An Interesting Article about HP Limits from Visor Down

[Rigger]

Visor Down (foremerly TWO Two Wheels Only) published an interesting article about the potential future of motorcycling.  Being on a 2008 VFR w/107bhp I am not really affected by this if it were to be implemented. But many of you are and that does concern me cause should look out for one another.  What are your thoughts not so much on the article but that idea of imposed hp restrictions?



http://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/ive-ridden-the-future-and-its-100bhp/20440.html

[ChrisZRX]

An interesting sentence from the article.

Having not affected accident statistics, the EU are putting pressure on France to remove the 100bhp limit...

I can certainly understand graduated licensing, but not keen on HP restrictions.  And this is coming from someone who will never own a 'busa or ZX14 because I think they're just too much.  

From I, Robot...

V.I.K.I.: You are making a mistake. My logic is undeniable.
Detective Del Spooner: You have so got to die.

[jfurf]

Visor Down (foremerly TWO Two Wheels Only) published an interesting article about the potential future of motorcycling.  Being on a 2008 VFR w/107bhp I am not really affected by this if it were to be implemented. But many of you are and that does concern me cause should look out for one another.  What are your thoughts not so much on the article but that idea of imposed hp restrictions?



http://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/ive-ridden-the-future-and-its-100bhp/20440.html

Very interesting. Thanks for the link.

I guess I'm conflicted. My streetbike would easily come in under the limit and it has plenty of power for the public roads but I also generally think people should be able to buy what vehicles they want as long as they can be used safely (and apparently in France, the 100 bhp limit has not reduced moto crashes).

But I think the author is onto something. If you put in a 100 bhp limit, the moto manufacturers would spend money developing aspects other than just top-end power AND you also might see an increase in riders who participate in track days and club racing, which would be good for the sport too.

[greench440]

It didn't work in Europe in the 90s and won't work unless all the world's governments enforce it on every motorcycle company.  All it takes is one company to not comply and we have a horsepower race again.

[garry]

My 950 Supermoto is a good example what a 100 HP literbike would be like I think. Solid pull across the rev range, limited redline (because it's a twin), and maybe 95 BHP (with my exhaust, airbox, and jetting mods).

As stated above, I'm OK with HP limits (50?) as part of a new rider licensing process, but not max HP restrictions.

[bomber]

I understand and provisionally support tiered licensing (as with most things, the deveil's in the details), but an overall horsepower limit seems an act looking for a reason to exist . . . . I don't see what possible good could come of it.

Anyone know of a reliable study that shows the injuries/fatalities broken down by power, displacement, or type of bike?

[jfurf]

It didn't work in Europe in the 90s and won't work unless all the world's governments enforce it on every motorcycle company.  All it takes is one company to not comply and we have a horsepower race again.

The French government does enforce a strict 106 bhp limit. No bikes can be sold without limiters. Of course, you can still buy a non-limited bike elsewhere and bring it in, but I think they're pretty tough on enforcement.

Edited to add: I think you're thinking of the voluntary top speed limit (200 mph) among the manufacturers, which MV Agusta proudly flouted.

[county]

Well, just something else Harley riders do not have to be concerned with....

[miles]

The French government does enforce a strict 106 bhp limit. No bikes can be sold without limiters. Of course, you can still buy a non-limited bike elsewhere and bring it in, but I think they're pretty tough on enforcement.

Edited to add: I think you're thinking of the voluntary top speed limit (200 mph 300 KPH) among the manufacturers, which MV Agusta proudly flouted.

FTFY

[greench440]

Edited to add: I think you're thinking of the voluntary top speed limit (200 mph) among the manufacturers, which MV Agusta proudly flouted.

Nope.  Look at the mid 90s BMWs that were voluntarily limited to 100 hp.  They threw out that self imposed limit as soon as they figured out how to make an engine with more than 100 hp.    

http://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/model/bmw/bmw_k1%2090.htm

Motorcycle manufacturers have a voluntary agreement to restrict bikes for sale in Germany to 100 horse power. Being a conscientious German manufacturer BMW has gone one stage further and has also restricted its bikes for export to the same limit. This is also rather convenient as it means bikes do not have to be taken out of the assembly line and altered. Up to now, though, this policy has been purely academic as no BMW bike was capable of producing more than l00hp.

The K1, the first BMW with four valves per cylinder, changes all that. More valves meant the cylinder head could be made smaller  four small circles take up less space than two big ones  thereby helping to increase the compression ratio. The K1's compression ratio is a lot higher than the rest of the K-series at 11.0:1 compared to 10.2:1. Fuel is also burnt more evenly by a four-valve cylinder boosting power still further. Thus BMW's first 16-valve engine was capable of producing more than l00hp, according to BMW officials. But they made the decision to restrict it abroad as well as at home because the motorcycle industry is "being watched by politicians".

[Cablebandit]

Nope.  Look at the mid 90s BMWs that were voluntarily limited to 100 hp.  They threw out that self imposed limit as soon as they figured out how to make an engine with more than 100 hp.    

How terribly convenient.

Glad I don't live in France.

[UFO]

Yes, please save me from myself.

That being said, I honestly could live with 100 bhp.  I would fucking hate it, but I could live with it.

[bubba zanetti]

I no longer look at bike specs for HP but rather torque. Let the legislators worry about HP and you can still get an amazing bike with 100 HP and tuned for high torque.

[ChrisZRX]

Oh, 100 bhp isn't improving accident statistics?  Better lower it to 80 bhp then.

This really is a slippery slope.  It should be fought with extreme prejudice.

[Rattlehead]

One of many reasons I'm glad I'm not in France.
They'd have to cut my bike off at like 5000rpm to keep it under 100bhp.  
Do I need more than 100bhp? Nope. It's sure nice not having a Gov't nanny telling me I can't have more than that though.  

I will admit though, the Busa really does have more power than is "safe and prudent" for street use. It's so ridiculiously easy to be running "ludacris speed" the excess power feels like a liability more than an asset a lot of the time.
Man, I must be getting old! Even 10 years ago I would have made fun of myself for saying something like that.  

[X1Glider]

I've seen plenty of people on 15 hp scooters hurt themselves badly.

Would only be fair to limit cars and trucks to 200 HP IMO.  Why can a newly licensed (rich) driver buy a 500 HP turbo Mustang, Vette, Porsche, whatever but be forced to buy a wimpy 100 HP bike.

Nothing wrong with 100 HP or less.  I've had quite a few sub 100 HP bikes since the millenium, some being favorites, including a 80 RWHP BMW R1100S.  I can get in trouble with just about anything really.

[ninetysix-ex-jay]

I know Norway has different license levels for 250, 600, and 1000 IIRC.

I don't see a big deal with that especially if we get grandfathered in for 'unlimited'.  I think a lot more people wouldn't get hurt that way.  

[Flyer]

In the USA and Canada, we (currently) have rights and responsibilities.
The EU is removing rights by legislation, as opposed to previous attempts by blitzcrieg...
If a lawyer in Paris can buy himself a 550hp Ferrari, I should be able to put that motor in my Munch Mammut if I can afford to!
 

[county]

Yes, please save me from myself.

That being said, I honestly could live with 100 bhp.  I would fucking hate it, but I could live with it.

Well, I think you need over 100 hp to move the FJR....I do not suppose they are big sellers in France....

[PatM]

Well, I think you need over 100 hp to move the FJR....I do not suppose they are big sellers in France....

Cops ride FJRs in France. I'd bet they're not limited.