Comparing my 2004 Ducati ST3 to my new (to me) 2005 BMW R1200ST

[Royal Tiger]

This is for my bud Falconati.  

I recently sold my 2004 Ducati ST3 and traded my 2003 aprilia RSV 1000R on a 2005 BMW R1200ST.  This is a run down of my impressions so far between the Duc and the BMW.

The Bikes:
2004 Ducati ST3
2005 BMW R1200ST

Fit & Finish:
I would call this close to a tie, with a slight edge going to the BMW.  Both bikes are very well put together with no wide panel gaps or squeaks & rattles.

Comfort & Ergos:
This one goes to the BMW.  The stock Ducati seat wasn't bad, but the BMW seat is a lot more comfortable, and I prefer the 2 piece design over the huge banana style Duc seat.  The BMW has the High/Low riders seat and I have it in the High position.  Very cool feature.  The faux carbon fiber material on the BMW seat feels thicker and of a better material then the one on the Duc.  I can't say if the BMW seat is the stock one as I bought it used and am still learning about it, but I would assume it is as the bike is just about completely stock.  As far as riding position, the BMW is slightly more upright while still being sporty.  The BMW places less weight on your wrists and has more leg room.  I'm just under 6' 2" and am mostly arms and legs (34-35" inseam).  I could flat foot my KLR650 and swing a leg over without mounting the pegs first.  I definitely prefer riding the BMW so far.  The wife has ridden on both and prefers the BMW hands down for comfort.

Luggage:
The BMW came with genuine BMW side bags and top case.  I had to buy the brackets and side bags for the Ducati when I got.  Absolutely NOT the Ducati's fault.  The BMW bags are bigger and A LOT easier to use.  You can close and secure them without locking them so if you want access, just push the button.  Big time plus!  Mounting and dismounting are easier on the BMW as well.  The Ducati didn't have a top case so no direct comparison, but the one on the BMW is superb in every way.  The guy I bought my ST3 from had another ST3 with the matching top case and it wasn't as nice as the one on the BMW.

Lighting:
The Ducati had great stock lighting.  I found it easy to ride at night compared to some previous motorcycles I owned.  I did have an issue with it's 2 headlight setup with one high and one low with no option to have both on.  It always looked like one was burned out.  I see just about every new Japanese bike has this layout now, and to me it's annoying.  Everyone picks on the "tombstone" headlight on the R1200ST but DAMN this thing kicks ass for night time riding!  Both lights illuminate on high, and even with stock bulbs it's BRIGHT!  Both bikes had front turn signals integrated into the front fairings with amber bulbs under clear glass.  For rear lights, both stock tail/brake lights are sufficiently bright and easy to see.  The Ducati had amber rear turn signals on goofy stalks that looked out of place with the side bags removed.  The BMW has clear rear turns with amber bulbs on mini stalks that are nicely styled into the rear of the bike that look fine with or without bags in place.

Performance/motor:
Ducati - 992cc L-Twin, 102hp @ 8750rpm, 68.6 lb-ft @ 7250rpm
BMW - 1170cc Boxer Twin, 110hp @ 7250rpm, 84.8lb-ft @ 6000rpm

Both bikes fall more on the sport side of the sport-touring compromise.  Neither are sport bikes with bags, but they are nowhere near slow or underpowered.  The Ducati felt a little more lively leaving a stop, but the tractor like torque of the BMW is intoxicating.  You can forget to downshift and the BMW just pulls you through curves like a Kenworth.  Both have been into the 120+ mph club with me and neither one had any problems getting, or staying, there.  The BMW seems less affected by strong headwinds and both were about the same with strong cross winds.  The BMW is being ridden like I stole it, and is getting excellent fuel economy.  Probably around 55mpg-ish.  The Ducati was always steady in the mid to high 40's.  Overall in terms of power as an attribute, they are both amazing machines, but I prefer the BMW.  The Ducati was EXTREMELY touchy in terms of RPM.  Get it under 4k and it felt like an old dump truck bucking and heaving.  The BMW has been down around 2k under load and not one ounce of "jitteriness".  Both applied power in an almost electric like fashion, but the clear torque advantage of the BMW is very tough to overcome.

