Two new buells! A few questions

[Spiffious]

So, my dad and I both got new 1125cr's last week.

We are loving the bikes.  I can't wait until its broken in and I can accelerate without short-shifting to keep it under 6k rpm.


Anyways, we have a few questions for the Buellites:

1) How to best care for the plastic body work?  The manual just lists various harley branded supplies.   Can I use normal car wash and normal wax to protect the finish?

2) Warranty:  The 2 yr unlimited mileage warranty is great, and I do NOT want to have it voided.  What do I have to do to avoid voiding it?  For example, the first service.  Can I do that myself as long as I document the work and keep oil receipts?  

3) Oil:  Are you switching to synthetics at 600 miles?  Do you have to use harley brand oil to keep warrenty, and if not, what kind?

4) Seat:  The stock seat isn't bad, but does anyone have any experience with the buell touring seat?

5)  How do I keep from salivating on my chin whenever looking at the 1125cr?

6)  Is it normal for the front wheel to be on a higher elevation plane than the rear wheel during acceleration?

[Sport-Touring]

[wbrisett]

1) How to best care for the plastic body work?  The manual just lists various harley branded supplies.   Can I use normal car wash and normal wax to protect the finish?

Wash? I just put on my rain gear and ride. That's pretty much the washing my bikes get. But then I've been living with a Uly for a long time and that's pretty much what the manual states. ;-)

2) Warranty:  The 2 yr unlimited mileage warranty is great, and I do NOT want to have it voided.  What do I have to do to avoid voiding it?  For example, the first service.  Can I do that myself as long as I document the work and keep oil receipts?  

3) Oil:  Are you switching to synthetics at 600 miles?  Do you have to use harley brand oil to keep warrenty, and if not, what kind?

Keep your receipts. That's what I'm doing. I've never had a warranty item denied. Wait. I've only had one issue with my Uly, damn exhaust actuator switch.

I will be putting in Royal Purple Synthetic this week in my CR.

Wayne

[Spiffious]

I figure I still have my SV that can double as my 'dirty' bike... I want to keep the CR pristine (or as much as can be while still actually riding it)

[Tyrroneous]

I've been using Honda spray wax/polish with good results. I think I remember reading in my manual that you can use normal car wash and wax too.

Doing your own maintenance will not void the warranty.  Just keep reciepts/proof of work done.  Watch out though, if you chance the filter, it can get messy.  Oil changes are wierd on this beastie.

I put in Mobil 1 synthetic at the first change.  The manual calls for the Harley synthetic, so I figured an equivalent (or superior) synthetic would also work.  

I've read good things about the Buell aftermarket seat over on BadWeb, but I have no complaints about the stock 1125R seat.  

I have the same drool problem...so can't help ya there.

[Rogue]

I would wait for the next major service before switching to synthetic.  Let the engine fully break in before doing that.  Meanwhile, use cheap dino-oil but change it at 4k miles.

[JamesG]

The Buell bodywork is bare unpainted plastic. Any plastic polish will do.

4) Seat:  The stock seat isn't bad, but does anyone have any experience with the buell touring seat?

If you are sitting on the seat long enough for it become uncomfortable, you are using a CR incorrectly.

5)  How do I keep from salivating on my chin whenever looking at the 1125cr?

Wear a bib?

6)  Is it normal for the front wheel to be on a higher elevation plane than the rear wheel during acceleration?

Yes.  

[wbrisett]

I would wait for the next major service before switching to synthetic.  

From what I understand, the bikes ship with synthetic from the factor, as do every other HD.

Wayne

[Rogue]

That's news to me.  

My Buell did NOT have synthetic oil and I'm sure it's a better engine than any H-D motor out there short of a VRod.  

BTW your engine was built by Rotax of Austria and NOT H-D.  

