About the Harley thing---for just a moment, seriously...

[thatguy]

Geordie how the fuck do you still have any brain cells left after the chemical warfare you declared on yer brain? Well said my friend.

Scott. I've been away from this site for a while. Nice to see you still enjoy sticking your foot in your mouth up to the hip. You still can't understand why someone would think other than you do regardless of subject.  

[james_g]

People buy cruisers because they are a uniquely American style of bike. I look back at pics of bikes through American history and you see bikes much like HD build today. Look at motorcycles in movies and what do you see? Cruisers and choppers.

You might as well ask why pick up trucks are popular. Or why country music is popular.

james

[SWriverstone]

Geordie how the fuck do you still have any brain cells left after the chemical warfare you declared on yer brain? Well said my friend.

Scott. I've been away from this site for a while. Nice to see you still enjoy sticking your foot in your mouth up to the hip. You still can't understand why someone would think other than you do regardless of subject.  

Ha! Good to hear from you thatguy.

Well, if being curious is a crime, then jail me.   I don't just blindly accept everything in life.  

Scott

[Dave W.]

I bought a new (2006) Sportster 1200.

It was returned under the lemon law.

When it ran as intended, it did nothing particularly well.
People looked at me like I was from another planet because I wore full gear and a full face helmet.

I went on to buy another cruiser years later. It was a metric, water cooled, fuel injected, shaft drive.

Still i have learned my cruiser lesson and they arent for me.

I have never had a HD rider make a rude comment to me (outside of internet forums) for being on a crotch rocket, metric cruiser, or dual sport.

[Andrew]

Deserving of a repost


Ride what your like, I care more of the time of day

[misanthropist]

Geordie how the fuck do you still have any brain cells left after the chemical warfare you declared on yer brain? Well said my friend.

Scott. I've been away from this site for a while. Nice to see you still enjoy sticking your foot in your mouth up to the hip. You still can't understand why someone would think other than you do regardless of subject.

To be 100% honest I always talked a better game than I ever played...I would describe myself as the Don Cherry of drug use.

Now Rick, on the other hand...that guy really was liquidating brain cells in a major way.


Sent from my brain using my hands

[nomadmax]

I ride an HD Road King but I have other bikes as well.  If my garage caught fire, I'd tip them all over to push my 1976 Suzuki GT250A out; it was my first streetbike.  I grew up on Japanese motorcycles. I'm just old enough to be older (53) and just young enough that a Brit bike means nothing to me because around here Honda, Kaw, Yamaha & Suzuki had beaten them to death.

Last night, I got ice cream at the old Dairy Queen outside the small town I live in.  I still remember being eight years old and seeing a guy named Bob sitting on red and cream HD Electra Glide that looked alot like my Road King.  He had on blue jeans, black combat boots, a white T shirt with a pack of Luckys rolled up in one sleeve. Every girl his age was standing around him oooing and aahhhing that bike and asking for a ride.  When I saw that; I knew I wanted to be THAT dude. I watched him ride all around this little town with girls on the pillion while I rode my 4 horse minibike with a bedroll strapped to the front like Then Came Bronson.

Bob retired from Frigidare and moved west with the girl he picked from the ones he rode around on the Harley.  They were killed in a crash some years later because they weren't wearing helmets (I DON'T wanna be that dude).

So, is it a little silly that one of primary reasons I ride an HD (among my other bikes) because I wanted to be that guy when I was eight? Yeah, it is.  But it pleases me on a some level and doesn't hurt anybody.

One of the other reasons I ride and HD is to be different.  Hear me out on this one.  I wear a full face helmet and gear when I ride, and I can ride.  I know that sounds egotistical but it's true; I can really ride just about anything very well. Most HD riders generally put more miles on their feet walking their bikes to a stop and starting from a light, that kinda puts me in category that's a little rare.

http://www.vstrom.info/Smf/index.php/topic,3918.msg48758.html#msg48758

That should be a link to another HD I rode and it wasn't a great bike for the most part but that notwithstanding I bought another; probably based on those desires of an eight year old boy. Yeah I know; that's dumb  

[Flyer]

What is it about cruisers (and by extension Harleys) that so many find compelling?

"Most" people see anything other than a cruiser as a "sport bike".
"Most" people don't want anything to do with perceived "sport" when operating anything as inherently dangerous as a motorcycle.
The perception seems to be that sport is dangerous on two wheels, and the cruiser/Harley is a much more benign alternative.
The 40's style and technology plays into this, and the meek spend lavishly.

[thatguy]

Ha! Good to hear from you thatguy.

Well, if being curious is a crime, then jail me.   I don't just blindly accept everything in life.  

Scott

Scott you know you've asked this question before. In fact photos were posted in the thread I recall. Yet you truly only wish to stir the shit. Lick the spoon and put it down.

