Somebody find this guy and give them the article 15 he deserves.

[NoGear]

But he has his Reflective belt to keep him safe!!!!  


On a serious note: you are exactly right. it does violate several regulations and policies. He needs to be made an example of.

As for as your post is concerned find out who wrote and approved of the policy about taking the ERC. More than likely they never even considered writing it to reflect that someone may have already taken it. As someone who has written and continues to write policy letters I will tell you that I am not always the subject matter expert in those areas but I get tasked to write them anyway. (I've been published so they assume I'm literate - no good deed will go unpunished)

Talk them and present you case in a logical manner and they may change the policy. It really isn't hard to do if done correctly. Biggest mistake people make is going and and starting the conversation with "This if f'ing stupid......."  When that happens, the powers that be never hear another word that is said. When I do it it usually goes like this "Sir, I don't think this policy was well thought out and it's making you look bad"   at that point they usually want to change it and I'm usually tasked with writing the new policy.

[Flyer]

He obviously doesn't have the intelligence and judgement to be in uniform.
Dump his ass.

[white26golf]

This guy's leadership will, or already has  found out who this guys is.  At the least this guy is going to have to retake an MSF course, or more likely revoke his riding privileges on post until he PCS's.

[Silverbird]

5 bucks says he didn't serve a single day.

[Carbonero]

Y'all got lots of free time.

[gradus]

He obviously doesn't have the intelligence and judgement to be in uniform.
Dump his ass.

The bar for intelligence and judgement isn't very high to be in uniform.  The service gets all types from the very best to the ..... not the best.    

[ConPilot1]

If he's not on base or on-post the whole argument is moot. Military regulations only extend off base in certain arenas.

If he's getting drunk in or out of uniform and getting in fights and arrested off-base, yeah, the UCMJ can kick in.

Just because he's driving like an asshole or doing something stupid like this doesn't necessarily warrant any military disciplinary action.

[Carbonero]

If he's not on base or on-post the whole argument is moot. Military regulations only extend off base in certain arenas.

If he's getting drunk in or out of uniform and getting in fights and arrested off-base, yeah, the UCMJ can kick in.

Just because he's driving like an asshole or doing something stupid like this doesn't necessarily warrant any military disciplinary action.

Kind of a +1 here.

If he has to lead by example, then so should everyone, right? I mean... Anyone ever seen a drunk cop? Anyone ever seen a crooked judge? Anyone ever see a corrupt official?

Pretty funny commentary in this thread given the normal "let Darwinism sort it out" tripe that's normally spewed in these cases.  

[sleazy rider]

Not if you're in uniform.  You musy conform to regs while representing.  Yeah, you can ride like an ass if you're not wearing Unc's clothing.

[sammyseaman]

Personally, I find the purple lights to be more atrocious than the texting.

   

[NoGear]

If he's not on base or on-post the whole argument is moot. Military regulations only extend off base in certain arenas.

If he's getting drunk in or out of uniform and getting in fights and arrested off-base, yeah, the UCMJ can kick in.

Just because he's driving like an asshole or doing something stupid like this doesn't necessarily warrant any military disciplinary action.

This is incorrect. As a member of the Armed Forces UCMJ covers you no matter where you.  That's 24/7 worldwide.  The "no texting while driving" was actually put out as a Presidential order to all government employees including the military.

For instance. I have a soldier that I dislike. While on leave he didn't shave and posted pictures of his unshaven self on FB. When he returned off of leave he was read his Article 15 for disobeying a lawful order.  He response was "I didn't know it was against the regs not to shave when you are on leave."  I pulled out a copy of the counseling statement that he was given before he left on leave reminding him that he still must comply with all rules and regulations while on leave (this was his first time going on leave since he joined and finished basic and AIT).  That counseling statement, which he signed, cut the legs out from underneath him.    

The moral of the story is you are never free from UCMJ until the day you have your DD214 in hand.   How do I know this? Because I'm a senior non-commissioned officer who has retired once and I'm back on active duty now.  Senior NCOs are sort of the EOEs in the military for those who haven't served.

[satxbonneville]

This is incorrect. As a member of the Armed Forces UCMJ covers you no matter where you.  That's 24/7 worldwide.  The "no texting while driving" was actually put out as a Presidential order to all government employees including the military.

