The Official S-T.N Digital Camera Thread

[vitaminC]

Nice post!

And what the hell kind of scary bug is that?
Jeff

Jerusalem cricket (also many other names)

[Sport-Touring]

[Johnny Monsoon]

Yeah, jumping to the S3 from some other cannon cheapo really jump started my excitement for better photography. I imagine an SLR would do much the same.

It will.  The D80 is a fantastic choice; I've been so damn impressed with this camera.  I was yanked into the SLR realm after playing with a buddy's D60 for about 10 minutes.  After realizing how woefully limited even a good P&S camera is by comparison, I vowed to grab a DSLR as soon as I could.  I did; a D80, and haven't looked back.  It goes almost everywhere with me (as my wife will attest... as she rolls her eyes).

[CBRXXBLACKBIRD]

 It goes almost everywhere with me (as my wife will attest... as she rolls her eyes).

I hear you there Johnny mine does the same thing, now that I have a studio setup at my house, I get to use her for testing my lighting techniques  

[FZ1 Matt]

Jerusalem cricket (also many other names)

Woah! Thanks. I googled it and am now quite grossed out. I don't care for anything that has an exoskeleton. Being from the Midwest, I've never seen anything like that. They sure grow em big out there.

[vitaminC]

Woah! Thanks. I googled it and am now quite grossed out. I don't care for anything that has an exoskeleton. Being from the Midwest, I've never seen anything like that. They sure grow em big out there.

We had one in our house once- very exciting!  

[FZ1 Matt]

Thanks for your recommendations on the Nikon 18-70 mm f/3.5-4.5G ED-IF AF-S DX zoom, doodah man.

I'm thinking that would be a lens that I will use and enjoy but sooner or later I'll be wishing I had more reach. This camera and lens I'm looking for would come with me on the bike everywhere. I don't want a pile of lenses. What do you all think about the Nikkor 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF AF-S DX VR II AF. Lots of people like it in reviews that I have read. It covers a great range and is pretty fast at f/3.5. Another thing I'm thinking about for fun is a Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 AT-X 116 Pro DX AF. Reviews on that one say they it's very close or better than the Nikon of similar size and the Tokina is half the price. It is has no Image stabilization however. That really isn't an issue with something that wide though, correct? I like that it's f/2.8 but since it has no IS, would it be sort of a wash for handheld night shots when compared to something a bit slower (f/3.5)?

One more camera question also. Does the D80 have live view? Can I see through the LCD screen as I take the pic, or is this view finder only? Will I miss no live view? I can take some funky angle shots with my S3IS because I can compose the image from the screen (the screen also rotates which has been usefull to me too). The D90 has live view I guess but is also more money and probably more than I want to spend right now for a camera body.

I'm getting antsy. I'm going to pull the trigger soon.  

Any Nikkor 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF AF-S DX VR II AF' s laying around by you for less than $620, Fred?  

[torags v2]

If I recall, I sold my 18/200 for $575 thru Craigs list.

It was the best choice for an overall travel lens. It only drove me nuts when I tried to shoot an indoor rodeo. The variable aperture is automatic, so you can't adjust it for low light to get bokeh.

Well this is a Sports Touring website and we're on a camera thread, so what do you think of this trip:

I have fleshed out my trip to bikeweek. My itinerary is roughed out and getting the gear packed for my R1150RS.

It goes like this: SF to San Diego. Leave SD a midnite to hit high altitude freezing weather during the day (east of Tucson), carry on to Jacksonville for a IBA 50CC. Get to Daytona Sunday 3/2/09, Check the Greyhound track to see if I can get access to photograph the practices in the am. Wednesday I'll shoot the matinee races. Then head over to Sopotnicks to shoot the Women's cole slaw wrestling.

Wed or Thursday nite photograph dirt rack at the Muni stadium, Fri is the Daytona 200 (I'll be there), Saturday is the Honda SupercrossAt nite.

Check in Sunday morn at main street for the topless gals parade & leave Daytona. Next stop Tucson,AZ rest time with a bud; before leaving for Page AZ area. This area has a lot of slot canyons - Antelope, Water Holes, Wire Pass and Bucskin Gulch. I figure 2-3 days before I head over to photograph some dunes in Death Valley.

A day n a half or two there before I leave for SF.

What do you think, did I miss anything? (the Sierra passes are closed in March)

Any suggestions?

Rags

[FZ1 Matt]

Thanks. I remember seeing pics from the Rodeo you took. I'll go back and check them out. What lenses are you using now?


Page, AZ on your trip sounds fun. I stayed there once. I didn't check it out as much as I should have. Have a good trip. Sounds Awesome!

