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« on: January 31, 2016, 12:44:39 pm »

Would like to get some sort of home theater reassembled.  All my components washed away in the flood of 2011, and I'm just slowly collecting parts.  Now that I have a set of Pioneer towers for mains, a set of Polk bookshelf speakers for backs, and a good sized sub, I need an AV receiver.

If you've upgraded and have one sitting, or would like to upgrade, I want a good used piece with no deficiencies.  5, 5.1, or 5.2 at minimum, and optical input.  Icing on the cake is a phono input, but I'm not holding my breath.

Anyone?

Thanks!
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« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2016, 01:08:31 pm »

I have a nice Denon AVR 2313CI. It was used for about two years, in EXCELLENT condition. I'm a professional AV installer, so I keep my equipment in top notch condition. It is in excellent condition, and I believe I have all the manuals and accessories and remote handy.

If you're not familiar with Denon, they are pretty much the defacto standard in AV receiver installations. And the 2313 was their top of the line at the time. Well, one notch below the 3313.

It has all the HDMI inputs/outputs you'd need, optical and coax digital inputs, and even has built in Pandora! You can also control the whole receiver with an app on your phone. No phono input, but you can buy good phono pre-amps online.

Here is an image of the back



Specs on BH

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/860824-REG/Denon_AVR_2313CI_AVR_2312CI_7_2_Channel_Integrated_Network.html

I can let it go for $400!


Let me know if you're interested. It is an EXCELLENT receiver!
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« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2016, 01:37:06 pm »

That's a really nice piece.  Thanks for the reply.  And I apologize for wasting your time by not indicating that I'd like to stay near $150...anything more than that is stretching right now, being out of work and all.
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« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2016, 02:04:06 pm »

I'm also looking, but not necessarily for a home audio - maybe just music.

Looking cheap, as I don't need the features of a modern day receiver, but I don't think I'll find a stereo receiver with a built in crossover and a line level subwoofer output - extra speakers are far from full range...

 -Dan
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« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2016, 09:12:18 pm »

No worries! If I come across anything, I'll let you guys know.  Bigok
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« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2016, 03:55:08 pm »

Goose - I can tell you that the 2313 is a great receiver. I have the 3313 running my family room set up. Only thing I hate is that every time it powers up it switches to TV/Audio and won't just stay on Cable/Sat... I have to switch it every time I turn on the TV.

But otherwise, great receiver.

- Dan
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« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2016, 04:39:42 pm »

My 2 tops recommendations (without going esoteric) would be Yamaha and Denon.

I'm on my 3rd Yamaha receiver. Not because any of them failed but just the opposite. They keep working when my wants change, so I hand them along to other family members.

I moved to the RX-V 871 for the internal, 7-port HDMI switcher, network streaming, and all the other features.

http://usa.yamaha.com/products/audio-visual/av-receivers-amps/rx/rx-v871_black_u/
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« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2016, 08:42:51 pm »

I'm a fan of Yamaha, Pioneer, Denon, and Harmon.  Onkyo would be fine as well.  My last Yamaha did not swim well.

Best Buy has the Pioneer VSX-530-K on sale for $180, what thinks you of that?
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« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2016, 10:32:48 am »

There are several good choices out there for the money.  For me, a decent AV receiver must use discrete amplification instead of the basic chip type.  

You need to determine whether or not you're going to use your AV receiver to run all video signals to it or not because the amount of available plugs would be key.  For me, I run most of my HDMI straight to my TV and use the receiver for audio only often times using the digital coax or TOS link for the audio.  That way, I don't always need to turn on my AV receiver when I want to watch something.  If you run everything through through your AV receiver, it will need to be on in order to watch TV.


For me, I've had experience with Sony, Sony ES, and Yamaha.  My Yamahas have held up the longest and, to me, provide a better sound quality.  That said, Onkyo, Denon, and a few others make good units as well.  


Here are some good resources for info:


http://www.cnet.com/topics/av-receivers/best-av-receivers/



http://www.soundandvision.com/content/top-picks-av-receivers#sHS0DBw8DRU4IP2w.97



http://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews
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« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2016, 04:15:54 pm »

Doug - my Denon has a standby passthrough, so when it is off I can still use the TV... The smart TV recognizes that the Denon is not on and then plays sound through the TV speakers - although I almost never do that. I have it so when I turn on the TV, the TV tells the Denon to wake up. Problem is, it also switches to TV/Audio instead of Cable/Sat....




There are several good choices out there for the money.  For me, a decent AV receiver must use discrete amplification instead of the basic chip type.  