[CLAY]

I think it's a combination of the reasons stated.  HD builds a pretty good yet overpriced bike.  The big thing, IMO, *is* the marketing- they have created an image of what the American Biker looks like, and many people buy in to that.  My brother in law (a die-hard lifestyle guy) rode my Bandit and talked for awhile about how he misses the power (he used to have a TL1000); when I asked why he didn't get another one partly it was because of how he rides- do-rag to-the-bar types of rides.  He has said his 30K+ custom Harley is just a bar-hopper.  He bought an old police HD for riding anything far.  He has had his custom HD for probably 6 years and probably has less than 5k miles on it.

He has fully bought into the image- the image created and perpetuated by the brilliant minds in the HD marketing department.  With a few brews he might admit that.  He likes to "play biker" (including trailering to Rapid City then riding into Sturgis pretending you rode all the way from Michigan  ).  His wife is fully in the scene- one of the times when we first met and I pulled up on my Bandit she asked why I ride "Jap junk"    You can't argue with that  .

Most metric cruiser do handle better and are more reliable, anecdotal evidence otherwise- but they don't portray the same "buy American" standard that HD does.

I don't dislike HD's at all.  A friend of mine at church has one; his wife rides pillion, and they love it.  He rides whenever he can.  He bought it used, and loves the thing to death.  Part of the reason he bought it *is* because of the "cool" stereotype he saw as a kid- it's and HD, plus it's *very* comfortable for his wife.  

What I do detest is the sheeple following that some people have, be it HD or otherwise.  In my experience (anecdotal) that has come mostly from the HD crowd, although the beemer riders are a close second.  It's the uniform I nearly always see around here with the HD crowd (do-rag, sunglasses, black HD t-shirt from the farthest shop you maybe have been to, jeans, maybe a vest with some patches, etc).  

As for the choice in bikes- like someone said- you can't ride a F150 then complain it doesn't handle like a vette.  They have vastly different purposes and vastly different characteristics.    You want a nice Sunday afternoon cruise?  Buy a cruiser.  You want to strafe the twisties?  Get a ST bike.  

[2RR2NV]

i just can't get over the price of the darn things for what ya get.  my wife and I have had no problem cruising on either the Busa or VFR.  plus, if we wanna corner strafe or wick it up, we can..... for a LOT less money. i guess i'm a rebel cause i want to do what I want to do and F everyone else. i get a bike for what i want to do...  except for the current one... wife bought it for me (not complaining one bit) since she wants me to have an SS with the very implied decision that we will have an ST or GT bike in the garage once again. i tend to agree about HD not being the only crowd that conforms...  my brother, when he had his BMW"Light Truck", he bought into so well, that even his wife was the same way and made a comment to my wife to the extent of"why doesn't he buy a BMW. they are soooo much better."  wish i had been there. i'm sure my sister-in-law got an earful.  

amazingly,   he sold the bike and bought a Miata cause he wasn't feeling too safe on the BMW.... um ok...  anyways, he just bought another bike.....a Yamaha Venture.  WTH??? surprised the heck outta me,  considering how he rides. he says, "it slows him down."  um..ok...  at least he is riding.  

[Carbonero]

I think many people have certain envy, and that's the basis for the bashing... And before panties get twisted up, let me elaborate.

• Whether you like the whole "harley lifestyle" thing or not, you have to admit and agree that it's a serious thing to a lot of people. It's big. It's truly just that - a lifestyle. Harley folks wear the name with whatever sense of pride they feel in it. They buy products beyond just the bikes. They belong to something. Again, whether you like the thing that is "the harley guy life" or not, it *is* something of a club, a tight-knit group, and a thing bigger than just a few people getting together. Call it the mystique, the American slant on it, the 100+ years of history, whatever... the fact remains that joining the Harley lifestyle means something to those who do it. Who the hell are we or anyone else to try to take that away?
• Harley sells a premium-priced product. Whether you like the bikes or not, owning one - much like with BMW, MV Agusta or Ducati - it represents are certain station in life, a certain amount of success and a certain ability to spend some amount of disposable income. Yes, there are those living in hovels just to afford to be part of the lifestyle - I've seen this firsthand, but for the most part, Harley purchasers are folks who have done pretty well for themselves, and treat themselves to a little luxury. Who the hell are we or anyone else to try to take that away?
• Harley bikes offer something that no other manufacturer can - if that's the style of bike you want, you can do ANYTHING with it, in terms of customizing, modifications, "making it mine", etc. Want saddle bags? Harley proper has probably 20 items of different styles and sizes, then when you move to the aftermarket, the options open up by an order of magnitude. As but one of a thousand-thousand examples.
• Laugh all you want about the apparel... if I could get some quality shirts that represent my choice of bike without looking like a Ricky Racer wannabe or an urban thug douchebag, I'd be all over it. Seriously, ever tried to buy decent looking clothes that show off your love of Honda or Suzuki or Kawasaki? Good luck. Meanwhile, anyone can toss on a nice Harley-logo polo and go to a nice restaurant.

Yes, I pretty much have some amount of envy about all of that. Me? I get to wear Yoshimura Suzuki silly-wear while bragging about my SV that I can't get $2000 for on the used market, for which I can get crappy soft saddle bags that flop around, or for which I have to spend $600 and more at Givi and SW-Motech, the one only MFGers who makes anything to fit the bike, all while riding to a sport-touring event with 35 people, all of whom are busy waving their dicks about how much faster they ride than everyone else.