[Johnny Monsoon]

One more camera question also. Does the D80 have live view? Can I see through the LCD screen as I take the pic, or is this view finder only? Will I miss no live view? I can take some funky angle shots with my S3IS because I can compose the image from the screen (the screen also rotates which has been usefull to me too). The D90 has live view I guess but is also more money and probably more than I want to spend right now for a camera body.

Nope, the live view in the LCD started with the D90.  I actually had a D90 for a short while and traded back to the D80.  I'll be absolutely honest when I say that the controls and slightly greater control of the camera with the D90 is something I miss, but not enough to forgo the photos it gave me.  I simply did not care for the images; the D90 could never duplicate the depth and beauty of the D80's images for some reason (which makes no sense to me because on paper, the D90 stomps the D80).  But, I want pretty pics at the end of the day, and I'm always pleased with the D80; in fact, it seems that the overall photo 'feel' of the D80 is much closer to the D200/300 cameras than the D90 is.  The D90 seems to produce more Canon-esque shots (sort of clinical feeling; which can be really good in some situations, but not for the type of shooting I like to do).

At any rate, I missed the 'live view' when weening myself off of P&S cameras, but it only really lasted about a week (or less).  You can have the camera display the photo on the LCD directly after you take the photo, which is really a better measure of what you'll get anyway; the live view does not change to represent the setting changes you're making (since it is an SLR vs. P&S).  I doubt you'll miss it either, despite seeming like a big thing to lose during the transition.  I know what you mean about funky camera angles, but honestly, that big lens proves a pretty good aiming tool; I haven't missed a 'funky angle' shot yet due to lack of live view.

Out of curiosity, why aren't you buying the 'kit'?  The supplied lens is very good.  VERY good.  A nice all-rounder; and I know BB has it for $899 right now, but probably can get it for less since they're dropping that model in favor of the D90.

[Avigar]

Matt, what is your budget for this changeover? You may be happier with the Nikon D90 which has a CMOS sensor that's rated at ISO3200. The CMOS specs are similar to the D300. The D80's CCD sensor is only rated at 1600. Two excellent for the money lenses are the Tamron 17-50 f2/8 and 70-200 f/2.8. I don't think you can go wrong with this combination if you're on a budget and want fast zoom lenses. At least you won't be upgrading for a while with this combo.

I did a pricegrabber search fo these 3 items and came up with these numbers:

D90 body - $860
17-50 - $364
70-200 - $620

It's a great and versatile setup for under 2 grand. One thing to add. Have you checked out the Nikonians forum yet? It's a great source of info on anything Nikon.

[Johnny Monsoon]

Matt, what is your budget for this changeover? You may be happier with the Nikon D90 which has a CMOS sensor that's rated at ISO3200. The CMOS specs are similar to the D300. The D80's CCD sensor is only rated at 1600.

Both cameras go to absolute shite above 1200.  They both start getting sketchy at 800+.  The D90 has much more user friendly ISO control than the D80, but the D80 isn't exactly difficult to change either; just a two-button at-once affair instead of a direct push button (as I recall).

I would NOT buy the D90 based on the 'spec' of ISO sensitivity.  If anything, the true singular advantage of the D90 over the D80 is the slight increase in FPS.  That is significant if you're doing a lot of sports shots or action photos.  The disadvantage though, is that the image DOES suffer for the rapid shooting.  I miss the faster shots, but honestly, not enough to keep the camera for that reason (again, for my purposes it was nice but nowhere near mandatory).  

[torags v2]

Thanks. I remember seeing pics from the Rodeo you took. I'll go back and check them out. What lenses are you using now?


Page, AZ on your trip sounds fun. I stayed there once. I didn't check it out as much as I should have. Have a good trip. Sounds Awesome!

I replace one 7" 18/200 with a 9" 24/70 2.8 plus a  10" 70/200 2.8. Quite a difference in "load" (and you need a new bag!).  But I like to take moon shots (it moves in low as well as stadium) light.

The lens is excellent in daylight...

Here's one with a D70S from the Wave near page



One from a rodeo (could have used a faster shutter speed - look at the rear hoof of the horse & I could have used 300mm)

[torags v2]

"One more camera question also. Does the D80 have live view? Can I see through the LCD screen as I take the pic, or is this view finder only? Will I miss no live view? I can take some funky angle shots with my S3IS because I can compose the image from the screen (the screen also rotates which has been usefull to me too). The D90 has live view I guess but is also more money and probably more than I want to spend right now for a camera body."

No live view on the D80. There is an angle viewfinder accessory that would help with those shots. Live view on a P&S is never accurate representing the full image from the lens. Frankly I have a problem seeing if my subject is in focus in live view during daylight, but I have used it for night shots on a tripod. I can get it right faster with the viewfinder (just me)

I have a D90 as a second cam primarily for DX "reach". I wouldn't buy it for live view. The D80 images can be excellent.

