order estimate for a Monster 1100 that has tipped over, and another one for a bike that has been stuffed. Show your friend the $$$s. Unless he's rich or really thick, he'll get the message.

My message would be that the Monster is a great *next* bike, but a novice should make his boo-boos on a bike that is *not* the pride and joy. Boo-boos don't have to be terrifying; they can be as mundane as tipping over in a sandy patch at a stop sign. But such a tipover can be very expensive to repair, depending on the bike.

The reality is that people get into riding for many reasons, one of which can be the "look." Appeal to that aspect of his motivation by emphasizing the preservation of the good looks of his new toy by practicing on another bike.

Starting on that Monster is not a "guaranteed" crash. However, there are ways to make learning how to ride more productive and less risky. The BRC is an excellent one. Starting out on a smaller bike after the BRC (I'd go even smaller than a 650cc unless he's a big boy) is another one.

Also, perhaps his reticence for signing up for the BRC is an indicator of his level of seriousness about all of this. I know that once I made up my mind to learn to ride, I signed up for the next available course (I was fortunate not to have such a long lead time). Maybe he's just not that into it?

He just told me of a friend who's recently bought a first bike--a Honda CBR250R (dunno, do you guys have the little 250 in the States?).  An excellent choice, IMO.  

There aren't enough such bikes available in the U.S. But yes, that one is. I'd get one if I could justify it to myself.  

Looks like I'll be helping this guy out a bit, to start (the local motorcycle school is no more, closest one that I know of is in a city 4 hours away...and motorcycle training is not subsidized here, ya gotta pay full price, over $500).

Bummer that there isn't a course closer to your friend.

In the U.S., the level of subsidy varies from state to state and from program to program. In certain states, training is free, or there is a nominal charge for it. In other states (such as New York), it can cost hundreds of dollars. I don't know of anywhere in the U.S. that costs over $500, but that's no guarantee that that isn't the case somewhere.

[spd2918]

I try not to give first bike advice to anyone unless it appears that they actually want advice.  Most people want you to confirm what they have already decided to buy.

My new to motorcycling completely untrained brother wanted a buddy's V-Star 1100 and asked my advice.  I attempted to steer him towards something smaller to learn on, but he bought it.  He rode it prior to taking the MSF.  He never mastered it and ended up selling it.  He later bought a small dual sport, but due to close calls he had on the 1100 he was too scared to ride.

A new to motorcycling completely untrained and small framed female friend at work wanted a Sportster 1200 and asked my advice.  I attempted to steer her towards something smaller to learn on, but her Harley boyfriend got her to buy one.  I hope she passes the MSF course.  She is already an expert on the failings of helmets.

My nephew has some dirt riding experience but is completely new and untrained on street riding.  He asked my advice about several "good deal" full on sport bikes on Craigslist.  I attempted to steer him towards smaller bikes, but his father told him he started riding on a 750 (25 years ago, a Japanese cruiser) so a race bike it will be.  He said he is too good a rider to take the MSF.

So fuck it.

[alexj]

Weird . . . . all three of the bikes I've bought since I found a small engine mechanic I trusted were recommended by said mechanic . . . if you find someone you trust as knowledgeable about X, why don't you listen to them about X?  Admittedly the KLR 250 turned out to NOT be the bike I wanted, but the mechanic was very helpful about helping me sell it and finding me a more suitable bike

I originally wanted a 1981 Honda Goldwing, but I was assured that no, I did not want a 1981 Honda Goldwing, what I really wanted was a small dual sport, preferably Honda or Yamaha, but Kawasaki is also pretty good

(my mechanics advice on my Chinese off brand scooter when it was acting up yet again was 'to get a Honda or Yamaha', so I got the Reflex)

I still kinda want a 1981 Honda Goldwing though

[Rincewind]

The Monster 1100 is a fantastic bike, but has so much torque at low RPM's that it is not very beginner friendly.  He should not have to master how to control wheelies at the same time that he is trying to master the basics.  An older 696/695/620 Monster with frame sliders would be a better start.  The Suzuki Gladius looks the part and is half the price of the used 1100.  

New riders that bite off more than they can chew seems pretty common.  Intimidation is real and hurts the learning process.

[bomber]

I might tend to view your friend's stance as similar to many I know who claim they wouldn't ride if they couldn't ride a Harley . . . .

Infatuation can appear in many ways . . . if he's really interested in riding, he'll find a way.

[Moto Morphin Power Ranger]

Sometimes friends who ask for advice just do care. if you are on the same page it's great if not then whatever. I have been asked by 4-5 friends and i told them all to get a cheep 250 they can learn on figure what they want in a bike. sell the bike for pretty much the same money they spent and go get what you want with some knowledge in the bank. So far no one has listened and got a bigger/sportier bike they thought was the one and 3 months later took a 2,000-2,500 hit on selling the bike to get what they want/fit.  

[bikerfish1100]

your friend is a maroon.










County said so.

[Papa Lazarou]

what sort of flowers would he like?

[jesse v]

It's sounding like he's not really interested in riding, he was just going through an infatuation phase.  I'll just keep pointing him towards 250's and 650's if actually gets seriously interested in the future.

Thanks everyone for your replies.

[nater]

Well that's too bad.  There really isn't much at Powerbrokers.  They must be selling them left and right.  Except for the overpriced Monster and the RSV that have been there for awhile.

[sfalexi]

PLenty of youtube videos showing people get on a bike, lose control, forget to pull in the clutch and brake, and crashing into bushes, parked cars, etc.  Maybe showing him what happens if you DON'T learn how to control a bike in a controlled environment might at least tempt him to take the class.  Stressing that it's better to learn and potentially drop a BORROWED bike.

Maybe go by a dealer, and point out two bikes (one used that has been dropped/has some scuffs) and a corresponding new bike.  Point out (arbitrary numbers), "New bike.  Sticker, $11k, ridden off the lot, now worth $9.8k.  Here's that same bike with a scuff on it cause it was dropped.  Maybe only once, but dropped.  Now worth $7k.  Taking a $200 class will help you keep it from losing an instant 3 grand with one drop.  Even better, take the class and buy a used bike that's been dropped.  Cause if you drop it again, it ain't 3 grand.  maybe a hundred bucks."

Unless he's loaded, or REALLY into the buy now/pay later going into debt, maybe talking some thousands of dollars difference in a little preventative class, or taking a few months of a learners bike which he can essentially "rent" by buying used and then selling it, maybe it'll help.

For what it's worth, I took the class, and bought a used Suzuki C50T with crash bars for 5500.  I put it through it's paces, dropping it in parking lots, gravel roads, etc.  Never a wipeout or dumping it, just dropping it practicing stops and u-turns and whatnot.  After 3 months, I traded it in for 5250 worth of credit.  Not a bad $250 turnover over for a few months till I got the first bike I WANTED.

Alexi

[black hills]

for a completely new rider there is nothing better than a cheap (beat up) DS. A 250 is just fine. then, once you get teh basics figured out and the stupid drops, you can sell it for what you paid and get what you want. Or keep it and improve your skills even farther. this guy rides a small bike, but I bet he would be fin on just about anything:

[jesse v]

Welp... He just bought an '01 SV650S.  We had a little maintenance pow-wow today and I really think he made a good bike choice.  Now if I could only convince him of the value of MSF BRC.

[Kootenanny]

OK, I really like the early SV650s.  Does it look anything like this one, that a friend was considering a few years ago?

[Moto Morphin Power Ranger]

that's a good learning bike. sounds like you talked some sense into them.

[jesse v]

OK, I really like the early SV650s.  Does it look anything like this one, that a friend was considering a few years ago?

Yes, but red.