You need to determine whether or not you're going to use your AV receiver to run all video signals to it or not because the amount of available plugs would be key.  For me, I run most of my HDMI straight to my TV and use the receiver for audio only often times using the digital coax or TOS link for the audio.  That way, I don't always need to turn on my AV receiver when I want to watch something.  If you run everything through through your AV receiver, it will need to be on in order to watch TV.


For me, I've had experience with Sony, Sony ES, and Yamaha.  My Yamahas have held up the longest and, to me, provide a better sound quality.  That said, Onkyo, Denon, and a few others make good units as well.  


Here are some good resources for info:


http://www.cnet.com/topics/av-receivers/best-av-receivers/



http://www.soundandvision.com/content/top-picks-av-receivers#sHS0DBw8DRU4IP2w.97



http://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews
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« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2016, 06:04:30 pm »

A (hopefully) gently used Yamaha RX-V675 and a new optical cable now reside in my stack of pending projects.  Thanks for everyone's input and efforts.
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« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2016, 06:48:04 pm »


Doug - my Denon has a standby passthrough, so when it is off I can still use the TV... The smart TV recognizes that the Denon is not on and then plays sound through the TV speakers - although I almost never do that. I have it so when I turn on the TV, the TV tells the Denon to wake up. Problem is, it also switches to TV/Audio instead of Cable/Sat....






Nice, thanks for the info, Dan.  How is the audio handled?  Can you use your TV speakers with your receiver off?  I suspect if you're using HDMI, the audio would pass through too.

Good feature too look for!
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« Reply #12 on: February 05, 2016, 11:47:17 am »





Nice, thanks for the info, Dan.  How is the audio handled?  Can you use your TV speakers with your receiver off?  I suspect if you're using HDMI, the audio would pass through too.

Good feature too look for!


Yes, it's video and audio pass through. The cable box isn't connected directly to the TV, it goes through the receiver.
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« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2016, 02:22:09 pm »

If, God-forbid, I ever need to replace my current AV unit, this is nice feature to have (most likely, they all of this now).
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« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2016, 12:53:32 am »


Goose - I can tell you that the 2313 is a great receiver. I have the 3313 running my family room set up. Only thing I hate is that every time it powers up it switches to TV/Audio and won't just stay on Cable/Sat... I have to switch it every time I turn on the TV.

But otherwise, great receiver.

- Dan



Hmm....are you using the ARC from your TV? If not, you can turn the "HDMI CONTROL" to OFF in the receiver, as well as whatever HDMI control you have on the TV.

Are you using some type of universal remote? Have you tried turning on the TV first, then the receiver? Or vice versa? On the Denon, there is a discreet code for the CBL/SAT...you can actually turn the unit on by pressing CBL/SAT on the remote....no need to press "power", and it will go straight to the correct input!

I do this for a living every day, and yeah, HDMI is a real pain in my ass sometimes!  
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« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2016, 09:54:15 am »

Nice, thanks for the info, Dan.  How is the audio handled?  Can you use your TV speakers with your receiver off?  I suspect if you're using HDMI, the audio would pass through too.

Good feature too look for!


Yamaha has passthrough on HDMI and "analog" audio (not TOS-Link). It won't power the external speakers since the amp isn't on.
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« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2016, 12:54:39 pm »

Yes, I am using the ARC from my TV. That way I can run everything through the basic Comcast Xfinity X1 remote (power and volume).

All I want to be able to do is stop the ARC from telling the Denon to switch to TV Audio. (I believe the entirety of the TV Audio source is simply an optical cable from the TV to the receiver for smart tv programs (like Netflix, etc.) - the back of the Denon shows TV/Audio for the optical audio input.

There is no HDMI input for TV/Audio.

I'm basically stuck using my phone (the Denon is in the closet) to turn the source to Cable/Sat via the Denon Remote App every time I turn on the TV.

If you could fix this, my gratitude would be significant.








Hmm....are you using the ARC from your TV? If not, you can turn the "HDMI CONTROL" to OFF in the receiver, as well as whatever HDMI control you have on the TV.

Are you using some type of universal remote? Have you tried turning on the TV first, then the receiver? Or vice versa? On the Denon, there is a discreet code for the CBL/SAT...you can actually turn the unit on by pressing CBL/SAT on the remote....no need to press "power", and it will go straight to the correct input!

I do this for a living every day, and yeah, HDMI is a real pain in my ass sometimes!  
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« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2016, 04:19:43 pm »

https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=8463
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« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2016, 06:17:33 pm »



Very cool - won't help me tho - problem isn't selecting the right input, it's the automatic switching of the sources to TV/AUDIO as soon as the Denon powers on.