Transmission:
This one is a clear win for the Ducati.  Both are 6 speeds with adequate spacing, including a high enough 6th gear to allow 90+mph slabbing to be drama free affairs, but the Ducati is in another league when it comes to smooth gear changes.  The BMW is decidedly "clunky", which upon some research seems to be a BMW trademark.  I have read A LOT of "they are all like that" comments on various forums.  I don't doubt it's ruggedness though, as there are thousands of R1100/1150/1200 bikes with over 100k miles out there and no one seemed to have specific transmission issues.  Not counting the spline issues that seem to have hit the 1150's the most.

Final Drive:
The Ducati is chain drive while the BMW is shaft.  All I can say is thank heaven for shaft drive as I am SO tired of cleaning chains.  

Weight:
Ducati - 447.5lbs "dry", 499.7lbs "wet"
BMW - 451.9lbs "dry", 504.9lbs "wet"

I found wildly different numbers in researching this.  Both seem about the same to me, but I would say the Ducati was a tad lighter from having to push them both around the garage, although not back to back.

Features:
The Ducati was available with ABS latter on, but the one I had did not have it.  My BMW has it and is my first ABS equipped bike.  The BMW also has heated grips, adjustable windscreen and cruise control.  Both bikes brake very well and although I have tried to get the ABS to kick on in ultra hard panic stops, I have felt no pulsing or vibrations in the lever or pedal.

Instrumentation:
The Ducati had a dial tachometer and a digital speedometer, a layout I prefer.  The BMW uses dials for both.  The Ducati had a digital engine temperature gauge, the BMW uses a digital bar graph.  The Ducati had various functions to display on the screen, but always defaulted back to the odometer when restarted.  Every time you got back on it was scrolling through menus using buttons on the dash.  The BMW has a digital display as well and scrolling from Trip I to Trip II to the odometer is done via a button on the left handlebar.  A lot easier and more comfortable to do, especially while moving.  They both have a digital bar graph fuel gauge.  The BMW actually has a "count down" feature when you reach 1/4 tank, where it takes your current average fuel economy and available fuel level and counts the miles down to empty.  It was fascinating watching it go 48 miles, 47 miles, 46 miles, etc...    Another really great idea.  The BMW has a gear indicator which the Ducati did not.  I like having one I have to admit.  Both had digital clocks.  The Ducati cluster was a tad better lit at night.

Overall Impression:
As of right now, I have to say I like the BMW better.  The wife says it's no contest as a passenger.  Service on the BMW seems to be a lot easier and probably less expensive as well.  The shaft drive and single sided swingarm are beautiful to look at.  The Ducati had the carbon fiber exhaust can without baffles so you knew it was coming!    The BMW has a stock can and sounds like a sewing machine.  That has to be fixed ASAP!!!  The non-dive feature of the Telelever front suspension is wonderful.  Not as good at communicating road surface "feel" as conventional forks, but you get used to it.  I have to say I'm very happy with the decision.

[bikerfish1100]

nice write-up.
one of my buddies, who rides a ton of BMW miles, claims the ST is his fave BMW of all time (he currently owns 2 of them, with about 200K miles between them).

try upshifting above 5Krpm, and see what that does for your "clunky trans". that, and use very little clutch action- maybe 1/2 squeeze, at most, in conjunction with preloading the shifter.

specifics on miles and price on the ST? i would not mind finding one to add to the stable as my 2up tourer.

[Royal Tiger]

nice write-up.
one of my buddies, who rides a ton of BMW miles, claims the ST is his fave BMW of all time (he currently owns 2 of them, with about 200K miles between them).

try upshifting above 5Krpm, and see what that does for your "clunky trans". that, and use very little clutch action- maybe 1/2 squeeze, at most, in conjunction with preloading the shifter.

specifics on miles and price on the ST? i would not mind finding one to add to the stable as my 2up tourer.

Just over 15k, $7995.

[falconati]

Excellent write-up, thank you sir!  I prefer the Duc's seat, and for some reason prefer the engine that shudders ( )but otherwise I thought your opinions were about what I thought.  I especially agree with the instrumentation - I absolutely hate the fact that many BMW models have a analog speedometer.  On a small motorcycle gauge, it's so much more difficult to keep track of your speed that way.

Very glad to read your impressions - maybe someday I'll own one (but I'd put more money on me getting an RT).

[chesthing]

Pretty damn light for having a 1200cc engine and shaft drive. I hear you, I'll NEVER go back to a chain.