There are few engines out there that ship out with synthetic motor oil.  I believe Porsche engines are and at one point, the Corvette engines did too (maybe the ZR1 motors).  These engines are hand built one at a time, and were supposedly "broken in" at the factory wherein after each Porshce and Corvette is finished, they are taken to an oval track and driven for a bit at relatively high speed.  Then their oil and filter are changed and Mobil 1 synthetic oil is poured in, the test driver signs off on each vehicle, and the car is then shipped to the dealership.  This is their "soft" break in from the factory.  When each vehicle was delivered to its owner, it can be driven pretty hard after that (some cases straight to the race track).  But I read about this many years ago and I'm not sure if this is still actually done.  Maybe those with new Porsche and Corvettes can attest to this.

The purpose of putting cheap, thin, dyno oil in a new engine is to allow the piston rings, bore, bearings, crank, etc. a chance to "bed in" to their new surroundings.  For example this allows the piston rings to properly seal within their bore so that oil does not seap through into the combustion chambers as the engine gains mileage.  Engines that are not properly broken in usually become oil burners later.  After about 600 miles, when you perform that first oil change it's normal to find tiny shavings of metal around the bottom of the oil pan (probably more in the oil filter).  That's usually because your engine's internals got broken in.  If synthetic oil is used at the initial engine start up (like straight from the factory), the synthetic oil coats your engines internals with lube and it never allows parts to bed in properly.  So unless that engine was designed with so much precision as to not require a break in by its owner because synthetic oil is already in it, synthetic oil should not be used for about 4k miles, sometimes it's wise to wait to the 10k mark.  It won't hurt the engine one bit.  What will hurt it is if you put in synthetic too early on an engine that is not fully broken in.  

Having said that, I could be wrong about H-D engines!  However, if Honda, Yamaha, & Kawasaki chooses not to hand built their already precise engines in their very high tech sportbikes putting out well over 100 bhp/liter and instead ships their ver precise engines with cheap dyno oil, I find it hard to believe that H-D ships theirs out with synthetic because they are that precisely built!    I mean, to get that kind of precision to be able to use synthetic oil from the factory, you would have to literally hand build each engine and check every single tolerance to a micro level to ensure everything is perfectly balanced and blueprinted.  I believe only a few engines meant for production machines are given that kind of love and care (case in point is Porsche and certain Corvette engines).

[chornbe]

From what I understand, the bikes ship with synthetic from the factor, as do every other HD.

Wayne

This is correct. Harley officially started shipping with Synth as of the '07 model year.

HD ships them with Synth because the Synth and Synth blends typically hold up better in high heat and help dissipate heat better than dino oils.

[wbrisett]

BTW your engine was built by Rotax of Austria and NOT H-D.  

Yeah, I knew that.  

My point was that HD (and Buell) have been shipping these bikes with Synthetic oil in them from the factory... or at least that's what I've been told by two people, one a local HD mechanic employed by the local HD dealership, the other somebody who asked that question when he was at the Buell factory last year. Now, what's unclear to me is if the 1125 engine shipped with synthetic oil or not, regardless, I bought synthetic for the 600 mile service and plan to use it.

One other note... my 600 mile service on my BMW RT was done free by the dealership, and they used synthetic oil during the 600 mile service. I have no clue however, what BMW specified and used out of the factory. So far, I haven't a lick of engine trouble with either my BMW RT or Buell Ulysses which used synthetic oil at their first service. It's really unfortunate that oil threads end up going down a rat hole on most boards because sometimes there are real nuggets in them, but then there are the hundreds of post you have to read to find them that are full of conjecture and wrong information.

Wayne

[kevin_stevens]

I honestly can't figure out why people get so excited about their motor oil, when by all accounts, if you keep any kind of oil in the motor and change it - ever, you never have an oil-related engine problem no matter what you use.

The same people never change their fork oil, which actually *does* turn to goop and stop working.  :shrug

I changed my oil at 400 miles with Mobil 1 V-Twin Synthetic, because it was on sale.  I have some Castrol going in Tuesday.  God knows what the Harley dealer will think of that, but since they couldn't schedule the 620 mile service for three weeks and I'm already at 1500 miles, damned if I was going to wait for them.