[ive_been_hijacked]

If anything, the true singular advantage of the D90 over the D80 is the slight increase in FPS.

I thought the D90's HD-quality movie capability fit that title?  

[torags v2]

I thought the D90's HD-quality movie capability fit that title?  

I don't know (how or if) you can make a print from the movie mode images.

Rags

[ive_been_hijacked]

I don't know (how or if) you can make a print from the movie mode images.

Rags

That's not my point.  My point is that the D80, nor any previous Nikon DSLR, could do movies.  Having the option with the D90 is nice.  And the fact that it's HD is an added bonus.  FPS are great for somethings, but for moto-travels the movies are nice ways to catch things that stills can't.  Bling factor aside, movie capability is the single reason I'd personally opt for the D90.

[FZ1 Matt]

Movies not a big deal to me. My S3IS Cannon is pretty good at that for most of what I'd want. D90 does look nice. I could always go up and up and up with different cameras. Kind of like starting with a GSXR600 and having people say the 750 is better. But the 750 is so close to the 1000 that I should just get that. With the 1000 purchase, I'd now be 2 steps away from what I thought I wanted and would have less money in  my pocket.

Chris, you should buy the D90. Just do it. You know you want to.  

[FZ1 Matt]

Matt, what is your budget for this changeover? You may be happier with the Nikon D90 which has a CMOS sensor that's rated at ISO3200. The CMOS specs are similar to the D300. The D80's CCD sensor is only rated at 1600. Two excellent for the money lenses are the Tamron 17-50 f2/8 and 70-200 f/2.8. I don't think you can go wrong with this combination if you're on a budget and want fast zoom lenses. At least you won't be upgrading for a while with this combo.

I did a pricegrabber search fo these 3 items and came up with these numbers:

D90 body - $860
17-50 - $364
70-200 - $620

It's a great and versatile setup for under 2 grand. One think to add. Have you checked out the Nikonians forum yet? It's a great
source of info on anything Nikon.

Thanks Ben,
Yes I would be very interested in not spending 2 grand. That Tamron 70-200 f/2.8 doesn't have Vibration Reduction aka. Image stabilization. It is faster though at 2.8 throughout the whole range. I'm thinking I want vibration reduction for extra tripodless freedom.

Would f/2.8 at 200mm with no stabilization make up for f/5.6 at 200mm with stabilization? I don't know what would work best for me.
That is how other lens makers like Tamaron draw you in -- with those impressive apertures. I just don't know.

Thanks for that nikonians link. I'm now going to spend all the time that I should be sleeping, reading that stuff. Wonderful.  

I didn't research my last truck purchase this much, geeze.

[Avigar]

Just wait until you catch the dreaded NAS (Nikon Acquisition Syndrone).    It's very addictive, never ending cycle. You need to research the type of lens and focal range you're most likely use often. Depending on your budget, buy the best lens you can readily afford. Nikon lenses will tend to hold their value much longer as compared to 3rd party versions. Plus, you'll probably end up changing camera bodies more often due to technology than you would lenses. If you're going to be shooting at the longer end minus a tripod, then VR would come in handy at a heftier price.

Before you decide on the camera and lenses, have you considered renting a setup for a weekend? It's a great way to test drive the different body and lens combinations. I'm sure there are local photography shops in your area that rent by the day or week.

If price is still the factor, also consider getting factory refurbished or used equipment. There are Nikon authorized vendors that sell the refurb stuff. Nikon refurb bodies and lenses usually have limited 90 day warranty periods. Just be aware of the so called "grey imports" when you start comparing prices on new items. They're the same new equipment, costs less, but do not carry the USA warranty. NikonUSA will not accept these grey imports for warranty repairs. You'll have to go through a 3rd party vendor to get them serviced. Have fun on your search.  

[Johnny Monsoon]

I thought the D90's HD-quality movie capability fit that title?  

There are a variety of issues with the video capability with the D90.  If you want a camcorder, get one, but don't use this camera to meet that need.

I took hundreds of photos using a variety of methods.  I really liked the fast shooting of the D90, but there is absolutely no way the images (even with exactly the same settings) were as good when I was hammering away as when I'd take a single photo.  The D80 gives images that are much, much closer (essentially indistinguishable) from composed photos than the D90 does.  I suspect that's an algorithm issue and not a hardware issue.

I probably should have done more research to see if there was a software update that would have gotten the D90 closer to the D80's images.  There's no doubt the D90 is a superior instrument, it just never gave images that looked as good and I was really disappointed with that.