[Rincewind]

Did you pick this up at Hermy's?  I saw they had a R12ST for sale.  Congrats.  

[Royal Tiger]

Did you pick this up at Hermy's?  I saw they had a R12ST for sale.  Congrats.  

Yes I did.  Thanks.  

[atadaskew]

The R1200St was my favourite out of the BMW twins.
The luggage capacity of the RT, but in a sportier flavour.

Wish they still made it.  Congrats!

[chiltech500]

Rincewind and Royal Tiger, I live in the Lehigh Valley as well and will be buying a BMW R12RT - but your posts about the ST have given me some pause...

I wonder what the pros/cons are with the ST vs RT models?

I have a bit of time to make a decision as I am down till at least next spring with a fractured femur on Labor Day thanks to a cager.

[bikerfish1100]

the ride positions of the ST and RT are different, with the ST being more SPORTtouring, and the RT more sportTOURING in their design. the RT has some more creature comforts than the ST, but not substantial. biggest difference is tht the ST was only offered in 2005 (maybe 2006 as well?), whereas the RT is still in production, and has seen some refinements made to it in the intervening years.

[1KPerDay]

Nice report. Thanks! How bout some piccies?

[Royal Tiger]

the ride positions of the ST and RT are different, with the ST being more SPORTtouring, and the RT more sportTOURING in their design. the RT has some more creature comforts than the ST, but not substantial. biggest difference is tht the ST was only offered in 2005 (maybe 2006 as well?), whereas the RT is still in production, and has seen some refinements made to it in the intervening years.

Agree completely.  The 2005 ST is 102lbs lighter then a 2005 RT according to MCN.  I just did 300 miles on my ST and love it!

[chiltech500]

ST bags must be purchased separately?

[Royal Tiger]

ST bags must be purchased separately?

I can't speak for that.  My bike had all three bags.  There were a couple for sale on Cycle Trader.  I believe they had the side bags.  

[falconati]

I believe the side bags were standard; however a top case was an option.

[ConPilot1]

Havn't seen a pic there yet homey.

fuckin' cops.  


Sounds nice. I'd like to try a BMW Boxer someday. When I have some more money.  

Never rode a Boxer, but the two BMW's I have had an opportunity to ride have been really, really nice in terms of suspension, handling, and power.
Weird rear brake pedal position (for me) and the clunky transmission on a K1300GT which I felt should have been silky, clicky smooth was a WTF? for me.

Sat on an R1200R with hardbags at a dealer and fell in love with it. Felt like it was made for me at 5-9"

[metalplater]

I just love my ST. The best bike I have ever owned. Its unfortunate that it was only available for a short time and that so few people "got it".

[Royal Tiger]

Havn't seen a pic there yet homey.

fuckin' cops.  


Sounds nice. I'd like to try a BMW Boxer someday. When I have some more money.  

Never rode a Boxer, but the two BMW's I have had an opportunity to ride have been really, really nice in terms of suspension, handling, and power.
Weird rear brake pedal position (for me) and the clunky transmission on a K1300GT which I felt should have been silky, clicky smooth was a WTF? for me.

Sat on an R1200R with hardbags at a dealer and fell in love with it. Felt like it was made for me at 5-9"

I'll post a pic for my idol.  

I learned why the trans feels so "clunky":

Glad to hear you're liking it Dan.  The R-bike's transmission feels the way it does because of its "automotive" design, that is, it is a separate unit hung on the back of the engine and it uses a single-plate, dry clutch just like a car.  This, combined with the shift linkage design is what gives it its comparatively clunky feel.  A point to keep in mind is that R-bike transmissions don't like to be rushed, there is a lot of rotating mass in those transmissions compared to more conventional unit-construction transmissions. Just remember, always use the clutch for up and downshifting and don't be tentative with the shifter.  
When the time comes I'll show you how to adjust the valves and do all of the other service yourself, these bikes are a walk in the park when it comes to maintenance.

[ConPilot1]

Wow. That's pretty. Good luck with it dude, looks like a lot of fun.
Let us know if you have any oil usage issues with it. I've been hearing bits about excessive oil usage on R-twin boxers here and there
and I've yet to draw any conclusions about it.

[chiltech500]

Sweet ride con pilot, I love the two-tone paint scheme