PS... see y'all at the Spring Meet. I couldn't make ESTN.  

[SWriverstone]

So if the following four images represent a popular aspect of the Harley mystique...






...then clearly these are popular icons---as well as ideas. But then consider the next 4 images, which could easily represent sport-touring and adventure riding...






The last 4 images above are all equally iconic, and I doubt anyone would say "I hate what those last 4 images represent." So what I wonder is, why don't more people have those kinds of associations (in the last 4 images) with sport-touring and ADV riding?

Scott

[thatguy]

Please. Scott although that's what those things mean to you don't put words in anyone else's mouth you speak only for yourself.

As far as riding goes you're a newbie. Many have single motorcycles with more mileage than you've put on the whole of your experience. Shit my Tuono's chain has more miles on it. We won't even consider my Harley. 'Cause you may never get there.

You want to go fast? I don't care who you are that's some funny shit right there.

You post things like this simply to evoke high emotion from others. Kinda like the guy who starts a bar fight and when it breaks out heads out the back door.

Well then here you go.

[SWriverstone]

If I'm posting just to stir things up, then why is the thread not just anger and controversy? There have been several good, thoughtful posts here. You seem like the kind of person, who might say "Stop rockin' the boat and shutup" if someone were trying to find a cure for cancer. If I wanted to stir things up, I'd call every person who posts an a$$hole and insult their mothers. I'm not doing anything of the sort.

And why even point out (as you suggest) that I'm stirring things up? It's just a forum. Hell, it would be completely accurate to say every post on this entire forum is a waste of time when we could all be out riding or working. (Want me to go find a thousand other posts on STN from folks just stirring things up? It would be easy!)

And sure, I haven't ridden as much as you or many others here (never suggested I have---I know you're a far better rider than I am)...but with 75K+ miles, I've ridden a hell of a lot more than many people. And what exactly are the qualifications to be allowed to ask a question about motorcycles or the people who ride them? 100k miles? 200k miles?  (I could say "Is your name Bill Harley or Arthur Davidson? Then you don't have a clue what you're saying and aren't entitled to comment on a Harley. But I wouldn't say that, because I know you're extremely knowledgeable about Harleys.)

We're just having a conversation, asking questions, expressing opinions---that's what EVERYONE on this forum does 100% of the time.

Scott

[Mr.Black]

[Carbonero]

Please. Scott although that's what those things mean to you don't put words in anyone else's mouth you speak only for yourself.

As far as riding goes you're a newbie. Many have single motorcycles with more mileage than you've put on the whole of your experience. Shit my Tuono's chain has more miles on it. We won't even consider my Harley. 'Cause you may never get there.

You want to go fast? I don't care who you are that's some funny shit right there.

You post things like this simply to evoke high emotion from others. Kinda like the guy who starts a bar fight and when it breaks out heads out the back door.

Well then here you go.

There's nowhere near enough decent discussion around here. I generally like Scott's posts. What's the problem? Don't like the topic, don't get involved. But to call HIM a troll, especially in comparison to some the douchebags around here, is f'ing ludicrous.

[Kootenanny]

FIrst off, I gotta say that asking why cruisers in general (and Harleys in particular) are so popular is a valid question.  They obviously suit the purposes of many motorcycle purchasers, as many such purchasers choose to buy them.

Here's my take on it: to the general public, "Harley" (and by extension, all cruisers) are "motorcycles"--that is, that's the image they get when they hear the word, "motorcycle."  And when one of the public decides they'd like to learn to ride, well, a cruiser is what they often look at first.  When a non-motorcyclist walks into a bike shop to sit on bikes, well, on the shop floor, let's face it, a cruiser seems much more friendly.  The seat is wide, soft, and low enough that they can plant both feet solidly on the ground...the bars just reach back to them, falling naturally to the hands.  Yes, sitting in the showroom, the average cruiser seems much more friendly than something with a tall seat that might feel a bit tippy, and an awkward forward lean required to reach the bars.  The average non-rider isn't going to realize that riding a bike on the street, being a dynamic process, is quite different than the static process of sitting on a bike in the showroom.  They are gonna think it's like sitting in a car--which feels pretty much the same whether the car is sitting still or moving.

So, it's understandable to me that many people won't understand how any of us could prefer riding "sporty" bikes.  They don't understand that, while these bike may be less comfortable when stopped, they can be just as comfortable as a cruiser when in motion--indeed, for many of us, more comfortable.  That we prefer the feeling of control we get from being in a dynamic, forward position.  

I've got more thoughts on this, but I'll have to post them later...

[highside]

I dont think buying a bike that can do 150 mph stock, or a 600 lb "enduro" are any less poserish than buying a Harley.

This debate is a lot like a religious debate. it never ends. and nothing gets people more pissed off than when someone else believes in different made up shit than they do.

The fact is that the argument over which koolade is better  will never end because they are all equally stupid and awesome at the same time.

[CLAY]

By the way- I was just reminded of the XR1200 on another place.


I would LOVE that Harley!