For instance. I have a soldier that I dislike. While on leave he didn't shave and posted pictures of his unshaven self on FB. When he returned off of leave he was read his Article 15 for disobeying a lawful order.  He response was "I didn't know it was against the regs not to shave when you are on leave."  I pulled out a copy of the counseling statement that he was given before he left on leave reminding him that he still must comply with all rules and regulations while on leave (this was his first time going on leave since he joined and finished basic and AIT).  That counseling statement, which he signed, cut the legs out from underneath him.   

The moral of the story is you are never free from UCMJ until the day you have your DD214 in hand.   How do I know this? Because I'm a senior non-commissioned officer who has retired once and I'm back on active duty now.  Senior NCOs are sort of the EOEs in the military for those who haven't served.

Not enough face palms to cover a dick move like this. Senior NCO's like you are one of the reasons I went 4 and out.

Sent from my TeamDRH ICS for GTablet using Tapatalk 2

[GTS_Rider]

Not enough face palms to cover a dick move like this. Senior NCO's like you are one of the reasons I went 4 and out...

Yeah...someone is a dick here, I'm sure it's not the guy that didn't shave while on leave...jeebus!

Yeah, actually I have no idea for all this military regiment shit. But still, seem like a cheap shot from the outside view...

[sfalexi]

Yeah...someone is a dick here, I'm sure it's not the guy that didn't shave while on leave...jeebus!

Yeah, actually I have no idea for all this military regiment shit. But still, seem like a cheap shot from the outside view...

I'm an nco, and really i think people need to look at the state of things before handing out serious punishments like article 15s.  Not shaving while on leave? For me, i wouldn't look twice.  So long as they shave before comming back into work, i could care less.  That move sounds too calculated.  

Rising without proper protective gear and while texting? Maybe ten years ago when mmotorcycle fatalities weren't such a high proority item when it comes to the army, maybe then it would just warrant a good ass chewin.  Nowadays, when they've gone so far as to institute more and more regs, mandatory msf training requirements including sportbike rider course and/or brc2 depending on what bike, and a mandatory motorcycle "mentorship" program beause too many people are dying on bikes, well at this point, it warrants more than an ass chewin.

It's like anything else in this world.  What's highly visible, and what's just not worth it.  Right now, with the army pulling out of iraq and deployments slowing down, the focus is shifting.  Car and motorcycle accidents are leading causes of soldiers dying, and this picture will NOT help.  

Alexi

[gradus]

I have a soldier that I dislike. While on leave he didn't shave and posted pictures of his unshaven self on FB. When he returned off of leave he was read his Article 15 for disobeying a lawful order.  

Lots of Mickey Mouse bullshit in the military.  Particularly when you point out that your dislike for him was a factor.  Another moral of the story .... that was a dick move.  

[NoGear]

well there are other things the soldier has done that I couldn't get him on so this was one I could prove and make it stick. He thought he was too slick and couldn't get caught on anything. Sometimes you punish them on what you can prove because you can't get them on what they deserve.  Now if this was a standup soldier I wouldn't of given two shits about it?No.   If I could of proven that he stole money from his roommates wall locker I would of seen his ass in jail. But going from broke one day to buying an xbox the same day the money goes missing and saying a "friend" gave him the money isn't proof. So instead I got him on something I could which cost him money, rank and ensures he can't re-enlist which gets another dirtbag out of the army.

And Alexsi no offense to you. You are an NCO but being a musician in the army doesn't exactly give you much experience in developing leadership skills. You'll never be a Team Leader, or Squad Leader or a Platoon Sergeant in a line unit. How many people are in a band total?   I spent 13 years in line units before I switched to MI.  I left because my body was broken from the time I spent there. Give up your flute, pick up a rifle and hump a ruck for a few years then we can talk about how to run a platoon or company.  You are  absolutely correct about this guy though. If its highly visible you can be sure it won't just be an ass chewing. You can forgive a mistake but you can't forgive one everyone knows about especially the person doing the wrong is of higher rank.