KeS

[Rogue]

Wow!  That is news to me.  Harley is that confident huh?  Well okay.

My Buell is an '06 and there was no mention of the use of Synthetic motor oil in it.  They did recommend changing oil and filter at 600 miles and following a ridiculous break in procedure so I figure they used cheap dyno oil and wanted their engine to break in properly back in '06.  I did go to Synthetic oil around the 10k figure although I get the feeling it won't matter a damn since I religously change my oil and filter every 4k miles.  Now that I'm at 25k miles, the motor burns LESS oil.  So I must have done something right.  I'm actually thinking of going back to regular dyno oil since I couldn't really care less if the motor lasts or not since the bike isn't worth anything at this point.  I think I'm just wasting my $$'s by using Syn oil.  

Honestly, I don't think it would affect your warranty at all by going to Synthetic.  I do think it is way too early to do that at 600 miles but that's just me.  Do what feels good to you.  

[Rogue]

I must have missed this.

Kevin, you got an 1125CR?  Congratulations!  

[Spiffious]

So, no problem using any 20-50 moto moil regardless of brand at first service?   I was thinking regular oil... then synthetic at the 2nd change.


As for plastic... Can I wax the plastic to help protect it?

[kevin_stevens]

So, no problem using any 20-50 moto moil regardless of brand at first service?   I was thinking regular oil... then synthetic at the 2nd change.


As for plastic... Can I wax the plastic to help protect it?

You might get hooked up with badweatherbikers.com if you aren't already - funky forum format, but there's a lot of Buell info there.

Yes, you can wax the plastic.  The only thing I've heard as a problem for the bodywork is someone who used some kind of plastic polish on the CR screen that left a grey residue.  It's not clear if that was just wax deposit that would clean off, or some chemical reaction.

I just use Plexus/Honda/Original spray'n'wax on the whole bike and it's worked ok so far.  Not sure what to use when I need to *actually* polish it to remove minor scratches  though (that plastic is pretty soft).

KeS

[chornbe]

Can someone point to an authoritative article or tech bulletin on why synth oil is bad or how it can be used "too soon"? The operative word here is authoritative. I'm not looking for "because the rings need to seat in". I'm an ASE certified engine mechanic. I know all about rings. I'm looking for authoritative evidence that synth oils are "bad" because they're "too slippery"...  

[kevin_stevens]

Can someone point to an authoritative article or tech bulletin on why synth oil is bad or how it can be used "too soon"? The operative word here is authoritative. I'm not looking for "because the rings need to seat in". I'm an ASE certified engine mechanic. I know all about rings. I'm looking for authoritative evidence that synth oils are "bad" because they're "too slippery"...  

Maybe in a different forum?  One intended for religious wars?  

KeS

[chornbe]

Maybe in a different forum?  One intended for religious wars?  

KeS

There's already a Harley subforum.  

[Rogue]

Well if you're an ASE mechanic, you don't need any authority to tell you what breaking in your engine is suppose to do, as well as how synthetic oil works and how it differs from standard oil.  Just put the two and two together and there's your answer.

If you were to read most every article about this that has been written in the past 10 years, you will come up with the same answers they have.  

[chornbe]

... authoritative...

[Rogue]

Many of those articles are based on authoritative sources.  

[chornbe]

Can someone point to an authoritative article or tech bulletin on why synth oil is bad or how it can be used "too soon"? The operative word here is authoritative. I'm not looking for "because the rings need to seat in". I'm an ASE certified engine mechanic. I know all about rings. I'm looking for authoritative evidence that synth oils are "bad" because they're "too slippery"...  

I'm just repeating this because all I can find when I looked were private web sites, blogs, opinion pieces and the occasional un-sourced or un-attributed magazine article.

"According to experts..." is not an attributed source.

[st ryder]

... authoritative...

I guess it all depends on who you consider to be an authority. How about Moto-Man?