That's a great item for people with receivers/tv's with one HDMI input but with multiple HDMI sources...
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« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2016, 05:20:24 am »




Very cool - won't help me tho - problem isn't selecting the right input, it's the automatic switching of the sources to TV/AUDIO as soon as the Denon powers on.

That's a great item for people with receivers/tv's with one HDMI input but with multiple HDMI sources...


Yep. Or who have more components than the TV supports or a receiver without HDMI support.

Amazingly affordable too.

I was suggesting it if you can't get your Denon issue resolved. 1 HDMI in to the Denon from the switch and it auto-switches to whichever device is active based on prioritized ports. Nothing for the Denon to dick with.
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« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2016, 03:44:11 pm »




Yep. Or who have more components than the TV supports or a receiver without HDMI support.

Amazingly affordable too.

I was suggesting it if you can't get your Denon issue resolved. 1 HDMI in to the Denon from the switch and it auto-switches to whichever device is active based on prioritized ports. Nothing for the Denon to dick with.


There is no HDMI input to the Denon associated with TV/Audio - the only active HDMI input is the cable box when the Denon is powered on.

Regardless of active source, it switches to TV/Audio, which is an optical digital input between the TV and the Denon.

Which gets me thinking - is that Optical input even necessary? I assume it is, as an ARC HDMI connection between the Denon (the monitor out HDMI output on the Denon) allows controls to be sent to the Denon through that cable, it can't pass audio both ways... can it?

 -Dan
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« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2016, 04:43:44 pm »

Optical (TOS-Like) is digital audio only (no video). I used it with my previous Yamaha to get better audio than I could with copper.

I also used the HDMI switch and bypassed the receiver for all video (since it didn't have HDMI as your Denon) doesn't.

TV stays on HDMI 1. HDMI switches video. Receiver does audio only (don't plumb in any video sources to it unless there's a device without HDMI out).
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« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2016, 04:54:06 pm »

I'm with you. My problem is that I use the Denon for audio 100% of the time. Through the ARC HDMI connection from Denon's monitor out to the Samsung Smart TV, when I turn on the TV, it powers up the Denon.

If I run the cable box HDMI output directly to the TV, and the DVD player's HDMI to the TV's second HDMI input (bypassing the Denon), I won't be able to have the Denon power up automatically when I power up the TV.

Either way, I have an extra step - either (1) powering up the Denon if I don't run the HDMI sources through the Denon; or (2) switching the Denon back to Cable/Sat after it is powered up by the TV.

I've tried to come up with a solution, but I'm at the point there isn't one. IF there was a TV/Audio HDMI input (or if I could assign the Cable Box HDMI to TV/Audio) that would be great, but there isn't and I can't assign any HDMI input to TV/Audio.

NO solution as of yet. Maybe a firmware update to the SAmsung TV so it will not automatically switch the input on the Denon to TV/Audio...

 -Dan
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« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2016, 06:39:21 am »


I've tried to come up with a solution, but I'm at the point there isn't one. IF there was a TV/Audio HDMI input (or if I could assign the Cable Box HDMI to TV/Audio) that would be great, but there isn't and I can't assign any HDMI input to TV/Audio.


Logitech Harmony remote. Easily set up to "script" control multiple devices with a single push of a button.
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« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2016, 02:54:45 pm »




Logitech Harmony remote. Easily set up to "script" control multiple devices with a single push of a button.


Yes, can use a Harmony remote with a delay that tells it to switch, but then I have to run infra red repeaters or some such because the Denon is in the closet behind the TV. I'll deal. Don't think there is a solution - Apparently Denon gave an option to turn off the auto switch to TV/Audio in its HDMI menu in newer receivers, but no firmware update fix as of yet for the 3313... Oh well, my family doesn't mind and they know what to do...

 -Dan
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« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2016, 05:25:16 pm »

Get an RF Harmony and IR Blaster for in the closet?
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« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2016, 06:13:16 pm »


Get an RF Harmony and IR Blaster for in the closet?


I actually have a Harmony remote under my bed...it's been sitting for a long time. I set it up for my basement once, but it wasn't worth it (it was a gift from a friend, and it is a little worn - you have to push a couple buttons fairly hard to get them to register...)

THanks for the advice. Maybe I'll play with it this weekend.

 _Dan
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« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2016, 07:40:51 pm »

Yes Harmony remote or some other type of remote. Us an RF unit to transmit the signal wirelessly.

The connect all your sources to the denon via HDMI only, and one HDMI out to the TV. Then get rid of the ARC...its a PITA most of the time. Then everything will run perfectly Wink
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