[ConPilot1]

well there are other things the soldier has done that I couldn't get him on so this was one I could prove and make it stick. He thought he was too slick and couldn't get caught on anything. Sometimes you punish them on what you can prove because you can't get them on what they deserve.  Now if this was a standup soldier I wouldn't of given two shits about it?No.   If I could of proven that he stole money from his roommates wall locker I would of seen his ass in jail. But going from broke one day to buying an xbox the same day the money goes missing and saying a "friend" gave him the money isn't proof. So instead I got him on something I could which cost him money, rank and ensures he can't re-enlist which gets another dirtbag out of the army.

And Alexsi no offense to you. You are an NCO but being a musician in the army doesn't exactly give you much experience in developing leadership skills. You'll never be a Team Leader, or Squad Leader or a Platoon Sergeant in a line unit. How many people are in a band total?   I spent 13 years in line units before I switched to MI.  I left because my body was broken from the time I spent there. Give up your flute, pick up a rifle and hump a ruck for a few years then we can talk about how to run a platoon or company.  

You sound like the first sergeant I had in the dorms come inspection time. Room would be spotlessly clean, vacuumed, dusted, glass shined, beds made up tight, bathrooms immaculate, personal junk stowed, uniforms lined up neatly in the closet and boots shined.

He'd view a room like that then go peel the refrigerator seal back from the metal surface, find a little gunk and then fail you for the room inspection.

[gradus]

And Alexsi no offense to you. You are an NCO but being a musician in the army doesn't exactly give you much experience in developing leadership skills. You'll never be a Team Leader, or Squad Leader or a Platoon Sergeant in a line unit. How many people are in a band total?   I spent 13 years in line units before I switched to MI.  I left because my body was broken from the time I spent there. Give up your flute, pick up a rifle and hump a ruck for a few years then we can talk about how to run a platoon or company.  You are  absolutely correct about this guy though. If its highly visible you can be sure it won't just be an ass chewing. You can forgive a mistake but you can't forgive one everyone knows about especially the person doing the wrong is of higher rank.

No offense to you NoGear, but you have to be quite skilled to get accepted into a military band.  They'll hand almost any bone head a rifle and ruck.  Do an average job long enough and you'll get an opportunity to lead them.  

(my dad was the first sergeant of the NC National Guard Band before accepting a CNO/CAO position)  NPR actually used his picture for their 150 Years of 'Taps' article.  
http://www.npr.org/blogs/deceptivecadence/2012/05/18/152939191/150-years-of-taps

[loadedmind]

Pretty boneheaded move on the rider's part.  I can't say I was ever well-versed in the UCMJ, but I have to agree with alexsi, ConPilot1 and GTS_Rider- NoGear is one of the reasons I didn't make the military a career - because they gave boneheaded dicks like him the opportunity to manage people.  

If I didn't know anything else about the situation, the fact that you admitted you had a personal vendetta against this soldier, then acted on it the way you did would be enough for me to question your character.  Our resident a$$hole on our base tried to get a guy into the brig because the soldier got a little sunburned on his leave.  I'll bet you think that was the proper thing to do too, huh?  It's people like you that reinforce my decision to get the hell out.  For that, I thank you.

[ConPilot1]

but I have to agree with alexsi, ConPilot1 and GTS_Rider- NoGear is one of the reasons I didn't make the military a career - because they gave boneheaded dicks like him the opportunity to manage people.

Here's a reason for no further interest in the military.

I put out a fire I discovered in a building I worked in at Vandenberg AFB.
Smelled smoke, alerted my co-worker, grabbed an extinguisher, pulled the fire alarm, put the fire out.

Spent the next 2 months coming and going from the OSI office being grilled and questioned and polygraphed and coerced into signing pre-written confessions that I started the fire.

When they caught the little curly-headed freckle-faced Tennessee cornfed c*ck-suck who actually set the damn fire and threw his ass out of the AF,
I was only "notified" by my superior that I was "no longer a suspect" and sent back to my work station.

No thank-you for your actions, no acknowledgment, NOTHING. 2-3 months of grief, worry, fear, and threats. I actually had to go to the JAG office for a military defense attorney.


That was it. 2nd tour NOT AN OPTION. F*ck that noise.

You're welcome, Vandenberg, for saving the 4392 ASG Reprographics Building. Thanks for nothing.

I should have ran out the door and let the motherf*cker burn in hindsight. Those who did went home and ate dinner that night.
I spent the evening in a wooden chair in a little white room with some bald-headed OSI f*ck screaming in my face.