"3 more words on break- in: NO SYNTHETIC OIL !!"

http://www.miatapower.com/engine-break-in.htm

[Tpoppa]

For the plastic, the Novus 1-2-3 kit woks great (search ebay).  1 is the polish, 2 & 3 will remove any light to medium scratches.

1125s are shipped with Dino, this is from a reliabe source (not me).  I believe the HD CVO motor is the only HD-related motor that ships with Syn.

[chornbe]

I guess it all depends on who you consider to be an authority. How about Moto-Man?

"3 more words on break- in: NO SYNTHETIC OIL !!"

http://www.miatapower.com/engine-break-in.htm

He's a consumer just like you and me.

I basically agree with him that he won't break an engine by running it hard from the get-go - if properly warmed up and you get the initial break-in oil out of it. Initial break-in or assembly lube has certain polishing compounds in it and is really, really bad to leave in long term.

[Skee]

Re: Moto-Man
I followed Moto-Man instructions to break-in my FJR.
I followed the manufacturer's instructions to break in my Wee.
Rarely, if ever, had to add oil to the FJR between changes.
I have noticed in the last 3 months that Wee is consuming almost a quart between changes.
It's not fair comparing a Suzuki V-twin to a Yamaha FJR.
Just sayin'.

As far as synthetic, for me, I did not find it cost effective.
Not sayin' that it doesn't have it's advantages.
Simple as that.

[st ryder]

He's a consumer just like you and me.

That does not make him anything less of an authority. Like the hackneyed saying goes, "The Titanic was built by professionals..."  

[chornbe]

That does not make him anything less of an authority. Like the hackneyed saying goes, "The Titanic was built by professionals..."  

Fair enough. By that logic, I'm an authority, and I say use whatever oil you want, just change it often, always use a new filter and for the sake of kittens and puppies everywhere, do NOT - EVER - free-rev your engine to red line and NEVER free-rev your engine while it's cold. Ever. Don't beat on your engine when it's cold - always let it come up to temp.

Following THOSE rules (along with the common sense stuff about oil level, etc) and you'll never blow an engine from abuse.

 

[st ryder]

Fair enough. By that logic, I'm an authority, and I say use whatever oil you want, just change it often, always use a new filter and for the sake of kittens and puppies everywhere, do NOT - EVER - free-rev your engine to red line and NEVER free-rev your engine while it's cold. Ever. Don't beat on your engine when it's cold - always let it come up to temp.

Following THOSE rules (along with the common sense stuff about oil level, etc) and you'll never blow an engine from abuse.

 

Sounds good. Whether or not I choose to follow your advice is based on my belief system, not your credentials. Who do you trust on matters of motorcycle defects? The experience of the ownership groups as collected and shared in such forums as this, or the factories who often deny widely reported defects exist? Who has the credentials, and who are the experts? Don't know 'bout you, but I tend to believe owners, because they *are* the experts on living with the bike, though they didn't design it. I don't know how many times I've worked with engineers who have told me things that I experience everyday are not possible.   People around the globe have a 8,000,000 : 1 chance of dying from swine flu. Rather than buying people soft, impact absorbing floor coverings so people won't kill themselves falling out of bed because the odds of that happening are far greater than getting and dying from the swine flu, the authoritative experts are promoting inoculation against swine flu.

Experts don't know shit half the time.  

 

[chornbe]

 I don't know how many times I've worked with engineers who have told me things that I experience everyday are not possible.    

Dude... I work in software. 'Nuff said.  

Experts don't know shit half the time.  

 

[Rogue]

Experts don't know shit half the time.  

 

I would have to agree.  Lots of cases that point to this.  Most recently, Enron, Tyson, GM, Fanie Mae/Freddie Mack, Other recently failed financial institutions, etc.  

[fast2win]

I have used regular car wax's or polishes on the body work. If you have light scratches a polish will work, a buffing wheel helps to speed things up. I wouldn't be too afraid to try different types

[RideEcono]

This is an old thread but, the manual specifically states to use a Synthetic Motorcycle Lubricant, then use multi-grade if synthetic is not available. The manual also specifically states not to mix types of oils.